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Gingersnap
05-13-2010, 10:56 AM
Transgenders win discrimination tiff with American Eagle Outfitters, AG Andrew Cuomo forces changes
BY Erica Pearson
DAILY NEWS STAFF WRITER

Wednesday, May 12th 2010, 9:04 AM

American Eagle Outfitters store in Times Square. American Outfitters has agreed to re-write their policies to accomodate transgender employees. Take our PollAmerican Eagle transgender case
Do you think employers should be able to ban men from dressing like ladies (and vice versa) at work?

Attorney General Andrew Cuomo has forced the flannel and khaki outpost to make some changes, including nixing a rule about employee "personal appearance" that banned men from wearing women's clothing and ladies from dressing as guys.

"This shows me that there's faith and hope. There might be a domino effect, that's what I'm hoping for," said Joi-elle White, 35, a transgender member of Make the Road New York.

The community group complained to Cuomo's office about what it called a pattern of discrimination against transgender job hunters. A probe confirmed the complaints, officials said.

The retailer - which employs more than 2,000 people in its 61 New York stores - signed a settlement deal promising to change its policies and employee handbook.

"To avoid further expense and the distraction of a prolonged argument, [we have] agreed to a compromise settlement in this case, with the understanding that AEO is not admitting to the findings," a company spokeswoman said.

It will be interesting to see how this plays out. I don't care if trannies drive buses or make sushi for a living but as a woman, I no more want one in a dressing room with me than I would any other version of male.


Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/money/2010/05/12/2010-05-12_transgenders_win_discriminmation_tiff_with_amer ican_eagle_outfitters_.html#ixzz0nozasJt3

noonwitch
05-13-2010, 11:02 AM
American Eagle Outfitters, the store known for selling clothes to women that look like men's clothes, has a problem with cross dressing employees?

Gingersnap
05-13-2010, 11:13 AM
American Eagle Outfitters, the store known for selling clothes to women that look like men's clothes, has a problem with cross dressing employees?

Would it make a difference if the store was Chico's, Nordstrom's, or Forever 21? :confused:

noonwitch
05-13-2010, 11:24 AM
Would it make a difference if the store was Chico's, Nordstrom's, or Forever 21? :confused:



It would be great for Forever 21 to hire trannies. No one else wants to buy that cheap, gaudy, fake-gold jewelry. The store I've seen doesn't sell anything that needs to be tried on first-it's all paste jewelry and accessories.


I really don't care if a trannie shares the dressing rooms or bathrooms with me. The last time I ever saw a store where they had a communal fitting room, without individual rooms or booths with doors, is a Marianne shop in the 70s. If a trannie wants to use a fitting room at Nordies when I'm using one, I'll only see him/her when I'm checking out how I look in the 3-way mirror in the hallway. Then I'm going to ask his/her opinion on how I look, like I would of anyone else standing there.

Gingersnap
05-13-2010, 11:35 AM
It would be great for Forever 21 to hire trannies. No one else wants to buy that cheap, gaudy, fake-gold jewelry. The store I've seen doesn't sell anything that needs to be tried on first-it's all paste jewelry and accessories.


I really don't care if a trannie shares the dressing rooms or bathrooms with me. The last time I ever saw a store where they had a communal fitting room, without individual rooms or booths with doors, is a Marianne shop in the 70s. If a trannie wants to use a fitting room at Nordies when I'm using one, I'll only see him/her when I'm checking out how I look in the 3-way mirror in the hallway. Then I'm going to ask his/her opinion on how I look, like I would of anyone else standing there.

Not me. As far as I can see the entire 'gender confusion' issue is just one more way for genetic males to take something away from genetic females and trivialize it. It's no different from a wigger claiming and capitalizing on black American history and experiences.

jediab
05-13-2010, 12:03 PM
Question: If a straight man dressed as a woman went into a woman's dressing room and was confronted, would he be arrested and branded a sexual predator? If so, why would it be fair for a he/she/it with a penis to do the same thing?

lacarnut
05-13-2010, 01:06 PM
American Eagle Outfitters, the store known for selling clothes to women that look like men's clothes, has a problem with cross dressing employees?

Clothes are not the problem; it's the freaks that wear them. As a customer I have the right to ask a manager to have a straight salesperson wait on me so that I do not throw up all over his merchandise. If that offends the misfits working in the store, tough shit.

noonwitch
05-13-2010, 01:50 PM
Clothes are not the problem; it's the freaks that wear them. As a customer I have the right to ask a manager to have a straight salesperson wait on me so that I do not throw up all over his merchandise. If that offends the misfits working in the store, tough shit.



And the manager has the right to tell you to wait in line for the first available clerk. You don't have the right to have a straight salesperson wait on you, and if you do throw up on the merchandise after demanding a straight clerk, you will pay for that merchandise.


You are free to boycott any store that hires gays, though. All of them probably hire gays, even WalMart. But Cracker Barrel fires employees once they find out they're gay, so at least there's a restaurant you can rely on, for the most part. Except for the sneaky gays who blend in with the straights, they might be able to convince a manager at Cracker Barrel that they are straight enough to wait tables for minimum wage.

Speedy
05-13-2010, 02:29 PM
And the manager has the right to tell you to wait in line for the first available clerk. You don't have the right to have a straight salesperson wait on you, and if you do throw up on the merchandise after demanding a straight clerk, you will pay for that merchandise.

Yes, I do. And the manager of said store has the right to hire whoever the fuck he wants. When I have owned my business I can tell you that I would not hire any transgendered person and the reason would entirely be because they were transgendered. Hell I would not hire a gay person if they were too obviously gay.

There are norms and people who fall out of those norms are ABNORMAL! If you are too fucking gay to live among a world of straight people then the problem is YOU, not the millions of straight people.

lacarnut
05-13-2010, 02:34 PM
[QUOTE=noonwitch;269436]And the manager has the right to tell you to wait in line for the first available clerk. You don't have the right to have a straight salesperson wait on you, and if you do throw up on the merchandise after demanding a straight clerk, you will pay for that merchandise.


QUOTE]

You are out of your mind. As a customor, I have a right to ask for straight salespersen. I have done it; so you do not know what the fuck you are talking about. I am not going let some sissy wait on me. If I did throw up in a store, I would like to see them try to make me pay for it. Oh, I forgot, you live in Detroit with all the degenerates. So, that would be the norm.

noonwitch
05-13-2010, 04:34 PM
[QUOTE=noonwitch;269436]And the manager has the right to tell you to wait in line for the first available clerk. You don't have the right to have a straight salesperson wait on you, and if you do throw up on the merchandise after demanding a straight clerk, you will pay for that merchandise.


QUOTE]

You are out of your mind. As a customor, I have a right to ask for straight salespersen. I have done it; so you do not know what the fuck you are talking about. I am not going let some sissy wait on me. If I did throw up in a store, I would like to see them try to make me pay for it. Oh, I forgot, you live in Detroit with all the degenerates. So, that would be the norm.


The store you shop at accomodates homophobic customs. Do they have separate drinking fountains for gays in your part of the country, too?



You shop at a store that accomodates your homophobic paranoia. The manager would rather avoid having a scene or allow his employees to be verbally harrassed at work, so he arranges for a straight person ring you up. I'm not sure why you are proud that you have the maturity of a 13 year old, but at least your store takes care of their most important customor:D.

lacarnut
05-13-2010, 04:52 PM
[QUOTE=lacarnut;269451]


The store you shop at accomodates homophobic customs. Do they have separate drinking fountains for gays in your part of the country, too?



You shop at a store that accomodates your homophobic paranoia. The manager would rather avoid having a scene or allow his employees to be verbally harrassed at work, so he arranges for a straight person ring you up. I'm not sure why you are proud that you have the maturity of a 13 year old, but at least your store takes care of their most important customor:D.

In my part of the country, we see very little of the deranged lifestyle you speak of. Thank God for that cause I would have to move out of Yankee cesspools like Detroit or NYC.

I have never had a homo, lesbo or transgender wait on me that I was aware of. However, I do like to fuck with Liberals that suck up to them like you. BTW, I do not use drinking fountains. Too many germs. :eek:

I am mature enough to have gotten laid many time. You should try it.

noonwitch
05-13-2010, 04:59 PM
[QUOTE=noonwitch;269479]

In my part of the country, we see very little of the deranged lifestyle you speak of. Thank God for that cause I would have to move out of Yankee cesspools like Detroit or NYC.

I have never had a homo, lesbo or transgender wait on me that I was aware of. However, I do like to fuck with Liberals that suck up to them like you. BTW, I do not use drinking fountains. Too many germs. :eek:

I am mature enough to have gotten laid many time. You should try it.



I didn't know treating people like human beings translated to sucking up to them.


I'm so mature that I don't need to get laid, especially if my only choices are idiotic crackers who are so insecure about their own sexuality that they are threatened by the very existence of gays in their vicinity.

I'm out of here, so don't misinterpret my lack of response to whatever inane comment you can pull out of that hateful little mind of yours as running away in fear. It's payday and Fringe is on tonight.

Speedy
05-13-2010, 05:09 PM
[QUOTE=lacarnut;269483]



I didn't know treating people like human beings translated to sucking up to them.

That is the problem. Getting treated like NORMAL human beings is offensive to these weirdos. Everyone who has a penis gets to use one restroom, everyone who does not uses the other one. Where is the inequality in that? Everyone who has a penis (or we will male slight exceptions here and limit it to those that one would "assume has a penis because of how they look) is covered by a vertain dress code and everyone who does not is covered by another. Of course this is not to be interpreted by how you feel about the fact that you have a penis or don't. It is not up to society who should have to accept the norms of these weirdos. It is up to these these oddballs to admit that they are weirdos and they should accept the much deserved scorn piled upon them.

JB
05-13-2010, 05:22 PM
I am mature enough to have gotten laid many time. You should try it.Dude, what's wrong with you? Uncalled for.

lacarnut
05-13-2010, 08:01 PM
Dude, what's wrong with you? Uncalled for.

Nothing. She questioned my maturity and evidently did not like my response....she can dish out the personal attacks but can not take them.That's what I call tough titty.

malloc
05-13-2010, 08:32 PM
I don't really have anything against gays or transgenders, mostly because I could care less about what a guy wears or who he sleeps with. That doesn't mean I'm going to let a man who is sexually confused enough to dress as a woman because it makes him feel sexy or something into my house to meet my kids and wife. I reserve the right to that decision through private property rights, so I must side with American Eagle on this issue.

American Eagle owns the store, owns the company, and thus American Eagle leadership has a absolute say in who they hire, and what their at-work dress code is and that is the end of the story. The transgenders who are calling themselves victims here weren't forced to work at American Eagle, they can leave and pursue employment within a company more friendly to their choices of attire. It doesn't matter the reason, the owner of the property, in this case the American Eagle company, sets the qualifications, agreements, and rules of conduct for hire.

I know this argument can be expanded to encompass hiring being based on race or religion or whatever, but I think the owner of the property has the right to not hire someone for any reason what so ever. I think the practice of basing hiring decisions in any way on race is stupid, ignorant, and disgraceful, but I won't ever stand between a person and their own stupidity. We can't legislate or litigate out the stupid, that doesn't work very well. The only thing we can do is let people be free to make their own decisions with their own property.

KhrushchevsShoe
05-13-2010, 08:36 PM
You are out of your mind. As a customor, I have a right to ask for straight salespersen. I have done it; so you do not know what the fuck you are talking about. I am not going let some sissy wait on me. If I did throw up in a store, I would like to see them try to make me pay for it. Oh, I forgot, you live in Detroit with all the degenerates. So, that would be the norm.

You must be the biggest asshole I have ever seen.

Im sure youre proud of it too, btw.

Gingersnap
05-13-2010, 09:10 PM
Let's get back to the real issue: why do genetic women have to play along with genetic men usurping female gender roles all the time?

This flap with the store is just part of a much larger initiative to invade female spaces like locker rooms, feminist groups and classrooms, and bathrooms/dormitories/hospital wards with men. It's about devaluing a woman's authentic experience (as usual). As usual, a woman who even mounts an objection to this kind of thing is automatically branded a traitor to her sex (under our new, improved understanding of "sex as a construct").

It's infuriating and it wouldn't be tolerated if the same tactics were brought to bear on racial, age, or ethnic spheres.

lacarnut
05-13-2010, 09:27 PM
You must be the biggest asshole I have ever seen.

Im sure youre proud of it too, btw.

Fuck you, punk.

patriot45
05-13-2010, 09:40 PM
Fuck you, punk.

That might have been too nuanced for the shoe!:D Go for the throat!!

I have a mother, daughters and granddaughters, keep the womans room the womans room and the mens room the mens room just like time immemorial! Its always worked well. Trannies, fags and lesbos still have to conform to the norm, the normal should not have to cater or conform to the deviant! Or am I wrong?

lacarnut
05-13-2010, 09:56 PM
That might have been too nuanced for the shoe!:D Go for the throat!!

I have a mother, daughters and granddaughters, keep the womans room the womans room and the mens room the mens room just like time immemorial! Its always worked well. Trannies, fags and lesbos still have to conform to the norm, the normal should not have to cater or conform to the deviant! Or am I wrong?

These freaks, trannies, fags and lesbos, want special rights. Canada and the Europeans have caved into them. It is a sad day when the government pays for sex changes for mentally impared losers.

Space Gravy
05-13-2010, 10:58 PM
I don't really have anything against gays or transgenders, mostly because I could care less about what a guy wears or who he sleeps with. That doesn't mean I'm going to let a man who is sexually confused enough to dress as a woman because it makes him feel sexy or something into my house to meet my kids and wife. I reserve the right to that decision through private property rights, so I must side with American Eagle on this issue.

American Eagle owns the store, owns the company, and thus American Eagle leadership has a absolute say in who they hire, and what their at-work dress code is and that is the end of the story. The transgenders who are calling themselves victims here weren't forced to work at American Eagle, they can leave and pursue employment within a company more friendly to their choices of attire. It doesn't matter the reason, the owner of the property, in this case the American Eagle company, sets the qualifications, agreements, and rules of conduct for hire.

I know this argument can be expanded to encompass hiring being based on race or religion or whatever, but I think the owner of the property has the right to not hire someone for any reason what so ever. I think the practice of basing hiring decisions in any way on race is stupid, ignorant, and disgraceful, but I won't ever stand between a person and their own stupidity. We can't legislate or litigate out the stupid, that doesn't work very well. The only thing we can do is let people be free to make their own decisions with their own property.

The owner of the property does not have that right, although it is hard to prove.

Federal Equal Opportunity Laws prohibit employment discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, or national origin. As far as I know sexual orientation isn't covered, yet.

Elspeth
05-14-2010, 12:31 AM
Let's get back to the real issue: why do genetic women have to play along with genetic men usurping female gender roles all the time?

This flap with the store is just part of a much larger initiative to invade female spaces like locker rooms, feminist groups and classrooms, and bathrooms/dormitories/hospital wards with men. It's about devaluing a woman's authentic experience (as usual). As usual, a woman who even mounts an objection to this kind of thing is automatically branded a traitor to her sex (under our new, improved understanding of "sex as a construct").

It's infuriating and it wouldn't be tolerated if the same tactics were brought to bear on racial, age, or ethnic spheres.

Your point is being ignored because the thread is mostly males and your buddy who doesn't seem to care.

I find your point very compelling, however. This idea of gender as a construct (sex is biological, related to body parts) is almost theatrical in concept: if you strike the pose, you can be the gender. The problem is that with the rethinking of gender comes the rethinking of the way we have lived for most of our existence. I heard during the Clinton administration that Hillary Clinton went to an international meeting where 5 genders were dilineated. I don't know what they all were, but I am assuming that after straight females and straight males, there were probably gay men and lesbians and then transexuals. Does this mean we need 5 restrooms?

What do you think gay men and trannies get from "invading" female spaces like bathrooms, dorms, etc?

malloc
05-14-2010, 05:01 AM
The owner of the property does not have that right, although it is hard to prove.

Federal Equal Opportunity Laws prohibit employment discrimination based on race, color, religion, sex, or national origin. As far as I know sexual orientation isn't covered, yet.


A law that excludes the right of a private property owner does not invalidate the right, it only tramples upon it. The private property owner still has the right to hire employees as he sees fit. It's just that his right as a private property owner has been infringed.

I'm not saying it's smart, and I'm not saying it's right.

jediab
05-14-2010, 09:00 AM
Let's get back to the real issue: why do genetic women have to play along with genetic men usurping female gender roles all the time?

This flap with the store is just part of a much larger initiative to invade female spaces like locker rooms, feminist groups and classrooms, and bathrooms/dormitories/hospital wards with men. It's about devaluing a woman's authentic experience (as usual). As usual, a woman who even mounts an objection to this kind of thing is automatically branded a traitor to her sex (under our new, improved understanding of "sex as a construct").

It's infuriating and it wouldn't be tolerated if the same tactics were brought to bear on racial, age, or ethnic spheres.

To further expand on this, would women be upset if they knew a man dressed as a woman was freely moving around in the women's dressing area like she/he/it belonged there? Or like Ginger said about locker rooms and such, where does it stop? And if it is allowed, how would they be able to keep the sickos out of the female only places if all the crossdressing men had to say was, "I am a transgendered!"

Gingersnap
05-14-2010, 02:08 PM
What do you think gay men and trannies get from "invading" female spaces like bathrooms, dorms, etc?

Personally, I see people who want to remake themselves into the opposite gender as having a sexual fetish disorder. They are aroused by the trappings of the sexual object. It's even more arousing to approximate the sexual object. "Becoming" the sexual object is the ultimate arousal - for a while, anyway.

There are other factors involved, of course. The vast majority of men who pretend to be women do so in a stilted, stereotyped kind of way. They dress like hookers, or like Miss High School Sweetheart of 1979. Often the older men dress in an updated version of what their mom must have worn in 60s, 70s, or 80s. You almost never see one of these men wearing standard American female wear: jeans, athletic shoes, and a t-shirt.

The few women who pretend to be men also behave/dress in stereotyped ways. They go for the pegged jeans, the boots, and the ball cap. They embark on the never-ending quest for the functional penis.

Either way, invading exclusive spaces and demanding access to inappropriate gender roles and prerogatives is just another way to disguise the actual purpose of the behavior: intensified sexual arousal.

There are plenty of masculine women and effeminate men. You can recognize and embrace ways of thought and habits of the mind that are more common to the opposite sex without trying to become the opposite sex. We would ordinarily never allow another group to exploit and appropriate the authentic experiences of a clearly identifiable people.

But since it's hyper-sexual, mentally disturbed men doing it to "nice" women, it's perfectly cool. :rolleyes:

Elspeth
05-15-2010, 01:40 AM
The vast majority of men who pretend to be women do so in a stilted, stereotyped kind of way. They dress like hookers, or like Miss High School Sweetheart of 1979. Often the older men dress in an updated version of what their mom must have worn in 60s, 70s, or 80s. You almost never see one of these men wearing standard American female wear: jeans, athletic shoes, and a t-shirt.


That's exactly right. If they dressed like me most days, they'd wear sweats and no make-up.



Either way, invading exclusive spaces and demanding access to inappropriate gender roles and prerogatives is just another way to disguise the actual purpose of the behavior: intensified sexual arousal.


This theory works for straight men who cross dress, but what about gay male cross dressers and drag queens? They certainly can't be aroused towards females by hyperstereotyped female clothing. There has to be an identification with the latter that isn't there with the straight male crossdressers.



We would ordinarily never allow another group to exploit and appropriate the authentic experiences of a clearly identifiable people.

But since it's hyper-sexual, mentally disturbed men doing it to "nice" women, it's perfectly cool. :rolleyes:

Nice...... and touche. That's absolutely right on. If I tried to dress in traditional African garb as a white woman, I'd be accused of stealing what wasn't mine.

BTW, ever notice how it's only slavery if it involves men? I was listening to some report on human trafficking in Arizona, and it suddenly occurred to me that this was about the sexual slavery of women. Slavery, real slavery. While black men bitch about their ancestors having been slaves, there are women of every color that still are.

CaughtintheMiddle1990
05-15-2010, 05:48 AM
Yes, I do. And the manager of said store has the right to hire whoever the fuck he wants. When I have owned my business I can tell you that I would not hire any transgendered person and the reason would entirely be because they were transgendered. Hell I would not hire a gay person if they were too obviously gay.

There are norms and people who fall out of those norms are ABNORMAL! If you are too fucking gay to live among a world of straight people then the problem is YOU, not the millions of straight people.

Why would you not hire an ''obviously gay'' person? And what do you mean by ''obviously gay."?
I mean I could understand if the person's character--gay or straight--suggested something creepy or unappealing, like creepy in the demented psycho stalker sort of sense, but..Just because the person is gay?

Speedy
05-15-2010, 08:22 AM
Why would you not hire an ''obviously gay'' person? And what do you mean by ''obviously gay."?
I mean I could understand if the person's character--gay or straight--suggested something creepy or unappealing, like creepy in the demented psycho stalker sort of sense, but..Just because the person is gay?


My business was in a small very conservative town. Hiring a flamer would be contrary to every reason why I wanted a business in the first place. MONEY! People would go to my competition who did not have a light in the loafers employee rather than to have to deal with such a person.

I did not have a business to provide anyone with a job. If I hired anyone it was because having them there was going to make me more money than not having them there. If a person who was black was going to drive customers away because he was black I would gladly NOT hire them for that very reason. In fact I would not have hired a pants-on-the-ground, ebonics spouting black because he was a pant-on-the-ground, ebonics spouting black. That would have had nothing to do with my customers, it would have been because of my own person prejudices that make me assume such a person is a piece of shit right off. But before the libs get all tied up in knots, I would not hire Eminem type wiggers either.

Elspeth
05-15-2010, 08:47 PM
Speedy,

Is "wigger" a real term or did you guys make that up?

Rockntractor
05-15-2010, 08:50 PM
Speedy,

Is "wigger" a real term or did you guys make that up?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wigger

Elspeth
05-15-2010, 08:57 PM
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wigger

Well how about that. Learn something new everyday.:eek:

Rockntractor
05-15-2010, 08:58 PM
Well how about that. Learn something new everyday.:eek:
I had to look it up , I wasn't sure.:)

MrsSmith
05-15-2010, 10:10 PM
Personally, I see people who want to remake themselves into the opposite gender as having a sexual fetish disorder. They are aroused by the trappings of the sexual object. It's even more arousing to approximate the sexual object. "Becoming" the sexual object is the ultimate arousal - for a while, anyway.

There are other factors involved, of course. The vast majority of men who pretend to be women do so in a stilted, stereotyped kind of way. They dress like hookers, or like Miss High School Sweetheart of 1979. Often the older men dress in an updated version of what their mom must have worn in 60s, 70s, or 80s. You almost never see one of these men wearing standard American female wear: jeans, athletic shoes, and a t-shirt.

The few women who pretend to be men also behave/dress in stereotyped ways. They go for the pegged jeans, the boots, and the ball cap. They embark on the never-ending quest for the functional penis.

Either way, invading exclusive spaces and demanding access to inappropriate gender roles and prerogatives is just another way to disguise the actual purpose of the behavior: intensified sexual arousal.

There are plenty of masculine women and effeminate men. You can recognize and embrace ways of thought and habits of the mind that are more common to the opposite sex without trying to become the opposite sex. We would ordinarily never allow another group to exploit and appropriate the authentic experiences of a clearly identifiable people.

But since it's hyper-sexual, mentally disturbed men doing it to "nice" women, it's perfectly cool. :rolleyes:
I guess that depends on where you are. I work with 2 transgender males, both in the process of becoming female. Both dress in very normal, female clothing. The one that is a doctor...and presumably can afford more of whatever they do...looks normal enough to pass as female. I still don't know which one he/she is, all our "female" doctors look female-enough. The nurse, on the other hand, while he tries really hard, wearing normal scrubs and a wig at work, and normal enough jeans and blouse when off-duty...he was obvious instantly. His walk, his voice, his non-existent butt and hips... everything gives him away. Luckily, "she" works on the Long Term Care floor, so most patients aren't aware enough to notice. However, in all fairness, I'd have to say that he does well enough that most people couldn't be sure if they didn't already know...

noonwitch
05-17-2010, 10:03 AM
I had to look it up , I wasn't sure.:)




It's what the black kids in Detroit call Eminem.

CueSi
05-17-2010, 01:46 PM
Let's get back to the real issue: why do genetic women have to play along with genetic men usurping female gender roles all the time?

This flap with the store is just part of a much larger initiative to invade female spaces like locker rooms, feminist groups and classrooms, and bathrooms/dormitories/hospital wards with men. It's about devaluing a woman's authentic experience (as usual). As usual, a woman who even mounts an objection to this kind of thing is automatically branded a traitor to her sex (under our new, improved understanding of "sex as a construct").

It's infuriating and it wouldn't be tolerated if the same tactics were brought to bear on racial, age, or ethnic spheres.

You'd find yourself in agreement with some radical feminists as well as some lesbians as well. I'm not sure HOW I feel about it, having known transwomen socially and worked with one. On one hand, I want them to be able to work and live as the gender they present themselves to be, but on the other hand, bar them from competing in women's sports and certain other areas where their former identity can be used against us (women). Transgendered women and cisgender men are like bats and humans. . .they are way more to fear from men than men have to fear from them. Many times they are victims of severe violence, which is my ONLY reason for allowing them into female spaces. If there was a way where transpeople could be safe and be who they are with a minimum of imposition on the rest of society, I'd be down.


~QC

FlaGator
05-17-2010, 01:58 PM
Why would you not hire an ''obviously gay'' person? And what do you mean by ''obviously gay."?
I mean I could understand if the person's character--gay or straight--suggested something creepy or unappealing, like creepy in the demented psycho stalker sort of sense, but..Just because the person is gay?

The person being 'obviously gay' means that he has sex with people who share his gender which is creepy and unappealing to anyone who doesn't either have sex with people of the same gender or who harbor secret desires to have sex with people of the same gender.

just saying...

noonwitch
05-17-2010, 03:34 PM
You'd find yourself in agreement with some radical feminists as well as some lesbians as well. I'm not sure HOW I feel about it, having known transwomen socially and worked with one. On one hand, I want them to be able to work and live as the gender they present themselves to be, but on the other hand, bar them from competing in women's sports and certain other areas where their former identity can be used against us (women). Transgendered women and cisgender men are like bats and humans. . .they are way more to fear from men than men have to fear from them. Many times they are victims of severe violence, which is my ONLY reason for allowing them into female spaces. If there was a way where transpeople could be safe and be who they are with a minimum of imposition on the rest of society, I'd be down.


~QC


I know what you mean. I had a friend who was male to female ts. She moved to Colorado a couple of years ago. Once they have had the surgery, there isn't any going back, and to continue to appear female, she underwent plastic surgery every 5 years or so. That can't be good for the body, in the long run. But she was so nice and was such a non-aggressive person that I worried that someone would hurt her when she was walking around in the Detroit area. Well, except that she was 6'5" and a Vietnam Vet (before the operation).