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View Full Version : Is There a Place for Gay People in Conservatism and Conservative Politics?



PoliCon
02-18-2010, 10:53 PM
POLICY FORUM
Wednesday, February 17, 2010
Noon

Featuring Nick Herbert, MP, Shadow Secretary of State for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs, Conservative Party, United Kingdom; Andrew Sullivan, The Daily Dish Blog, The Atlantic; and Maggie Gallagher, President, National Organization for Marriage.

The Cato Institute
1000 Massachusetts Avenue, NW
Washington, DC 20001
QuickTimeWatch the Event in QuickTime (M4V)
http://ne.edgecastcdn.net/000873/archive-2010/cpf-02-17-10.m4v

Under the leadership of David Cameron, Britain's Conservative Party has jettisoned much of its former opposition to gay rights. Cameron supported civil unions for gays and appointed a number of openly gay men to his shadow cabinet. Nick Herbert will explain the reasons for those changes and elaborate on the new Conservative social agenda. Will the United States follow the British example? Our distinguished panel will consider the future of gay people's participation in mainstream society and conservative politics on both sides of the Atlantic.

http://www.cato.org/event.php?eventid=6987

PoliCon
02-18-2010, 10:55 PM
Wow. Interesting - but the guy doing the introducing is an ass and wrong on what his said about conservatives.

stsinner
02-18-2010, 10:57 PM
There's absolutely a place for gay people in conservatism.. Keep your sexuality to yourself, deal with homosexuality not being accepted as normal and, hence, not being qualified for marriage, and just keep your sexuality in the bedroom.. Take the rainbow stickers off your cars and stop pressing moral people to accept you as normal... I'd say that homosexual people can lead very successful careers in a conservative administration, as long as they don't throw their sexuality in our face... Just do your job, and be a fag in the bedroom.. No problem... No fag parades, no fag TV shows, etc, and I think that gays could make huge strides...

PoliCon
02-18-2010, 11:00 PM
I disagree. Not with the idea that homosexuality should be something left in the bedroom - but with your assertion that there is no room for gay people. I think that there is room for gay people - but no room for overt homosexuality.

PoliCon
02-18-2010, 11:04 PM
I disagree with the speaker on almost anything. Another 'big tent' idiot. :rolleyes:

Rockntractor
02-18-2010, 11:13 PM
I disagree. Not with the idea that homosexuality should be something left in the bedroom - but with your assertion that there is no room for gay people. I think that there is room for gay people - but no room for overt homosexuality.

Still fighting for acceptance aren't you cupcake? Go ahead admit it you'll feel better little guy!

PoliCon
02-18-2010, 11:20 PM
Still fighting for acceptance aren't you cupcake? Go ahead admit it you'll feel better little guy!

bite me goatboy. :p

PoliCon
02-18-2010, 11:21 PM
BTW - the final speaker was VERY good.

Rockntractor
02-18-2010, 11:25 PM
BTW - the final speaker was VERY good.

You mean like you found yourself attracted to him?:eek:

PoliCon
02-18-2010, 11:30 PM
You mean like you found yourself attracted to him?:eek:

the final speaker is a SHE.

Rockntractor
02-18-2010, 11:32 PM
the final speaker is a SHE.
Oh, well then you wouldn't be attracted to her.

PoliCon
02-18-2010, 11:35 PM
Oh, well then you wouldn't be attracted to her.

of course the second speaker was more feminine than the last . . . . Andrew Sullivan is a douche. :rolleyes:

malloc
02-18-2010, 11:40 PM
There's absolutely a place for gay people in conservatism.. Keep your sexuality to yourself, deal with homosexuality not being accepted as normal and, hence, not being qualified for marriage, and just keep your sexuality in the bedroom.. Take the rainbow stickers off your cars and stop pressing moral people to accept you as normal... I'd say that homosexual people can lead very successful careers in a conservative administration, as long as they don't throw their sexuality in our face... Just do your job, and be a fag in the bedroom.. No problem... No fag parades, no fag TV shows, etc, and I think that gays could make huge strides...

I consider myself a conservative Republican and I'm not against gay marriage, or gay anything. I'm not necessarily for it either. I just don't care. As far as I'm concerned it doesn't apply to me. I've got a living to make, a family to care for, and a kid's science project to plan. I could care less who wears the gown and whether or not the ceremony had a star wars theme.

That being said, I agree with your sentiments on the stickers and the in-your-face attitude. I don't believe people are special, or deserve special consideration because they are gay. I certainly don't think I should watch my language or expressions around gay people. If they can't deal with it, I think that's their problem.

I think the whole gay marriage thing is really a problem for the States, or even localities. Either way, it certainly isn't my problem, so I'm not going to make it one of my problems. I've got plenty of them to go around without adding more.

Rockntractor
02-18-2010, 11:40 PM
of course the second speaker was more feminine than the last . . . . Andrew Sullivan is a douche. :rolleyes:
Is his head shaped like a nozzle and does he smell like a summer breeze?:confused:

patriot45
02-18-2010, 11:46 PM
I consider myself a conservative Republican and I'm not against gay marriage, or gay anything. I'm not necessarily for it either. I just don't care. As far as I'm concerned it doesn't apply to me. I've got a living to make, a family to care for, and a kid's science project to plan. I could care less who wears the gown and whether or not the ceremony had a star wars theme.

That being said, I agree with your sentiments on the stickers and the in-your-face attitude. I don't believe people are special, or deserve special consideration because they are gay. I certainly don't think I should watch my language or expressions around gay people. If they can't deal with it, I think that's their problem.

I think the whole gay marriage thing is really a problem for the States, or even localities. Either way, it certainly isn't my problem, so I'm not going to make it one of my problems. I've got plenty of them to go around without adding more.

Exactly! Who really cares about 1.5% of the population being deviant, when the libs are out, this won't be a priority!

Kay
02-19-2010, 01:31 AM
I've tried to view the gay issue from all angles, and I've tried particularly over the last few years to be a fairly tolerant person of other people regardless of their orientation. But I have to be honest and say that for me tolerance hasn't taken root and grown. I have issues with the gay lifestyle that are ingrained too deep in my belief system.

That said, on the question of is there room for them in the conservative movement, I say absolutely. Everyone has a right to their own beliefs and if my beliefs intersect with a gay person's on the subject of conservative politics on that we can agree and work together just fine. Doesn't mean I accept his lifestyle.

nightflight
02-19-2010, 01:57 AM
http://gayconservative.org/


When I turned 18 in 1991, I was thrilled to finally have the ability to vote. I was a product of the MTV generation where my knowledge of politics was limited to MTV's "Rock the Vote" commercials. My first election was the 1992 presidential election. I voted for Bill Clinton. I also voted for him in 1996. As my political knowledge started to shift from MTV to talk radio and cable news, I began to realize the major mistake I had made. Since then; being part of the gay community, I've developed a love for political adversity when someone from my community would question how gay I was since I voted Republican. I also noticed that coming out as a Republican in my community is far more dramatic than coming out as a gay man to the rest of the world. Needless to say, the contempt I have received has transformed from something that made me nervous and uncomfortable to something I am most proud of.

Constitutionally Speaking
02-19-2010, 07:59 AM
the final speaker is a SHE.

Or so you say!!! :D



It's hard to tell sometimes!

Rebel Yell
02-19-2010, 10:16 AM
I certainly don't think I should watch my language or expressions around gay people. If they can't deal with it, I think that's their problem.

That applies to much more than just gays, that pretty much applies to the human race in my book.

noonwitch
02-19-2010, 10:53 AM
I really don't care who marries whom, who has sex what way with what gender and so on, as long as all parties involved are human beings and consenting adults and no one gets hurt without their consent.

I live my personal life by pretty conservative values, but I'm not gay and sex has never really been all that important to me, so I don't try to judge others by my standard for my own behavior. And I'm not a conservative or a republican, so my opinion really doesn't matter here.

BadCat
02-19-2010, 10:55 AM
I don't even think there is a place for them in the human race, much less the Conservative side of it.

AmPat
02-19-2010, 11:40 AM
Is There a Place for Gay People in Conservatism and Conservative Politics? Sure, just not behind me.:eek:

CueSi
02-19-2010, 08:49 PM
I'm bisexual, and I'm here. . .one of my best mentors as an emerging conservative was a transwoman... she was a former well decorated Sailor who was a strong Conservative. She taught me how to shoot, and raised two sons - -one's in the Army, the other a chef for Carnival cruise line. She didn't start transitioning till her sons were grown, an act I consider so selfless and unlike the "me and my pleasures , hell or high water", attitude many LBGT people have.

I don't know why I'm wasting my words here, but I figured with my personal story because sometimes just saying "Yes", ain't enough.

~QC

Articulate_Ape
02-19-2010, 09:13 PM
I don't even think there is a place for them in the human race


You know the Third Reich shared your perspective on this, right? I sort of know why they sadly held that view, but why do you?

Articulate_Ape
02-19-2010, 09:15 PM
I'm bisexual, and I'm here. . .one of my best mentors as an emerging conservative was a transwoman... she was a former well decorated Sailor who was a strong Conservative. She taught me how to shoot, and raised two sons - -one's in the Army, the other a chef for Carnival cruise line. She didn't start transitioning till her sons were grown, an act I consider so selfless and unlike the "me and my pleasures , hell or high water", attitude many LBGT people have.

I don't know why I'm wasting my words here, but I figured with my personal story because sometimes just saying "Yes", ain't enough.

~QC



Your words are not wasted here.

stsinner
02-19-2010, 09:17 PM
I'm bisexual, and I'm here. . .one of my best mentors as an emerging conservative was a transwoman... she was a former well decorated Sailor who was a strong Conservative. She taught me how to shoot, and raised two sons - -one's in the Army, the other a chef for Carnival cruise line. She didn't start transitioning till her sons were grown, an act I consider so selfless and unlike the "me and my pleasures , hell or high water", attitude many LBGT people have.

I don't know why I'm wasting my words here, but I figured with my personal story because sometimes just saying "Yes", ain't enough.

~QC

That's disgusting and perverted... And, "Transwoman," isn't a word.. Sorry, but you can't make up your own words because you're defective..

stsinner
02-19-2010, 09:21 PM
There's plenty of room for gay conservatives, as long as nobody knows they're gay.. As long as they keep their sexuality in the bedroom, as the majority of heterosexuals do and don't clamor for special treatment and validation of their sickness.. I believe that homosexuals can do plenty of things really well, but get their point across to someone who has a working moral compass isn't one of them.. They can type and file paperwork and fetch coffee and do all sorts of things very well, but I just don't want to see an antagonistic rainbow sticker on your car or see you make out with your partner in public.. I don't believe they should be oppressed at all as long as they don't shove their perversion in your faces.. There are plenty of heterosexuals with some pretty fucked-up lifestyles behind closed doors, and I really don't care, as long as they do the job I ask them to do.. They don't put pictures of whips and fuzzy handcuffs and shit on their car windows, so why do queers need rainbow stickers?? Keep the shit in the bedroom, and we have no problem with them in the Conservative party..

nightflight
02-19-2010, 09:38 PM
I have no problem with them.

Articulate_Ape
02-19-2010, 09:38 PM
Slap me and call me Gertude, but I don't recall Jesus ever bringing up homosexuality. I am pretty sure that is because such individuals were at best banished and at worst stoned to death at the time. Oddly enough homosexuality has been in the midst of humankind at least since recorded history began.

I don't pretend to understand what make a person homosexual or why people try to change their gender (although hermaphrodites are born every day). I just don't care. I really don't care even more than you stsinner. You don't care what they do in the bedroom, nor do I. I don't care what they do in public if it is not something heterosexuals would not normally do. I just don't care.

What I do care about is this nation and the absolute disaster the current White House and Congress is piling on all of our heads, gay or not. As far as I am concerned, if gay people are as concerned about this as I am, they can sit with me in the bleachers a holler anytime.

BadCat
02-19-2010, 09:49 PM
You know the Third Reich shared your perspective on this, right? I sort of know why they sadly held that view, but why do you?

I have a very low tolerance for defects.

Articulate_Ape
02-19-2010, 09:53 PM
I have a very low tolerance for defects.

Ergo your inferiority complex?

PoliCon
02-19-2010, 10:16 PM
That's disgusting and perverted... And, "Transwoman," isn't a word.. Sorry, but you can't make up your own words because you're defective..

You are one step closer to convincing me that you are a DU mole. :rolleyes:

SarasotaRepub
02-19-2010, 10:32 PM
I have a very low tolerance for defects.

JHC!!!! You kill me sometimes!!! :D:D:D

SarasotaRepub
02-19-2010, 10:34 PM
I'm bisexual, and I'm here. . .one of my best mentors as an emerging conservative was a transwoman... she was a former well decorated Sailor who was a strong Conservative. She taught me how to shoot, and raised two sons - -one's in the Army, the other a chef for Carnival cruise line. She didn't start transitioning till her sons were grown, an act I consider so selfless and unlike the "me and my pleasures , hell or high water", attitude many LBGT people have.

I don't know why I'm wasting my words here, but I figured with my personal story because sometimes just saying "Yes", ain't enough.

~QC

You aren't wasting your words here, that was quite interesting.

I

PoliCon
02-19-2010, 11:14 PM
Yeah, I'm a DU mole, and I'm a SF mole, and I'm a freeper, and I'm a truther, and blah blah blah....

You wear many hats and your shoes fit - what can I say? :rolleyes:

Articulate_Ape
02-19-2010, 11:16 PM
You aren't wasting your words here, that was quite interesting.




Copycat.

BadCat
02-19-2010, 11:17 PM
Ergo your inferiority complex?

You seem to think you know me pretty well there newbie.

If you did, you would certainly know I do not have any sort of inferiority complex.

Articulate_Ape
02-19-2010, 11:19 PM
You seem to think you know me pretty well there newbie.

If you did, you would certainly know I do not have any sort of inferiority complex.


Good, then you won't be put off when I say that you come across as a world class jackass. And I mean that in a good way.

BadCat
02-19-2010, 11:23 PM
Good, then you won't be put off when I say that you come across as a world class jackass. And I mean that in a good way.

And you won't be put off when I say "Stick it up your ass faggot".

And I mean that sincerely.

PoliCon
02-19-2010, 11:23 PM
Take it to the DOME. :mad:

BadCat
02-19-2010, 11:26 PM
Take it to the DOME. :mad:

The retread isn't worth a dome thread.

You don't recognize this particular pattern?

Articulate_Ape
02-19-2010, 11:26 PM
And you won't be put off when I say "Stick it up your ass faggot".

And I mean that sincerely.

Are you propositioning me here? I hardly know you. Plus I don't swing that way, but I can respect your orientation.

SarasotaRepub
02-19-2010, 11:29 PM
The retread isn't worth a dome thread.

You don't recognize this particular pattern?

Don't throw Cold Water on him!!! :D

Articulate_Ape
02-19-2010, 11:30 PM
Take it to the DOME. :mad:

My apologies, Poli. I was just trying to be civil.

BadCat
02-19-2010, 11:33 PM
Are you propositioning me here? I hardly know you. Plus I don't swing that way, but I can respect your orientation.

I would guess that all the propositions you've ever received have occurred in truck stops along the New Jersey Turnpike.

You say you don't know me, but then you make comments like you and I have been friends for years.

I'm also glad you respect my orientation. From what I've read from you, there's not a thing about you I respect.

Articulate_Ape
02-19-2010, 11:42 PM
I would guess that all the propositions you've ever received have occurred in truck stops along the New Jersey Turnpike.

You say you don't know me, but then you make comments like you and I have been friends for years.

I'm also glad you respect my orientation. From what I've read from you, there's not a thing about you I respect.

I will not engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent in this thread because I, unlike you, respect the rules of this forum and the guidance of its moderators. Therefore, if you choose to be weighed, measured, and found wanting, then call me out in the Dome with your daft accusations. I will no longer engage you here.

PoliCon
02-19-2010, 11:49 PM
The retread isn't worth a dome thread.

You don't recognize this particular pattern?

I don't care who it is. You can take it to the dome and stop shitting all over this thread. Thank you.

Rockntractor
02-19-2010, 11:51 PM
I don't care who it is. You can take it to the dome and stop shitting all over this thread. Thank you.
Poli shut up and stay out of it!

Articulate_Ape
02-20-2010, 12:15 AM
Who the fuck am I supposed to be? I sure as hell ain't Jesus..one sec let me check... Nope, not him. So who am I supposed to be?

wilbur
02-20-2010, 09:03 AM
I love it... the old "sure, just as long as they hang their head in shame, and keep their mouths shut, and recognize that they are moral cripples because I say so, and acknowledge the moral superiority of MY relationships, then sure - they can have a place at the table. And by God, they better not have the audacity to put an innocous bumper sticker on their car! See?! I'm pro gay!"

I sure wouldnt want to join, would you? This kind of attitude couldnt go away fast enough.

BadCat
02-20-2010, 10:21 AM
I will not engage in a battle of wits with an unarmed opponent in this thread because I, unlike you, respect the rules of this forum and the guidance of its moderators. Therefore, if you choose to be weighed, measured, and found wanting, then call me out in the Dome with your daft accusations. I will no longer engage you here.

Awwww. I'm heartbroken.

BadCat
02-20-2010, 10:43 AM
I love it... the old "sure, just as long as they hang their head in shame, and keep their mouths shut, and recognize that they are moral cripples because I say so, and acknowledge the moral superiority of MY relationships, then sure - they can have a place at the table. And by God, they better not have the audacity to put an innocous bumper sticker on their car! See?! I'm pro gay!"

I sure wouldnt want to join, would you? This kind of attitude couldnt go away fast enough.

It's not going to go away, Wilbur.
In fact, for your side, it will probably get worse.

Gingersnap
02-20-2010, 01:37 PM
Knock it off. All you people know where the Dome is and how it works - use it, if you feel inclined. Otherwise, get back on topic or drop it.

CueSi
02-21-2010, 06:34 PM
I love it... the old "sure, just as long as they hang their head in shame, and keep their mouths shut, and recognize that they are moral cripples because I say so, and acknowledge the moral superiority of MY relationships, then sure - they can have a place at the table. And by God, they better not have the audacity to put an innocous bumper sticker on their car! See?! I'm pro gay!"

I sure wouldnt want to join, would you? This kind of attitude couldnt go away fast enough.

I can't stand your haughty ass attitude either, buddy.

~QC

patriot45
02-21-2010, 07:26 PM
I really don't care who marries whom, who has sex what way with what gender and so on, as long as all parties involved are human beings and consenting adults and no one gets hurt without their consent.

I live my personal life by pretty conservative values, but I'm not gay and sex has never really been all that important to me, so I don't try to judge others by my standard for my own behavior. And I'm not a conservative or a republican, so my opinion really doesn't matter here.

How does a Lib live by conservative values! :eek: That would make you not a lib, but we know better!

Rockntractor
02-21-2010, 07:31 PM
How does a Lib live by conservative values! :eek: That would make you not a lib, but we know better!

Noonie is far more conservative then she is liberal. She has to work with liberals everyday and it's a wonder she is still sane!

patriot45
02-21-2010, 07:35 PM
Noonie is far more conservative then she is liberal. She has to work with liberals everyday and it's a wonder she is still sane!

He is certainly safer here than at DU!

PoliCon
02-21-2010, 08:07 PM
He is certainly safer here than at DU!

ppppsssssttt - 'he' is a SHE. :p

patriot45
02-21-2010, 08:11 PM
ppppsssssttt - 'he' is a SHE. :p

Hehe, so are you!
I never seen real life action pics of either of you so I don't have a clue what you'se are!

Rockntractor
02-21-2010, 08:16 PM
Hehe, so are you!
I never seen real life action pics of either of you so I don't have a clue what you'se are!

This is Poli's holodeck, he can be whatever he wants to.

Bubba Dawg
02-21-2010, 08:18 PM
This is Poli's holodeck, he can be whatever he wants to.

Can Poli get me a date with Counselor Troi?

Rockntractor
02-21-2010, 08:19 PM
Can Poli get me a date with Counselor Troi?
Just say the word and it shall be done! Where else could he be six foot three.:D

PoliCon
02-21-2010, 08:21 PM
Hehe, so are you!
I never seen real life action pics of either of you so I don't have a clue what you'se are!

And you never will see a pic of me. Sorry. :o

PoliCon
02-21-2010, 08:22 PM
Can Poli get me a date with Counselor Troi?

please. If I'm gonna date anyone from the start trek universe it's gonna be 7 of 9. :D

patriot45
02-21-2010, 08:56 PM
And you never will see a pic of me. Sorry. :o

Whats up!?! Are you short!?
I hear alot of people won't post a pic, whats up with that? I and many others have been throwing them up for years. I'm not afraid of someone finding out that I am a conservative! And I'm bald, but thin! :D

Just take your picture with a big dog and a cool gun, no one will screw with you!:D

Rockntractor
02-21-2010, 08:57 PM
Whats up!?! Are you short!?
I hear alot of people won't post a pic, whats up with that? I and many others have been throwing them up for years. I'm not afraid of someone finding out that I am a conservative! And I'm bald, but thin! :D

Just take your picture with a big dog and a cool gun, no one will screw with you!:D
If he does I can't laugh?:confused:

patriot45
02-21-2010, 09:08 PM
If he does I can't laugh?:confused:

Oh C'mon!!! Her first pic would be totally bogus!:rolleyes:
Probably a pic of Jake Gyllenhaal and some sort of pisstol!:D

Rockntractor
02-21-2010, 09:13 PM
Oh C'mon!!! Her first pic would be totally bogus!:rolleyes:
Probably a pic of Jake Gyllenhaal and some sort of pisstol!:D
I think she is mad anyway, she disappeared I've been too mean.:(

patriot45
02-21-2010, 09:16 PM
I think she is mad anyway, she disappeared I've been too mean.:(

At least we didn't Hi-jack the thread! Its still kinda gay! BTW I think she like it when your mean!
Whip me, beat me, call me Edna!! Its a poli-mantra!

PoliCon
02-21-2010, 09:32 PM
Whats up!?! Are you short!?
I hear alot of people won't post a pic, whats up with that? I and many others have been throwing them up for years. I'm not afraid of someone finding out that I am a conservative! And I'm bald, but thin! :D

Just take your picture with a big dog and a cool gun, no one will screw with you!:D

No thanks. One internet stalker showing up at my door scaring the shit out of my wife is more than enough for me.

PoliCon
02-21-2010, 09:34 PM
At least we didn't Hi-jack the thread! Its still kinda gay! BTW I think she like it when your mean!
Whip me, beat me, call me Edna!! Its a poli-mantra!

Mean? Goatboy? :rolleyes: He's as mean silk sheets.