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megimoo
03-14-2010, 01:22 PM
Short Barrel Shotguns for Department of Education?
The Department of Education has issued a solicitation for...well, here, I'll let them tell you:

The U.S. Department of Education (ED) intends to purchase twenty-seven (27) REMINGTON BRAND MODEL 870 POLICE 12/14P MOD GRWC XS4 KXCS SF. RAMAC #24587 GAUGE: 12 BARREL: 14" - PARKERIZED CHOKE: MODIFIED SIGHTS: GHOST RING REAR WILSON COMBAT; FRONT - XS CONTOUR BEAD SIGHT STOCK: KNOXX REDUCE RECOIL ADJUSTABLE STOCK FORE-END: SPEEDFEED SPORT-SOLID - 14" LOP are designated as the only shotguns authorized for ED based on compatibility with ED existing shotgun inventory, certified armor and combat training and protocol, maintenance, and parts.

A 14" barrel is something denied to We the People. Unless our registration is approved and we pay a tax...

NFA '34 said so. And why?

The $200 making and transfer taxes on most NFA firearms were considered quite severe and adequate to carry out Congress’ purpose to discourage or eliminate transactions in these firearms.

The Miller ruling upheld it. Even though the "reasoning" was wrong.

And let's not forget the accusation of shortening barrels illegally was the catalyst for the government killing Randy Weaver's wife and son.

They really don't want us having these. But they want them for themselves. Why?

I join my colleague Seattle Gun Rights Examiner Dave Workman in asking "Why does Department of Education need 12-gauge shotguns?" Except I would insert "the hell" between "Why" and "does."

Per Workman's article:

A spokesperson for the Department of Education says the guns are for use by officers with the agency’s Office of Inspector General. They have full federal law enforcement authority, and the IG’s office investigates “waste, fraud, abuse, and other criminal activity involving Federal education funds, programs, and operations.”

And why do they have "full federal law enforcement authority"?

"I guess that someone in the federal government thinks there's going to be a civil war . . ."
http://sipseystreetirregulars.blogspot.com/2010/03/i-guess-that-someone-in-federal.html
...............
http://www.examiner.com/x-1417-Gun-Rights-Examiner~y2010m3d11-Short-barrel-shotguns-for-Department-of-Education

lacarnut
03-14-2010, 01:27 PM
You mean I can not buy one. I am in the market for a shotgun and would like to know what is the shortest barrel one that I can buy that is legal.

NJCardFan
03-14-2010, 03:42 PM
You mean I can not buy one. I am in the market for a shotgun and would like to know what is the shortest barrel one that I can buy that is legal.

I can.:D Being in law enforcement has it's little privileges.

Big Guy
03-14-2010, 03:45 PM
You mean I can not buy one. I am in the market for a shotgun and would like to know what is the shortest barrel one that I can buy that is legal.

Unfortunately you are restricted to an 18" Barrel unless you pay the $200 Tax to the BATFE. It's not really worth it.

I have an 18" Barrel on my 870, the longer barrel will improve accuracy it's just not as good for clearing rooms as the shorter barrel.

NJCardFan
03-14-2010, 03:48 PM
Unfortunately you are restricted to an 18" Barrel unless you pay the $200 Tax to the BATFE. It's not really worth it.

I have an 18" Barrel on my 870, the longer barrel will improve accuracy it's just not as good for clearing rooms as the shorter barrel.

Is that was you have in your avatar?

Big Guy
03-14-2010, 03:48 PM
I can.:D Being in law enforcement has it's little privileges.

Yes you can, be careful the BATFE still want's their $200. I had quite a discussion with an agent in Nashville while I was building mine, opted out of the shorter BBL.

lacarnut
03-14-2010, 03:50 PM
I can.:D Being in law enforcement has it's little privileges.

Lucky you. However, I would not want your job for all the tea in China .:) Takes a special person to do what you do.

lacarnut
03-14-2010, 03:53 PM
Unfortunately you are restricted to an 18" Barrel unless you pay the $200 Tax to the BATFE. It's not really worth it.

I have an 18" Barrel on my 870, the longer barrel will improve accuracy it's just not as good for clearing rooms as the shorter barrel.

I am dumb as the day long when it comes to guns so I would like to ask your opinion on removing the stock and putting a pistol grip on it. I read that something like that could be done. The gun will be for house use only plus what kind of ammo would you use .

Big Guy
03-14-2010, 03:55 PM
Is that was you have in your avatar?

Yes but that isn't ahttp://i811.photobucket.com/albums/zz35/BigGuychitman/Mytoys.jpg pic of mine, here is mine.

BadCat
03-14-2010, 03:56 PM
You mean I can not buy one. I am in the market for a shotgun and would like to know what is the shortest barrel one that I can buy that is legal.

If you have a Cabela's near you, watch for sales. They've been putting Rem 870 and Mossberg 500's in tactical configurations, at prices right around $300.

BadCat
03-14-2010, 04:00 PM
I have one of these next to the nightstand, loaded and chambered at all times (no, I don't have any kids)...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v238/Gixerman1000/Long%20guns/M4S90.jpg

I have the same mag tube as this guy does, it doesn't cut off the tube at 5 rounds. I can get 9 into it using the "Benelli shuttle" trick.

Big Guy
03-14-2010, 04:02 PM
I am dumb as the day long when it comes to guns so I would like to ask your opinion on removing the stock and putting a pistol grip on it. I read that something like that could be done. The gun will be for house use only plus what kind of ammo would you use .

You can purchase one for around $300, then get a new stock with a pistol brip for between $50.00 and $250.00. If your not into guns much I would just order one the way I want it from a local gun shop and be done with it.

As far as ammo, I like to rotate 00 Buck, 1 oz Slug. Get the reduced recoil, it will do what you need with way less recoil.

Chuck58
03-14-2010, 04:04 PM
I picked up a Saiga a year or so ago. Twenty inch barrel and a couple of high capacity mags.

Excellent shotgun. It's just a mean looking gun and absolutely reliable. I've put a couple of thousand rounds through it, mostly my reloads shooting trap (not very successfully). Love this thing.

Big Guy
03-14-2010, 04:05 PM
I have one of these next to the nightstand, loaded and chambered at all times (no, I don't have any kids)...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v238/Gixerman1000/Long%20guns/M4S90.jpg

I have the same mag tube as this guy does, it doesn't cut off the tube at 5 rounds. I can get 9 into it using the "Benelli shuttle" trick.

Sweet, I only fit 5 plus 1 with my 2 round mag extension.

BadCat
03-14-2010, 04:08 PM
You can purchase one for around $300, then get a new stock with a pistol brip for between $50.00 and $250.00. If your not into guns much I would just order one the way I want it from a local gun shop and be done with it.

As far as ammo, I like to rotate 00 Buck, 1 oz Slug. Get the reduced recoil, it will do what you need with way less recoil.

Second the rec on the low recoil rounds...very nice stuff.

I have the first 5 as 00, the last 4 as slugs...in case they run.

lacarnut
03-14-2010, 04:30 PM
I have the first 5 as 00, the last 4 as slugs...in case they run.

That's some funny shit there.

Big Guy
03-14-2010, 04:36 PM
Second the rec on the low recoil rounds...very nice stuff.

I have the first 5 as 00, the last 4 as slugs...in case they run.

1st is 00 to slow em down, then the slug to stop em. Ever used a Bore thunder round?:D

NJCardFan
03-14-2010, 09:26 PM
Lucky you. However, I would not want your job for all the tea in China .:) Takes a special person to do what you do.

You have to be fucked up in the head. Pretty much explains me. :D

Big Guy
03-14-2010, 09:28 PM
You have to be fucked up in the head. Pretty much explains me. :D

You don't have to be crazy, but it helps.

PoliCon
03-14-2010, 10:01 PM
I cannot think of a single justifiable reason for the ED to need such firearms.

Big Guy
03-14-2010, 10:03 PM
I cannot think of a single justifiable reason for the ED to need such firearms.

Those first graders can be a hand full.

Rockntractor
03-14-2010, 10:11 PM
They will have to give Policon a 410 gauge, the recoil from a 12 gauge would knock the little fella over!:eek:

Big Guy
03-14-2010, 10:13 PM
They will have to give Policon a 410 gauge, the recoil from a 12 gauge would knock the little fella over!:eek:

410 with reduced recoil #8 shot. :D

Bubba Dawg
03-14-2010, 10:14 PM
I am dumb as the day long when it comes to guns so I would like to ask your opinion on removing the stock and putting a pistol grip on it. I read that something like that could be done. The gun will be for house use only plus what kind of ammo would you use .

I love the 870. You won't go wrong with it.

I have a Mossberg Mariner that comes with a regular stock and an interchangeable pistol grip that has no stock at all behind the pistol grip.

The advantage with the pistol grip is compactness. That, along with the short barrel makes the weapon very pointable. It is more difficult to shoot accurately (for me anyway) with that type pistol grip. I like the pistol grip with the stock behind it like Badcat showed in the illustration.

With full house loads of buckshot and a simple pistol grip the gun does buck when you shoot it. With that arrangement, it is a close-up weapon that is devastating in its effect.

For most situations I prefer the regular stock, or one with the pistol grip and a stock behind it. Try it and see which you are comfortable with.

Rockntractor
03-14-2010, 10:16 PM
410 with reduced recoil #8 shot. :D
He could wear big shoes too so he would wobble but not fall down!:D

Bubba Dawg
03-14-2010, 10:21 PM
They will have to give Policon a 410 gauge, the recoil from a 12 gauge would knock the little fella over!:eek:

Even with a .410, he has such tiny hands.

And you know what they say...tiny hands....tiny...gloves....

Rockntractor
03-14-2010, 10:27 PM
Even with a .410, he has such tiny hands.

And you know what they say...tiny hands....tiny...gloves....

How could he see over the desks to shoot? I guess he would have to stand on top of his desk!

Bubba Dawg
03-14-2010, 10:29 PM
How could he see over the desks to shoot? I guess he would have to stand on top of his desk!

Okay, for the sake of argument, let's say that Poli could actually climb all the way up on his desk. Do you think he could do it lugging a shotgun?

Freeman_Shadwell
03-14-2010, 10:29 PM
Aside from the fact that shotguns being issued to the DOE is beyond ridiculous, and rather suspect, I love my 870. :D

I bought mine with the factory "18 barrel w/ 2 shot extensioin, and later added a "28 vent rib barrel for trap/skeet. It normally stays in 2 legged vermin mode with the short barrel and 6 rounds of 00 buck in the butt stock shell holder.

megimoo
03-14-2010, 10:30 PM
Even with a .410, he has such tiny hands.

And you know what they say...tiny hands....tiny...gloves....http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUXD3kjI_PI

PoliCon
03-14-2010, 10:31 PM
Those first graders can be a hand full.
AH! but those who should use them would never - and those that would use them would never be given the chance.

PoliCon
03-14-2010, 10:33 PM
They will have to give Policon a 410 gauge, the recoil from a 12 gauge would knock the little fella over!:eek:

If I have to get a chair to kick your ass - I will. :mad:

Bubba Dawg
03-14-2010, 10:33 PM
Aside from the fact that shotguns being issued to the DOE is beyond ridiculous, and rather suspect, I love my 870. :D

I bought mine with the factory "18 barrel w/ 2 shot extensioin, and later added a "28 vent rib barrel for trap/skeet. It normally stays in 2 legged vermin mode with the short barrel and 6 rounds of 00 buck in the butt stock shell holder.

It's hard to beat a Remington shotgun. I like to trade guns with family and friends so, right now as it happens, I am without a Remington, but the purchase or trade for an 870 is on the horizon.

Rockntractor
03-14-2010, 10:33 PM
Okay, for the sake of argument, let's say that Poli could actually climb all the way up on his desk. Do you think he could do it lugging a shotgun?

I'm thinking it might be better just to give him a hand grenade, But could he throw it far enough to escape the blast?:confused:

Bubba Dawg
03-14-2010, 10:35 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUXD3kjI_PI

Nice. :D

Mini-P

Bubba Dawg
03-14-2010, 10:36 PM
I'm thinking it might be better just to give him a hand grenade, But could he throw it far enough to escape the blast?:confused:

His right arm is incredibly strong. He uses it to....you know....um.......:o:D

Rockntractor
03-14-2010, 10:41 PM
His right arm is incredibly strong. He uses it to....you know....um.......:o:D

Good point! As long as he didn't put to much squeeze on it!:D

Bubba Dawg
03-14-2010, 10:42 PM
Good point! As long as he didn't put to much squeeze on it!:D

He'll shoot his eye out.....

PoliCon
03-14-2010, 10:46 PM
I'm thinking it might be better just to give him a hand grenade, But could he throw it far enough to escape the blast?:confused:

Don't make me kick your ass again!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i38X8GA0wAY

PoliCon
03-14-2010, 10:47 PM
His right arm is incredibly strong. He uses it to....you know....um.......:o:D

oy vey. I haven't needed to do that over a decade. :rolleyes:

Rockntractor
03-14-2010, 10:48 PM
He'll shoot his eye out.....
http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv230/upyourstruly/ShootEye_blackt-shirt.jpg?t=1268624849

PoliCon
03-14-2010, 10:49 PM
http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv230/upyourstruly/ShootEye_blackt-shirt.jpg?t=1268624849

I did kinda look like him as a kid . . . and not just because of the PJ's either. :p

Bubba Dawg
03-14-2010, 10:53 PM
I did kinda look like him as a kid . . . and not just because of the PJ's either. :p

:D