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View Full Version : US Cuba Relations...a Poll.



SarasotaRepub
04-18-2009, 08:59 AM
With President Obama making it clear he wants new relations with our Commie buddies south of Miami...what do you think?

djones520
04-18-2009, 09:20 AM
Honestly, I have no clue.

And I'm quite offended that you didn't include a poll option for those of us who are clueless. :mad:

SarasotaRepub
04-18-2009, 09:50 AM
Honestly, I have no clue.

And I'm quite offended that you didn't include a poll option for those of us who are clueless. :mad:


Got ya covered bud. ;)

djones520
04-18-2009, 09:54 AM
Yes!!!!!11!

SarasotaRepub
04-18-2009, 10:15 AM
I've felt for a long time we need to open up Cuba to the full POWER of US
exploitation. I remember reading somewhere that there are only a small
handful of hotels on the island that would be up to US standards. And
Casinos...must have them!!!

Look at all that cheap labor down there too! The heck with sugar, we
need more cheap iPods and sneakers!!! And don't forget the oil!!!
Castro and his brother can kick the ChiComs to the curb. Get
Halliburton in there baby and let the black gold flow.

Ahhh yes, it'll be like old times again. The President is a genius!!!

Gingersnap
04-18-2009, 10:21 AM
I'm all for seducing them to the dark side with organic baby carrots and cheap laptops. :)

SarasotaRepub
04-18-2009, 10:25 AM
I'm all for seducing them to the dark side with organic baby carrots and cheap laptops. :)

Aftermarket Chevy parts...don't forget that!!! :D

PoliCon
04-18-2009, 01:08 PM
Aftermarket Chevy parts...don't forget that!!! :D

Ah here we have the real reason why he wants to open relations! With the big three on the verge of collapse - the market for car parts in cuba could keep the UAW afloat for several years!

PoliCon
04-18-2009, 01:09 PM
I'm kinda torn in this one. . . . I can see pros and cons to both sides . . . .

Troll
04-18-2009, 05:08 PM
Open relations with Cuba.

Fidel Castro is, for all intents and purposes, dead. Even if he weren't, I'm not for blackballing an entire nation because of their crappy leader. His people obviously hate him, so let's let them see what economic liberty can produce - maybe it'll catch on. An entire generation of Cubans has come and gone since Castro took power, why should we bear them any ill will?

FlaGator
04-18-2009, 05:28 PM
Open relations with Cuba. Those being hurt by the embargo are not those who should be feeling the pain. Also, if the embargo hasn't brought about change after 50 years it will never bring about anything useful. It's well pass time to try something different.

stsinner
04-18-2009, 06:11 PM
As always, and as any patriot should, I ask myself, "How does this benefit America?" Answer-in no way.. It benefits only Cubans and opens the door to more illegal immigration.

Odysseus
04-18-2009, 09:51 PM
As always, and as any patriot should, I ask myself, "How does this benefit America?" Answer-in no way.. It benefits only Cubans and opens the door to more illegal immigration.

The only way that this could benefit America is if we use this to undermine the dictatorship of the Castro brothers, but that would take a deliberate effort on the part of our government, and I don't see Obama going for that.

PoliCon
04-18-2009, 11:25 PM
The only way that this could benefit America is if we use this to undermine the dictatorship of the Castro brothers, but that would take a deliberate effort on the part of our government, and I don't see Obama going for that.

And there is where I would support normalization of relations.

Bleda
04-19-2009, 10:09 PM
Cuba is still ruled by the Castro brothers, and even if we turned the country into a paradise, the people still wouldn't have the guts to revolt. We'd just be doing the Castros a favor by granting them legitimacy.

Odysseus
04-20-2009, 10:41 AM
Cuba is still ruled by the Castro brothers, and even if we turned the country into a paradise, the people still wouldn't have the guts to revolt. We'd just be doing the Castros a favor by granting them legitimacy.

It's not that they lack the guts, it's that they lack the means. First off, as bad as things are in Cuba, most Cubans don't know enough about the outside world to make a comparison, and those who do oppose the regime lack the tools to organize and communicate with each other. If we provided laptops with aircards and cell phones to dissidents, the regime would crumble within a few months as the deluge of information undermined them.

PoliCon
04-20-2009, 10:46 AM
It's not that they lack the guts, it's that they lack the means. First off, as bad as things are in Cuba, most Cubans don't know enough about the outside world to make a comparison, and those who do oppose the regime lack the tools to organize and communicate with each other. If we provided laptops with aircards and cell phones to dissidents, the regime would crumble within a few months as the deluge of information undermined them.

yes - but do you think for a second that those tools would be allowed? :confused:

noonwitch
04-20-2009, 11:46 AM
I'm for a gradual approach. Begin some trade, let relatives visit their loved ones and send them money, and see where that goes.


I'll only agree to a Trump casino in Cuba if Trump moves there with it!

ReaganForRus
04-20-2009, 01:03 PM
The embargo is not political, it's business. Both the Reagan and Clinton administrations sought to explore normalization of relations with the Castro regime. It didn't happen. The reason normalization failed comes down to money. The properties seized by Castro and his cohorts are some of the most valued properties on the island, be they the fertile farms in the west or the beach properties in Havana. The owners want to be compensated for the seizures or have the ownerships restored. These owners include expatriates who owned land and businesses as well properties owned by certain families out of New York City. The embargo won't end. There may be nibbles around the edges, but no normalization.

Why?

Because the Castro regime wants total control.........and the minute that the Castro regime allows outside investment, the Castro regime is over. Outside sources would want their person in power.

The losers are the people of Cuba.:(

FlaGator
04-20-2009, 01:15 PM
The embargo is not political, it's business. Both the Reagan and Clinton administrations sought to explore normalization of relations with the Castro regime. It didn't happen. The reason normalization failed comes down to money. The properties seized by Castro and his cohorts are some of the most valued properties on the island, be they the fertile farms in the west or the beach properties in Havana. The owners want to be compensated for the seizures or have the ownerships restored. These owners include expatriates who owned land and businesses as well properties owned by certain families out of New York City. The embargo won't end. There may be nibbles around the edges, but no normalization.

Why?

Because the Castro regime wants total control.........and the minute that the Castro regime allows outside investment, the Castro regime is over. Outside sources would want their person in power.

The losers are the people of Cuba.:(

I ask the question, what has 50 years of embargo accomplished?

Odysseus
04-20-2009, 01:53 PM
yes - but do you think for a second that those tools would be allowed? :confused:
Of course not, but if Cuba opens itself up to American investment and trade, they're going to have a hard time keeping them out, especially if we make a concerted effort to ensure that the Cuban dissenters get them.

I'm for a gradual approach. Begin some trade, let relatives visit their loved ones and send them money, and see where that goes.
It will go into the pockets of the Castros and their cronies.

I'll only agree to a Trump casino in Cuba if Trump moves there with it!
Haven't those people suffered enough? :D

I ask the question, what has 50 years of embargo accomplished?
Funny story: When I was in college, we had a class that invited the Cuban ambassador to the UN to speak. At the end of his speech, which was the usual crap about Cuba's peaceful intentions and our warlike ones, there was a brief Q&A session. I asked why Cuba, which could trade with the entire socialist/communist world, needed trade with America? Was this an admission that capitalism could provide things that communism couldn't? Needless to say, this went over about as well as a pork patty in a Wahhabi mosque.

The embargo never hurt us. Cuba exports next to nothing, and the Soviets had to subsidize Castro to the tune of billions per year, which drained their economy during the Cold War. Now that Hugo Chavez has taken up the role of rich patron, and is spending money hand over fist there, he's eroding some of his support in Venezuela, where the drop in oil prices is tanking the economy and starving his social programs. Cuba is the left's money pit, and the more that they have to spend to shore up the last communist kleptocracy, the better.

ReaganForRus
04-20-2009, 02:23 PM
The embargo never hurt us. Cuba exports next to nothing, and the Soviets had to subsidize Castro to the tune of billions per year, which drained their economy during the Cold War. Now that Hugo Chavez has taken up the role of rich patron, and is spending money hand over fist there, he's eroding some of his support in Venezuela, where the drop in oil prices is tanking the economy and starving his social programs. Cuba is the left's money pit, and the more that they have to spend to shore up the last communist kleptocracy, the better.

Bingo!, Cuba has to import food.........what food that is grown, particularly sugar, is used to prop up the Castro regime. Cigars?...alternative markets, particularly Costa Rica and El Salvador have replaced Cuba in the production of cohibas. Truth is, Cuba already trades with the world and still is a sh**hole. You unleash freedom, liberty, and capitalism on the people of Cuba, watch what happens.

The embargo isn't about politics, it's about money and retaining power..........Castro wants the now "status quo"", screw the Cuban population.:(

Question to this august group of thinkers............"If the Cuban model of healthcare is to be the envy of the world, explain why Fidel flew to a capialist country, Spain, for his surgery?":confused: