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megimoo
06-01-2009, 09:10 AM
Obama administration blocks sale of 6 AH-64D helicopters to Israel - approves 12 to Egypt
But the sources said the Longbow as well as other defense requests have been shelved by the administration amid its review of the potential use of American weapons platforms by Israel.


"Now Here is a threat .Supply the Arabs with advance Apache Longbow attack helicopter and Hamas attacks Jerusalem ,Obama's clearly at war with Israel !"

President Obama holds up supply of helicopters to Israel out of concern for
Palestinian civilians.

But when it comes to 12 of the same helicopters for Egypt its the standard
boiler plate "The proposed sale of this equipment and support will not alter
the basic military balance in the region."]

#1 Administration blocks helicopters for Israel due to civilian casualties
in Gaza
Wednesday, May 27, 2009
www.worldtribune.com/worldtribune/WTARC/2009/ss_israel0424_05_27.asp

WASHINGTON - The Obama administration has blocked Israel's request for
advanced U.S.-origin attack helicopters.

Government sources said the administration has held up Israel's request for
the AH-64D Apache Longbow attack helicopter. The sources said the request
was undergoing an interagency review to determine whether additional Longbow
helicopters would threaten Palestinian civilians in the Gaza Strip.

"During the recent war, Israel made considerable use of the Longbow, and
there were high civilian casualties in the Gaza Strip," a source close to
the administration said.

The sources said Israel has sought to purchase up to six new AH-64Ds in an
effort to bolster conventional and counter-insurgency capabilities. They
said Israel wants to replenish its fleet after the loss of two Apache
helicopters in the 2006 war with Hizbullah.

The Israel Air Force has also requested U.S. permission to integrate the
Spike extended-range anti-tank missile into the AH-64D. Spike ER, developed
by the state-owned Rafael Advanced Defense Systems, has a range of eight
kilometers and was installed on the Eurocopter Tiger and AgustaWestland A129
helicopters.

The sources said the deployment of Spike would require integration into the
Longbow's millimeter-wave fire control and acquisition system. They said
this would require permission from both Boeing and the U.S. government.

Israel's Defense Ministry and air force have discussed procurement of
additional Longbows with the U.S. firm Boeing. But the sources said the
Longbow as well as other defense requests have been shelved by the
administration amid its review of the potential use of American weapons
platforms by Israel.

http://www.imra.org.il/story.php3?id=43763

stsinner
06-01-2009, 10:17 AM
This is very disturbing.

ActualCasualty
06-01-2009, 10:38 AM
Obama, Something smells funny and my guess is, its YOU!!!

Lars1701a
06-01-2009, 10:41 AM
Gator must be all happy now!!!11!!1!


Him and the magic negro are like two pees in a pod.:D


I am not worried the Jewish lobby will get a hold of the MN and let him know whats what.

Odysseus
06-01-2009, 11:52 AM
Gator must be all happy now!!!11!!1!
Him and the magic negro are like two pees in a pod.:D
I am not worried the Jewish lobby will get a hold of the MN and let him know whats what.

Sounds like Gator's going to be working at the State Department. The real issue is that the administration is blaming Israel for casualties caused by Hamas. It was Hamas that fired thousands of rockets at Israeli civilians. It was Hamas that sited the launchers among Arab civilians and ensured that they would be hit by any returned fire. It was Hamas that used the war to settle scores and attacked Fatah supporters, inflating the "civilian" death toll. Yet, our administration blames this on Israel.

megimoo
06-02-2009, 05:19 PM
Sounds like Gator's going to be working at the State Department. The real issue is that the administration is blaming Israel for casualties caused by Hamas. It was Hamas that fired thousands of rockets at Israeli civilians. It was Hamas that sited the launchers among Arab civilians and ensured that they would be hit by any returned fire. It was Hamas that used the war to settle scores and attacked Fatah supporters, inflating the "civilian" death toll. Yet, our administration blames this on Israel.
He Is One fifth black African,one fifth Kansas white and three fifth Arab !His father was an Kenyan Muslem, His step father was an Indonesian Muslem and he was educated in a madras at an early age .Would you expect him to be Pro Israeli ?

Odysseus
06-02-2009, 07:54 PM
He Is One fifth black African,one fifth Kansas white and three fifth Arab !His father was an Kenyan Muslem, His step father was an Indonesian Muslem and he was educated in a madras at an early age .Would you expect him to be Pro Israeli ?

Nope. But then, I didn't vote for him, now did I? What cracks me up is that there are Jews who did vote for him and who are now shocked, shocked I tell you, that he's undermining a key ally and making nice with a nation that directly endangers Israel, Europe and the US. Go figure... :confused:

Rockntractor
06-02-2009, 10:39 PM
I am so mad I don’t know what to post. How can one man change all of our foreign policy so drastically? The Republicans sit back with hardly a whimper of protest. What does he have to do before we stand up and tell him enough? These wimpy little tea parties just aren’t cutting it for me.

megimoo
06-02-2009, 10:54 PM
Nope. But then, I didn't vote for him, now did I? What cracks me up is that there are Jews who did vote for him and who are now shocked, shocked I tell you, that he's undermining a key ally and making nice with a nation that directly endangers Israel, Europe and the US. Go figure... :confused:
Young American Jews don't give a hoot about the homeland of their long gone fathers.To them liberalism is their new god and Liberal politics is everything .A Frenchman is to wine as an young American Jew is to liberalism .It flows in their veins and instills their every action.

stsinner
06-02-2009, 11:31 PM
Well, now Israel is cozying up to Russia since Obama has abandoned them..

Rockntractor
06-02-2009, 11:36 PM
Well, now Israel is cozying up to Russia since Obama has abandoned them..
I hope Russia gives them all the help they need. I am waitig for obama to put in a red square. Everything is turned upside down. I am in the wrong universe.

gator
06-03-2009, 08:05 AM
We have given the filthy Israelis almost a trillion dollars in aid and weapons since 1967.

We had no business giving the goddamn Israelis weapons that they used to kill the Palestinians and to take the land away from the Palestinians.

I don't think we need to be in the business of taking sides in a conflict that has nothing to do with our own security. I do, however, think that it would be poetic justice if we reversed the trend and started to give weapons to the Palestinians. I would like to see them with F-15s, and F-16s, and Apache gunships and Patriot missiles and 50 caliber machine guns and ACPs and Bradleys and M-16s and all the weapons that the Israelis have been using to kill the Palestinians so that the playing field could be leveled. Maybe even a nuke or two. That way the next time the asshole Israelis killed Palestinian children or tried to take away some land to make room for some new wave of Russian immigrants then the Palestinians could kick the Israeli asses.

That would be real justice.

SaintLouieWoman
06-03-2009, 08:33 AM
I hope Russia gives them all the help they need. I am waitig for obama to put in a red square. Everything is turned upside down. I am in the wrong universe.

I think we should all be afraid as we're marching, as Glenn Beck said, on the road to socialism. We're already there with the MN leading the way. :eek:

AmPat
06-03-2009, 09:06 AM
Sounds like Gator's going to be working at the State Department. The real issue is that the administration is blaming Israel for casualties caused by Hamas. It was Hamas that fired thousands of rockets at Israeli civilians. It was Hamas that sited the launchers among Arab civilians and ensured that they would be hit by any returned fire. It was Hamas that used the war to settle scores and attacked Fatah supporters, inflating the "civilian" death toll. Yet, our administration blames this on Israel.
Those quaint little facts are inconvienent to the popular understanding. Hamas has a right to kill innocents, just read the liberal rags, they'll confirm it. Israel must wait years before striking back. Even then the "poor" Arab riff-raff gets a huge BJ from the world's press over their tragic circumstances.:rolleyes:

AmPat
06-03-2009, 09:09 AM
I don't think we need to be in the business of taking sides in a conflict that has nothing to do with our own security. I do, however, think that it would be poetic justice if we reversed the trend and started to give weapons to the Palestinians.
That would be real justice.

Sounds like you've chosen your side.

gator
06-03-2009, 09:39 AM
I donít really care who wins the conflict. I was just speculating on a fantasy of real justice in the area.

Since I am a real American I tend to side with the oppressed. The Israelis are brutal assholes and it would be justice if they got their asses kicked from the Palestinians. It would be good turnabout if the Palestinians were given American made weapons.

My number one choice would be to not ever get involved in the first place.

My number two choice would be to stop giving the goddamn Israeli any weapons that they can use to kill Palestinians children and women like they have been doing for the last 60 years. It is really sickening to know that my taxpayerís money is being used to arm a brutal apartheid theocracy.

I really donít have a third choice but an enjoyable fantasy would be for the Palestinians to get a little payback.

gator
06-03-2009, 09:53 AM
Those quaint little facts are inconvienent to the popular understanding. Hamas has a right to kill innocents, just read the liberal rags, they'll confirm it. Israel must wait years before striking back. Even then the "poor" Arab riff-raff gets a huge BJ from the world's press over their tragic circumstances.:rolleyes:

The Israelis have been quite good at killing Palestinian innocents when it suited their needs for land. They are legendary for killing. They have killed Palestinian women, children and non combatants at a sickening rate but you donít hear too much about that from the American press. Hamas was formed to fight the Israeli brutality. The Israelis created Humas just like the Nazis created the French underground freedom fighters in WWII.

The American press very seldom reports the real brutality of the Israelis and you never see the conflict reported in the right context.

It really doesnít make any difference to the Israelis what the Arab world reports. They are only interested in the bias in the American press because America is where they get their money and security guarantee.

As long as the goddamn Israelis get their F-16s from the US what difference does it make to them what foreign presses report?

Jfor
06-03-2009, 10:10 AM
Ummm... The Israelis have been having to fight for their land since their inception of modern Israel. The Palestinians can form their own country anytime they want per the UN resolution that help to create the modern state of Israel. The Israelis turned a bunch of sand that the Arabs did nothing with into something that was productive. What have the Palestinians done with all the money they have been given over the years? That's right, they pay for homicide bombers, they pay to wage war against Israeli civilians. The Palestinian terrorists hide their equipment amongst the Palestinian people as well as hide themselves amongst the populace so that when Israel responds to an attack that Palestinian civilians will be killed.

Rockntractor
06-03-2009, 10:22 AM
The jews purchased the land that became Israel. They have every right to defend it.

The Jewish National Fund - Keren Kayemet L'Israel - the land purchase and development fund of the Zionist Organization, was founded at the Fifth Zionist Congress in December 1901. It was resolved that "The JNF shall be the eternal possession of the Jewish people. Its funds shall not be used except for the purchase of lands..." In the early years, the JNF acquired tracts of lands with funds raised from Jews abroad, in the Galilee, in Judea and near Lake Kinneret. The first large area acquired in 1921, in the Jezreel Valley, increased the JNF's holdings to nearly 15,000 acres (60,000 dunams). Jewish-owned land and settlements rapidly increased, despite legal restrictions imposed by the British administration. JNF leasehold contracts run for 49 years and can be prolonged by the lessee or his heirs for as long as they serve the purpose specified.

http://www.mfa.gov.il/MFA/History/Modern+History/Centenary+of+Zionism/Jewish+Settlement+in+the+Land+of+Israel.htm

gator
06-03-2009, 10:44 AM
Ummm... The Israelis have been having to fight for their land since their inception of modern Israel. The Palestinians can form their own country anytime they want per the UN resolution that help to create the modern state of Israel. The Israelis turned a bunch of sand that the Arabs did nothing with into something that was productive. What have the Palestinians done with all the money they have been given over the years? That's right, they pay for homicide bombers, they pay to wage war against Israeli civilians. The Palestinian terrorists hide their equipment amongst the Palestinian people as well as hide themselves amongst the populace so that when Israel responds to an attack that Palestinian civilians will be killed.

Your input is noted but the Palestinians think that it is their land and it is worth fighting for. The Israelis can go back to Europe and Russia anytime they want.

I feel the Israelis are the real terrorists in the area and have been since 1947. The Palestinians are fighting for their land. They have to fight because the goddamn Israelis are bringing in millions of immigrants. Most of them from Russia.

The Israelis use American made weapons to kill Palestinian children so donít give me your crocodile tears over the Palestinians fighting back. Both sides kill children. In fact over the years the Israelis have killed more Palestinians than the Palestinians have killed Israelis.

Rockntractor
06-03-2009, 10:50 AM
Time and time again we have seen periods of peace broken by hamas rockets launched into Israel or a suicide bomber detonating himself among Inocents.

Odysseus
06-03-2009, 11:13 AM
We have given the filthy Israelis almost a trillion dollars in aid and weapons since 1967.

We had no business giving the goddamn Israelis weapons that they used to kill the Palestinians and to take the land away from the Palestinians.
I don't think we need to be in the business of taking sides in a conflict that has nothing to do with our own security. I do, however, think that it would be poetic justice if we reversed the trend and started to give weapons to the Palestinians. I would like to see them with F-15s, and F-16s, and Apache gunships and Patriot missiles and 50 caliber machine guns and ACPs and Bradleys and M-16s and all the weapons that the Israelis have been using to kill the Palestinians so that the playing field could be leveled. Maybe even a nuke or two. That way the next time the asshole Israelis killed Palestinian children or tried to take away some land to make room for some new wave of Russian immigrants then the Palestinians could kick the Israeli asses.
That would be real justice.
Ah, the Ministry of Hate has finally issued a statement. Funny thing is, I keep asking you to explain your position on the Palestinians in light of the reality of the actual history, and you keep ignoring the questions. Once again, here are the questions that you refuse to answer, because they blow your worldview out of the water:


You've claimed that Israelis kicked the Arabs off of their own land, but if this were the case, how did they do it?
The UN partition plan would have divided up Palestine into two regions, based solely on who was in the majority in those areas. Jews would have only had sovereignty over their own enclaves, while Arabs would have had sovereignty over theirs, while Jerusalem, which has had a Jewish majority since biblical times, would have been an open city. The Jews were willing to accept this, but not the Arabs. Ask yourself why the Arabs would not accept a tiny Jewish state on land in which they were already the majority?
If hatred of Israel is the only thing driving Arab policies, then why is it that they are backing Islamic revolutions in the Philippines, Chechnya, Thailand and Kenya, none of which was ever an ally or supporter of Israel? Why are there Islamiist jihads against Christian Animists in Darfur, Baha'is in Iran, or anywhere else that a sizeable Moslem community butts up against anyone else?
[/QUOTE]


Those quaint little facts are inconvienent to the popular understanding. Hamas has a right to kill innocents, just read the liberal rags, they'll confirm it. Israel must wait years before striking back. Even then the "poor" Arab riff-raff gets a huge BJ from the world's press over their tragic circumstances.:rolleyes:
Hamas even has the right to murder Palestinians and blame the Israelis for it. Hamas picked up the opportunity to eliminate hundreds of Fatah members during the fighting and then added them to the body count for the incursion.

I donít really care who wins the conflict. I was just speculating on a fantasy of real justice in the area.

Since I am a real American I tend to side with the oppressed. The Israelis are brutal assholes and it would be justice if they got their asses kicked from the Palestinians. It would be good turnabout if the Palestinians were given American made weapons.

My number one choice would be to not ever get involved in the first place.

My number two choice would be to stop giving the goddamn Israeli any weapons that they can use to kill Palestinians children and women like they have been doing for the last 60 years. It is really sickening to know that my taxpayerís money is being used to arm a brutal apartheid theocracy.

I really donít have a third choice but an enjoyable fantasy would be for the Palestinians to get a little payback.
Isn't it funny how Gator fantasizes about mass murder of Jews, but then complains whenever he's called out as an antisemite? I'm just sayin'...

megimoo
06-03-2009, 11:22 AM
The Israelis have been quite good at killing Palestinian innocents when it suited their needs for land. They are legendary for killing. They have killed Palestinian women, children and non combatants at a sickening rate but you donít hear too much about that from the American press. Hamas was formed to fight the Israeli brutality. The Israelis created Humas just like the Nazis created the French underground freedom fighters in WWII.

The American press very seldom reports the real brutality of the Israelis and you never see the conflict reported in the right context.

It really doesnít make any difference to the Israelis what the Arab world reports. They are only interested in the bias in the American press because America is where they get their money and security guarantee.

As long as the goddamn Israelis get their F-16s from the US what difference does it make to them what foreign presses report?
Would you be overjoyed if the entire Nation of Israel ceased to exist with every man woman and child of Israeli decent dead and replaced by those fun loving Hamas murderers ?Would that appease your anger and hatred of the Jews ?

You just may get your wish after this bean bag president of ours has his way giving aid and confort to the many enemies of the Jews on this latest American Arabic mea culpa world tour.He is in Saudi Arabia now kissing the royals asses and begging their pardons.He will no doubt offer them Nuclear parity with Israel as if they don't already have it !

He tells us and the Arabs that we ,America,are the worlds largest Muslim nation and that we also hate the Jews ! Gator the man who ordered the attack on USS Liberty,Moshe Dyan and the man who condoned it President Lyndon Johnson are both dead .Give it up and let it go,you have been loyal to the Men Of Liberty, your shipmates, to a fault !

gator
06-03-2009, 01:37 PM
Would you be overjoyed if the entire Nation of Israel ceased to exist with every man woman and child of Israeli decent dead and replaced by those fun loving Hamas murderers ?Would that appease your anger and hatred of the Jews ?

You just may get your wish after this bean bag president of ours has his way giving aid and confort to the many enemies of the Jews on this latest American Arabic mea culpa world tour.He is in Saudi Arabia now kissing the royals asses and begging their pardons.He will no doubt offer them Nuclear parity with Israel as if they don't already have it !

He tells us and the Arabs that we ,America,are the worlds largest Muslim nation and that we also hate the Jews ! Gator the man who ordered the attack on USS Liberty,Moshe Dyan and the man who condoned it President Lyndon Johnson are both dead .Give it up and let it go,you have been loyal to the Men Of Liberty, your shipmates, to a fault !

I don't really give a shit one way or another if Israel exist or don't exist. It is not my problem or my concern.

I would be overjoyed if my hard earned tax money was not being sent to the Middle East to support brutal apartheid theocratic governments, like Israel. I think we have better use of our money, don't you?

I would be very pleased if we could get real justice for the veterans of the USS Liberty. They are calling for a war crimes investigation against Israel. At least we could do that and enact the suggestions of the Moorer Independent Commission, couldn’t we? What is wrong with that?

I don't think there is a statute of limitations on the murder of Americans, do you? If so then according to you all Bin Laden has to do is hide out for a few more years and then he will be home free, just like the Israelis.

I would exhibit a certain perverse satisfaction if the Palestinians could get a little payback on the goddamn Israelis. I feel that way because as an American I usually side with the oppressed.

I heard Obama last year kissing the ass of the AIPAC at the annual meeting. Like Clinton, McCain and all the other candidates he promised he would send American money and expend American lives to make sure that Israel lived high on the hog. Nothing is going to change much. America will continue to be involved in the entanglement of a foreign conflict that has nothing to do with our own security.

gator
06-03-2009, 01:49 PM
Ah, the Ministry of Hate has finally issued a statement. Funny thing is, I keep asking you to explain your position on the Palestinians in light of the reality of the actual history, and you keep ignoring the questions. Once again, here are the questions that you refuse to answer, because they blow your worldview out of the water:


You've claimed that Israelis kicked the Arabs off of their own land, but if this were the case, how did they do it?
The UN partition plan would have divided up Palestine into two regions, based solely on who was in the majority in those areas. Jews would have only had sovereignty over their own enclaves, while Arabs would have had sovereignty over theirs, while Jerusalem, which has had a Jewish majority since biblical times, would have been an open city. The Jews were willing to accept this, but not the Arabs. Ask yourself why the Arabs would not accept a tiny Jewish state on land in which they were already the majority?
If hatred of Israel is the only thing driving Arab policies, then why is it that they are backing Islamic revolutions in the Philippines, Chechnya, Thailand and Kenya, none of which was ever an ally or supporter of Israel? Why are there Islamiist jihads against Christian Animists in Darfur, Baha'is in Iran, or anywhere else that a sizeable Moslem community butts up against anyone else?



Hamas even has the right to murder Palestinians and blame the Israelis for it. Hamas picked up the opportunity to eliminate hundreds of Fatah members during the fighting and then added them to the body count for the incursion.

Isn't it funny how Gator fantasizes about mass murder of Jews, but then complains whenever he's called out as an antisemite? I'm just sayin'...

I have already exposed the reason why you love Israel more than America so your opinion and your stupid questions do not mean anything to me. You have run away from my questions and refused to get your head out of your Israeli loving ass so you don’t get to ask the questions and answer none.

You have your filthy agenda to support Israel and I have my agenda to stop my tax money from going to a brutal apartheid Middle East country and to get justice for American military men that were murdered by your Israeli friends.

I have a pro American agenda and you have a pro Israel agenda. You can kiss my redneck ass.

gator
06-03-2009, 01:53 PM
Time and time again we have seen periods of peace broken by hamas rockets launched into Israel or a suicide bomber detonating himself among Inocents.

Time and time again we have seen the goddamn Israeli kill Palestinians and steal their land.

The Israelis are the oppressors. They have been for the last 60 years and they have killed a lot of innocent Palestinians. The Palestinians are fighting back. As an American I understand that.

megimoo
06-03-2009, 02:02 PM
I don't really give a shit one way or another if Israel exist or don't exist. It is not my problem or my concern.

I would be overjoyed if my hard earned tax money was not being sent to the Middle East to support brutal apartheid theocratic governments, like Israel. I think we have better use of our money, don't you?

I would be very pleased if we could get real justice for the veterans of the USS Liberty. They are calling for a war crimes investigation against Israel. At least we could do that and enact the suggestions of the Moorer Independent Commission, couldnít we? What is wrong with that?

I don't think there is a statute of limitations on the murder of Americans, do you? If so then according to you all Bin Laden has to do is hide out for a few more years and then he will be home free, just like the Israelis.

I would exhibit a certain perverse satisfaction if the Palestinians could get a little payback on the goddamn Israelis. I feel that way because as an American I usually side with the oppressed.

I heard Obama last year kissing the ass of the AIPAC at the annual meeting. Like Clinton, McCain and all the other candidates he promised he would send American money and expend American lives to make sure that Israel lived high on the hog. Nothing is going to change much. America will continue to be involved in the entanglement of a foreign conflict that has nothing to do with our own security.
You are unlikely to get any justice for the men of USS Liberty from this bunch in Washington they want that episode in history to stay buried and forgotten to protect the party.As for payback for Palestine that's about to happen with Obama giving the Arabs advanced American military hardware.

They will shortly be on a par with Israel and are sure to attack when they have a large enough numerical superiority .Between Russia,Iran and Obama they will have all they need to reduce Israel to cinders and kill or infect most of the Jews.

Look for a five pronged attack on the Jews with an internal riot and a massive Humas Gazan uprising featuring salvos of Saddams germ filled Missiles from both Syria and Lebanon on Israeli city's in range .

The IDF know this is about to happen and are now conducting drills to 'iron out 'any problems but the odds are against them.You may soon have your wish come true Gator !

Lars1701a
06-03-2009, 02:12 PM
Your input is noted but the Palestinians think that it is their land and it is worth fighting for. The Israelis can go back to Europe and Russia anytime they want.

I feel the Israelis are the real terrorists in the area and have been since 1947. The Palestinians are fighting for their land. They have to fight because the goddamn Israelis are bringing in millions of immigrants. Most of them from Russia.

The Israelis use American made weapons to kill Palestinian children so donít give me your crocodile tears over the Palestinians fighting back. Both sides kill children. In fact over the years the Israelis have killed more Palestinians than the Palestinians have killed Israelis.


Hey slick hate to break this to you but the jews ie Israelis have been there for 1000's of years. :rolleyes:


Before 1947 (correct me if i am wrong) there was no Palestine. If they want a home they should fight Jodan.

Lars1701a
06-03-2009, 02:15 PM
Time and time again we have seen the goddamn Israeli kill Palestinians and steal their land.

The Israelis are the oppressors. They have been for the last 60 years and they have killed a lot of innocent Palestinians. The Palestinians are fighting back. As an American I understand that.

If you call yourself a Christian (which in Gods eyes comes before before being an American) Any hate, violence you bestow on Israelis will be returned in kind. Disregard this if you are non Christian, but sparky they are Gods chosen people.

Zathras
06-03-2009, 02:25 PM
Sounds like you've chosen your side.

And that side is the same one as Hitler and the Nazis of the 30's and 40's, Hamas, Hezbola, Iran's leadership, the late Yassir Arafat and his boys, Stormfront.com, the KKK, and any other jew hating organization out there that I missed.

If that's what's passing for "moral clarity" these days, I want nothing of it.

Rockntractor
06-03-2009, 02:39 PM
Time and time again we have seen the goddamn Israeli kill Palestinians and steal their land.

The Israelis are the oppressors. They have been for the last 60 years and they have killed a lot of innocent Palestinians. The Palestinians are fighting back. As an American I understand that.
You don't answer peoples specific questions you just keep droning on with your antisemetic hatred.

Odysseus
06-03-2009, 03:28 PM
I have already exposed the reason why you love Israel more than America so your opinion and your stupid questions do not mean anything to me. You have run away from my questions and refused to get your head out of your Israeli loving ass so you donít get to ask the questions and answer none.
If, by that, you mean that you got me to admit that I was Jewish, it's not like I tried to hide it. As for your questions, I've answered everything that you've ever asked, but you've never answered mine. Instead, you hurl obscenities and pretend that this is intelligenct discourse, when I could get a more substantive argument from a crap fight at the Bronx Zoo monkey house.

You have your filthy agenda to support Israel and I have my agenda to stop my tax money from going to a brutal apartheid Middle East country and to get justice for American military men that were murdered by your Israeli friends.

I have a pro American agenda and you have a pro Israel agenda. You can kiss my redneck ass.
My agenda is the defense of my country and its allies. Your agenda appears to be genocide.

Time and time again we have seen the goddamn Israeli kill Palestinians and steal their land.

The Israelis are the oppressors. They have been for the last 60 years and they have killed a lot of innocent Palestinians. The Palestinians are fighting back. As an American I understand that.
You keep making the claim that the Israelis stole Palestinian land, but you've never answered my question as to how they did it. Could it be that you don't really know the history of the region and are just regurgitating talking points to mask your ignorance? As an American (although not a "real American" like you, apparently), I understand that the Israelis have bent over backwards to accomodate the Palestinians and gotten nothing but empty promises, lies and violence in return. If Israel really was a violent, apartheid state, as you keep putting it, how long would it take for Israel to really mop up Hamas and Hezbollah without regard to civilian casualties? The only reason that Israel hasn't done it is because, unlike their enemies, they respect human life, even if it's the lives of those who hate them. Were you aware that Gaza was completely dependent on Israel for electricity and water, even Hamas, which lobbed thousands of rockets at Israeli civilians? Or that Israel could have cut off the electricity and water at any time during the incursion into Gaza, but didn't, because they are more concerned for the people of Gaza than Hamas is? While Hamas and Hezbollah deliberately endanger civilians for propaganda purposes, the Israelis put their own people at risk rather than simply engaging with heavy weapons from safe ranges. Ironically, if you found yourself dropped in Gaza tomorrow, you'd be safe with the Israelis, but the Palestinians would kill you in a heartbeat for not being a Muslim.

You don't answer peoples specific questions you just keep droning on with your antisemetic hatred.
Okay, so I'm not the only one who's noticed? :D

gator
06-03-2009, 05:49 PM
You don't answer peoples specific questions you just keep droning on with your antisemetic hatred.

Understanding that it is not in the best interest of the US to support Israel and understanding that Israel has been the aggressor in the Middle East conflict is not anti Semitic. Wanting justice for the crewmembers of the USS Liberty is not anti Semitism. Israel supporters spin it that way because they can’t stand to have anybody point out the moral clarity of the US staying out of entanglements that have nothing to do with our security. They are afraid that if the majority of Americans ever felt that way Israel wouldn’t get any more American money and that is a fate worst than death as far as they are concerned. They want Israel to live well no matter the cost to America.

As far as answering questions I see that you are a relative newby on CU. I suggest you go back into the archives and pull up other discussions about Israel and you will see who runs away from answering the real questions.

The filthy Israeli supporters have a little dog and pony show they drag out every time someone has the audacity to hold Israel accountable for the harm that it has done to America.

The first little pony they trot out is the “Israel can do no wrong” pony. They spout the Israel spin on everything and ignore the real facts of Israel brutality over the years. This little pony is big on denial.

The second pony that trots out is the “it is in the interest of the US to fight Israel’s enemies” pony. This is really a pathetic little show because they completely ignore the fact that we have pissed a billion people off because we support Israel. They also ignore the advice of our Founding Fathers to stay out of foreign entanglements. Supporting Israel is like the worst foreign entanglement we have ever done.

When all else fails they do the “anti Semtic” dog and pony show. In this part of the entertainment they usually use names like “Nazi” and “Stormfront” and accuse the poster of killing 6 million Jews in WWII, or something.

Odysseys is particularly loathsome. If you go back into the archives you will see that he has demeaned many brave American men because they question Israel. Two of the men that the shithead demeaned were awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor.

Odysseys has made it crystal clear that his loyalties lies with Israel and not with the interest of the US. I have exposed him big time in other threads and he deserves no respect. He is not loyal to America and I don’t feel a need to answer his hate again and again.

gator
06-03-2009, 06:00 PM
If you call yourself a Christian (which in Gods eyes comes before before being an American) Any hate, violence you bestow on Israelis will be returned in kind. Disregard this if you are non Christian, but sparky they are Gods chosen people.

I don't think so but thanks for brining up this subject so that I can ‘splain it to you.

Christians believe that Christians are “God’s chosen people”. The New Testament is very clear on that. Look at the New Covenant.

As far as Christians are concerned Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Wiccans and the rest will not enter into the Kingdom of Heaven because they do not accept the Grace of God through the blood of Jesus Christ. I am sorry but I didn’t make up the rules. I just quote them.

Rockntractor
06-03-2009, 06:14 PM
The first little pony they trot out is the “Israel can do no wrong” pony.
I don't give Israel a free pass. I am concerned that many of them are letting down their gaurd and giving in to political correctness. They are starting to fight like we do with one hand tied behind their back. They will not survive if they continue to do this. My biggest fear for Israel is that they once again will march willingly into the ovens.

Lars1701a
06-03-2009, 06:17 PM
I don't think so but thanks for brining up this subject so that I can ‘splain it to you.

Christians believe that Christians are “God’s chosen people”. The New Testament is very clear on that. Look at the New Covenant.

As far as Christians are concerned Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Wiccans and the rest will not enter into the Kingdom of Heaven because they do not accept the Grace of God through the blood of Jesus Christ. I am sorry but I didn’t make up the rules. I just quote them.

Is that what your buddies at stormfront say?


Hey slick in the end times God is going to give the Jews a last chance to accept him thats how much he loves them.


You are wrong They were, are and always will be his chosen people. Why do you think we are protecting them?? when they divert from Gods path they have payed dearly.

Lars1701a
06-03-2009, 06:31 PM
I don't think so but thanks for brining up this subject so that I can ‘splain it to you.

Christians believe that Christians are “God’s chosen people”. The New Testament is very clear on that. Look at the New Covenant.



As far as Christians are concerned Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Wiccans and the rest will not enter into the Kingdom of Heaven because they do not accept the Grace of God through the blood of Jesus Christ. I am sorry but I didn’t make up the rules. I just quote them.

Give me a verse that backs up your statement.

On edit:The NT did not remove Gods promise to Abraham. God knew the plan of salvation when the promise was made.

gator
06-03-2009, 07:15 PM
Is that what your buddies at stormfront say?


Hey slick in the end times God is going to give the Jews a last chance to accept him thats how much he loves them.


You are wrong They were, are and always will be his chosen people. Why do you think we are protecting them?? when they divert from Gods path they have payed dearly.


I don't know what Stromfront says because I never have visted the site.

It does, however, say that in the Bible and I will be glad to quote the scripture to you if you are really interested.

When Jesus came to take away our sins he laid out the ground rules for being God's chosen people. It is very simple; have Faith and accept the Grace of God. Jews, along with many other people, do not accept the Grace of God. They are stuck on the Old Covenant that Jesus says no longer applies because Man was incapable of adhering to the Ten Commandments and that is why He came to take away our sins. This is Christianity 101 and it is a much more fundamental tenet of Christianity than the allegorical rantings in Revelation. Many Christians believe that the message in Revelation was one of prophecies of the Roman Empire and has nothing to do with the end of the world.

Now, there are some very fundamental Christian sects that claim that Jews will enter the Kingdom of God just because they are Jews but the sects have no paid attention to the message of the New Testament. They are a little bit like the fundamentalist Muslims in that they disregard the important message in favor of end times prophecies.

Rockntractor
06-03-2009, 07:20 PM
I don't know what Stromfront says because I never have visted the site.

It does, however, say that in the Bible and I will be glad to quote the scripture to you if you are really interested.

When Jesus came to take away our sins he laid out the ground rules for being God's chosen people. It is very simple; have Faith and accept the Grace of God. Jews, along with many other people, do not accept the Grace of God. They are stuck on the Old Covenant that Jesus says no longer applies because Man was incapable of adhering to the Ten Commandments and that is why He came to take away our sins. This is Christianity 101 and it is a much more fundamental tenet of Christianity than the allegorical rantings in Revelation. Many Christians believe that the message in Revelation was one of prophecies of the Roman Empire and has nothing to do with the end of the world.

Now, there are some very fundamental Christian sects that claim that Jews will enter the Kingdom of God just because they are Jews but the sects have no paid attention to the message of the New Testament. They are a little bit like the fundamentalist Muslims in that they disregard the important message in favor of end times prophecies.
The dispensationalist curches I have had contact with believe the jews will come to faith in the last days and be saved. I have never met any universalist dispensational evangelicals but that doesn't mean there aren't some out there.

gator
06-03-2009, 11:27 PM
The dispensationalist curches I have had contact with believe the jews will come to faith in the last days and be saved. I have never met any universalist dispensational evangelicals but that doesn't mean there aren't some out there.


If you think that then God bless you. It doesn't jive with the basic tenet of Christianity but what the hay, you can believe anything you want.

Christianity is all about accepting the fact that God takes responsibility for our sins because he gave us free will. Jews donít accept that premise. They are stuck on the Old Covenant of the Ten Commandant, which makes them a deeds based religion. Not much different from the Mormons or the Muslims.

Rockntractor
06-03-2009, 11:30 PM
If you think that then God bless you. It doesn't jive with the basic tenet of Christianity but what the hay, you can believe anything you want.

Christianity is all about accepting the fact that God takes responsibility for our sins because he gave us free will. Jews don’t accept that premise. They are stuck on the Old Covenant of the Ten Commandant, which makes them a deeds based religion. Not much different from the Mormons or the Muslims.
You entirely missed my point. Read it again and then tell me specifically what i said.

Rockntractor
06-03-2009, 11:41 PM
While individual Jews must come to Christ for salvation, God is still not finished with Israel as a nation. The Bible tells us that in the end times, Israel will finally recognize Jesus as their Messiah (Zechariah 12:10). Jeremiah 33:8, Ezekiel 11:17, Romans 11:26 predicted that in the end times Israel would be regenerated, restored, and regathered in their homeland. This regathering already took place in 1948 when Israel was recognized as a sovereign country by the United Nations. (Please see our article on Israel’s role in the end times). Clearly, God is not finished with the Jewish people.

http://www.gotquestions.org/Jews-saved.html

I am not a dispensationalist although there are points where I agree with them this is a dispensationalist View of the conversion of the jews in the last days.

Lars1701a
06-04-2009, 07:20 AM
I don't know what Stromfront says because I never have visted the site.

It does, however, say that in the Bible and I will be glad to quote the scripture to you if you are really interested.

When Jesus came to take away our sins he laid out the ground rules for being God's chosen people. It is very simple; have Faith and accept the Grace of God. Jews, along with many other people, do not accept the Grace of God. They are stuck on the Old Covenant that Jesus says no longer applies because Man was incapable of adhering to the Ten Commandments and that is why He came to take away our sins. This is Christianity 101 and it is a much more fundamental tenet of Christianity than the allegorical rantings in Revelation. Many Christians believe that the message in Revelation was one of prophecies of the Roman Empire and has nothing to do with the end of the world.

Now, there are some very fundamental Christian sects that claim that Jews will enter the Kingdom of God just because they are Jews but the sects have no paid attention to the message of the New Testament. They are a little bit like the fundamentalist Muslims in that they disregard the important message in favor of end times prophecies.

I ASKED you to point it out to me in the NT where it says God took back his promise to Abraham.

You are just masking your hatred of Jews behind Christianity.

You are really a bonehead, in one line you are for the underdog but then bash Israel. They are the UNDERDOG, they are surrounded by enemies on all sides that would love to invade and destroy them.

If I said it once I said it a million times if the Palestinians wanted peace, real peace they would have had it by now. They like all denizens of the ME want to crush Israel. Nice to now you throw yourself in with their lot.

Lars1701a
06-04-2009, 07:22 AM
http://www.gotquestions.org/Jews-saved.html

I am not a dispensationalist although there are points where I agree with them this is a dispensationalist View of the conversion of the jews in the last days.

My point exactly.

gator
06-04-2009, 08:49 AM
I ASKED you to point it out to me in the NT where it says God took back his promise to Abraham.

You are just masking your hatred of Jews behind Christianity.

You are really a bonehead, in one line you are for the underdog but then bash Israel. They are the UNDERDOG, they are surrounded by enemies on all sides that would love to invade and destroy them.

If I said it once I said it a million times if the Palestinians wanted peace, real peace they would have had it by now. They like all denizens of the ME want to crush Israel. Nice to now you throw yourself in with their lot.

" For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God., not as a result of works, that no one should boast." [Ephesians 2:6, 7]

This is the central tenet of Christianity and I am frankly surprised that you have a difficult time understanding the concept. Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Wiccans and other religions (even including the Mormons who claim to be Christians) donít accept the concept of Grace.

Every Jew , Muslim etc can be a ďchosen oneĒ by accepting the Grace of God through the blood of Christ. If they donít then they are condemned to Hell.

How can the goddamn Israelis be considered the underdogs when they have nuclear weapons and every high tech American made weapon known to Man? They use these American made weapons to kill Palestinians women, children and non combatants. They do it with brutality as they are stealing land to make room for the millions of European and Russian immigrants.

The Israeli brutalize Christian Palestinians along side the Muslims. There is a sizeable population of Christian Palestinians and they get their land taken away at the same rate as the Muslim Palestinians. This stupid NeoCon idea that we should ally with the Israelis because they are killing Muslims because Muslims attacked us on 911 doesnít even hold water because the Israelis murder Christians Palestinians along with the Muslims population.

There is a member on CU that lived in the Middle East as a young child. Her father was an American diplomat. She will tell you a story of the Israelis destroying the church she attended and was Confirmed in.

Last year a couple of Israelis visited the shooting range that I frequent. They were on vacation in Florida. These assholes said they were members of the IDF. What really made me sick was that these shitheads were bragging about how they used M-1 Carbines to ambush Palestinian civilians. Civilians that were non combatants. They were laughing and giggling about it.

The Palestinians have been pushed into ghettos and enclaves reminiscent of the Nazi regime and that makes them an underdog as far as I am concerned. I donít have any love for them but I understand that they are being brutalized so the Israelis can live well. As an American I donít like that shit. I really donít like the idea that my tax money is being used to supply the weapons that are being used to kill the Palestinians. That is unacceptable.

I understand why the Palestinians are fighting back. I would also fight back if I were in their position. No American would accept being treated like the Palestinians. I also understand why they hate Americans since we are supplying their enemy with weapons that are used to kill their children.

The Israeli spin is that Palestinians are evil Muslims that want to destroy the West and besides they are treated well by the Israelis. It kind of reminds me of the claims of the Southern politicians back in the 1930s that Negroes should be happy because they have the right to vote and the same freedoms at the White Man.

Rockntractor
06-04-2009, 09:10 AM
How can the ******* Israelis be considered the underdogs when they have nuclear weapons and every high tech American made weapon known to Man? We have cow pasrures bigger than Israel and they are surrounded by arabs!

gator
06-04-2009, 09:53 AM
We have cow pasrures bigger than Israel and they are surrounded by arabs!

You do know that the Palestinians are surrounded by the Israelis don't you? You do know that the Palestinians are in ghettos and that the Israelis are using American made weapons to kill them, don't you?

You failed to comment on my point that no American would put up with the same level of brutality as the Palestinians.

As I have said before I really don't care what the Israelis do. I just recognize that they are a brutal apartheid theocracy just like every other pissant Middle East country.

Although I have sympathy for the brutalized Palestinians and understand why they fight back against the Israelis and understand why they hate Americans for giving weapons to the Israelis at the end of the day I could really care less. I just donít want my money being used to provide weapons to the Israelis so they can kill Palestinians. It is not my fight and we should not be intervening in the conflict. Israel is a rich country. Let them provide for their own defense. I work too hard for my money for it to be given to the Israelis so they can live well.

I love America and not Israel. I want us to start listening to our Founding Fathers instead of the filthy pro Israel lobby. We donít need to be involved in the foreign entanglement of guaranteeing the security of Israel. It is like the worst foreign policy decision we ever made and it has been a disaster for us. The Israelis get to live high on the hog and we pay for it. It is also very immoral for us to back a brutal apartheid theocracy like Israel. We are better than that.

Rockntractor
06-04-2009, 10:00 AM
I love America and not Israel. I want us to start listening to our Founding Fathers instead of the filthy pro Israel lobby. We don’t need to be involved in the foreign entanglement of guaranteeing the security of Israel. It is like the worst foreign policy decision we ever made and it has been a disaster for us. The Israelis get to live high on the hog and we pay for it. It is also very immoral for us to back a brutal apartheid theocracy like Israel. We are better than that.

You convinced me. we will just let their enemies exterminate them.
But they control our media and our finacial institutions. What should we do with them over here?

Zathras
06-04-2009, 11:47 AM
We have cow pasrures bigger than Israel and they are surrounded by arabs!

Herr Gator has forgotten the saying "Quantity has a quality all it's own".

Odysseus
06-04-2009, 01:19 PM
Your input is noted but the Palestinians think that it is their land and it is worth fighting for. The Israelis can go back to Europe and Russia anytime they want.
So, just thinking that it's their land makes it so? Obama doesn't think that you should own guns (and in your case, given what we euphemistically refer to as your state of mind, he may have a point), so does that give him the right to take them away from you and inflict terror on you and everyone who worships as you do?


I feel the Israelis are the real terrorists in the area and have been since 1947. The Palestinians are fighting for their land. They have to fight because the goddamn Israelis are bringing in millions of immigrants. Most of them from Russia.
Why did the Arabs have to try to annihilate Jews in 1948? Why did they have antisemitic riots in the 1920s and 30s? What justified them trying to murder Jews who were fleeing the Holocaust?

The Israelis use American made weapons to kill Palestinian children so don’t give me your crocodile tears over the Palestinians fighting back. Both sides kill children. In fact over the years the Israelis have killed more Palestinians than the Palestinians have killed Israelis.
Israel didn't start getting US weapons until the late 1960s. Before that, they were on their own. Also, the PLO was formed in 1964, when Egypt and Jordan owned the occupied territories. Why didn't they feel the need to attack Egypt and Jordan, who had more than twenty years to establish a Palestinian state on land that they had conquered?

As far as answering questions I see that you are a relative newby on CU. I suggest you go back into the archives and pull up other discussions about Israel and you will see who runs away from answering the real questions.
Allow me to provide the links. Here is one where I answer Gator's questions and repeat mine yet again. (http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showpost.php?p=22237&postcount=26) Then there's this page, where I asked Gator the same questions five times and he failed to respond, claiming that you had already done so and that he doesn't have to answer my questions. (http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showthread.php?t=3155&highlight=You%27ve+claimed+Israelis+kicked+Arabs+l and%2C+case%2C&page=4) BTW, here's my answer to his questions (http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showpost.php?p=43599&postcount=158), to which he responded (http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showpost.php?p=43642&postcount=160)with his usually slew of Tourette's syndrome-inspired rage, attacks on my patriotism and manhood, but no substantive rebuttal.


Odysseys is particularly loathsome. If you go back into the archives you will see that he has demeaned many brave American men because they question Israel. Two of the men that the shithead demeaned were awarded the Congressional Medal of Honor.

Odysseys has made it crystal clear that his loyalties lies with Israel and not with the interest of the US. I have exposed him big time in other threads and he deserves no respect. He is not loyal to America and I don’t feel a need to answer his hate again and again.
Gator is lying. I have demeaned no one except him, but since he considers anything other than complete acquiesence to his line of garbage as an attack on the morals, honor and personal hygene of the source, he makes this claim. He's unhinged. But, don't take my word for it. Go back and read the links.


" For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God., not as a result of works, that no one should boast." [Ephesians 2:6, 7]

This is the central tenet of Christianity and I am frankly surprised that you have a difficult time understanding the concept. Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Wiccans and other religions (even including the Mormons who claim to be Christians) don’t accept the concept of Grace.

Every Jew , Muslim etc can be a “chosen one” by accepting the Grace of God through the blood of Christ. If they don’t then they are condemned to Hell.
And since we Jews are condemned to Hell, it doesn't matter if we're slaughtered in this world, since we're damned in the next. Gator's quite the piece of work, isn't he?


" There is a member on CU that lived in the Middle East as a young child. Her father was an American diplomat. She will tell you a story of the Israelis destroying the church she attended and was Confirmed in.
And just who is that? And why hasn't it been brought up previously?


" Last year a couple of Israelis visited the shooting range that I frequent. They were on vacation in Florida. These assholes said they were members of the IDF. What really made me sick was that these shitheads were bragging about how they used M-1 Carbines to ambush Palestinian civilians. Civilians that were non combatants. They were laughing and giggling about it.
Assuming that this is true. We only have your word for it, and your word on this subject is about as good as Geobbels'.

" The Palestinians have been pushed into ghettos and enclaves reminiscent of the Nazi regime and that makes them an underdog as far as I am concerned. I don’t have any love for them but I understand that they are being brutalized so the Israelis can live well. As an American I don’t like that shit. I really don’t like the idea that my tax money is being used to supply the weapons that are being used to kill the Palestinians. That is unacceptable.
The Palestinians were pushed into those Ghettos by their fellow Arabs in 1948. When Israel took over the territories, they tried to build new housing, but anyone who left the camps was murdered by the PLO. Get the facts right.

The Israeli spin is that Palestinians are evil Muslims that want to destroy the West and besides they are treated well by the Israelis. It kind of reminds me of the claims of the Southern politicians back in the 1930s that Negroes should be happy because they have the right to vote and the same freedoms at the White Man.
Again, if this were true, then Islamic violence against others wouldn't be an issue, unless they supported Israel. And yet, it's not the case. Every place where Islam abuts another culture is a site of violence. India, Russia/Chechnya, Thailand, Nigeria, Argentina, France and a host of other places have nothing to do with the Palestinian conflict, and yet they are sites of conflict between Muslims and non-Muslims, especially Jews, who are specifically singled out and targeted. Explain that, please, in the context of your claim that this is all Israeli propaganda.

You do know that the Palestinians are surrounded by the Israelis don't you? You do know that the Palestinians are in ghettos and that the Israelis are using American made weapons to kill them, don't you?
First, the Palestinians aren't surrounded. Gaza borders Israel and Egypt. The West Bank is bordered by Israel and Jordan, so it's not exactly surrounded, now is it? And you know that Jordan, as part of the Palestine mandate assigned to Britain after WWI, is a Palestinian state, don't you? So Israel is actually surrounded, not just by Arabs, but by Palestinians. As for the use of American weapons, the Israelis take great pains to avoid civilian casualties. It's Hamas that deliberately causes them, both among Israelis and Arabs. And, BTW, Hezbollah also rains rockets down on Israel and has been doing so since the early 1970s, long before Israel was forced to invade. Why is it that a Lebanese militia that has no contact with Israel is justified in attacking and inflicting casualties on civilians? For that matter, what American would tolerate a deluge of rockets on American civilians from Mexico or Canada (okay, a lot of Democrats would, but you get my point)? Why is it that Palestinians aren't supposed to put up with the kid gloves treatment that they get from Israel, but Israelis are supposed to tolerate suicide bombings, kidnappings and rockets?

Oh, and Israel offered to give back Gaza to the Egyptians, but they didn't want it, and Jordan gave up any claim to the West Bank years ago, which makes sense, as neither country had any legitimate claim to either place, but be that as it may, they had the opportunity to create Palestinian states when they had the territory for twenty years, and Egypt had the opportunity again in 1980. Why didn't they? And for that matter, Israel left Gaza several years ago, although they continue to supply water and power there. Why is Hamas spending the billions of dollars in aid that it gets from the EU and the Arab states on a war that it can't win instead of feeding, clothing and housing the people that it claims to represent?

I love America and not Israel. I want us to start listening to our Founding Fathers instead of the filthy pro Israel lobby. We don’t need to be involved in the foreign entanglement of guaranteeing the security of Israel. It is like the worst foreign policy decision we ever made and it has been a disaster for us. The Israelis get to live high on the hog and we pay for it. It is also very immoral for us to back a brutal apartheid theocracy like Israel. We are better than that.
So far, the only thing that I've seen that you love is your gun room, except for the carpet. America can do without your parody of patriotism. BTW, I've asked a lot of questions in my reply to your diatribe. I don't expect any answers, just insults, but for those who've never seen you in action before, it will be instructive.

Zathras
06-04-2009, 01:30 PM
So far, the only thing that I've seen that you love is your gun room, except for the carpet. America can do without your parody of patriotism. BTW, I've asked a lot of questions in my reply to your diatribe. I don't expect any answers, just insults, but for those who've never seen you in action before, it will be instructive.

The problem is Herr Gator can't admit he's wrong and you're right because, if he does, it will prove he's a hypocrit.

Lars1701a
06-04-2009, 01:31 PM
" For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God., not as a result of works, that no one should boast." [Ephesians 2:6, 7]

This is the central tenet of Christianity and I am frankly surprised that you have a difficult time understanding the concept. Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Wiccans and other religions (even including the Mormons who claim to be Christians) donít accept the concept of Grace.

Every Jew , Muslim etc can be a ďchosen oneĒ by accepting the Grace of God through the blood of Christ. If they donít then they are condemned to Hell.

How can the goddamn Israelis be considered the underdogs when they have nuclear weapons and every high tech American made weapon known to Man? They use these American made weapons to kill Palestinians women, children and non combatants. They do it with brutality as they are stealing land to make room for the millions of European and Russian immigrants.

The Israeli brutalize Christian Palestinians along side the Muslims. There is a sizeable population of Christian Palestinians and they get their land taken away at the same rate as the Muslim Palestinians. This stupid NeoCon idea that we should ally with the Israelis because they are killing Muslims because Muslims attacked us on 911 doesnít even hold water because the Israelis murder Christians Palestinians along with the Muslims population.

There is a member on CU that lived in the Middle East as a young child. Her father was an American diplomat. She will tell you a story of the Israelis destroying the church she attended and was Confirmed in.

Last year a couple of Israelis visited the shooting range that I frequent. They were on vacation in Florida. These assholes said they were members of the IDF. What really made me sick was that these shitheads were bragging about how they used M-1 Carbines to ambush Palestinian civilians. Civilians that were non combatants. They were laughing and giggling about it.

The Palestinians have been pushed into ghettos and enclaves reminiscent of the Nazi regime and that makes them an underdog as far as I am concerned. I donít have any love for them but I understand that they are being brutalized so the Israelis can live well. As an American I donít like that shit. I really donít like the idea that my tax money is being used to supply the weapons that are being used to kill the Palestinians. That is unacceptable.

I understand why the Palestinians are fighting back. I would also fight back if I were in their position. No American would accept being treated like the Palestinians. I also understand why they hate Americans since we are supplying their enemy with weapons that are used to kill their children.

The Israeli spin is that Palestinians are evil Muslims that want to destroy the West and besides they are treated well by the Israelis. It kind of reminds me of the claims of the Southern politicians back in the 1930s that Negroes should be happy because they have the right to vote and the same freedoms at the White Man.

I am still waiting for an answer to my question. :rolleyes:


Where and when did God take back his promise to Abraham? The Jews have had and still have God's blessing even though they have not accepted the Lord.


Again you fail to see that the Palestinians cause a lot of their own problems by electing terrorists for leaders.


Again Israel was there long before the Palestinian was.

gator
06-04-2009, 02:34 PM
You convinced me. we will just let their enemies exterminate them.
But they control our media and our finacial institutions. What should we do with them over here?

The fact that other people want to exterminate Israel is of little or no concern to me. It is not my duty as an American to provide for the security of every Tom, Dick and David in the world. Israel is a rich country. They led the world in the creation of per capita of millionaires last year. The average filthy Israeli spends less per capita on defense than the average American. We are being taxed heavily and giving the money to the goddamn Israelis so they can live well. Let them provide for their own defense. Donít you think that would be a smart thing?

From a moral standpoint we shouldn't be supporting a brutal apartheid theocracy. We shouldnít be giving weapons and money to a country that steals lands from innocent people and uses our weapons to kill children and non combatants. From an economic standpoint we shouldn't be borrowing money from the Chinese and giving it to the goddamn Israelis. Not when we are running an almost two trillion dollar a year deficit.

I love America, not Israel. It is pathetic to see the assholes in this country that will sell America down the river just so their Israeli suckbuddies can live well. It is disgusting and the people that do it are traitors to America. You see a good representation of those traitors posting on CU.

gator
06-04-2009, 02:44 PM
The problem is Herr Gator can't admit he's wrong and you're right because, if he does, it will prove he's a hypocrit.


So you trotted out the "Herr Gator" pony? Like I said in a previous post when all else fails the pro Israel dickheads uses the anti Semitic card. Israel is a country, not a religion, ethnic or racial group.

I am right on this issue. From a moral and economic standpoint America should not have ever embarked on the path to guarantee the security of Israel. It was the worst foreign policy decision we have ever made. We have paid dearly for it and we are immoral for doing so given the record of brutality of the Israelis against the Palestinians. We should be ashamed!

If you and a few other dickheads want to be a traitor to America and put Israelís interest above Americaís then there is not much I can do about it except to occasionally point out how filthy and disgusting it is.

Rockntractor
06-04-2009, 02:54 PM
I love America, not Israel. It is pathetic to see the assholes in this country that will sell America down the river just so their Israeli suckbuddies can live well. It is disgusting and the people that do it are traitors to America. You see a good representation of those traitors posting on CU.
All you say may be true as far as your love for america but your view of Israel only exists amoung far left liberals and white supremists. you may not belong in either of these groups but you are certainly not in agreement with most conservatives. At what age did you form this point of view and who influenced you.

gator
06-04-2009, 02:56 PM
I am still waiting for an answer to my question. :rolleyes:


Where and when did God take back his promise to Abraham? The Jews have had and still have God's blessing even though they have not accepted the Lord.


Again you fail to see that the Palestinians cause a lot of their own problems by electing terrorists for leaders.


Again Israel was there long before the Palestinian was.

The Russian and European Jews were not in Israel before the Palestinians. The European and Russian Jews displaced the Palestinians and forced them into ghettos and killed their children and took their homes and land and generally treated them like shit. If you condone that then you have no morals.

If you want to believe that Jews are going to Heaven then go right ahead. It is against Christian doctrine but that is fine is that is what you want to believe. Some Christians believe that they have to handle snakes or speak in tongues so believing that someone can enter in the Kingdom of God without Jesus Christ as their Savior is possible.

megimoo
06-04-2009, 03:55 PM
The Russian and European Jews were not in Israel before the Palestinians. The European and Russian Jews displaced the Palestinians and forced them into ghettos and killed their children and took their homes and land and generally treated them like shit. If you condone that then you have no morals.

If you want to believe that Jews are going to Heaven then go right ahead. It is against Christian doctrine but that is fine is that is what you want to believe. Some Christians believe that they have to handle snakes or speak in tongues so believing that someone can enter in the Kingdom of God without Jesus Christ as their Savior is possible.



"The Russian and European Jews were not in Israel before the Palestinians."
.............................
Ashkenazic and Sephardic Jews

The pages in this site are written from the Ashkenazic Jewish perspective. Ashkenazic Jews are the Jews of France, Germany, and Eastern Europe and their descendants. Sephardic Jews are the Jews of Spain, Portugal, North Africa and the Middle East and their descendants. Sephardic Jews are often subdivided into Sephardim (from Spain and Portugal) and Mizrachim (from the Northern Africa and the Middle East), though there is much overlap between those groups. Until the 1400s, the Iberian Peninsula, North Africa and the Middle East were all controlled by Muslims, who generally allowed Jews to move freely throughout the region. When the Jews were expelled from Spain in 1492, many of them were absorbed into existing Mizrachi communities in Northern Africa and the Middle East. .
...........................
Gator where have you been ?Have you ever heard of the Great temples of Solomon, This First Temple was destroyed by the Babylonians in 587 BC.Construction of a new temple was begun in 537 BC; after a hiatus, work resumed 520 BC, with completion occurring in 516 BC and dedication in 515. According to the Book of Ezra, rebuilding of the Temple was authorized by Cyrus the Great and ratified by Darius the Great. Five centuries later, this Second Temple was renovated by Herod the Great in about 20 BC, also known as Herod's Temple. It was subsequently destroyed by the Romans in 70 AD (see The Siege of Jerusalem in 70 AD).
........................................
Jewish Diaspora ("diaspora" ="dispersion, scattering")
The Jewish state comes to an end in 70 AD, when the Romans begin to actively drive Jews from the home they had lived in for over a millennium. But the Jewish Diaspora ("diaspora" ="dispersion, scattering") had begun long before the Romans had even dreamed of Judaea. When the Assyrians conquered Israel in 722, the Hebrew inhabitants were scattered all over the Middle East; these early victims of the dispersion disappeared utterly from the pages of history. However, when Nebuchadnezzar deported the Judaeans in 597 and 586 BC, he allowed them to remain in a unified community in Babylon. Another group of Judaeans fled to Egypt, where they settled in the Nile delta. So from 597 onwards, there were three distinct groups of Hebrews: a group in Babylon and other parts of the Middle East, a group in Judaea, and another group in Egypt. Thus, 597 is considered the beginning date of the Jewish Diaspora. While Cyrus the Persian allowed the Judaeans to return to their homeland in 538 BC, most chose to remain in Babylon. A large number of Jews in Egypt became mercenaries in Upper Egypt on an island called the Elephantine. All of these Jews retained their religion, identity, and social customs; both under the Persians and the Greeks, they were allowed to run their lives under their own laws. Some converted to other religions; still others combined the Yahweh cult with local cults; but the majority clung to the Hebraic religion and its new-found core document, the Torah.
http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/History/Diaspora.html
........................................

Odysseus
06-04-2009, 04:02 PM
The problem is Herr Gator can't admit he's wrong and you're right because, if he does, it will prove he's a hypocrit.
Very true. And it also means that he'll have lost an argument to a Jew.

I am still waiting for an answer to my question. :rolleyes:
Welcome to the club. :rolleyes:

All you say may be true as far as your love for america but your view of Israel only exists amoung far left liberals and white supremists. you may not belong in either of these groups but you are certainly not in agreement with most conservatives. At what age did you form this point of view and who influenced you.
Goebbels, obviously. Julius Streicher, and I'm sure that the Protocols of the Elders of Zion are prominently displayed among Gator's reading lists.

The Russian and European Jews were not in Israel before the Palestinians. The European and Russian Jews displaced the Palestinians and forced them into ghettos and killed their children and took their homes and land and generally treated them like shit. If you condone that then you have no morals.
Lies. The Eurpean Jews began moving to Israel in the 1890s, but there was always a Jewish presence in Israel, especially in Jerusalem, which had a Jewish majority as far back as the 1890s, with a plurality before that according to the Ottoman census data. I've provided this information before, but you obvious don't read anything that doesn't conform to your worldview. However, for the edification of those who aren't raving antisemites, here is the data for Jerusalem:

Year Total Muslim Jewish Christian % Jews
1844 15,510 5,000 7,120 3,390 45.9
1876 25,030 7,560 12,000 5,470 47.9
1896 45,420 8,560 28,112 8,748 61.9
1922 52,081 13,411 33,971 4,699 65.2
1931 90,451 19,894 51,222 19,335 56.6
1945 164,330 33,680 99,320 31,330 60.4


If you want to believe that Jews are going to Heaven then go right ahead. It is against Christian doctrine but that is fine is that is what you want to believe. Some Christians believe that they have to handle snakes or speak in tongues so believing that someone can enter in the Kingdom of God without Jesus Christ as their Savior is possible.
There's a difference between believing that Jews don't go to Heaven and wanting to send us to Hell. And as you've demonstrated, your fantasy is sending every Jew in Israel to Hell, as well as any American Jew who opposes your lunacy. Get help. Seriously.

megimoo
06-04-2009, 04:07 PM
I ASKED you to point it out to me in the NT where it says God took back his promise to Abraham.

You are just masking your hatred of Jews behind Christianity.

You are really a bonehead, in one line you are for the underdog but then bash Israel. They are the UNDERDOG, they are surrounded by enemies on all sides that would love to invade and destroy them.

If I said it once I said it a million times if the Palestinians wanted peace, real peace they would have had it by now. They like all denizens of the ME want to crush Israel. Nice to now you throw yourself in with their lot.
He didn't and wouldn't .GODS word true !He will further chastise Israel but never abandon her.Like an unfaithful wife who goes astray GOD who is love will bring her back home to himself .

He will punish her unfaithfulness as he already has but finally when she has fully repented he will take her to his bosom again as in the days of David the King !

Genesis 22:18 "In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice."
..............................
Genesis 24:35 "The LORD has greatly blessed my master, so that he has become rich; and He has given him flocks and herds, and silver and gold, and servants and maids, and camels and donkeys.
....................................
Genesis 26:4 "I will multiply your descendants as the stars of heaven, and will give your descendants all these lands; and by your descendants all the nations of the earth shall be blessed;
.................................
Genesis 27:29 May peoples serve you, And nations bow down to you; Be master of your brothers, And may your mother's sons bow down to you. Cursed be those who curse you, And blessed be those who bless you."
....................................
<< Genesis 12:3 >>

.....................................
New American Standard Bible (©1995)
And I will bless those who bless you, And the one who curses you I will curse. And in you all the families of the earth will be blessed."
......................
GOD'S WORDģ Translation (©1995)
I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you, I will curse. Through you every family on earth will be blessed."
.......................
King James Bible
And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.
........................
American King James Version
And I will bless them that bless you, and curse him that curses you: and in you shall all families of the earth be blessed.
...........................
American Standard Version
and I will bless them that bless thee, and him that curseth thee will I curse: and in thee shall all the families of the earth be blessed.
.....................
Bible in Basic English
To them who are good to you will I give blessing, and on him who does you wrong will I put my curse: and you will become a name of blessing to all the families of the earth.
........................
Douay-Rheims Bible
I will bless them that bless thee, and curse them that curse thee, and IN THEE shall all the kindred of the earth be blessed:
.............................
http://bible.cc/genesis/12-3.htm

Lars1701a
06-04-2009, 04:31 PM
He didn't and wouldn't .GODS word true !He will further chastise Israel but never abandon her.Like an unfaithful wife who goes astray GOD who is love will bring her back home to himself .

He will punish her unfaithfulness as he already has but finally when she has fully repented he will take her to his bosom again as in the days of David the King !

Genesis 22:18 "In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice."
..............................
Genesis 24:35 "The LORD has greatly blessed my master, so that he has become rich; and He has given him flocks and herds, and silver and gold, and servants and maids, and camels and donkeys.
....................................
Genesis 26:4 "I will multiply your descendants as the stars of heaven, and will give your descendants all these lands; and by your descendants all the nations of the earth shall be blessed;
.................................
Genesis 27:29 May peoples serve you, And nations bow down to you; Be master of your brothers, And may your mother's sons bow down to you. Cursed be those who curse you, And blessed be those who bless you."
....................................
<< Genesis 12:3 >>

.....................................
New American Standard Bible (©1995)
And I will bless those who bless you, And the one who curses you I will curse. And in you all the families of the earth will be blessed."
......................
GOD'S WORDģ Translation (©1995)
I will bless those who bless you, and whoever curses you, I will curse. Through you every family on earth will be blessed."
.......................
King James Bible
And I will bless them that bless thee, and curse him that curseth thee: and in thee shall all families of the earth be blessed.
........................
American King James Version
And I will bless them that bless you, and curse him that curses you: and in you shall all families of the earth be blessed.
...........................
American Standard Version
and I will bless them that bless thee, and him that curseth thee will I curse: and in thee shall all the families of the earth be blessed.
.....................
Bible in Basic English
To them who are good to you will I give blessing, and on him who does you wrong will I put my curse: and you will become a name of blessing to all the families of the earth.
........................
Douay-Rheims Bible
I will bless them that bless thee, and curse them that curse thee, and IN THEE shall all the kindred of the earth be blessed:
.............................
http://bible.cc/genesis/12-3.htm





Now this is what I am talking about.

GATOR HAS BEEN PWND

gator
06-04-2009, 07:33 PM
Now this is what I am talking about.

GATOR HAS BEEN PWND

Hardly pwnd, whatever that means. All Christians consider themselves to be Spiritual Jews. I have used that term many times myself. That has nothing to do with modern day Israel.

If you think that the assholes that kill Palestinians, almost on a daily basis, including women and children and if you think that the assholes that murdered the 34 Americans on board the USS Liberty and attacked the lifeboats and if you think those that have no belief in the Salvation of Jesus Christ is going to make their way into the Kingdom of God then you know very little about Christianity.

I suspect the leaders of Israel will be sharing Hell with the leaders of the Third Reich. If they repent their sins and accept Jesus Christ as their Savior then they will be granted salvation just like anybody else. There is nothing in the Bible that says that modern day Israelis will get a get out of jail free card simply because they immigrated from Russia to Israel and joined the IDF and killed Palestinians, which is what they do. However, if you want to belief that is the case then you can join the snake handlers and speaker of tongues in your belief. My sect of Christianity and most of the Christian world does not share that belief. In fact last year the pastor of my church gave a very good sermon on why Jews should get right with Christ. He didnít single out Jews. He listed the failures of all the major religions.

Rockntractor
06-04-2009, 07:39 PM
Gator! At what age did you develop your opinions about Israel. Who influenced you?

gator
06-04-2009, 08:15 PM
Gator! At what age did you develop your opinions about Israel. Who influenced you?

I figured out what a buch of pricks the Israelis were on June 8th, 1967 when they murdered 34 of my fellow NSA brothers.

Go back and read some of the previous threads on this topic. I explained my understanding of the brutality of Israel in great detail.

This silliness on CU from you goddamn Israeli supporters have got me thinking. You are telling me that according to Christian Doctrine all modern day Israelis will be automatically be sent to Heaven because they are “God Chosen People”.

I think I am wasting my time trying to be a Christian. I need to renounce Jesus Christ and convert to Judaism. I need to then take advantage of the “right of return” and immigrate to Israel. I can then join the IDF, get issued an American supplied weapon and kill me some of those Palestinians. I wonder if the more Palestinians I kill and the more Palestinian land I secure for Israel will make my stay in Heaven a even more enjoyable? Do I get extra points for killing women and children?

I can’t wait to see Saint Peter and show him my IDF card so I can get the express bus through the Pearly Gates.

I need to make a hard copy of this thread so if St Peter doesn’t send me to Heaven then I can just show him that since it posted on the Internet by a bunch of people that love Israel more than America then it must be true.

Rockntractor
06-04-2009, 08:18 PM
This silliness on CU from you goddamn Israeli supporters have got me thinking. You are telling me that according to Christian Doctrine all modern day Israelis will be automatically be sent to Heaven because they are “God Chosen People”.
Nobody told you that. You are imagining things that aren't there.

Rockntractor
06-04-2009, 08:19 PM
Do I get extra points for killing women and children?
Ask Hamas that they use women and children for human shields.

gator
06-04-2009, 08:23 PM
Nobody told you that. You are imagining things that aren't there.

Hardly imagining it. Go back and read the thread.

What the friggin use is to be "God Chosen People" if you don't get the express bus through the Pearly Gates?

Kind of a waste of a good title if you don't get anything out of it, isn't it?

Rockntractor
06-04-2009, 08:23 PM
This silliness on CU from you******** Israeli supporters have got me thinking. You are telling me that according to Christian Doctrine all modern day Israelis will be automatically be sent to Heaven because they are “God Chosen People”.
You need to get some of this hatred and revenge out of your heart. I don't think the holy spirit wants to share a room with that. Forgive! let it go. Don't destroy yourself.

djones520
06-04-2009, 08:26 PM
You need to get some of this hatred and revenge out of your heart. I don't think the holy spirit wants to share a room with that. Forgive! let it go. Don't destroy yourself.

Good luck with that. There will be nothing left of the man without his petty hatred.

Rockntractor
06-04-2009, 08:29 PM
Good luck with that. There will be nothing left of the man without his petty hatred.
You only damage yourself when you harbor that much ill will. It is not hurting the people of Israel it is destroying him. I am sad now that I know.

SarasotaRepub
06-04-2009, 08:30 PM
I canít wait to see Saint Peter and show him my IDF card so I can get the express bus through the Pearly Gates.


Forget the IDF card, bring one of your AR's and you'll be in like Flint! :p:D
Oh, and bring some Tannerite.

gator
06-04-2009, 08:35 PM
Ask Hamas that they use women and children for human shields.

Do you have a clue what you are talking about?

The friggin Israelis kill Palestinians left and right and take away their land and put them in ghettos and you make comments about them fighting back? What kind of person are you?

As far as killing children goes the goddamn Israelis have killed more Palestinian children than Palestinians have killed Israeli children.

As far as killing children let me remind you that it is considered acceptable in warfare. At least we Americans think so.

During the American Revolution North and South Carolina militiamen killed Loyalist women, children and non combatants in the name of the Revolution.

That goddamn piece of shit Lincoln murdered many American children, women and noncombatants in his dirty little invasion of the South and they put up a memorial to him in our nation’s capital.

During WWII America killed on purpose hundreds of thousands if not millions of German children and noncombatants in the mass bombing of German cities. We killed many thousands of Japanese children on purpose. Hell, we even nuked them twice.

Don’t give some pathetic little comment about Palestinians fighting for their freedom. They are fighting for their lives against a very well armed and brutal foe.

Unlike the pro Israel supporters as a real American I understand fighting against oppression.

Odysseus
06-04-2009, 08:37 PM
I figured out what a buch of pricks the Israelis were on June 8th, 1967 when they murdered 34 of my fellow NSA brothers.
Here we go again... :rolleyes: Delusional conspiracy theories that even the Weekly World News wouldn't dignify.


I think I am wasting my time trying to be a Christian. I need to renounce Jesus Christ and convert to Judaism. I need to then take advantage of the ďright of returnĒ and immigrate to Israel. I can then join the IDF, get issued an American supplied weapon and kill me some of those Palestinians. I wonder if the more Palestinians I kill and the more Palestinian land I secure for Israel will make my stay in Heaven a even more enjoyable? Do I get extra points for killing women and children?
You're definitely wasting your time trying to be a Christian with that attitude (I don't recall the words "filthy" or "bastards" in the sermon on the mount, much less the more colorful parts of your vocabulary), and on behalf of Jews around the world, I can say that we don't want you as a co-religionist. But, if you're looking for points for killing women and children, the global jihad will take you in a heartbeat, as that's their specialty. In fact, Hamas has killed more Palestinians than Israel has, so if you want to kill Palestinians without any moral constraints, that would be the way to go.


I need to make a hard copy of this thread so if St Peter doesnít send me to Heaven then I can just show him that since it posted on the Internet by a bunch of people that love Israel more than America then it must be true.
The only places that this thread will get you are Al Qaeda and Stormfront. You've got the whole Jew-hatred thing down, and I can see you getting off on beheading infidels with a dull knife. You've pretty much blown the whole "Prince of Peace" thing with your irrational and obsessive hatreds, so you might as well go whole hog (if you'll forgive the expression of Haram) and convert to Islam. See you in Gitmo.

Rockntractor
06-04-2009, 08:38 PM
Do you have a clue what you are talking about?

The friggin Israelis kill Palestinians left and right and take away their land and put them in ghettos and you make comments about them fighting back? What kind of person are you?

As far as killing children goes the goddamn Israelis have killed more Palestinian children than Palestinians have killed Israeli children.

As far as killing children let me remind you that it is considered acceptable in warfare. At least we Americans think so.

During the American Revolution North and South Carolina militiamen killed Loyalist women, children and non combatants in the name of the Revolution.

That goddamn piece of shit Lincoln murdered many American children, women and noncombatants in his dirty little invasion of the South and they put up a memorial to him in our nation’s capital.

During WWII America killed on purpose hundreds of thousands if not millions of German childrenand noncombatants in the mass bombing of German cities. We killed many thousands of Japanese children on purpose. Hell, we even nuked them twice.

Don’t give some pathetic little comment about Palestinians fighting for their freedom. They are fighting for their lives against a very well armed and brutal foe.

Unlike the pro Israel supporters as a real American I understand fighting against oppression.
You are not thinking with a rational mind. You have your reasons for your anger I wish you well and hope you find a better way!

Odysseus
06-04-2009, 08:40 PM
You are not thinking with a rational mind. You have your reasons for your anger I wish you well and hope you find a better way!

Forget it. Gator is crazier than a rat in a coffee can. I've been on the receiving end of his insanity before, and this time I'm just happy that he hasn't resorted to threatening me through my chain of command again.

gator
06-04-2009, 10:10 PM
You are not thinking with a rational mind. You have your reasons for your anger I wish you well and hope you find a better way!

I am very rational.

However, I know to an Israeli supporter any criticism of Israel is considered irrational.

Sorry but not everybody drinks the Israel koolaid. Some of us actually would like to hold them accountable for their crimes and to stop American money from being given to the bastards. It is called looking after Americaís interest and not the interest of some sleazy Middle East country.

I am through with this thread.

Odysseus
06-05-2009, 09:53 AM
I am very rational.

However, I know to an Israeli supporter any criticism of Israel is considered irrational.
Anybody hear any criticism of Israel? Unless your diatribes about filthy Israelis are a comment on personal hygene, I haven't heard anything that would count as criticism, just lots of unsubstantiated, bigoted assertions with nothing to support them. No stats, no sources, nada. Where are the Palestinian women and children that you claim were murdered? Where are the numbers? What are the sources of your information? Can you even support an argument?

I'm about halfway though ILE (what used to be called CGSC), and if I turned in a paper with your rhetorical techniques, they'd flunk me and then have me evaluated for Post-Traumatic Stress.


Sorry but not everybody drinks the Israel koolaid. Some of us actually would like to hold them accountable for their crimes and to stop American money from being given to the bastards. It is called looking after Americaís interest and not the interest of some sleazy Middle East country.
America's interest is in supporting its allies and defeating its enemies. Israel didn't launch 9/11, blow up the USS Cole, threaten to wipe its neighboring states off the map or blackmail the US with oil embargos, and Israel isn't spreading terrorism throughout the world. Israel isn't the problem.


I am through with this thread.
Yeah, right. Heard that before. :rolleyes: