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Articulate_Ape
04-14-2010, 06:15 PM
...that this is going to amount to anything?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBody5RPo2o



I'd say not very good.


http://i531.photobucket.com/albums/dd359/JamesSavant/pope-1.jpg

fettpett
04-14-2010, 06:18 PM
the whole thing is a crock of shit. he wasn't even in the postions to do anything about the Milwaukee case, because he wasn't in the office till 5 years later...

Articulate_Ape
04-14-2010, 06:19 PM
the whole thing is a crock of shit. he wasn't even in the postions to do anything about the Milwaukee case, because he wasn't in the office till 5 years later...

Which office? Cardinal?

fettpett
04-14-2010, 06:21 PM
no, the office that dealt with the sex abuse cases at the Vatican.

Articulate_Ape
04-14-2010, 06:26 PM
no, the office that dealt with the sex abuse cases at the Vatican.

FWIW, which may not be much since it's the NYT...



Top Vatican officials — including the future Pope Benedict XVI — did not defrock a priest who molested as many as 200 deaf boys, even though several American bishops repeatedly warned them that failure to act on the matter could embarrass the church, according to church files newly unearthed as part of a lawsuit.

Whole story... (http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/25/world/europe/25vatican.html)

fettpett
04-14-2010, 06:49 PM
yeah, thats the story i was refereing too. Either Mark Belling (1130 WISN) or Jeff Wagner (620 WTMJ) out of Milwaukee were talking about it a couple of weeks ago when the stroy came out. The AP didn't even talk to Weakland who was in charge of the investgation. Murphy died 2-3 DAYS after Weakland sent the letters to the Vatican. so the whole case was a moot point.

fettpett
04-14-2010, 06:55 PM
it was Jeff Wagner, http://www.620wtmj.com/shows/jeffwagner/89116122.html
unfortunately his like doesn't go anywhere :(

Also Timothy Dolan http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timothy_Dolan who's the Archbishop in NY is the brother to Wagner's former partner. the NY press hates him too because he's very conservative

Gingersnap
04-14-2010, 10:46 PM
When will the atheists demand to arrest the Secretary of Education? Public schools have way more sex abuse and the people who use them usually have no other options.

NJCardFan
04-14-2010, 10:57 PM
When will the atheists demand to arrest the Secretary of Education? Public schools have way more sex abuse and the people who use them usually have no other options.

bingbingbingbingbingbingbing

And by extension, doesn't that make the president responsible?

wilbur
04-14-2010, 11:08 PM
When will the atheists demand to arrest the Secretary of Education? Public schools have way more sex abuse and the people who use them usually have no other options.

Public schools generally don't smuggle their child rapists out of the country to evade the law, and/or re-assign them to other schools.

And if they do, they get in a helluva lot of trouble for it. Our laws can actually reach them, for the most part.

Rockntractor
04-14-2010, 11:13 PM
Public schools generally don't smuggle their child rapists out of the country to evade the law, and/or re-assign them to other schools.

Our laws actually reach them, for the most part.

No the President makes them czars after they write books about it.




Someone quote this so the little bitch has to read it!

Articulate_Ape
04-14-2010, 11:17 PM
When will the atheists demand to arrest the Secretary of Education? Public schools have way more sex abuse and the people who use them usually have no other options.

I am no fan of public education, but intellectual honesty demands some citation here, Ginger.

Rockntractor
04-14-2010, 11:23 PM
Fistgate III: Obama’s Safe Schools Czar’s ‘Black Book’ For Kids Included Tips on Fisting and Pi$$ing on Your Partner
by Jim Hoft

In March 2000 the Gay, Lesbian, and Straight Education Network (GLSEN) organization of Massachusetts held its 10 Year Anniversary GLSEN/Boston conference at Tufts University. This conference was fully supported by the Massachusetts Department of Education, the Safe Schools Program, the Governor’s Commission on Gay and Lesbian Youth, and some of the presenters even received federal money. During the 2000 conference, workshop leaders led a “youth only, ages 14-21″ session that offered lessons in “fisting” a dangerous sexual practice. During the same workshop an activist asked 14 year-old students, “Spit or swallow?… Is it rude?” The unbelievable audio clip is posted here. Barack Obama’s “Safe Schools Czar” Kevin Jennings is the founder of GLSEN. He was paid $273,573.96 as its executive director in 2007. Jennings was the keynote speaker at the 2000 GLSEN conference.


Barack Obama’s “Safe Schools Czar” was the keynote speaker at the GLSEN/Boston Conference at Tufts University in 2000. High school students at the conference learned about fisting and watersports from the GLSEN activists. Jennings is seen here holding the conference program. (Via Mass Resistance)
http://biggovernment.com/jhoft/2009/12/09/fistgate-iii-obamas-safe-schools-czars-black-book-for-kids-included-tips-on-fisting-and-piing-on-your-partner/

Gingersnap
04-14-2010, 11:27 PM
Public schools generally don't smuggle their child rapists out of the country to evade the law, and/or re-assign them to other schools.

And if they do, they get in a helluva lot of trouble for it. Our laws can actually reach them, for the most part.

Since when? 1995? No public school teachers between 1900 and 1994 ever got "therapy", reassignment, or transfers? None of them were "encouraged" to take early retirement? They never moved to administrative jobs inside the schools full of kids? Never? Really?

You are either uninformed or wildly naive. It was standard practice to do all of things in the public school system up until the early to mid 1990s. Like it was standard practice in the RCC and among the Lutherans and in the Boy's Clubs and so on.

The knee-jerk horror of child sexual abuse is pretty new. Prior to that it was considered a psychological pathology that could be cured or redirected. Before that it was considered a garden variety sexual perversion. :rolleyes:

Gingersnap
04-14-2010, 11:34 PM
I am no fan of public education, but intellectual honesty demands some citation here, Ginger.

Educator Sexual Misconduct (http://www2.ed.gov/rschstat/research/pubs/misconductreview/report.pdf)

Articulate_Ape
04-14-2010, 11:38 PM
Educator Sexual Misconduct (http://www2.ed.gov/rschstat/research/pubs/misconductreview/report.pdf)

Thank you.

Gingersnap
04-14-2010, 11:54 PM
Thank you.

Anytime. No matter how rotten some Catholic priests have been over the past 100 years, they simply didn't have the sheer numbers to equal the equivalent rottenness among public school teachers.

Today, the best estimate of educator or religious sexual abuse is about 4% across all school types, rec center/sports groups, after-school activity centers, or religious activity groups.

Here's an interesting link to sexual abuse of deaf kids at state schools right here in the good old non-religious USA: Seattle Post Intelligencer (http://www.seattlepi.com/specials/licensetokill/testhelp.asp?searchpagefrom=1&searchdiff=19)

Articulate_Ape
04-15-2010, 12:00 AM
Anytime. No matter how rotten some Catholic priests have been over the past 100 years, they simply didn't have the sheer numbers to equal the equivalent rottenness among public school teachers.

Today, the best estimate of educator or religious sexual abuse is about 4% across all school types, rec center/sports groups, after-school activity centers, or religious activity groups.

Here's an interesting link to sexual abuse of deaf kids at state schools right here in the good old non-religious USA: Seattle Post Intelligencer (http://www.seattlepi.com/specials/licensetokill/testhelp.asp?searchpagefrom=1&searchdiff=19)

But how many of those teachers were prosecuted, Ginger? I have not yet read that whole pdf file.

Gingersnap
04-15-2010, 12:10 AM
But how many of those teachers were prosecuted, Ginger? I have not yet read that whole pdf file.

It would depend on the time frame you used. Many of the current claims against Catholic priests occurred between 1950 and 1985 - most now date from the late 1970s. Very few would have gone to prosecution then, partly because the current "meme" was counseling and a "change of scene" and partly out of a misguided but prevalent respect for authority. The same was true of public school teachers of that time. Women went through the same thing over sexual abuse by physicians during that era. Today most docs will not perform an internal exam on a woman without a female nurse present and this is true of female doctors. Times change.

Articulate_Ape
04-15-2010, 12:54 AM
It would depend on the time frame you used. Many of the current claims against Catholic priests occurred between 1950 and 1985 - most now date from the late 1970s. Very few would have gone to prosecution then, partly because the current "meme" was counseling and a "change of scene" and partly out of a misguided but prevalent respect for authority. The same was true of public school teachers of that time. Women went through the same thing over sexual abuse by physicians during that era. Today most docs will not perform an internal exam on a woman without a female nurse present and this is true of female doctors. Times change.


I might have to pretend you are smarter than me after that. Damn you to hell!

noonwitch
04-15-2010, 08:59 AM
It would depend on the time frame you used. Many of the current claims against Catholic priests occurred between 1950 and 1985 - most now date from the late 1970s. Very few would have gone to prosecution then, partly because the current "meme" was counseling and a "change of scene" and partly out of a misguided but prevalent respect for authority. The same was true of public school teachers of that time. Women went through the same thing over sexual abuse by physicians during that era. Today most docs will not perform an internal exam on a woman without a female nurse present and this is true of female doctors. Times change.



Until the 90s, Children's Services still provided services to reuinte children with parents who sexually abused them. Times definitely change. But the two things are related to your point about the trend at the time of counseling those accused of sexual crimes, because it was thought that they could be rehabilitated. Nobody really thinks that anymore, except for very young offenders (under 14 or so) who were recently abused themselves.

Gingersnap
04-15-2010, 10:05 AM
Until the 90s, Children's Services still provided services to reuinte children with parents who sexually abused them. Times definitely change. But the two things are related to your point about the trend at the time of counseling those accused of sexual crimes, because it was thought that they could be rehabilitated. Nobody really thinks that anymore, except for very young offenders (under 14 or so) who were recently abused themselves.

Too true. As a society we always seem willing to believe that whatever answer we come up with now is the gold standard for resolving the issue and that it should morally apply retroactively. Then 15 years go by and there is an entirely new 'gold standard' answer that assumes the very same level of certainty and moral authority.

It's exhausting.

fettpett
04-15-2010, 10:24 AM
Too true. As a society we always seem willing to believe that whatever answer we come up with now is the gold standard for resolving the issue and that it should morally apply retroactively. Then 15 years go by and there is an entirely new 'gold standard' answer that assumes the very same level of certainty and moral authority.

It's exhausting.

exactly, thus the reason for statute of limitations on everything but murder. I absolutely hate it when people try and force their current morality on historical events or people. you can't do it. simply because what society deems moral now, may not be moral tomorrow or 40 years from now

FlaGator
04-15-2010, 12:39 PM
When will the atheists demand to arrest the Secretary of Education? Public schools have way more sex abuse and the people who use them usually have no other options.

The Secretary of Education, Arne Duncan, believes in the evolution so he is exempt from arrest.