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Junebug68
06-03-2008, 10:46 AM
Wouldn't be DU without some hating on religion.


BlueJazz (1000+ posts) Sat May-31-08 08:57 AM
Original message
78% of the US population believe in angels

It's followed by 8 pictures of an angry smilie hitting its head on a wall.


sleebarker (1000+ posts) Sat May-31-08 11:55 AM
Response to Original message
6. That's what happens when people are ignorant
They look for magical explanations of the world.

uberllama42 (1000+ posts) Sat May-31-08 03:06 PM
Response to Reply #9
28. It shows that four out of five people believe something on zero evidence
It speaks poorly about the critical thinking skills of people in this country.

I find belief in angles ridiculous and do not think that particular belief deserves respect. Do we respect those who believe in fairies or leprechauns?

Do we respect those who believe that Saddam Hussein had weapons of mass destruction in 2003?

Belief in angles, IMO, is symptomatic of a larger cultural problem in America. Those who believe in supernatural entities for which there is no evidence can make very poor decisions. The fact that critical thinking skills are so rare has negative implications for the rest of us, who have to interact with angel-believers on a daily basis.

Teh hate is strong with this one.


TexasObserver (1000+ posts) Sat May-31-08 02:34 PM
Response to Original message
22. Angels don't care about kids in Darfur starving or kids in Rwanda getting arms cut off. Angels care about Americans, mainly church going Americans, Christians. They care about things like whether a person has a bad accident or not.

nadinbrzezinski (1000+ posts) Sat May-31-08 03:26 PM
Response to Original message
41. Magical thinking, the prelude to a new dark age
there, I said it

And so did Carl Sagan before he died

And here is a cute answer...


ayeshahaqqiqa (1000+ posts) Sat May-31-08 09:05 AM
Response to Original message
4. Well, I'm married to one.......n/t

It's mostly just infighting, but I found it amusing.



http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=214x173633

BSR
06-03-2008, 10:58 AM
Yet these same people talk about their "spirit guides" and "healing white light" :rolleyes:

linda22003
06-03-2008, 11:01 AM
"I find belief in angles ridiculous and do not think that particular belief deserves respect."

I completely agreed with that when I was in school, but my math teachers strenuously disagreed, so I had to learn acute, obtuse, ALL the different angles.

Junebug68
06-03-2008, 11:03 AM
Yet these same people talk about their "spirit guides" and "healing white light" :rolleyes:

Good point!

Gingersnap
06-03-2008, 11:28 AM
"I find belief in angles ridiculous and do not think that particular belief deserves respect."

I completely agreed with that when I was in school, but my math teachers strenuously disagreed, so I had to learn acute, obtuse, ALL the different angles.

LOL! Good one! :D

nightflight
06-03-2008, 11:48 AM
Yet these same people talk about their "spirit guides" and "healing white light" :rolleyes:

Very good point.

gator
06-03-2008, 12:19 PM
Yet these same people talk about their "spirit guides" and "healing white light" :rolleyes:

Weren't a bunch of these Code Pink dingbats casting "spells" on the miliary recently?

The Night Owl
06-03-2008, 01:20 PM
Yet these same people talk about their "spirit guides" and "healing white light" :rolleyes:

You are correct to point out that DUers who believe in "healing white light" and other such New Age nonsense are in no position to criticize others for believing in angels, but not everyone at DU subscribes to New Age nonsense. For instance, I don't. I consider all religious and superstitious beliefs to be equally implausible.

"There's another reason I think popularizing science is important, why I try to do it. It's a foreboding I have -- maybe ill-placed -- of an America in my children's generation, or my grandchildren's generation, when all the manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when we're a service and information-processing economy; when awesome technological powers are in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest even grasps the issues; when the people (by "the people" I mean the broad population in a democracy) have lost the ability to set their own agendas, or even to knowledgeably question those who do set the agendas; when there is no practice in questioning those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and religiously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in steep decline, unable to distinguish between what's true and what feels good, we slide, almost without noticing, into superstition and darkness." - Carl Sagan

gator
06-03-2008, 03:11 PM
You are correct to point out that DUers who believe in "healing white light" and other such New Age nonsense are in no position to criticize others for believing in angels, but not everyone at DU subscribes to New Age nonsense. For instance, I don't. I consider all religious and superstitious beliefs to be equally implausible.

"There's another reason I think popularizing science is important, why I try to do it. It's a foreboding I have -- maybe ill-placed -- of an America in my children's generation, or my grandchildren's generation, when all the manufacturing industries have slipped away to other countries; when we're a service and information-processing economy; when awesome technological powers are in the hands of a very few, and no one representing the public interest even grasps the issues; when the people (by "the people" I mean the broad population in a democracy) have lost the ability to set their own agendas, or even to knowledgeably question those who do set the agendas; when there is no practice in questioning those in authority; when, clutching our crystals and religiously consulting our horoscopes, our critical faculties in steep decline, unable to distinguish between what's true and what feels good, we slide, almost without noticing, into superstition and darkness." - Carl Sagan


Isn't Carl Sagan the dude that died?

If he died without Faith and accepting the Grace of God then he he is pretty much dead.

If he had Faith then he would believe in the Word of God. The Word of God speaks of angles being the messengers of God.

If you don't believe then you don't believe and Hell is very cold and dark.

linda22003
06-03-2008, 03:19 PM
The Word of God speaks of angles being the messengers of God.

As I said above, in my math classes, angles seemed to be more devilish than heavenly in origin.

The Night Owl
06-03-2008, 03:21 PM
Isn't Carl Sagan the dude that died?

If he died without Faith and accepting the Grace of God then he he is pretty much dead.

If he had Faith then he would believe in the Word of God. The Word of God speaks of angles being the messengers of God.

If you don't believe then you don't believe and Hell is very cold and dark.

I'll let Mr. Sagan speak for himself...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4E-_DdX8Ke0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDjwF_-ydcM&feature=related

Shannon
06-03-2008, 03:22 PM
"I find belief in angles ridiculous and do not think that particular belief deserves respect."

I completely agreed with that when I was in school, but my math teachers strenuously disagreed, so I had to learn acute, obtuse, ALL the different angles.

ROFL!:D


....

gator
06-03-2008, 04:28 PM
I'll let Mr. Sagan speak for himself...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4E-_DdX8Ke0

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iDjwF_-ydcM&feature=related


So Sagan is a goddamn atheist and that makes him a credible source on angels in your eyes?

I use to think that he full of bullshit when he was alive. I am not even so sure he was that good of a scientist although PBS made a celebrity out of him.

Anyway he is dead now and if he doesn’t believe in angels then he is very cold and very dead just like you will be soon if you don't accept the Grace of God.

The Night Owl
06-03-2008, 04:39 PM
I use to think that he full of bullshit when he was alive. I am not even so sure he was that good of a scientist although PBS made a celebrity out of him.


Carl Sagan was a good scientist, but I think his greatest contribution was the popularizing of science...

http://www.bartelby.com/65/sa/Sagan-Ca.html

NYhorizon
06-03-2008, 10:08 PM
"I find belief in angles ridiculous and do not think that particular belief deserves respect."

I completely agreed with that when I was in school, but my math teachers strenuously disagreed, so I had to learn acute, obtuse, ALL the different angles.

Ha! Good one!

Leaving angles aside for a moment, though, there certainly are a lot of obtuse people at the DUmp. ;)

LibraryLady
06-03-2008, 10:12 PM
I doubt that most people understand the Biblical concept of Angels.

gator
06-03-2008, 10:25 PM
I doubt that most people understand the Biblical concept of Angels.


There is a difference in the Old Testament and the New Testament description.

For instance, in the Old Testament Satan was an Angel of God that was sent with God's bidding to challenge Man. In the New Testament in the Book of Revelation Satan is at war with God.

Most of the description in the Bible is that of a messenger.

The Night Owl
06-03-2008, 11:34 PM
There is a difference in the Old Testament and the New Testament description.

For instance, in the Old Testament Satan was an Angel of God that was sent with God's bidding to challenge Man. In the New Testament in the Book of Revelation Satan is at war with God.

Most of the description in the Bible is that of a messenger.

What I'm about to ask might come across like a joke, but I'm being serious... Is Satan a believer?

Dan D. Doty
06-04-2008, 12:10 AM
What makes this a great country is you can believe whatever you want ( or believe nothing at all for that matter) and nobody can make you do otherwise.

If you want to worship bushes ,or think that God is in fact a giant spider, so be it. We are nation that was founded on the fact that each of us can worship as we please, follow any doctine, or choose whatever deity we wish.

This is liberty, treasure it my friends.

movie buff
06-04-2008, 07:20 AM
What I'm about to ask might come across like a joke, but I'm being serious... Is Satan a believer?

Yes, Satan believes in God, if that was what you were asking. There is a passage in the Bible in which I believe it says, "Even demons believe in Jesus, and tremble at His name." That passage was meant to show that simply believing in Jesus is not enough to achieve salvation, that actually accepting Him as your Savior is what counts.
I believe in angels, and I find it unsurprising that DU continues to spew out its blatant hatred towards anyone who believes in God or angels.
As many people here pointed out, it is hypocritical and hilarious that the DUmmies in their typical display of hatred and arrogance act like all who believe in angels are stupid cavemen, yet they themselves post all kinds of threads in which they sing the praises of Wicca, Astrology, the occult, etc..

The Night Owl
06-04-2008, 09:42 AM
Yes, Satan believes in God, if that was what you were asking. There is a passage in the Bible in which I believe it says, "Even demons believe in Jesus, and tremble at His name." That passage was meant to show that simply believing in Jesus is not enough to achieve salvation, that actually accepting Him as your Savior is what counts.

If Satan believes in God, then why would Satan wage war against God? Waging war against what one believes to be an omnipotent being is not exactly the smartest thing to do. Satan would have to be pretty stupid to wage war against God, someone he knows he can't beat, and yet the Bible portrays him as a clever trickster.

gator
06-04-2008, 09:47 AM
If Satan believes in God, then why would Satan wage war against God? Waging war against what one believes to be an omnipotent being is not exactly the smartest thing to do. Satan would have to be pretty stupid to wage war against God, someone he knows he can't beat, and yet the Bible portrays him as a clever trickster.

People that don't believe in God and people that wage war against God aren't exactly known for their intelligence, know what I mean?

Who knows the mind of Satan?

Lager
06-04-2008, 10:12 AM
They don't believe in angles? How obtuse!

The Night Owl
06-04-2008, 10:13 AM
They don't believe in angles? How obtuse!

Hey! Making fun of fat people isn't nice!

:D

BSR
06-04-2008, 11:22 AM
If Satan believes in God, then why would Satan wage war against God? Waging war against what one believes to be an omnipotent being is not exactly the smartest thing to do. Satan would have to be pretty stupid to wage war against God, someone he knows he can't beat, and yet the Bible portrays him as a clever trickster.

This might answer some of your questions

http://www.gotquestions.org/angels-sin.html

http://www.gotquestions.org/Satan-defeat.html

Junebug68
06-04-2008, 11:50 AM
If Satan believes in God, then why would Satan wage war against God? Waging war against what one believes to be an omnipotent being is not exactly the smartest thing to do. Satan would have to be pretty stupid to wage war against God, someone he knows he can't beat, and yet the Bible portrays him as a clever trickster.

Satan is the epitome of all evil - that makes him pretty darn stupid in my eyes. Tricks don't make one smart.

The Night Owl
06-04-2008, 12:08 PM
This might answer some of your questions

http://www.gotquestions.org/angels-sin.html

http://www.gotquestions.org/Satan-defeat.html

Interesting. According to the Got Questions site, Satan is a great deceiver and an expert at falsifying truth...


As the great deceiver, Satan is an expert at falsifying truth (2 Corinthians 11:13-15).

If Satan is a great deceiver who is allowed to try to influence mankind, then is it not possible that parts of the Bible have been perverted by Satan?

Anyway, getting back to the subject of this supposed war between God and Satan... I have a difficult time believing that a being which is supposedly "extremely intelligent" could be so blinded by pride that it would spend thousands of years fighting a war it can't win. Moreover, if God, who supposedly has perfect foreknowledge, created Satan even though he knew that Satan would betray him and go to war against him, then isn't the supposed war between God and Satan really just God being at war with himself?

I guess one can't blame God for going to war with himself. Existing for eternity and having perfect foreknowledge of what will take place in that eternity would make me want to go to war with myself too just to break the boredom.

The Night Owl
06-04-2008, 12:09 PM
Satan is the epitome of all evil - that makes him pretty darn stupid in my eyes. Tricks don't make one smart.

According to the website Johnny Vegas provided a link to, Satan is extremely intelligent.

BSR
06-04-2008, 12:23 PM
Interesting. According to the Got Questions site, Satan is a great deceiver and an expert at falsifying truth...


As the great deceiver, Satan is an expert at falsifying truth (2 Corinthians 11:13-15).

If Satan is a great deceiver who is allowed to try to influence mankind, then is it not possible that parts of the Bible have been perverted by Satan?

Anyway, getting back to the subject of this supposed war between God and Satan... I have a difficult time believing that a being which is supposedly "extremely intelligent" could be so blinded by pride that it would spend thousands of years fighting a war it can't win. Moreover, if God, who supposedly has perfect foreknowledge, created Satan even though he knew that Satan would betray him and go to war against him, then isn't the supposed war between God and Satan really just God being at war with himself?

I guess one can't blame God for going to war with himself. Existing for eternity and having perfect foreknowledge of what will take place in that eternity would make me want to go to war with myself too just to break the boredom.


And this is why it is useless to debate you on religion. Your not interested in learning about what Christians believe, your only intrested in trying to find ways to mock Christians.


Instead of arguing with you and playing your little game, I'll pray for you instead..

gator
06-04-2008, 12:28 PM
Interesting. According to the Got Questions site, Satan is a great deceiver and an expert at falsifying truth...


As the great deceiver, Satan is an expert at falsifying truth (2 Corinthians 11:13-15).

If Satan is a great deceiver who is allowed to try to influence mankind, then is it not possible that parts of the Bible have been perverted by Satan?

Anyway, getting back to the subject of this supposed war between God and Satan... I have a difficult time believing that a being which is supposedly "extremely intelligent" could be so blinded by pride that it would spend thousands of years fighting a war it can't win. Moreover, if God, who supposedly has perfect foreknowledge, created Satan even though he knew that Satan would betray him and go to war against him, then isn't the supposed war between God and Satan really just God being at war with himself?

I guess one can't blame God for going to war with himself. Existing for eternity and having perfect foreknowledge of what will take place in that eternity would make me want to go to war with myself too just to break the boredom.

Any being with free will can be blinded with pride.

Free will is a bitch. It makes us do all kinds of stupid things. However, you can thank God for Grace. Us poor humans have it, Satan doesn't.

The Night Owl
06-04-2008, 12:29 PM
And this is why it is useless to debate you on religion. Your not interested in learning about what Christians believe, your only intrested in trying to find ways to mock Christians.


Instead of arguing with you and playing your little game, I'll pray for you instead..

I haven't mocked anyone.

Junebug68
06-04-2008, 03:57 PM
According to the website Johnny Vegas provided a link to, Satan is extremely intelligent.

Intellegence does not equal rational actions, and irrational actions such as fighting God seem stupid to me. Intelligent people can do some very very stupid things.

The Night Owl
06-04-2008, 05:32 PM
Intellegence does not equal rational actions, and irrational actions such as fighting God seem stupid to me. Intelligent people can do some very very stupid things.

I understand that intelligent people aren't always rational, but in the case of Satan, aren't we are talking about an "extremely intelligent" being who has spent thousands of years fighting a war it can't possibly win?

biccat
06-04-2008, 05:57 PM
I understand that intelligent people aren't always rational, but in the case of Satan, aren't we are talking about an "extremely intelligent" being who has spent thousands of years fighting a war it can't possibly win?
Because you're attributing human thoughts and actions to an inhuman being. Human reasoning is not necessarily universal, it is unique to humans.

Unfortunately, there aren't any sentient beings with which to compare ourselves.

Junebug68
06-04-2008, 07:56 PM
I understand that intelligent people aren't always rational, but in the case of Satan, aren't we are talking about an "extremely intelligent" being who has spent thousands of years fighting a war it can't possibly win?

So if someone is "extremly intelligent," they are incapable of doing anything stupid????