PDA

View Full Version : Harry Knox,Obama’s Appointee, Says Bible Teaching on Homosexuality Is ‘Not True’



megimoo
04-08-2009, 09:32 AM
Obama’s Christian Appointee Says Bible Teaching on Homosexuality Is ‘Not True’
...................
"The most common proof texts come from the Old Testament and from the Apostle Paul's letters to 1st-century churches.

Genesis 19:4-11 relates a same-sex assault attempt on two male angels visiting Sodom; Leviticus 18:22 calls same-sex relations an "abomination"
........................
Leviticus 20:13 calls it "a detestable act";
Paul speaks of same-sex acts as "unnatural" and "unrighteous"
............................
Romans 1:26-27,
..........................
1 Corinthians 6:9-20
.............................
1 Timothy 1:8-11. "
..........................
President Obama has named to his faith-based advisory council a self-professed Christian who holds that the New Testament's teaching that homosexual behavior is unnatural and wrong--which is found in St. Paul's letter to the Romans--“is not true." The appointee, Harry Knox, has also said that Obama's decision to invite the Rev. Rick Warren to say a prayer at the Inauguration "tainted" the ceremony and that Pope Benedict XVI is a "discredited leader." Harry Knox, a professed gay Christian who is director of the religion and faith program at the Human Rights Campaign, a homosexual rights group, was named to President...


http://www.cnsnews.com/public/content/article.aspx?RsrcID=46263

PoliCon
04-08-2009, 11:58 AM
For those looking for scripture regarding homosexuality - there is something hidden in "slang" that people do not realize is a condemnation of homosexuality in scripture. The Jews would refer to homosexuals - especially homosexual prostitutes as DOGS. So when you see OT passages that don't quite make sense - such as Exodus 11:7 or Deuteronomy 23:18 - they're not talking about a puppy.

noonwitch
04-08-2009, 04:05 PM
The Bible is not exactly clear in the stories of Sodom and Gomorrah whether God disapproves of homosexuality or of homosexual rape. We all know He's cool with hetero rapists, as long as they don't rape married women and pay off the father of their victims (and marry the poor girl or woman).


Yes, Leviticus does condemn homosexuality, but it procribes a whole lot of other behavior, too, including the eating of pork and shellfish, sitting on a chair that a menstruating woman has sat upon, and so on. The OT law also states that women who are not virgins when they get married must be stoned to death (unless they have the bloody sheet to show as evidence of their virginity), as do urban rape victims who don't scream for help (that's in Deutoronomy 22). No where in the Bible is lesbianism specifically condemned by God or Jesus, interestingly enough.


It seems to me that those who are opposed to any type of tolerance of homosexuality are picking and choosing what in the Old Testament they want to punish people for and what they don't. I don't mean those who are opposed to gay marriage only-that is a position that one may take for a lot of reasons, not all of them religious. I mean the people who can't stand the thought of gays, who would like to see gays arrested and prosecuted for consensual acts between adults, who wants to boycott any business that markets products to gays, and so on.


Jesus never said anything about homosexuality, one way or another. Paul is Paul-some consider his letters to the early church to be the word of God, but I consider them to be the words of Paul. Jesus did say to love your neighbor, and he didn't add "unless he's a homosexual".

But, really, did anyone think that Obama was going to be appointing anyone to a post who is going to be intolerant of homosexuality?


I'm sure lacurnut will have plenty of insults to throw my way, but after 4:30, I'm on vacation until Monday.

Gingersnap
04-08-2009, 04:32 PM
Regardless of how you view the OT, the Christian aversion to homosexuality rests on the idea that sexuality is a gift to be used only within the context of marriage. Whatever the world may think, there is no place for homosexual marriage within traditional, creedal Christianity. Homosexuals are not singled out in this regard, either.

Traditional Christians are not "red letter" Christians. ;)

MrsSmith
04-08-2009, 07:17 PM
The Bible is not exactly clear in the stories of Sodom and Gomorrah whether God disapproves of homosexuality or of homosexual rape. We all know He's cool with hetero rapists, as long as they don't rape married women and pay off the father of their victims (and marry the poor girl or woman).


Yes, Leviticus does condemn homosexuality, but it procribes a whole lot of other behavior, too, including the eating of pork and shellfish, sitting on a chair that a menstruating woman has sat upon, and so on. The OT law also states that women who are not virgins when they get married must be stoned to death (unless they have the bloody sheet to show as evidence of their virginity), as do urban rape victims who don't scream for help (that's in Deutoronomy 22). No where in the Bible is lesbianism specifically condemned by God or Jesus, interestingly enough.


It seems to me that those who are opposed to any type of tolerance of homosexuality are picking and choosing what in the Old Testament they want to punish people for and what they don't. I don't mean those who are opposed to gay marriage only-that is a position that one may take for a lot of reasons, not all of them religious. I mean the people who can't stand the thought of gays, who would like to see gays arrested and prosecuted for consensual acts between adults, who wants to boycott any business that markets products to gays, and so on.


Jesus never said anything about homosexuality, one way or another. Paul is Paul-some consider his letters to the early church to be the word of God, but I consider them to be the words of Paul. Jesus did say to love your neighbor, and he didn't add "unless he's a homosexual".

But, really, did anyone think that Obama was going to be appointing anyone to a post who is going to be intolerant of homosexuality?


I'm sure lacurnut will have plenty of insults to throw my way, but after 4:30, I'm on vacation until Monday.
Christ said:
Mar 10:6 "But from the beginning of creation, {God} MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE.

Mar 10:7 "FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER,

Mar 10:8 AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH; so they are no longer two, but one flesh.



Mat 19:4 And He answered and said, "Have you not read that He who created {them} from the beginning MADE THEM MALE AND FEMALE,

Mat 19:5 and said, 'FOR THIS REASON A MAN SHALL LEAVE HIS FATHER AND MOTHER AND BE JOINED TO HIS WIFE, AND THE TWO SHALL BECOME ONE FLESH'?

Mat 19:6 "So they are no longer two, but one flesh. What therefore God has joined together, let no man separate."


Not much room in there for either type of homosexual behavior.



Mat 15:18 "But the things that proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and those defile the man.

Mat 15:19 "For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, slanders.


Mar 7:20 And He was saying, "That which proceeds out of the man, that is what defiles the man.

Mar 7:21 "For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed the evil thoughts, fornications, thefts, murders, adulteries,

Mar 7:22 deeds of coveting {and} wickedness, {as well} {as} deceit, sensuality, envy, slander, pride {and} foolishness.

Mar 7:23 "All these evil things proceed from within and defile the man."


If you're going to throw around OT laws, you've got to have some understanding of NT theology. Some OT laws do not apply to the church, though they may still apply to the Children of Israel. Some OT laws are for both...and the NT makes that clear.

It seems to me that most people who start throwing out OT laws have never read what Christ said.

AHeneen
04-08-2009, 11:19 PM
Interesting...I happened to read 1 Corinthians tonight and came across this:


1 Cor 7:1-3, 10-11
Now for the matters you wrote about: It is good for a man not to marry. But since there is so much immorality, each man should have his own wife, and each woman her own husband. The husband should fulfill his marital duty to his wife, and likewise the wife to her husband.

...

To the married I give this command (not I, but the Lord): A wife must not separate from her husband...And a husband must not divorce his wife.

It doesn't say each man should have his own wife or husband, and each woman her own husband or wife. How does any Christian condone homosexuality?

PoliCon
04-08-2009, 11:27 PM
Interesting...I happened to read 1 Corinthians tonight and came across this:



It doesn't say each man should have his own wife or husband, and each woman her own husband or wife. How does any Christian condone homosexuality?

homosexuality is a different issue than that of marriage.

megimoo
04-08-2009, 11:28 PM
Interesting...I happened to read 1 Corinthians tonight and came across this:



It doesn't say each man should have his own wife or husband, and each woman her own husband or wife. How does any Christian condone homosexuality?
Save your fingers,She's an apologist for all kinds of weird critters.I don't recall GOD condemning bestiality but I'm sure it's in there somewhere !

FlaGator
04-08-2009, 11:35 PM
<snip>
Yes, Leviticus does condemn homosexuality, but it procribes a whole lot of other behavior, too, including the eating of pork and shellfish, sitting on a chair that a menstruating woman has sat upon, and so on. The OT law also states that women who are not virgins when they get married must be stoned to death (unless they have the bloody sheet to show as evidence of their virginity), as do urban rape victims who don't scream for help (that's in Deutoronomy 22). No where in the Bible is lesbianism specifically condemned by God or Jesus, interestingly enough.
<snip> </quote>
I find it interesting that in Leviticus homosexuality is nestled right in their with child sacrifice, adultery and beastiality. Perhaps those things are ok too!

[QUOTE]Lev 18:20 “ ‘Do not have sexual relations with your neighbor’s wifex and defile yourself with her.

Lev 18:21 “ ‘Do not give any of your childreny to be sacrificed1 to Molech,z for you must not profane the name of your God.a I am the Lord.b

Lev 18:22 “ ‘Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman;c that is detestable.d

Lev 18:23 “ ‘Do not have sexual relations with an animal and defile yourself with it. A woman must not present herself to an animal to have sexual relations with it; that is a perversion.e





Jesus never said anything about homosexuality, one way or another. Paul is Paul-some consider his letters to the early church to be the word of God, but I consider them to be the words of Paul. Jesus did say to love your neighbor, and he didn't add "unless he's a homosexual".

But, really, did anyone think that Obama was going to be appointing anyone to a post who is going to be intolerant of homosexuality?


I'm sure lacurnut will have plenty of insults to throw my way, but after 4:30, I'm on vacation until Monday.

Jesus did speak against sexual immorality.
Mark 7:20

He went on: “What comes out of a man is what makes him ‘unclean.’ For from within, out of men’s hearts, come evil thoughts, sexual immorality, theft, murder, adultery, greed, malice, deceit, lewdness, envy, slander, arrogance and folly. All these evils come from inside and make a man ‘unclean.’ ”


Since Christ wasn't here to change the law then we can be safely infer that what was considered sexual immorality in the Old Testament applied to Jesus' train of though in the New Testement.