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BadCat
06-06-2010, 01:18 PM
On Sunday mornings here in the Bible belt, there is a radio show on the "conservative talk radio station" out of Raleigh. It's called the "Jesus Christ Show"

It's one of the oddest things I've ever heard.

The "host" pretends that HE IS INDEED Jesus Christ. He talks about Christ's teaching in the FIRST PERSON. The callers who call into his show tend to be on the verge of some sort of horrible collapse in their lives and they refer to the host as "JESUS CHRIST". There is lots of crying, wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Now, I'm 100% a-religious and I find this show funny as heck, but what do those of you who follow the teachings of Christ think about this?

I was thinking it is either blasphemy or darned close to it.

NJCardFan
06-06-2010, 01:25 PM
Jesus Christ does have a show:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KX5ic2ZPmLU

lurkalot
06-06-2010, 01:38 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ofzCZiQ9vjA

PoliCon
06-06-2010, 03:52 PM
On Sunday mornings here in the Bible belt, there is a radio show on the "conservative talk radio station" out of Raleigh. It's called the "Jesus Christ Show"

It's one of the oddest things I've ever heard.

The "host" pretends that HE IS INDEED Jesus Christ. He talks about Christ's teaching in the FIRST PERSON. The callers who call into his show tend to be on the verge of some sort of horrible collapse in their lives and they refer to the host as "JESUS CHRIST". There is lots of crying, wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Now, I'm 100% a-religious and I find this show funny as heck, but what do those of you who follow the teachings of Christ think about this?

I was thinking it is either blasphemy or darned close to it.

Fundies can be pretty stupid. Need I say more?

Wei Wu Wei
06-06-2010, 03:57 PM
Fundies can be pretty stupid. Need I say more?

Harsh. Everyone can act a bit like a fundie when it comes to whatever they hold to be true, sure fundies are a bit more sensitive to the stress of uncertainty but I think we're all a bit guilty of that.

Elspeth
06-06-2010, 04:28 PM
On Sunday mornings here in the Bible belt, there is a radio show on the "conservative talk radio station" out of Raleigh. It's called the "Jesus Christ Show"

It's one of the oddest things I've ever heard.

The "host" pretends that HE IS INDEED Jesus Christ. He talks about Christ's teaching in the FIRST PERSON. The callers who call into his show tend to be on the verge of some sort of horrible collapse in their lives and they refer to the host as "JESUS CHRIST". There is lots of crying, wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Now, I'm 100% a-religious and I find this show funny as heck, but what do those of you who follow the teachings of Christ think about this?

I was thinking it is either blasphemy or darned close to it.

Is it a Clear Channel station? If so, then the guy might be Neil Saavedra, a former seminary student turned talk radio host. Here is the link to the LA show:

http://www.kfiam640.com/pages/JesusChrist.html?feed=128001&article=444961

http://www.thejesuschristshow.com/

Articulate_Ape
06-06-2010, 04:52 PM
On Sunday mornings here in the Bible belt, there is a radio show on the "conservative talk radio station" out of Raleigh. It's called the "Jesus Christ Show"

It's one of the oddest things I've ever heard.

The "host" pretends that HE IS INDEED Jesus Christ. He talks about Christ's teaching in the FIRST PERSON. The callers who call into his show tend to be on the verge of some sort of horrible collapse in their lives and they refer to the host as "JESUS CHRIST". There is lots of crying, wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Now, I'm 100% a-religious and I find this show funny as heck, but what do those of you who follow the teachings of Christ think about this?

I was thinking it is either blasphemy or darned close to it.


That is just bizarre.

PoliCon
06-06-2010, 05:18 PM
Harsh. Everyone can act a bit like a fundie when it comes to whatever they hold to be true, sure fundies are a bit more sensitive to the stress of uncertainty but I think we're all a bit guilty of that.

shut the fuck up and go away. No one asked for the input of a FUCKTARD.

warpig
06-06-2010, 06:41 PM
I thought he died in Waco.............

MrsSmith
06-06-2010, 06:44 PM
True fundies are probably the least stressed people around. There is no reason to be stressed when you know that God is in control, He loves you, and all things work together for the good of those that love Him. :D:D
(We're not stupid, either.)

warpig
06-06-2010, 06:46 PM
Besides according to the Bible coming in over the radio is NOT how the second coming will be noticed.

Wei Wu Wei
06-06-2010, 07:45 PM
True fundies are probably the least stressed people around. There is no reason to be stressed when you know that God is in control, He loves you, and all things work together for the good of those that love Him. :D:D
(We're not stupid, either.)

Except that real life is uncertain and there's a kernal of the Real within our experience that is fundamentally unknowable. This unknowability is the antithesis of fundamentalism, and a fundie is at constant war with it. They can delude themselves and if they surround themselves with mirrors and keep themselves in an echo chamber and avoid any real criticism they can stave off the conscious experience of anxiety, but they can't get rid of it entirely and when it rears it's head, fundies are the most fearful.

Wei Wu Wei
06-06-2010, 07:46 PM
shut the fuck up and go away. No one asked for the input of a FUCKTARD.

you mad bro?

PoliCon
06-06-2010, 08:36 PM
you mad bro?

You are not my bro. I doubt that you are even a member of the same species. :rolleyes: fucktard troglodyte. :rolleyes:

MrsSmith
06-06-2010, 10:31 PM
Except that real life is uncertain and there's a kernal of the Real within our experience that is fundamentally unknowable. This unknowability is the antithesis of fundamentalism, and a fundie is at constant war with it. They can delude themselves and if they surround themselves with mirrors and keep themselves in an echo chamber and avoid any real criticism they can stave off the conscious experience of anxiety, but they can't get rid of it entirely and when it rears it's head, fundies are the most fearful.

Exactly what did you not understand about the simple concept that all things are in God's hands? Regardless of what we know, He knows everything. Fundies have absolutely no reason to stress out, we can always just remind ourselves that it's not our problem, in the end. Your reply was very heavy on BS, though...are you studying to be a salesman? :D

Rockntractor
06-06-2010, 10:39 PM
Fundies can be pretty stupid. Need I say more?

Sometimes you utterly amaze me. You haven't listened to the show or done any research about it yet you feel qualified to label him as fundie and stupid.

CueSi
06-06-2010, 10:43 PM
Except that real life is uncertain and there's a kernal of the Real within our experience that is fundamentally unknowable. This unknowability is the antithesis of fundamentalism, and a fundie is at constant war with it. They can delude themselves and if they surround themselves with mirrors and keep themselves in an echo chamber and avoid any real criticism they can stave off the conscious experience of anxiety, but they can't get rid of it entirely and when it rears it's head, fundies are the most fearful.

I hate to tell you this, but . . .you're wrong.

I'm not a fundie. . .but this is actually the best depiction of what a fundamentalist thinks...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpmUMyaKnVs

When faced with the unknown, he goes on what he knows and believes, and steps out into the darkness. No reason to believe. No evidence...but he steps out anyway.

It seems simplistic and can understandably be seen as stupid, but it's not. We all put our faith in something.

~QC

Rockntractor
06-06-2010, 11:17 PM
Fundies can be pretty stupid. Need I say more?
Iím really not sure what you mean with your animosity toward what you call fundies. By Fundie I assume you are referring to a fundamentalist Christian which would mean to me someone who believes in the deity of Christ, justification by faith alone, the trinity, the second coming of Christ, the sinless nature of Christ, that he died for our sins and arose the third day to ascend into heaven to sit on a throne at the right hand of God, his second coming to receive us unto himself. These are the fundamentals that you mock after going to church this morning. Take these away and what you have left is a philosopher that may or may not have walked the earth two thousand years ago, a nut who claimed to be God!

patriot45
06-06-2010, 11:29 PM
Iím really not sure what you mean with your animosity toward what you call fundies. By Fundie I assume you are referring to a fundamentalist Christian which would mean to me someone who believes in the deity of Christ, justification by faith alone, the trinity, the second coming of Christ, the sinless nature of Christ, that he died for our sins and arose the third day to ascend into heaven to sit on a throne at the right hand of God, his second coming to receive us unto himself. These are the fundamentals that you mock after going to church this morning. Take these away and what you have left is a philosopher that may or may not have walked the earth two thousand years ago, a nut who claimed to be God!

Wow! That was deep Rock!

The poli is spouting "fundie" like the DUmp does. Just something to say, not knowing what she says.

Give her a break, she hasn't slept in a week!!

Rockntractor
06-06-2010, 11:32 PM
Wow! That was deep Rock!

The poli is spouting "fundie" like the DUmp does. Just something to say, not knowing what she says.

Give her a break, she hasn't slept in a week!!
Sometimes that boy really chaps my ass!

RobJohnson
06-07-2010, 12:55 AM
On Sunday mornings here in the Bible belt, there is a radio show on the "conservative talk radio station" out of Raleigh. It's called the "Jesus Christ Show"

It's one of the oddest things I've ever heard.

The "host" pretends that HE IS INDEED Jesus Christ. He talks about Christ's teaching in the FIRST PERSON. The callers who call into his show tend to be on the verge of some sort of horrible collapse in their lives and they refer to the host as "JESUS CHRIST". There is lots of crying, wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Now, I'm 100% a-religious and I find this show funny as heck, but what do those of you who follow the teachings of Christ think about this?

I was thinking it is either blasphemy or darned close to it.

Sounds strange but I doubt that Jesus does talk radio.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 12:55 AM
Iím really not sure what you mean with your animosity toward what you call fundies. By Fundie I assume you are referring to a fundamentalist Christian which would mean to me someone who believes in the deity of Christ, justification by faith alone, the trinity, the second coming of Christ, the sinless nature of Christ, that he died for our sins and arose the third day to ascend into heaven to sit on a throne at the right hand of God, his second coming to receive us unto himself. These are the fundamentals that you mock after going to church this morning. Take these away and what you have left is a philosopher that may or may not have walked the earth two thousand years ago, a nut who claimed to be God!

There are fundamentalists - and then there are fundies. There is a difference. A fundamentalists believes that the world was created on 6 days. A fundie believes that that means it was created in exactly 144 hours. I have no issue with MOST of what you said - everything except the faith alone bit which is directly in contradiction of scriptures. . . . but that's another discussion - anyhow believing those thing does not make you a fundie. Fundies are the idiots that: insist that gays can't be saved - that Christ turned water into grape juice - that believe that every word of the bible is literally true EXCEPT when Christ says this IS my body and this IS my blood - that the world was created in 144 hours - they are the people that check their brains at the door when they walk into church.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 12:57 AM
Wow! That was deep Rock!

The poli is spouting "fundie" like the DUmp does. Just something to say, not knowing what she says.

Give her a break, she hasn't slept in a week!!

Oh know - I've spent far too much time in apologetics not to know of which I speak. You all mistakenly equate fundie - with fundamentalist and that is not the case. A fundie is a fundamentalist on crack,

Wei Wu Wei
06-07-2010, 01:06 AM
Exactly what did you not understand about the simple concept that all things are in God's hands? Regardless of what we know, He knows everything. Fundies have absolutely no reason to stress out, we can always just remind ourselves that it's not our problem, in the end. Your reply was very heavy on BS, though...are you studying to be a salesman? :D

That's hardly a simple concept.

Who/what is God? How does one know there is a God? How does one know God is as they believe him to be?

I should note like always that I am very big on Faith, I consider faith crucial to living, but these questions still stand, as a fundamentalist claims to know what is unknowable.

Wei Wu Wei
06-07-2010, 01:08 AM
I hate to tell you this, but . . .you're wrong.

I'm not a fundie. . .but this is actually the best depiction of what a fundamentalist thinks...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NpmUMyaKnVs

When faced with the unknown, he goes on what he knows and believes, and steps out into the darkness. No reason to believe. No evidence...but he steps out anyway.

It seems simplistic and can understandably be seen as stupid, but it's not. We all put our faith in something.

~QC

Except that when a fundamentalist faces the unknown, they try to neutralize it and make it into something that is known. They try to resolve the anxiety that the unknowable brings by convincing themselves that they have The Answer. This is what I consider to be the opposite of faith, which is knowing that you do not know, and stepping out anyway.

MrsSmith
06-07-2010, 08:35 AM
That's hardly a simple concept.

Who/what is God? How does one know there is a God? How does one know God is as they believe him to be?

I should note like always that I am very big on Faith, I consider faith crucial to living, but these questions still stand, as a fundamentalist claims to know what is unknowable.

No human can understand who/what is God, and that really doesn't matter. We know Him because His Son accepted us and His Holy Spirit lives within us. It's like knowing anyone else, we have a relationship. Faith is only involved in remember Who we know He is, as revealed in His book...not in believing that He exists and knows us.

MrsSmith
06-07-2010, 08:36 AM
Except that when a fundamentalist faces the unknown, they try to neutralize it and make it into something that is known. They try to resolve the anxiety that the unknowable brings by convincing themselves that they have The Answer. This is what I consider to be the opposite of faith, which is knowing that you do not know, and stepping out anyway.

We don't have The Answer, but we know Who does. Faith is trusting in Who He is, and stepping into His Will instead of running our own lives.

wilbur
06-07-2010, 08:40 AM
I'm not a fundie. . .but this is actually the best depiction of what a fundamentalist thinks...


This is a better depiction of what a fundamentalist thinks...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LACyLTsH4ac

or this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4yBvvGi_2A

MrsSmith
06-07-2010, 08:44 AM
There are fundamentalists - and then there are fundies. There is a difference. A fundamentalists believes that the world was created on 6 days. A fundie believes that that means it was created in exactly 144 hours. I have no issue with MOST of what you said - everything except the faith alone bit which is directly in contradiction of scriptures. . . . but that's another discussion - anyhow believing those thing does not make you a fundie. Fundies are the idiots that: insist that gays can't be saved - that Christ turned water into grape juice - that believe that every word of the bible is literally true EXCEPT when Christ says this IS my body and this IS my blood - that the world was created in 144 hours - they are the people that check their brains at the door when they walk into church.
Gays can be saved, any sin can be forgiven...but Jesus did turn water into wine...and the Bible is literally true. True fundies are those that know the subject of Christianity well and love God with all their minds (not check them at the door).
And we know that we are saved by faith alone because scripture makes that very clear.

MrsSmith
06-07-2010, 08:45 AM
This is a better depiction of what a fundamentalist thinks...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LACyLTsH4ac

or this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4yBvvGi_2A

:rolleyes:

CueSi
06-07-2010, 09:06 AM
This is a better depiction of what a fundamentalist thinks...

<Stupid simplistic bullshit>



HURR HURR HURR... Christians r stoopid.

God, you're predictable.

man, if there's anything I hate more than fundie legalistic Christians, it's fundie condescending atheists. Ya'll make me wanna break up with my girlfriend, go to Salt Lake City, and convert to Mormonism.

~QC

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 09:11 AM
Oh know - I've spent far too much time in apologetics not to know of which I speak. You all mistakenly equate fundie - with fundamentalist and that is not the case. A fundie is a fundamentalist on crack,

Your little sayings only mean what you and your little circle apply to them. You are not the beginning and end when it comes to Christian theology. A clear conscious helps one sleep well.

wilbur
06-07-2010, 09:12 AM
HURR HURR HURR... Christians r stoopid.

God, you're predictable.

man, if there's anything I hate more than fundie legalistic Christians, it's fundie condescending atheists. Ya'll make me wanna break up with my girlfriend, go to Salt Lake City, and convert to Mormonism.

~QC

You deserve it. Comparing Dr. Jones to a fundie is a crime against humanity.

CueSi
06-07-2010, 09:22 AM
You deserve it. Comparing Dr. Jones to a fundie is a crime against humanity.

Let me start with Good Morning and fuck you. :)

You're a humorless hateful bitch, wilbur. . .I had a point and I made it and because "god FORBID!!" I used a perceptively intellegent person to a GASP! Fundie. . . you went for the worst stereotypes. There are smart Christians and dumb atheists. . . I don't care how smart you think you are, the fact you went for the stereotype puts you RIGHT on the level of the people you make fun of in my eyes. You're a fundie w/o the blessed excuse of religion.

Fuck you, fuck your wanna be intelligent condescending deitaphobic attitude in your sloppy diseased cvnt with Ted Haggard's dick. Without lube.

Attitudes like yours are why people hate atheists. You are why there are fundie Christians.

I may buy a long skirt and stop wearing makeup.

~QC

noonwitch
06-07-2010, 09:24 AM
On Sunday mornings here in the Bible belt, there is a radio show on the "conservative talk radio station" out of Raleigh. It's called the "Jesus Christ Show"

It's one of the oddest things I've ever heard.

The "host" pretends that HE IS INDEED Jesus Christ. He talks about Christ's teaching in the FIRST PERSON. The callers who call into his show tend to be on the verge of some sort of horrible collapse in their lives and they refer to the host as "JESUS CHRIST". There is lots of crying, wailing and gnashing of teeth.

Now, I'm 100% a-religious and I find this show funny as heck, but what do those of you who follow the teachings of Christ think about this?

I was thinking it is either blasphemy or darned close to it.



We had some neighbors who converted to the AOG at one point, and my mom went to their church's big Christmas extravaganza, with a huge choir and an orchestra. My mom said this about it afterwards:

1. The music was amazing and beautiful.
2. She couldn't deal with the people speaking in tongues and waving their arms around (my mom was raised episcopalian and we were UCC). Personally, I can deal with the second, just not the first.
3. They had a slide show (it was the early 80s) that featured pictures of Jesus representing various stories from the New Testament. The minister wore a Jesus costume for the slides. Out of everything that my mom experienced that day, this is what disturbed her the most-she thought it was presumptuous of him.


I don't know. I'm someone who loves "Jesus Christ, Superstar". I don't think that's blasphemy, although it was picketed at theaters in my hometown when the movie was released-people in Grand Rapids embrace it now, however. There are a lot of movies now about the story of Jesus, including some made by very devout believers, so I don't think that the very idea of an actor representing Jesus is automatically blashphemy.

I'm also a South Park fan, but I know a lot of people, especially catholics, who are very offended by the way Jesus is represented on that show. I also appreciated The Last Temptation of Christ, which so many found offensive and Mother Angelica told viewers that to even watch it was to commit a mortal sin. Both of those are portrayals that many people consider blasphemy. I obviously don't see it that way myself, yet I can see why others might find it so.

wilbur
06-07-2010, 09:28 AM
Let me start with Good Morning and fuck you. :)

You're a humorless hateful bitch, wilbur. . .


Actually, I thought my post was pretty funny...



I had a point and I made it and because "god FORBID!!" I used a perceptively intellegent person to a GASP! Fundie. . . you went for the worst stereotypes. There are smart Christians and dumb atheists. . . I don't care how smart you think you are, the fact you went for the stereotype puts you RIGHT on the level of the people you make fun of in my eyes. You're a fundie w/o the blessed excuse of religion.

Fuck you, fuck your wanna be intelligent condescending deitaphobic attitude in your sloppy diseased cvnt with Ted Haggard's dick. Without lube.




Yea, but I at least get extra points for depicting *actual fundies*.




Attitudes like yours are why people hate atheists. You are why there are fundie Christians.

I may buy a long skirt and stop wearing makeup.

~QC

And quite frankly, if that's how you and others choose your beliefs, based on your personal distaste for a few personalities that hold those beliefs, you're doing it wrong.

Sonnabend
06-07-2010, 09:30 AM
You deserve it. Comparing Dr. Jones to a fundie is a crime against humanity.

He is. And a liar.

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 09:32 AM
I obviously don't see it that way myself, yet I can see why others might find it so.

This is what I like about you, you state your views as yours personally without saying all others are stupid for not having them. in matters of religion no one here has met God and has all understanding him. Some claim to but it is better to remember in many cases they are only opinions formed by many things that have effected us in our lives up to this point.

CueSi
06-07-2010, 09:37 AM
Actually, I thought my post was pretty funny...

Yea, but I at least get extra points for depicting *actual fundies*.

And quite frankly, if that's how you and others choose your beliefs, based on your personal distaste for a few personalities that hold those beliefs, you're doing it wrong.


It wasn't... you just hit my Berserk Button : The Condescending Atheist. Next to the Anti-smoking Zealot, Shiny Happy Mormon, Outing-Happy Monkey, and the Sexually Repressed and Proud Of It Dumb Ass, that is the type that deserves a punch in the face.

Now (man, why did the POTUS have to ruin this) let me be clear :I have no problems with the irreligous. My father is an atheist, so is my best friend and the fella who if I were to be honest, I'd want to marry. But none of them have ever harbored the attitude that you hinted at.

So? I was making an illustration on Faith - - I'm sorry I couldn't find anything to hit your prejudices. And if that's what you focused on, rather than actually pointing out any flaws with my illustration (and I'm sure I've got PLENTY), then fuck your point system.

Heh, I hate anti-smoking zealots just as much, but I refuse to light up. So. . .yeah.

~QC

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 11:11 AM
Your little sayings only mean what you and your little circle apply to them. You are not the beginning and end when it comes to Christian theology. A clear conscious helps one sleep well.

lol you should get out more.

This is a collection of Fundie sayings: http://www.fstdt.com/Top100.aspx and if you don't see the difference between someone who holds their faith to be true - and these idiots who check their brains at the door of the church - oh well. Sucks to be you then. :p

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 11:13 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y4yBvvGi_2A

This guy is a fundie. :rolleyes:

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 11:14 AM
Gays can be saved, any sin can be forgiven...but Jesus did turn water into wine...and the Bible is literally true. True fundies are those that know the subject of Christianity well and love God with all their minds (not check them at the door).
And we know that we are saved by faith alone because scripture makes that very clear.

EXACTLY my point Smith - There is a real and measurable difference between a fundamentalist and a fundie. Fundies are more or less caricatures of fundamentalists.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 11:20 AM
We had some neighbors who converted to the AOG at one point, and my mom went to their church's big Christmas extravaganza, with a huge choir and an orchestra. My mom said this about it afterwards:

1. The music was amazing and beautiful.
2. She couldn't deal with the people speaking in tongues and waving their arms around (my mom was raised episcopalian and we were UCC). Personally, I can deal with the second, just not the first.
3. They had a slide show (it was the early 80s) that featured pictures of Jesus representing various stories from the New Testament. The minister wore a Jesus costume for the slides. Out of everything that my mom experienced that day, this is what disturbed her the most-she thought it was presumptuous of him.


I don't know. I'm someone who loves "Jesus Christ, Superstar". I don't think that's blasphemy, although it was picketed at theaters in my hometown when the movie was released-people in Grand Rapids embrace it now, however. There are a lot of movies now about the story of Jesus, including some made by very devout believers, so I don't think that the very idea of an actor representing Jesus is automatically blashphemy.

I'm also a South Park fan, but I know a lot of people, especially catholics, who are very offended by the way Jesus is represented on that show. I also appreciated The Last Temptation of Christ, which so many found offensive and Mother Angelica told viewers that to even watch it was to commit a mortal sin. Both of those are portrayals that many people consider blasphemy. I obviously don't see it that way myself, yet I can see why others might find it so.
IMO what the AOG minister was trying to do with the costume is recapture something that most low church protestants threw out long ago - the eye. In fact - there is a general movement in most protestant sects that do not have liturgy to incorporate visual elements into their services - ie: dance - because they have realized that the eye can be as powerful as the ear in building faith.

MrsSmith
06-07-2010, 11:36 AM
lol you should get out more.

This is a collection of Fundie sayings: http://www.fstdt.com/Top100.aspx and if you don't see the difference between someone who holds their faith to be true - and these idiots who check their brains at the door of the church - oh well. Sucks to be you then. :p

The fact that idiots post online does not make those idiots all fundies.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 11:42 AM
The fact that idiots post online does not make those idiots all fundies. True. There are other flavors of idiot out there - wilbur for example . . . .

Gingersnap
06-07-2010, 11:44 AM
Back to the topic: I wouldn't care for this type of show myself. I listen to a fair amount of Christian broadcasting but I've never heard of someone doing this kind of thing.

noonwitch
06-07-2010, 12:09 PM
IMO what the AOG minister was trying to do with the costume is recapture something that most low church protestants threw out long ago - the eye. In fact - there is a general movement in most protestant sects that do not have liturgy to incorporate visual elements into their services - ie: dance - because they have realized that the eye can be as powerful as the ear in building faith.



I have had more diverse religious experiences than my mother, depsite her attempts to prevent from doing so. She comes from the liturgical traditions, so for her, most contemporary churches are frightening to some degree. She doesn't really like my Unity church, which is pretty liberal, but doesn't have many symbols or decorations in the sanctuary, which is basically an auditorium. She likes the gospel choir, and that's about it.

It's hard to describe my mom's beliefs, other than she is a mainline protestant, and very liberal. For her, ministers should wear the regalia, communion should be celebrated monthly, and any deviations from the usual are of the politically correct kind (african folk songs in the hymnals, white ladies doing "traditional african dance" during the service-the kind of liberal stuff that would drive you crazy).

I won't even bring her to the church I go to on Saturdays. It's a non-denominational church, but she is one of those mainline christians who would immediately label it fundamentalist, because she doesn't think there is a difference between fundamentalist and evangelical. To her, Baptists, AOG, mega-churches, Christian Reformed, RCA, and so on are all the same-fundamentalists.

Wei Wu Wei
06-07-2010, 04:45 PM
Gays can be saved, any sin can be forgiven...but Jesus did turn water into wine...and the Bible is literally true. True fundies are those that know the subject of Christianity well and love God with all their minds (not check them at the door).
And we know that we are saved by faith alone because scripture makes that very clear.

How old is the Earth?
How did the human species come to be?

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 04:50 PM
How old is the Earth?
How did the human species come to be?

Irrelevant.
http://trollcats.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/08/shut_the_fuck_up_trollcat.jpg

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 05:23 PM
Policon is the Bible the word of God or does it stand on the same foundation as other historical and spiritual writings?

Gingersnap
06-07-2010, 05:29 PM
If you guys need to discuss Christian theology (not that there's anything wrong with that), please start a new thread.

The radio show discussion would be pretty interesting on its own if anybody remembered that it was the original subject of the thread. ;)

Articulate_Ape
06-07-2010, 05:30 PM
Back to the topic: I wouldn't care for this type of show myself. I listen to a fair amount of Christian broadcasting but I've never heard of someone doing this kind of thing.

I think someone should start a Mohammad Show. I bet it would be really popular.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 05:38 PM
Policon is the Bible the word of God or does it stand on the same foundation as other historical and spiritual writings?

That would depend on how you define and are using the term "Word of God."

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 05:53 PM
That would depend on how you define and are using the term "Word of God."

Literally as I stated it, but this conversation is over. Ginger doesn't want us talking about it.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 06:01 PM
Literally as I stated it,Word of God has many usages and definitions. So - like I said - it depends on how you are using and defining it.



but this conversation is over. Ginger doesn't want us talking about it.She is more then welcome to split off the conversation. It's not like it's hard to do with vbullitin.

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 06:12 PM
Word of God has many usages and definitions. So - like I said - it depends on how you are using and defining it.

She is more then welcome to split off the conversation. It's not like it's hard to do with vbullitin.

It would be awfully hard to discuss this or anything else with you if you don't understand the literal meaning of words.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 06:22 PM
It would be awfully hard to discuss this or anything else with you if you don't understand the literal meaning of words.

For crying out Loud Rock - the term Word of God has many meaning and uses. To WHICH meaning - and WHICH use do you refer? Do I believe that the Bible is Jesus Christ? No. The Bible is not Jesus.

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 06:28 PM
For crying out Loud Rock - the term Word of God has many meaning and uses. To WHICH meaning - and WHICH use do you refer? Do I believe that the Bible is Jesus Christ? No. The Bible is not Jesus.
Did I say that? Do you believe the Bible is Gods word to man?

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 06:57 PM
For crying out Loud Rock - the term Word of God has many meaning and uses. To WHICH meaning - and WHICH use do you refer? Do I believe that the Bible is Jesus Christ? No. The Bible is not Jesus.

Incapable of answering a literal question as stated, yet you set yourself up as a judge over fundamentalist Christians.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 06:59 PM
Did I say that? Do you believe the Bible is Gods word to man?

I believe that the scriptures are truthfully recorded and contain God's the revelation of God's plan of salvation. I believe that the scriptures are God breathed, given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. I believe that every tittle and Jot of the scriptures is there for a reason and not the smallest part of the law will pass away until ALL is fulfilled. I believe that scriptures are THE authoritative work containing the revealed Word Of God.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 07:00 PM
Incapable of answering a literal question as stated, yet you set yourself up as a judge over fundamentalist Christians.

It is impossible to properly answer a question where terms which have multiple meanings are used but not clarified. Asking you to clarify terms does not equate to being incapable.

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 07:04 PM
It is impossible to properly answer a question where terms which have multiple meanings are used but not clarified. Asking you to clarify terms does not equate to being incapable.

I spoke in English your native tongue not Greek, I did not say Logos.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 07:11 PM
I spoke in English your native tongue not Greek, I did not say Logos.

And yet in English there is still more than one definition for the term "Word of God."

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 07:13 PM
And yet in English there is still more than one definition for the term "Word of God."

Bill Clinton and what the definition of is is typical liberal dodging.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 07:16 PM
Bill Clinton and what the definition of is is typical liberal dodging.

No sir - it's proper apologetics. At least half of the divisions in Christianity today are over the definitions of terms. Take "Mother of God" (THEOTOKOS) for example. Protestants see the term very differently than do Catholics.

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 07:19 PM
No sir - it's proper apologetics. At least half of the divisions in Christianity today are over the definitions of terms. Take "Mother of God" (THEOTOKOS) for example. Protestants see the term very differently than do Catholics.

I didn't ask you any of these things. Do you think the Bible is the word of God to man?

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 07:29 PM
I didn't ask you any of these things. Do you think the Bible is the word of God to man?

This answer was not sufficient?


I believe that the scriptures are truthfully recorded and contain God's the revelation of God's plan of salvation. I believe that the scriptures are God breathed, given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness. I believe that every tittle and Jot of the scriptures is there for a reason and not the smallest part of the law will pass away until ALL is fulfilled. I believe that scriptures are THE authoritative work containing the revealed Word Of God.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 07:30 PM
I didn't ask you any of these things. Do you think the Bible is the word of God to man?

If you want a yes/no answer you're going to have to define the term.

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 07:40 PM
What I say are my words, what I request, the stories I may tell, my experiences are all my words. I may write them down myself, I may speak them, I may request someone to write them down for me but they are still my words. Is the Bible the word of God to man?

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 07:44 PM
What I say are my words, what I request, the stories I may tell, my experiences are all my words. I may write them down myself, I may speak them, I may request someone to write them down for me but they are still my words. Is the Bible the word of God to man?

I cannot fairly answer that question unless you define the terms.

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 07:48 PM
I cannot fairly answer that question unless you define the terms.

My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 07:54 PM
My people are destroyed for lack of knowledge.

Very true - and part of knowledge is the meanings and usages of words.

Lager
06-07-2010, 07:56 PM
Let me start with Good Morning and fuck you. :)

You're a humorless hateful bitch, wilbur. . .I had a point and I made it and because "god FORBID!!" I used a perceptively intellegent person to a GASP! Fundie. . . you went for the worst stereotypes. There are smart Christians and dumb atheists. . . I don't care how smart you think you are, the fact you went for the stereotype puts you RIGHT on the level of the people you make fun of in my eyes. You're a fundie w/o the blessed excuse of religion.

Fuck you, fuck your wanna be intelligent condescending deitaphobic attitude in your sloppy diseased cvnt with Ted Haggard's dick. Without lube.

Attitudes like yours are why people hate atheists. You are why there are fundie Christians.

I may buy a long skirt and stop wearing makeup.

~QC

Now that there is one of the better posts I have read in a long time. That's worth browsing thru 8 pages.

Bubba Dawg
06-07-2010, 08:02 PM
If you guys need to discuss Christian theology (not that there's anything wrong with that), please start a new thread.

The radio show discussion would be pretty interesting on its own if anybody remembered that it was the original subject of the thread. ;)

It might be a trifle difficult to discuss the merits of The Jesus Christ Show without delving into theology at least a little bit.....:p

Bubba Dawg
06-07-2010, 08:03 PM
I thought he died in Waco.............

Nice....

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 08:05 PM
Very true - and part of knowledge is the meanings and usages of words.
I put the word in context and I think you no exactly what it meant.

Bubba Dawg
06-07-2010, 08:07 PM
Sometimes that boy really chaps my ass!

Chapped ass.....you been around Lurkie? :eek::D

And don't let Poli bother you Rock, just look at him and repeat after me....O ye of little faith.

Bubba Dawg
06-07-2010, 08:21 PM
Oh know - I've spent far too much time in apologetics not to know of which I speak. You all mistakenly equate fundie - with fundamentalist and that is not the case. A fundie is a fundamentalist on crack,

One is a caricature and the other is not. I get that.

I admit that when I read your original remark on the subject I didn't catch that you were making a distinction though. I thought you were being overly harsh. I've been around Fundies and Fundamentalistsa lot in my life.

I think I know now what you meant.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 08:21 PM
I put the word in context and I think you no exactly what it meant.

I you want a yes or no answer to your question - please give a definition of the term.

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 08:22 PM
Chapped ass.....you been around Lurkie? :eek::D

And don't let Poli bother you Rock, just look at him and repeat after me....O ye of little faith.

I wonder what would happen to Poli if we put him in a blender, not a literal blender of course but a spiritual blender and mix him with love and hugs.........awe to hell with it. Somebody needs to beat the shit out of that boy!:rolleyes:

Gingersnap
06-07-2010, 08:23 PM
It might be a trifle difficult to discuss the merits of The Jesus Christ Show without delving into theology at least a little bit.....:p

Why? It doesn't matter what your faith perspective is (or lack thereof), is it ever a good idea to impersonate a religious figure in this way? :confused:

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 08:23 PM
One is a caricature and the other is not. I get that.

I admit that when I read your original remark on the subject I didn't catch that you were making a distinction though. I thought you were being overly harsh. I've been around Fundies and Fundamentalistsa lot in my life.

I think I know now what you meant. Fundie has become a term that has a definition of it's own. If I had meant fundamentalists - I would have said fundamentalists. :) In some ways I could easily be classified as a fundamentalist - but then again - in many other ways I could be classified as a theological liberal. Depends on the issue.

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 08:24 PM
Why? It doesn't matter what your faith perspective is (or lack thereof), is it ever a good idea to impersonate a religious figure in this way? :confused:

Apparently it works for some people. I doubt that it would work for me as I cannot even sit through Hank Hanegraaff without wanting to strangle the man.

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 08:26 PM
Why? It doesn't matter what your faith perspective is (or lack thereof), is it ever a good idea to impersonate a religious figure in this way? :confused:
http://www.thejesuschristshow.com/about/

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 08:29 PM
Apparently it works for some people. I doubt that it would work for me as I cannot even sit through Hank Hanegraaff without wanting to strangle the man.

I bet you have to wrap duct tape around your head for Vernon McGee, John Macarthur and some of the other Bible believers!

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 08:31 PM
I bet you have to wrap duct tape around your head for Vernon McGee, John Macarthur and some of the other Bible believers!

McGee is interesting if you can get past his clear biases. Never heard Macarthur.

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 08:34 PM
McGee is interesting if you can get past his clear biases. Never heard Macarthur.

http://www.gty.org/

Bubba Dawg
06-07-2010, 08:38 PM
Why? It doesn't matter what your faith perspective is (or lack thereof), is it ever a good idea to impersonate a religious figure in this way? :confused:

Well, if we were discussing the Apostle Paul Show I would agree. Since the OP asked the question as to whether or not the manner in which The Jesus Christ Show was being presented was blasphemy or not pretty much opened the door to a theological discussion.

That question can obviously not be discussed in any meaningful way without referencing the the related question of who (indeed) is Jesus Christ?

A detailed discussion of the relationship of works and faith in Justification would prolly be out of line but the Word of God discussion, etc etc is marvelous.

I'm rather enjoying this thread. Of course, I am a Bolshevik. :p

CueSi
06-07-2010, 09:19 PM
Now that there is one of the better posts I have read in a long time. That's worth browsing thru 8 pages.

You're welcome, Lager. :) It's just one of those things that just BUGS me.

~QC

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 09:49 PM
http://www.gty.org/

I may give him a listen. ANYHOW - the only "Christian radio program" I've heard that I cannot stomach is "Bible Answerman." Hanegraaff's self promotion is disgusting. Beyond that his claims at a theological monopoly on the truth are ridiculous.

Gingersnap
06-07-2010, 10:02 PM
Well, if we were discussing the Apostle Paul Show I would agree. Since the OP asked the question as to whether or not the manner in which The Jesus Christ Show was being presented was blasphemy or not pretty much opened the door to a theological discussion.

That question can obviously not be discussed in any meaningful way without referencing the the related question of who (indeed) is Jesus Christ?

A detailed discussion of the relationship of works and faith in Justification would prolly be out of line but the Word of God discussion, etc etc is marvelous.

I'm rather enjoying this thread. Of course, I am a Bolshevik. :p

Blasphemy is a technical term that could be applied by some denominations but never by others. I assumed it was being used for its theatrical quality.

I don't have problems discussing Justification or Logos or anything else theological. I just wish you guys would title the threads with our handy-dandy REL label so the unwary can go back to evaluating Megan Fox's rear end. :p

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 10:08 PM
Blasphemy is a technical term that could be applied by some denominations but never by others. I assumed it was being used for its theatrical quality.

I don't have problems discussing Justification or Logos or anything else theological. I just wish you guys would title the threads with our handy-dandy REL label so the unwary can go back to evaluating Megan Fox's rear end. :p
I give it a 9!

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 10:09 PM
I give it a 9!

GIVE it a 9?? How generous of you since it clearly IS an 11. :rolleyes:

Bubba Dawg
06-07-2010, 10:18 PM
Blasphemy is a technical term that could be applied by some denominations but never by others. I assumed it was being used for its theatrical quality.

I don't have problems discussing Justification or Logos or anything else theological. I just wish you guys would title the threads with our handy-dandy REL label so the unwary can go back to evaluating Megan Fox's rear end. :p

I can't keep it straight about the difference between heresy and apostasy and you throw the Blasphemy Holy Hand Grenade at me?

Don't Be Cruel. :(

Theatrical quality....hmmmmmmmm.......Jesus Christ.....SUPERSTAR!!!!!!!!

Wait....it's been done.....

Megan Fox's rear end.......A pic or a link to a pic would be nice......

just sayin'......

Don't Be Cruel.........Don't Be Cruel......Don't Be Cruel.... whoah....I just got a sudden cravin' for a peanut butter and banana sammich. Lisa Marie you get away from that strange man, his hair looks like it has been on fire......hey my jumpsuit is too tight.....where's my cape.......gahhhhhhhhhhhhh:eek:

Bubba Dawg
06-07-2010, 10:19 PM
I give it a 9!

It's a nine on the technicals, but what about style points Herr Piggman? ;)

Bubba Dawg
06-07-2010, 10:20 PM
GIVE it a 9?? How generous of you since it clearly IS an 11. :rolleyes:

It goes to 11......?

PoliCon
06-07-2010, 10:33 PM
It goes to 11......?

for her ass it does! :D

Bubba Dawg
06-07-2010, 10:34 PM
for her ass it does! :D

Nice.....

Rockntractor
06-07-2010, 10:36 PM
It's a nine on the technicals, but what about style points Herr Piggman? ;)

We will see how long it stays up there. Durability factors in too!

FlaGator
06-08-2010, 10:13 PM
There are fundamentalists - and then there are fundies. There is a difference. A fundamentalists believes that the world was created on 6 days. A fundie believes that that means it was created in exactly 144 hours. I have no issue with MOST of what you said - everything except the faith alone bit which is directly in contradiction of scriptures. . . . but that's another discussion - anyhow believing those thing does not make you a fundie. Fundies are the idiots that: insist that gays can't be saved - that Christ turned water into grape juice - that believe that every word of the bible is literally true EXCEPT when Christ says this IS my body and this IS my blood - that the world was created in 144 hours - they are the people that check their brains at the door when they walk into church.

That distinction exists only in your own mind. Perhaps you shouldn't expect others to be cognizant to your thoughts and biases on the predominating view of the various aspects and definitions of fundamentalism. The definition you are using of the term "fundies" seems to signify that you have bought in to the far left's view of extreme fundamentalism which isn't fundamentalism any more than eco-terrorism defines the whole green movement.. I never realized you were a lib sympathizer. I happily apply the word "fundie" to myself and most of the Christians I know and we are not representative of your description.

PoliCon
06-08-2010, 10:19 PM
That distinction exists only in your own mind. I guess you have not engaged in much internet apologetics if you believe that this is something I came up with on my own.

MrsSmith
06-08-2010, 10:25 PM
That distinction exists only in your own mind. Perhaps you shouldn't expect others to be cognizant to your thoughts and biases on the predominating view of the various aspects and definitions of fundamentalism. The definition you are using of the term "fundies" seems to signify that you have bought in to the far left's view of extreme fundamentalism which isn't fundamentalism any more than eco-terrorism defines the whole green movement.. I never realized you were a lib sympathizer. I happily apply the word "fundie" to myself and most of the Christians I know and we are not representative of your description.


I guess you have not engaged in much internet apologetics if you believe that this is something I came up with on my own.

I agree with FlaGator...Fundie is merely shortened Fundamentalist. They are the same term, and used correctly, describe a person that has carefully studied the fundamental beliefs common to all Christian groups, knows the Bible fairly well, and has a decent grasp of theology...and believes the things God has revealed. Those you quote are not "fundies," they are idiots that understand as little about theology as, say, wilbur...they're just on the other end of the ignorance scale.

PoliCon
06-08-2010, 10:26 PM
I agree with FlaGator...Fundie is merely shortened Fundamentalist. They are the same term, and used correctly, describe a person that has carefully studied the fundamental beliefs common to all Christian groups, knows the Bible fairly well, and has a decent grasp of theology...and believes the things God has revealed. Those you quote are not "fundies," they are idiots that understand as little about theology as, say, wilbur...they're just on the other end of the ignorance scale.

what ever makes you happy. It's not worth arguing about. That prolly one of the biggest complaints I have with fundamentalists - the absolutely STOOPID things they're willing to argue about.

Rockntractor
06-08-2010, 10:31 PM
what ever makes you happy.

Make that three of us! A fundamentalist believes that God means what he says and says what he means. If you pray for the guidance of the Holy spirit before you study you don't need a theologian or linguist present to learn Gods will from the Bible.

PoliCon
06-08-2010, 10:44 PM
Make that three of us! A fundamentalist believes that God means what he says and says what he means. If you pray for the guidance of the Holy spirit before you study you don't need a theologian or linguist present to learn Gods will from the Bible.

I find that most people who make this claims only take what the bible says that agrees with what their chosen beliefs are. I could right here and now point out to you a verse where Christ makes a very literal statement and I'll wager that you will not accept the statement as being literal.

Rockntractor
06-08-2010, 10:46 PM
I find that most people who make this claims only take what the bible says that agrees with what their chosen beliefs are. I could right here and now point out to you a verse where Christ makes a very literal statement and I'll wager that you will not accept the statement as being literal.

Why was the Son of God incapable of turning water into wine after creating the earth?

PoliCon
06-08-2010, 10:53 PM
Why was the Son of God incapable of turning water into wine after creating the earth?

No - but I have yet to meet a fundamentalist who will concede that the same God who spoke the universe into existence can change bread and wine into his body and blood. And yet Jesus said: Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.

Rockntractor
06-08-2010, 11:04 PM
No - but I have yet to meet a fundamentalist who will concede that the same God who spoke the universe into existence can change bread and wine into his body and blood. And yet Jesus said: Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you.

Are you catholic, I'm trying to figure out what you are getting at here?

PoliCon
06-08-2010, 11:16 PM
Are you catholic, I'm trying to figure out what you are getting at here?

How many fundamentalists do you know that believe in the doctrine of the real presence? A doctrine which states that Jesus Christ is real and present in the elements of the Eucharist - that a doctrine that takes Jesus at his word when he said: This IS my body - this IS my blood. My point is simple - fundamentalists believes "that God means what he says and says what he means" only so far as what God says agrees with what they already believe.

Rockntractor
06-08-2010, 11:26 PM
How many fundamentalists do you know that believe in the doctrine of the real presence? A doctrine which states that Jesus Christ is real and present in the elements of the Eucharist - that a doctrine that takes Jesus at his word when he said: This IS my body - this IS my blood. My point is simple - fundamentalists believes "that God means what he says and says what he means" only so far as what God says agrees with what they already believe.
Regardless of what one thinks the molecular structure the Eucharist is he should have absolute reverence and a repentant heart when he partakes of the lords supper. I have no problem with the catholic doctrine of transubstantiation it changes nothing for me of the significance of the event. Others add the ordinance of humility (foot washing) Seventh day Adventists and Freewill Baptists, if this symbolism is important to you, do it. obviously you must be catholic or you wouldn't jump right to this.

PoliCon
06-08-2010, 11:38 PM
Regardless of what one thinks the molecular structure the Eucharist is he should have absolute reverence and a repentant heart when he partakes of the lords supper. I have no problem with the catholic doctrine of transubstantiation it changes nothing for me of the significance of the event. Others add the ordinance of humility (foot washing) Seventh day Adventists and Freewill Baptists, if this symbolism is important to you, do it. obviously you must be catholic or you wouldn't jump right to this.

actually - I'm not Roman Catholic - but I am a member of a liturgical church. I did not mention transubstantiation for a reason - it's not about HOW He is real and present in the Eucharist but THAT he is real and present in the Eucharist. If Fundamentalists truly believe as you said - that God says what he means and means what he says - then all fundamentalist churches should espouse the doctrine of the real presence and partake of the Eucharist as a part of their every service.

Rockntractor
06-08-2010, 11:48 PM
actually - I'm not Roman Catholic - but I am a member of a liturgical church. I did not mention transubstantiation for a reason - it's not about HOW He is real and present in the Eucharist but THAT he is real and present in the Eucharist. If Fundamentalists truly believe as you said - that God says what he means and means what he says - then all fundamentalist churches should espouse the doctrine of the real presence and partake of the Eucharist as a part of their every service.

I guess it is all clear now, the reason you mock fundamentalist Christians and use the f- word in almost every sentence is because of how you view the Lords Supper. I should have known, you certainly know your Bible!

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 12:07 AM
I guess it is all clear now, the reason you mock fundamentalist Christians I do not mock fundamentalist - I mock fundies.

and use the f- word in almost every sentenceAs for FUCK - it is a word that holds no power in heaven or earth. It is pointless to label it verboten. :rolleyes: Hypocritical to forbid fuck and thrown damn around when damn actually DOES have power in heaven and on earth.
is because of how you view the Lords Supper. I should have known, you certainly know your Bible!I view the Eucharist with the utmost reverence.

FlaGator
06-09-2010, 07:23 AM
I guess you have not engaged in much internet apologetics if you believe that this is something I came up with on my own.

You speak of what you do not know since you know little of my behavior of this site. Making assumptions like that is exemplifies your errors in your definition of Fundies.

FlaGator
06-09-2010, 07:41 AM
I do not mock fundamentalist - I mock fundies.
As for FUCK - it is a word that holds no power in heaven or earth. It is pointless to label it verboten. :rolleyes: Hypocritical to forbid fuck and thrown damn around when damn actually DOES have power in heaven and on earth. I view the Eucharist with the utmost reverence.

Which may be one in the same as far as many fundamentalists are concerned.

As for the use of the f word, the word on Earth is generally used in an unflattering negative way. For someone who proclaims the faith it profanes God by using it. We are to appear as light and salt to the world. We are to be different than those in the world and act as attractors to the light. If you behave as the world does then you are proclaiming your acceptence of what the world finds good. You become no different than that which you are to be an alternative to.

Bear in mind that your behavior in the world is what non believers will use to define standard Christian behavior, just like the behavior you disapprove by the "fundies" is considered as reflective of all fundamentalist as a whole. You may be able to make that distinction but most are not. If your behavior is questionable then you must discard the behavior for fear that you may put God in a negative light. Profane language when used by Christians puts God in a bad light because most who hear or read your words can't make the distinctions that you do. The world at large doesn't think that the f word has no power in heaven or earth, they just know that it is a negative word used to insult and belittle others.

FlaGator
06-09-2010, 08:07 AM
How many fundamentalists do you know that believe in the doctrine of the real presence? A doctrine which states that Jesus Christ is real and present in the elements of the Eucharist - that a doctrine that takes Jesus at his word when he said: This IS my body - this IS my blood. My point is simple - fundamentalists believes "that God means what he says and says what he means" only so far as what God says agrees with what they already believe.

What you are leaving out is Jesus added "do this in remembrance of me". Does the wine and the host transubstantiate or consubstantiate or is the Eucharist a memorial service to bring us closer to Jesus? I do not know nor do I need to know the specifics and argue about them. I participate in communion because it is one of the Sacraments of my faith. I do not need to know the specific workings of an combustion engine in order to ride the bus. I am a Eucharist Minister and I take this Sacrament very seriously. What I believe the Word tells concerning the nature of the Eucharist is only my interpretation of its workings. How one thinks it works is irrelevent to one's salvation. It is one of Paul's disputable matters.

noonwitch
06-09-2010, 09:23 AM
What you are leaving out is Jesus added "do this in remembrance of me". Does the wine and the host transubstantiate or consubstantiate or is the Eucharist a memorial service to bring us closer to Jesus? I do not know nor do I need to know the specifics and argue about them. I participate in communion because it is one of the Sacraments of my faith. I do not need to know the specific workings of an combustion engine in order to ride the bus. I am a Eucharist Minister and I take this Sacrament very seriously. What I believe the Word tells concerning the nature of the Eucharist is only my interpretation of its workings. How one thinks it works is irrelevent to one's salvation. It is one of Paul's disputable matters.



I like the bus analogy.


I am from a liberal christian tradition. Communion is completely symbolic, and by participating, we are reminding ourselves of Jesus' sacrifice and of our commitment to Him. At least that's the way it was explained to me in confirmation class, in the UCC. I respect the Catholic belief in the presence/transubstantiation, but I'm never going to believe that the priest literally changes the eucharist into the body and blood of Christ.

Unity, my Sunday church, rarely practices communion-only on Maunday Thursday. I kind of miss it. I don't know when the other church does it, but they don't do it during the Saturday night service (which is allegedly identical to the Sunday service).

Molon Labe
06-09-2010, 11:56 AM
You deserve it. Comparing Dr. Jones to a fundie is a crime against humanity.

Hate to say it Wilbur, but his depiction of faith is spot on.

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 01:37 PM
You speak of what you do not know since you know little of my behavior of this site. Making assumptions like that is exemplifies your errors in your definition of Fundies.

Do I now? Cause looks to me from the qualifiers I put in that statement - QUITE intentionally - that I went out of my way to make it clear that I do not know what you do off this site all the while you make the assumption that the differentiation between fundies and fundamentalists is something I came up with all on my own.

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 01:46 PM
Which may be one in the same as far as many fundamentalists are concerned.If a fundamentalists chooses to identify with the caricature of fundamentalism - that's their choice and not my problem.


As for the use of the f word, the word on Earth is generally used in an unflattering negative way. For someone who proclaims the faith it profanes God by using it. ROTFL! God invented the act - how does giving the act the proper english term for said act profane God? :rolleyes: Come now. You're better than this. The prohibition against the word is a Victorian sentiment.


We are to appear as light and salt to the world. We are to be different than those in the world and act as attractors to the light. If you behave as the world does then you are proclaiming your acceptence of what the world finds good. You become no different than that which you are to be an alternative to.So you believe that to be light and salt you have to walk around holier than thou? Is that what Jesus did?


Bear in mind that your behavior in the world is what non believers will use to define standard Christian behavior, just like the behavior you disapprove by the "fundies" is considered as reflective of all fundamentalist as a whole. You may be able to make that distinction but most are not. If your behavior is questionable then you must discard the behavior for fear that you may put God in a negative light. Profane language when used by Christians puts God in a bad light because most who hear or read your words can't make the distinctions that you do. The world at large doesn't think that the f word has no power in heaven or earth, they just know that it is a negative word used to insult and belittle others. I'll rot in hell before I walk around nose in the air looking down at people with a holier than thou attitude. NO THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 01:50 PM
What you are leaving out is Jesus added "do this in remembrance of me". Does the wine and the host transubstantiate or consubstantiate or is the Eucharist a memorial service to bring us closer to Jesus? I do not know nor do I need to know the specifics and argue about them. I participate in communion because it is one of the Sacraments of my faith. I do not need to know the specific workings of an combustion engine in order to ride the bus. I am a Eucharist Minister and I take this Sacrament very seriously. What I believe the Word tells concerning the nature of the Eucharist is only my interpretation of its workings. How one thinks it works is irrelevent to one's salvation. It is one of Paul's disputable matters.

HOW it happens is irrelivant. Attempting to define how is no different than trying to put God in a box. What is important is THAT it happens. God said UNEQUIVOCALLY this ***IS*** my body this ***IS*** my blood. The Greek bears this out. And as I have said - fundamentalists INSIST that the bible be taken literally - except where doing so would refute their already held beliefs. They have no problem insisting that creation was accomplished in 144 hours - because the scriptures say it took place in 6 days - but they refuse to accept that Jesus meant what he said when he named the bread and wine as his body and blood.

FlaGator
06-09-2010, 03:23 PM
HOW it happens is irrelivant. Attempting to define how is no different than trying to put God in a box. What is important is THAT it happens. God said UNEQUIVOCALLY this ***IS*** my body this ***IS*** my blood. The Greek bears this out. And as I have said - fundamentalists INSIST that the bible be taken literally - except where doing so would refute their already held beliefs. They have no problem insisting that creation was accomplished in 144 hours - because the scriptures say it took place in 6 days - but they refuse to accept that Jesus meant what he said when he named the bread and wine as his body and blood.

I'm not arguing one way or another concerning the nature of the Euchrist. I am a fundamentalist and much of what you describe is wrong. You are painting with a very broad brush and combining different characteristics and beliefs of many fundamentalist groups under one heading and ascribing it to all fundamentalist. Have you personally meet every fundamentalist to evaluation you opinion and verify the accuracy of it? I think not. You don't even know if I believe in transubstantiation or not so how can you claim that fundamentalists believe this that or the other thing? All you can state with any assurance is that some fundamentalists don't accept transubstantiation. I have news for you, some do.

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 03:32 PM
I'm not arguing one way or another concerning the nature of the Euchrist. I am a fundamentalist and much of what you describe is wrong. You are painting with a very broad brush and combining different characteristics and beliefs of many fundamentalist groups under one heading and ascribing it to all fundamentalist. Have you personally meet every fundamentalist to evaluation you opinion and verify the accuracy of it? I think not. You don't even know if I believe in transubstantiation or not so how can you claim that fundamentalists believe this that or the other thing? All you can state with any assurance is that some fundamentalists don't accept transubstantiation. I have news for you, some do.

Do you deny that a key tenant of Christian fundamentalism is that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God and should be taken literally?

FlaGator
06-09-2010, 03:39 PM
If a fundamentalists chooses to identify with the caricature of fundamentalism - that's their choice and not my problem. ROTFL! God invented the act - how does giving the act the proper english term for said act profane God? :rolleyes: Come now. You're better than this. The prohibition against the word is a Victorian sentiment.
So you believe that to be light and salt you have to walk around holier than thou? Is that what Jesus did?
I'll rot in hell before I walk around nose in the air looking down at people with a holier than thou attitude. NO THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

I look down on no one unless it is to help them up. Would you like to show me where i have looked down on someone?

I believe to be light and salt I have to walk around and put God in a good light. I have to treat people decently, help those who need it and generally behave kindly towards non believers in a manner that makes them curious as to my joy.

How I behave reflects on what people think of Christians as long as I profess to be a Christian. Now if I say I'm a Christian and I'm out running around cussing and calling people a f***tard because I disagree with them then I am not putting God and Christianity in a very positive light. I would be debasing the beliefs that Christ told me to exemplify.

Try this, print out a bunch of your posts to Wei, you know, the ones where you call him propane names and take them to your minister. Don't tell him their yours but ask him what he thinks of a Christian who writes like that in a public forum.

FlaGator
06-09-2010, 03:45 PM
Do you deny that a key tenant of Christian fundamentalism is that the Bible is the inerrant Word of God and should be taken literally?

The Bible is the inerrant word of God and it should be taken literally were Christ is speaking literally and taken figuratively where he is speaking figuratively. For example if Christ was to say "I am the door" I don't believe that He means he is a piece of wood with hinges and a handle. When John or any Biblical writer refers to Jesus as the Lamb of God I don't think that they mean He is literally a furry four legged animal that we make sweaters out of.

The disagreement you seem to have with some fundamentalists is in what you and they believe is literal speech and what is figurative speech.

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 03:46 PM
I look down on no one unless it is to help them up. Would you like to show me where i have looked down on someone?

I believe to the light and salt I have to walk around and put God in a good light. I have to treat people decently, help those who need it and generally behave kindlyt towards non believers in a manner that makes them.

How I behave reflects on what people think of Christians as long as I profess to be a Christian. Now if I say I'm a Christian and I'm out running around cussing and calling people a f***tard because I disagree with them then I am not putting God and Christianity in a very positive light. I would be debasing the beliefs that Christ told me to exemplify.

Try this, print out a bunch of your post to Wei, you know, the ones where you call him propane names and take them to your pasture. Don't tell him their yours but ask him what he thinks of a Christian who writes like that in a public forum.

Tell me - how did Christ deal with intransigent and unrepentantly self-righteous? What did Christ have to say about he sinner as opposed to the preening elitists? Are you going to tell me that Christ never called a spade a spade? Or in wee wee's case a fucktard a fucktard?

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 03:55 PM
The Bible is the inerrant word of God and it should be taken literally were Christ is speaking literally and taken figuratively where he is speaking figuratively. For example if Christ was to say "I am the door" I don't believe that He means he is a piece of wood with hinges and a handle. When John or any Biblical writer refers to Jesus as the Lamb of God I don't think that they mean He is literally a furry four legged animal that we make sweaters out of.

The disagreement you seem to have with some fundamentalists is in what you and they believe is literal speech and what is figurative speech.


My dear fellow - when Christ began a statement with VERILY VERILY or TRULY TRULY (depending on your translation) he was giving a clear spiritual truth and what he said was not figurative but literal - not in the corporeal sense - but in the actual factual truth sense. So when Christ said VERILY VERILY I SAY UNTO YOU, I AM THE DOOR OF THE SHEEP - He is quite literally the door of the sheep. Does this mean that he is corporally a door? that he has hinges and a knob etc? NO OF COURSE NOT. But that does not mean he is speaking figuratively. It means that he is a door - the portal - the way in. Half the problem is that people confuse LITERAL with CORPOREAL.

Articulate_Ape
06-09-2010, 04:00 PM
My dear fellow - when Christ began a statement with VERILY VERILY or TRULY TRULY (depending on your translation) he was giving a clear spiritual truth and what he said was not figurative but literal - not in the corporeal sense - but in the actual factual truth sense. So when Christ said VERILY VERILY I SAY UNTO YOU, I AM THE DOOR OF THE SHEEP - He is quite literally the door of the sheep. Does this mean that he is corporally a door? that he has hinges and a knob etc? NO OF COURSE NOT. But that does not mean he is speaking figuratively. It means that he is a door - the portal - the way in. Half the problem is that people confuse LITERAL with CORPOREAL.


What do you teach again?

Wei Wu Wei
06-09-2010, 04:27 PM
The Bible is the inerrant word of God and it should be taken literally were Christ is speaking literally and taken figuratively where he is speaking figuratively. For example if Christ was to say "I am the door" I don't believe that He means he is a piece of wood with hinges and a handle. When John or any Biblical writer refers to Jesus as the Lamb of God I don't think that they mean He is literally a furry four legged animal that we make sweaters out of.

The disagreement you seem to have with some fundamentalists is in what you and they believe is literal speech and what is figurative speech.

That seems like an easy way to tell when Jesus was speaking literally or figuratively, but how can you distinguish between when the prophets and authors of the books of the bible were speaking literally or figuratively?

Seems obvious to me, as I see it, that the Bible is loaded with poetry and figurative language. Even many Christian theologians during the rise of Christianity have said that much of what is said about God cannot be literally true (often times things are said about God which implies he has a physical body). Many of these theologians have gone as far as to say that no language at all can describe God, but at best can honor Him. Anselm of Canterbury addressed this and Thomas Hobbes was pretty specific about it.

FlaGator
06-09-2010, 04:43 PM
Tell me - how did Christ deal with intransigent and unrepentantly self-righteous? What did Christ have to say about he sinner as opposed to the preening elitists? Are you going to tell me that Christ never called a spade a spade? Or in wee wee's case a fucktard a fucktard?

Christ separated believers from non-believers. He treated the self righteous Pharisees one away and those who lacked understanding another. The Pharisees where expected to know better because they represented God, the tax collectors and other sinners He treated differently. He tried the as you would treat any lost soul.

Christ never called the adulteress woman a whore, he called her a sinner in need of repentance. I think you know what his exact words were.

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 04:47 PM
Christ separated believers from non-believers. He treated the self righteous Pharisees one away and those who lacked understanding another. The Pharisees where expected to know better because they represented God, the tax collectors and other sinners He treated differently. He tried the as you would treat any lost soul.

Christ never called the adulteress woman a whore, he called her a sinner in need of repentance. I think you know what his exact words were.

It seems to me that Wee wee has previously claim to be a Christian. Are you going to claim that Wee wee is not self-righteous?

Christ also differentiated between the lost and the reprobate as well.

FlaGator
06-09-2010, 04:47 PM
My dear fellow - when Christ began a statement with VERILY VERILY or TRULY TRULY (depending on your translation) he was giving a clear spiritual truth and what he said was not figurative but literal - not in the corporeal sense - but in the actual factual truth sense. So when Christ said VERILY VERILY I SAY UNTO YOU, I AM THE DOOR OF THE SHEEP - He is quite literally the door of the sheep. Does this mean that he is corporally a door? that he has hinges and a knob etc? NO OF COURSE NOT. But that does not mean he is speaking figuratively. It means that he is a door - the portal - the way in. Half the problem is that people confuse LITERAL with CORPOREAL.

My dear fellow, I also read the Greek and I know a great deal of theology. Now who is being condescending?

The bottom line here seems to be that you don't agree with what some fundamentalists believe to be literal speech and what is figurative. Again, it is interpretation and one of those disputable matters that Paul warns us bring unnecessary disunity to the body of Christ. Instead of looking down on them, just accept the fact that their view is not the same as yours.

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 04:48 PM
What do you teach again?

Why? Clearly you find fault with something I have said so please speak your mind. I can prolly guess what it is - but I'd rather not assume.

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 04:52 PM
My dear fellow, I also read the Greek and I know a great deal of theology. Now who is being condescending? Who did I accuse of condescension? :confused: If you feel I was being condescending - please be made aware that I was not.


The bottom line here seems to be that you don't agree with what some fundamentalists believe to be literal speech and what is figurative. Again, it is interpretation and one of those disputable matters that Paul warns us bring unnecessary disunity to the body of Christ. Instead of looking down on them, just accept the fact that their view is not the same as yours.

Not at all - I disagree with their claim to believe the Bible should be taken literally when they only take those parts literally that agree with their preferred doctrines. Let me point you to another example - the notion of Sola Fide - which is directly in contradiction to scripture.

FlaGator
06-09-2010, 04:55 PM
It seems to me that Wee wee has previously claim to be a Christian. Are you going to claim that Wee wee is not self-righteous?

Christ also differentiated between the lost and the reprobate as well.

I know the he and I have debated many a few things and he treated me with respect and I treated him with respect. I didn't cuss or name call and neither did he. We just disagreed and defended our points of view.

Wei is a fallen Christian, as a Calvinist I work from the assumption that he is not saved and never has been so I treat him as such. He may have been chosen and his fall however, may be temporary and he may return to the faith in which cause you haven't treated him like a brother (and he hasn't treated you like one either). You and I disagree but we do treat each other like brothers in Christ. We aren't rude to each other and we manage to get our points across in a generally respectul manner. Since you don't know who God has and hasn't called shouldn't you err on the side of caution?

FlaGator
06-09-2010, 04:58 PM
Who did I accuse of condescension? :confused: If you feel I was being condescending - please be made aware that I was not.


Not at all - I disagree with their claim to believe the Bible should be taken literally when they only take those parts literally that agree with their preferred doctrines. Let me point you to another example - the notion of Sola Fide - which is directly in contradiction to scripture.

If I misunderstood you words, I apology for feeling you were speaking down to me.

I believe that some fundamentalist look at Christ words at the Last Supper to be figurative. I take them as literal (just so you know) but I view those who see it differently as having a different understanding of that point than I do.

I must be off to Church. I'll pick this back up when I get back my friend.

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 05:10 PM
I know the he and I have debated many a few things and he treated me with respect and I treated him with respect. I didn't cuss or name call and neither did he. We just disagreed and defended our points of view.

Wei is a fallen Christian, as a Calvinist I work from the assumption that he is not saved and never has been so I treat him as such. He may have been chosen and his fall however, may be temporary and he may return to the faith in which cause you haven't treated him like a brother (and he hasn't treated you like one either). You and I disagree but we do treat each other like brothers in Christ. We aren't rude to each other and we manage to get our points across in a generally respectul manner. Since you don't know who God has and hasn't called shouldn't you err on the side of caution?

I refuse to treat garbage with respect. If that makes me less Christian or a bad Christian in your eyes - oh well. I take the words of Christ to heart when he says not to cast pearls before swine. I have long ago given up on his as anything more than a troll. He's no interest in learning or hearing or actual dialogues - with him it's nothing more than a game. I have no respect for people who play games like that. I feel it safe to say that you and I are not going to agree on much of anything. We agree on Christ and little else it seems. Our views are too incongruous which often results in confrontation. That being said - I am NOT a Calvinist and hold no calvinistic tenancies so I feel no need to assume that Wee wee is called or saved or even human.

Articulate_Ape
06-09-2010, 06:12 PM
Why? Clearly you find fault with something I have said so please speak your mind. I can prolly guess what it is - but I'd rather not assume.

Ok. Let's begin with your first assertion:


when Christ began a statement with VERILY VERILY or TRULY TRULY (depending on your translation) he was giving a clear spiritual truth and what he said was not figurative but literal - not in the corporeal sense - but in the actual factual truth sense.

Just one example: "Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you." John 6:52-54

If that doesn't represent figurative speech, then Christianity is even weirder than I thought. In terms of corporeal versus literal, I found your distinction somewhat bizarre in that the two are by definition rather mutually inclusive, with literal being something (e.g. an idea, statement, word, etc.) taken at face value and corporeal describing something that exists in the physical rather than the spiritual realm. In fact, based on our senses corporeal things are factual, while things expressed literally might or might not be factual, but are to be taken at face value as expressed.

It therefore follows that when you said...


So when Christ said VERILY VERILY I SAY UNTO YOU, I AM THE DOOR OF THE SHEEP - He is quite literally the door of the sheep. Does this mean that he is corporally a door? that he has hinges and a knob etc? NO OF COURSE NOT.

...you were half right in that Jesus clearly was/is not corporeally a door, and you were half wrong when you stated that he's is literally the door when, in fact, he was and still is as figuratively that door as when he first suggested it. If he was referring to himself literally as that door, he would have had to have meant he was corporeally that door, hinges knob and all.

That said:


But that does not mean he is speaking figuratively.

Why yes, yes it does.


It means that he is a door - the portal - the way in.

Figuratively speaking, yes; if you believe it.


Half the problem is that people confuse LITERAL with CORPOREAL.

Yes they do.

Articulate_Ape
06-09-2010, 06:32 PM
Coming up next... The Articulate Ape Show. Stay tuned!

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 08:17 PM
Ok. Let's begin with your first assertion:



Just one example: "Then Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Except ye eat the flesh of the Son of man, and drink his blood, ye have no life in you." John 6:52-54 You prove my point. Unless you literally eat his flesh and blood you have no life within you. Does that mean you eat his corporeal body? No. He told us before this passage what exactly IS is flesh and what IS his blood - the elements of the Eucharist. Are the corporeally his flesh and blood? No. But in the most real sense - since Christ himself spoke it - the bread and wine become his body and blood. This was a hard teaching that made many people stop following him. Looking at it as symbolic - looking at it figuratively would not make it a hard teaching.


If that doesn't represent figurative speech, then Christianity is even weirder than I thought. Am I to understand then than you are not Christian?


In terms of corporeal versus literal, I found your distinction somewhat bizarre in that the two are by definition rather mutually inclusive, with literal being something (e.g. an idea, statement, word, etc.) taken at face value and corporeal describing something that exists in the physical rather than the spiritual realm. In fact, based on our senses corporeal things are factual, while things expressed literally might or might not be factual, but are to be taken at face value as expressed. You're not grasping that something can be factual and true without having to be corporeally factual and true. There is always a philosophical element to the definition of terms. Take the term door. A door can be defined without having to resort to physical characteristics. A door can be said to be a connected movable covering that allows and/or restricts entrance/egress to/from a give place/space/etc. Any corporeal characteristics are secondary to the primary function of a door.

Rockntractor
06-09-2010, 08:20 PM
And he tells me I need to get out more often!:rolleyes:

Bubba Dawg
06-09-2010, 08:24 PM
Coming up next... The Articulate Ape Show. Stay tuned!

What do you get if you put a lab monkey in a blender?

Rhesus Pieces.

Wei Wu Wei
06-09-2010, 09:48 PM
I know the he and I have debated many a few things and he treated me with respect and I treated him with respect. I didn't cuss or name call and neither did he. We just disagreed and defended our points of view.

Wei is a fallen Christian, as a Calvinist I work from the assumption that he is not saved and never has been so I treat him as such. He may have been chosen and his fall however, may be temporary and he may return to the faith in which cause you haven't treated him like a brother (and he hasn't treated you like one either). You and I disagree but we do treat each other like brothers in Christ. We aren't rude to each other and we manage to get our points across in a generally respectul manner. Since you don't know who God has and hasn't called shouldn't you err on the side of caution?

We have disagreed before. I have prayed and asked for salvation at a younger age, my ideas have changed with time, I still hold Christian values and believe that the prophets did receive divine revelations and was written down in the Bible, but I understand why most Christians wouldn't consider my beliefs to be in line with theirs.

I agree too, I haven't always treated Policon as I know I should. I try to offer help when I think I can, but I can't deny that more than once I've acted with malicious intent.

You and I disagree on many things, but I'm glad you act like a Christian should to others, and offer good perspective for myself to reflect on. :)

Wei Wu Wei
06-09-2010, 09:49 PM
I refuse to treat garbage with respect. If that makes me less Christian or a bad Christian in your eyes - oh well. I take the words of Christ to heart when he says not to cast pearls before swine. I have long ago given up on his as anything more than a troll. He's no interest in learning or hearing or actual dialogues - with him it's nothing more than a game. I have no respect for people who play games like that. I feel it safe to say that you and I are not going to agree on much of anything. We agree on Christ and little else it seems. Our views are too incongruous which often results in confrontation. That being said - I am NOT a Calvinist and hold no calvinistic tenancies so I feel no need to assume that Wee wee is called or saved or even human.

You and I are the same.

Rockntractor
06-09-2010, 09:56 PM
You and I are the same.
:D:D:D:D

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 10:01 PM
You and I are the same.

I'm glad we on who and what you are.

Rockntractor
06-09-2010, 10:13 PM
I'm glad we on who and what you are.

Sometimes I have to stop reading and check who posted it, I confuse you and Wei Wei all the time!

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 10:19 PM
Sometimes I have to stop reading and check who posted it, I confuse you and Wei Wei all the time!

:rolleyes:

Articulate_Ape
06-09-2010, 10:21 PM
You prove my point. Unless you literally eat his flesh and blood you have no life within you. Does that mean you eat his corporeal body? No. He told us before this passage what exactly IS is flesh and what IS his blood - the elements of the Eucharist. Are the corporeally his flesh and blood? No. But in the most real sense - since Christ himself spoke it - the bread and wine become his body and blood. This was a hard teaching that made many people stop following him. Looking at it as symbolic - looking at it figuratively would not make it a hard teaching.
Am I to understand then than you are not Christian?
You're not grasping that something can be factual and true without having to be corporeally factual and true. There is always a philosophical element to the definition of terms. Take the term door. A door can be defined without having to resort to physical characteristics. A door can be said to be a connected movable covering that allows and/or restricts entrance/egress to/from a give place/space/etc. Any corporeal characteristics are secondary to the primary function of a door.

I am not a Christian, but I can play one on TV. Your semantically gymnastics aside, you're ass is still sucking water from a linguistic standpoint. I reckon that's what happens when your put your brain on the shelf for a god that actually rather repeatedly has signaled that you should not do that if you want to understand god. But you go girl. How wrong could people like Pat Robertson be? I mean really.

PoliCon
06-09-2010, 10:28 PM
I am not a Christian, but I can play one on TV. Your semantically gymnastics aside, you're ass is still sucking water from a linguistic standpoint. I reckon that's what happens when your put your brain on the shelf for a god that actually rather repeatedly has signaled that you should not do that if you want to understand god. But you go girl. How wrong could people like Pat Robertson be? I mean really.


ROTFL. You are more than welcome to disagree with my "semantically gymnastics" [sic] but you assumption that I 'shelf' my brain are unjustified. :rolleyes:

Articulate_Ape
06-09-2010, 10:33 PM
ROTFL. You are more than welcome to disagree with my "semantically gymnastics" [sic] but you assumption that I 'shelf' my brain are unjustified. :rolleyes:

You(sic) assumption that I think you have shelved your brain indicated that you took my figurative mention of your corporeal organ literally. Game, set, match. :p

FlaGator
06-10-2010, 08:22 AM
I refuse to treat garbage with respect. If that makes me less Christian or a bad Christian in your eyes - oh well. I take the words of Christ to heart when he says not to cast pearls before swine. I have long ago given up on his as anything more than a troll. He's no interest in learning or hearing or actual dialogues - with him it's nothing more than a game. I have no respect for people who play games like that. I feel it safe to say that you and I are not going to agree on much of anything. We agree on Christ and little else it seems. Our views are too incongruous which often results in confrontation. That being said - I am NOT a Calvinist and hold no calvinistic tenancies so I feel no need to assume that Wee wee is called or saved or even human.

It is not my eyes that matter. I am human and a sinner and prone to error. My opinion matters nothing. Only Christ's determination matters and that must lie strictly between you and Him. I state my beliefs on this and that is all. However I never take my beliefs as infallible. I also try not to give up on any one because of my fallibility and I do not know the mind of God so to criticize his handy worked is, for me and my beliefs, risky business. Again these are my beliefs and what I glean from my exegesis of Scripture and from my reading of historically trusted theologians.

BTW, we agree on more than you think. It seems that I only chime in when we disagree because you manage to state the common views we have succinctly so why should I amend that which you have said?

Elspeth
06-11-2010, 02:35 PM
Is it a Clear Channel station? If so, then the guy might be Neil Saavedra, a former seminary student turned talk radio host. Here is the link to the LA show:

http://www.kfiam640.com/pages/JesusChrist.html?feed=128001&article=444961

http://www.thejesuschristshow.com/

I'm quoting myself because there IS a Jesus Christ show and it DOES play on Clear Channel stations on Sunday mornings.

I tried to answer the original question, but everyone seemed hell bent on killing each other. Now that the fight is over, I think my quote (above) answers the actual question in the OP.

Imagine that!:eek:

PoliCon
06-11-2010, 02:38 PM
I'm quoting myself because there IS a Jesus Christ show and it DOES play on Clear Channel stations on Sunday mornings.

I tried to answer the original question, but everyone seemed hell bent on killing each other. Now that the fight is over, I think my quote (above) answers the actual question in the OP.

Imagine that!:eek:

:p no one's dead. Hell - no one is even bloody :p

Elspeth
06-11-2010, 02:40 PM
:p no one's dead. Hell - no one is even bloody :p

BUT DID YOU CHECK THE LINK?

Please, just acknowledge that someone gave a factual answer that might help the OP.

:(:(

PoliCon
06-11-2010, 02:48 PM
BUT DID YOU CHECK THE LINK?

Please, just acknowledge that someone gave a factual answer that might help the OP.

:(:(

I did check the link. I'd prolly never listen to the show - but I did check the link.