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Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 12:52 PM
This thread in response to this thread: Rape 'impossible' in marriage, says Muslim cleric (and the dozen others about the terrors of sharia)
http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showthread.php?t=32762



The sole purpose of non-Jews is to serve Jews, according to Rabbi Ovadia Yosef, the head of Shas's Council of Torah Sages and a senior Sephardi adjudicator.

“Goyim were born only to serve us. Without that, they have no place in the world – only to serve the People of Israel,” he said in his weekly Saturday night sermon on the laws regarding the actions non-Jews are permitted to perform on Shabbat.

According to Yosef, the lives of non-Jews in Israel are safeguarded by divinity, to prevent losses to Jews.

“In Israel, death has no dominion over them... With gentiles, it will be like any person – they need to die, but [God] will give them longevity. Why? Imagine that one’s donkey would die, they’d lose their money.

This is his servant... That’s why he gets a long life, to work well for this Jew,” Yosef said.

“Why are gentiles needed? They will work, they will plow, they will reap. We will sit like an effendi and eat.

That is why gentiles were created,” he added.

http://www.jpost.com/JewishWorld/JewishNews/Article.aspx?ID=191782&R=R1



Rabbi Ovadia Yosef (Hebrew: עובדיה יוסף‎) (born September 23, 1920) is a Mizrahi Haredi rabbi, Talmudic scholar, and recognized halakhic authority. Born in Baghdad, Iraq, he is the former Sephardi Chief Rabbi of Israel. Yosef is also the current spiritual leader of the Shas political party in the Israeli Knesset. He is highly revered in the Orthodox Jewish world, especially in the Sephardi and Mizrahi communities, for his erudition and Torah scholarship. He is among the most important poskim of the past few generations and is regarded by many as the foremost Rabbinical authority and a source of Daat Torah.

FlaGator
10-20-2010, 12:58 PM
This thread in response to this thread: Rape 'impossible' in marriage, says Muslim cleric (and the dozen others about the terrors of sharia)
http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showthread.php?t=32762



http://www.jpost.com/JewishWorld/JewishNews/Article.aspx?ID=191782&R=R1

What does one have to do with the other? Seems like a none starter unless you are demonstrating the inaneness of one by comparing it to the other. Neither one have any Biblical basis in truth.

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 12:59 PM
Is Judaism compatable with the Constitution and American Freedom?

Well according to this guy, it doesn't look like it.....

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 01:00 PM
What does one have to do with the other? Seems like a none starter unless you are demonstrating the inaneness of one by comparing it to the other. Neither one have any Biblical basis in truth.

Top authorities within the religion saying a thing that is anti-American-freedom. Should we treat Judaism the same way Islam is treated around these parts?

Gingersnap
10-20-2010, 01:00 PM
More GD than Breaking News.

I'm sure God will sort it out when the time comes.

FlaGator
10-20-2010, 01:03 PM
Top authorities within the religion saying a thing that is anti-American-freedom. Should we treat Judaism the same way Islam is treated around these parts?

The difference here is that the Koran can be viewed as supporting the Muslim cleric's stance. The Torah, however, is not supportive of this Rabbi's views.

wilbur
10-20-2010, 01:07 PM
The difference here is that the Koran can be viewed as supporting the Muslim cleric's stance. The Torah, however, is not supportive of this Rabbi's views.

It takes *A LOT* of interpretive licence to make the Torah the holy book of a peaceful religion...

Though I do have to wonder... what would the Jews need protecting from if the Goyim didn't exist (and therefore could never try to exterminate them).

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 01:13 PM
It takes *A LOT* of interpretive licence to make the Torah the holy book of a peaceful religion...

lmao i was abotu to say

noonwitch
10-20-2010, 01:19 PM
Was he joking?


I don't know any jews who would agree with him.

FlaGator
10-20-2010, 01:25 PM
It takes *A LOT* of interpretive licence to make the Torah the holy book of a peaceful religion...

Though I do have to wonder... what would the Jews need protecting from if the Goyim didn't exist (and therefore could never try to exterminate them).

I don't think that Judaism has ever been considered a "religion of peace." It has been considered a religion of laws and justice.

FlaGator
10-20-2010, 01:28 PM
Was he joking?


I don't know any jews who would agree with him.

I don't think there are any. It's just WWW and wilbur getting all excited about a imaginary connection between two entirely different view points.

wilbur
10-20-2010, 01:36 PM
I don't think that Judaism has ever been considered a "religion of peace." It has been considered a religion of laws and justice.

But what monotheistic religion isn't about "laws and justice"? They all have laws, and their versions of justice. A religion may become un-peaceful when its "laws and justice" are incongruent with a mixed population of infidels (goyim, gentiles, whatever), and conflict arises. Old Judaism is filled with such conflict.

Judaism was one of the worlds first exclusive religions... that is, you could not be apart of it unless you were born into it. And woe to everyone else who wasn't part of God's chosen tribe. Just like Christianity, it's extremist and hardline past self has been tempered into submission by the emergence of western values and past hardships.... not the other way around.

But I'll grant you that most Jews today are a peaceful people. At the very least one cannot say they are any more warlike than any other people. Which is good... but this disposition can hardly be said to have come from the Torah.. which holds its own against the Quran as an atrocity filled barbarity.

wilbur
10-20-2010, 01:37 PM
I don't think there are any. It's just WWW and wilbur getting all excited about a imaginary connection between two entirely different view points.

I think she was talking about the Rabbi in the OP

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 01:41 PM
Was he joking?


I don't know any jews who would agree with him.

He's a leading Jewish authority in Israel.

Where are all the jewish people standing up and denouncing this guy?? I don't see them!

Articulate_Ape
10-20-2010, 01:47 PM
There are nutjobs in the fundamentalist branch of every religion. The difference is whether those nutjobs ACT on their beliefs in such a way as to affect other people. I would also point out that fundamentalism is truly a tiny fringe in all religions other than Islam which, by its very nature is fundamentalist at its core with moderation comprising its fringe.

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 01:48 PM
uh huh look at this extremist apologist trying to split hairs. This rabbi tried to place a curse on palestinians. he knows what he's doing



Yosef’s Saturday night sermons have seen many controversial statements from the 90-year-old rabbi. In August, Yosef caused a diplomatic uproar when he wished a plague upon the Palestinian people and their leaders, a curse he retracted a few weeks later, when he blessed them along with all of Israel’s other peace-seeking neighbors.

Gingersnap
10-20-2010, 01:53 PM
He's talking about the labor Gentiles would be permitted to perform on the Sabbath in Israel and he's talking about it from an Orthodox worldview. Orthodox Jews can do no labor on the Sabbath. For centuries, Jews have hired Gentiles to light fires, feed livestock, light lamps, and carry belongings for Jews. Centuries - maybe longer.

So, from an Orthodox perspective Gentiles do exist to relieve Jews of labor. So what? No Gentile has ever been forced to carry packages on Saturday for a Jew.

As far as the speculation over the hereafter goes, I can't understand how atheists or agnostics would have any concern at all about what Jews think happens to Gentiles after death. How is that relevant to anything?

This is a complete non-issue and it certainly has no bearing on the brutal treatment of women under Sharia law. :rolleyes:

CaughtintheMiddle1990
10-20-2010, 01:56 PM
I don't think there are any. It's just WWW and wilbur getting all excited about a imaginary connection between two entirely different view points.


I used to be next store with Hasidic Jews, they were kids my age at the time and we used to hang out a lot since there weren't other kids where I lived. They said basically the same thing this Rabbi did--That the goyim's purpose is to serve the Jew. They told me they were taught this by their Rabbi, and I doubt it was the same Rabbi since it was a totally different location.

Articulate_Ape
10-20-2010, 01:56 PM
He's a leading Jewish authority in Israel.

Where are all the jewish people standing up and denouncing this guy?? I don't see them!

They have denounced his inflammatory comments about Mahmoud Abbas, etc. and they will condemn this as well. You'll see.

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 01:57 PM
I used to be next store with Hasidic Jews, they were kids my age at the time and we used to hang out a lot since there weren't other kids where I lived. They said basically the same thing this Rabbi did--That the goyim's purpose is to serve the Jew. They told me they were taught this by their Rabbi, and I doubt it was the same Rabbi since it was a totally different location.

Proof in the pudding.

FlaGator
10-20-2010, 01:58 PM
But what monotheistic religion isn't about "laws and justice"? They all have laws, and their versions of justice. A religion may become un-peaceful when its "laws and justice" are incongruent with a mixed population of infidels (goyim, gentiles, whatever), and conflict arises. Old Judaism is filled with such conflict.

Judaism was one of the worlds first exclusive religions... that is, you could not be apart of it unless you were born into it. And woe to everyone else who wasn't part of God's chosen tribe. Just like Christianity, it's extremist and hardline past self has been tempered into submission by the emergence of western values and past hardships.... not the other way around.

But I'll grant you that most Jews today are a peaceful people. At the very least one cannot say they are any more warlike than any other people. Which is good... but this disposition can hardly be said to have come from the Torah.. which holds its own against the Quran as an atrocity filled barbarity.

The point I was trying to make is that no where that I am aware of has the argument been made that Judaism was being held up as a religion of peace as has the Muslim religion.

The extremist and hardline past of Christianity, as you call it, was not a product of Christian beliefs or values. This past was perpetrated by those who used Christianity as a means of power to dominate others. I challenge you to find New Testament Christian teaching that upholds or condones that actions of those who lead the Church from around the time of Constantine to roughly the 18th century. On the other hand I can provide for you examples of Muslim teachings from the Koran that not only encourage and condone violent behavior and actions but call for it.

Articulate_Ape
10-20-2010, 01:59 PM
uh huh look at this extremist apologist trying to split hairs. This rabbi tried to place a curse on palestinians. he knows what he's doing

Mohammad Atta and his band of flying monkeys knew what they were doing too, they were still nutjobs.

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 01:59 PM
They have denounced his inflammatory comments about Mahmoud Abbas, etc. and they will condemn this as well. You'll see.

I don't see them. I don't know what you are talking about. If most Jewish people do not agree with what this Rabbi is saying then why havn't I heard them denounce it? Why Have I Not Heard Them Denounce it?:

It's a simple question. Until I personally hear the majority of Jewish people denounce it I won't accept any of these apologetics.

It's up to the Jewish community to speak out against extremists like this (who isn't just some lone nut but actually a high-ranking member of the Jewish community).

Where are they? I don't see them!

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 02:00 PM
The point I was trying to make is that no where that I am aware of has the argument been made that Judaism was being held up as a religion of peace as has the Muslim religion.

The extremist and hardline past of Christianity, as you call it, was not a product of Christian beliefs or values. This past was perpetrated by those who used Christianity as a means of power to dominate others. I challenge you to find New Testament Christian teaching that upholds or condones that actions of those who lead the Church from around the time of Constantine to roughly the 18th century. On the other hand I can provide for you examples of Muslim teachings from the Koran that not only encourage and condone violent behavior and actions but call for it.

Am I allowed to quote church leaders of those centuries on their justification of these actions?

Articulate_Ape
10-20-2010, 02:03 PM
I don't see them. I don't know what you are talking about. If most Jewish people do not agree with what this Rabbi is saying then why havn't I heard them denounce it? Why Have I Not Heard Them Denounce it?:

It's a simple question. Until I personally hear the majority of Jewish people denounce it I won't accept any of these apologetics.

It's up to the Jewish community to speak out against extremists like this (who isn't just some lone nut but actually a high-ranking member of the Jewish community).

Where are they? I don't see them!

Many of them are hearing it for the first time themselves with this article. Do you think that all Jews follow the sermons of this crazy 90 year old relic? Read the comments for that article for starters.

FlaGator
10-20-2010, 02:03 PM
I used to be next store with Hasidic Jews, they were kids my age at the time and we used to hang out a lot since there weren't other kids where I lived. They said basically the same thing this Rabbi did--That the goyim's purpose is to serve the Jew. They told me they were taught this by their Rabbi, and I doubt it was the same Rabbi since it was a totally different location.

I do not doubt that the Hasidic jews feel this way concerning gentiles, but I don't think that you can find support for this view with in the confines of the Torah. Even their slaves where to rest of their labors on the Sabbath and were to be treated with concern and respect. Check out the Leviticus laws on this.

FlaGator
10-20-2010, 02:05 PM
Am I allowed to quote church leaders of those centuries on their justification of these actions?

Sure, but that doesn't mean I will believe or accept the justifcations. I'm certain Ted Bundy could justifiy his actions but that doesn't mean the justifications are acceptable.

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 02:06 PM
Many of them are hearing it for the first time themselves with this article. Do you think that all Jews follow the sermons of this crazy 90 year old relic? Read the comments for that article for starters.

Oh yes this recognized authority on Judaism is just some guy and no one knows who he is. uh huh sure.,

When 50%+1 of the Jews in the world condemn this man, when I personally hear it, then you might have a point. until then SHADDDUUUPPPP

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 02:08 PM
Sure, but that doesn't mean I will believe or accept the justifcations. I'm certain Ted Bundy could justifiy his actions but that doesn't mean the justifications are acceptable.

whoa now.


you mean....wait...slow down...you're saying that in major religions, especially those with billions or more people....hold it...you're saying that the words and actions of extremists, no matter how well accepted during the time period in question, are not representative of the faith itself or of the followers?


hold on I need to go dunk my head in ice water and think about this a little harder.

Articulate_Ape
10-20-2010, 02:14 PM
Oh yes this recognized authority on Judaism is just some guy and no one knows who he is. uh huh sure.,

When 50%+1 of the Jews in the world condemn this man, when I personally hear it, then you might have a point. until then SHADDDUUUPPPP

You mean like the 50% of Muslims who condemn physical acts of terror? Please.

FlaGator
10-20-2010, 02:17 PM
whoa now.


you mean....wait...slow down...you're saying that in major religions, especially those with billions or more people....hold it...you're saying that the words and actions of extremists, no matter how well accepted during the time period in question, are not representative of the faith itself or of the followers?


hold on I need to go dunk my head in ice water and think about this a little harder.

Nope that is not what I said and I am pretty certain you know it so don't act stupid. In this case there is no justification for what Christian leaders of the middle age did that can be supported by a reading of the New Testament. However, if the extremeists views fall in line with the tenets of their believe system then that is another story all together.

For example, show me in New Testament writings where the inquisition was acceptable under scripture. Show me in New Testament writings where forced subjection of people to the Christian faith is an acceptable practice.

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 02:22 PM
You mean like the 50% of Muslims who condemn physical acts of terror? Please.

Articulate Ape, are you a fan of Disco music?

http://imgur.com/tGsn8.jpg

Articulate_Ape
10-20-2010, 02:28 PM
Articulate Ape, are you a fan of Disco music?


No, I'm heterosexual, but I see you are really into it.

Gingersnap
10-20-2010, 02:47 PM
Again, this is a non-issue. It pertains to the traditional work Gentiles have performed (and been paid to do) for Jews on the Sabbath and Holy Days. So what if Orthodox Jews pay Gentiles to flip on the lights or turn off the TV? How is this at all comparable to Sharia law?

The Jews don't need to denounce it because they aren't strapping bombs to themselves and threatening to blow up schools unless the Gentiles press the elevator buttons for them.

*shakes head*

AmPat
10-20-2010, 02:52 PM
He's a leading Jewish authority in Israel.

Where are all the jewish people standing up and denouncing this guy?? I don't see them!

Where are all the Jews strapping bombs to their children and attacking innocents?
Where are all the "Kill the Goyim signs?"
Where are the Jewish schools raising the next several million terrorists?
What has this to do with ANYTHING?
Be clear Karl, we love watching you make a fool of yourself.

Calypso Jones
10-20-2010, 02:53 PM
I think you're being a bit disingenuous about this ninety year old guy and his remarks. And when did religion concern you any unless you're able to beat conservatives, christians, and supporters of israel over the head with it. :)

have you ever really taken a good look at your motives?

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 03:15 PM
Israel doesn't use suicide bombers, they launch their bombs.

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 03:16 PM
This thread was made, as said in the OP, as a response to an other thread. The comparison should be clear.

Articulate_Ape
10-20-2010, 03:22 PM
Israel doesn't use suicide bombers, they launch their bombs.

You mean like Hezbollah does?

Wei Wu Wei
10-20-2010, 03:29 PM
You mean like Hezbollah does?

Something like that yeah.

hampshirebrit
10-20-2010, 04:33 PM
As far as the speculation over the hereafter goes, I can't understand how atheists or agnostics would have any concern at all about what Jews think happens to Gentiles after death. How is that relevant to anything?



Believe (hah, believe, :rolleyes:), believe me when I say, THIS atheist has no concern about what Jews think about Gentiles after death.

What members of any particular god-club have to say on the subject of what they think happens to me after my death is of no concern to me, other than that I hope that the way they deliver their musings gives me yet another chance to mock them. I'm rarely disappointed in this regard.

Give WeeWee credit though, he's started a thread that has reached 41 posts in under four hours.

Uhrah WeeWee, you Marxist bastard.

Lager
10-20-2010, 04:39 PM
Israel doesn't use suicide bombers, they launch their bombs.

There you go. The use of force by Israel is no different, either in motive or desired outcome, from the use of force by Islamic extremists. Nice equation there. Once we know you hold that as a core belief, it kind of makes reading your OP a waste of time.

m00
10-21-2010, 01:22 AM
Is Judaism compatable with the Constitution and American Freedom?

Well according to this guy, it doesn't look like it.....

So you show your true colors, you want to kick out all jews.

MrsSmith
10-21-2010, 04:59 AM
This thread in response to this thread: Rape 'impossible' in marriage, says Muslim cleric (and the dozen others about the terrors of sharia)
http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showthread.php?t=32762



http://www.jpost.com/JewishWorld/JewishNews/Article.aspx?ID=191782&R=R1


Top authorities within the religion saying a thing that is anti-American-freedom. Should we treat Judaism the same way Islam is treated around these parts?


I don't see them. I don't know what you are talking about. If most Jewish people do not agree with what this Rabbi is saying then why havn't I heard them denounce it? Why Have I Not Heard Them Denounce it?:

It's a simple question. Until I personally hear the majority of Jewish people denounce it I won't accept any of these apologetics.

It's up to the Jewish community to speak out against extremists like this (who isn't just some lone nut but actually a high-ranking member of the Jewish community).

Where are they? I don't see them!


Israel doesn't use suicide bombers, they launch their bombs.

Maybe you chose the wrong guy for your premise...especially after you quoted his Wiki article. I can certainly see why you didn't include a link...

Rabbi Yosef has long been a distinguished rabbinical authority advocating peace negotiations in the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, and has done so since the late 1980s. His main justification is the halakhic principle of Pikuach Nefesh, in which all the Jewish commandments (excluding adultery, idolatry, and murder) are put on hold if a life is put in danger. Using an argument first articulated by the late American rabbinical leader Joseph Soloveitchik, Rabbi Yosef claims that the Arab-Israeli conflict endangers human lives, thereby meeting the above criteria and overruling the priority of commandments pertaining to settling the land of Israel.[15] Therefore, Israel is permitted — even obligated if saving lives is a definitive outcome — to make serious efforts to reach a peace settlement as well as to make arrangements to properly protect its citizens

Tsk, tsk, what a horrible extremist you've chosen, one that believes the ultimate role of government is to save human lives as well as protecting its citizens. (Note the contrast there, "human lives" evidently is not limited to citizens.)

wilbur
10-21-2010, 06:26 AM
Maybe you chose the wrong guy for your premise...especially after you quoted his Wiki article. I can certainly see why you didn't include a link...


Tsk, tsk, what a horrible extremist you've chosen, one that believes the ultimate role of government is to save human lives as well as protecting its citizens. (Note the contrast there, "human lives" evidently is not limited to citizens.)

Of course, the quote noted from the OP describes his motivation for saving lives....

He doesn't want to lose his servants.

wilbur
10-21-2010, 06:33 AM
Again, this is a non-issue. It pertains to the traditional work Gentiles have performed (and been paid to do) for Jews on the Sabbath and Holy Days. So what if Orthodox Jews pay Gentiles to flip on the lights or turn off the TV? How is this at all comparable to Sharia law?

The Jews don't need to denounce it because they aren't strapping bombs to themselves and threatening to blow up schools unless the Gentiles press the elevator buttons for them.

*shakes head*

Really? Seriously? Its all just about Gentiles working on the Sabbath, there's no contemptible sentiment in the quotes at all? I think the quotes say differently.

Lets revisit the actual quote from the Rabbi:


“Goyim were born only to serve us. Without that, they have no place in the world

In Israel, death has no dominion over them... With gentiles, it will be like any person – they need to die, but [God] will give them longevity. Why? Imagine that one’s donkey would die, they’d lose their money."



Kinda dissolves that carefully crafted rationalization, eh?

djones520
10-21-2010, 06:38 AM
Israel doesn't use suicide bombers, they launch their bombs.

Israel follows the LOAC. They fight following the Geneva Convention. The people you defend them against use illegal combatants, against civilian targets, hospitals, schools, and non-combatants in general. :rolleyes:

3rd-try
10-21-2010, 07:45 AM
I always find it fascinating when left-leaning individuals, or groups attempt to lower other religions to the level of Islam. The same left-leaning individuals or groups are champions women's and gay rights.

This is America. And America has proven a thousand times over that it is a tolerant nation. However, this attitude dissolves when we're put in danger by our tolerance.

To any reasonable American this thread represents a feeble attempt to paint the Jewish doctrine as the equivalent of Islam. Until Jews begin bombing us, slitting our throats, and demanding their extremist laws be adopted here, this is really only a word-game with no substance.

If, for some reason, this makes you feel intellectually superior or just warm and fuzzy, then enjoy. I don't understand it, but I'm a knuckle-draggin' redneck who is concerned about real threats much more than semantics.

Rockntractor
10-21-2010, 09:21 AM
Really? Seriously? Its all just about Gentiles working on the Sabbath, there's no contemptible sentiment in the quotes at all? I think the quotes say differently.

Lets revisit the actual quote from the Rabbi:


“Goyim were born only to serve us. Without that, they have no place in the world

In Israel, death has no dominion over them... With gentiles, it will be like any person – they need to die, but [God] will give them longevity. Why? Imagine that one’s donkey would die, they’d lose their money."



Kinda dissolves that carefully crafted rationalization, eh?
Another antisemitic, I wish you racist bigots would go back to stormfront where you belong.

Gingersnap
10-21-2010, 10:10 AM
Really? Seriously? Its all just about Gentiles working on the Sabbath, there's no contemptible sentiment in the quotes at all? I think the quotes say differently.

Lets revisit the actual quote from the Rabbi:


“Goyim were born only to serve us. Without that, they have no place in the world

In Israel, death has no dominion over them... With gentiles, it will be like any person – they need to die, but [God] will give them longevity. Why? Imagine that one’s donkey would die, they’d lose their money."



Kinda dissolves that carefully crafted rationalization, eh?

In what way? Here again, are you professing outrage on behalf of a group you don't represent and don't actually understand: religious Gentiles. People who are not religious and not Jewish don't give a flip what the Orthodox think of them in the Big Picture. Traditional Christians who exert themselves enough to understand the religious context here also don't care. Why would we?

I spend exactly zero amount of time worrying about being the good graces of Buddhists, animists, Muslims, Jews, Wiccans or Zoroastrians. Their speculation about my place in the world and my Final Destination has no impact on my life at all.

Those speculations have no impact at all on you.

Odysseus
10-21-2010, 10:41 AM
Is Judaism compatable with the Constitution and American Freedom?

Well according to this guy, it doesn't look like it.....
Nice try. Watch how your arguments get completely blown out of the water. First, the incompatibility issue: Aside from this crank, Jews do not expect Americans to submit to Jewish law. We don't demand that all Americans submit to Mosaic law, ban pork and get circumcised. We just want to be left alone and be allowed to make our lives in the US, in accordance with US law, specifically, the Constitution. There is no American Jewish group seeking to overthrow our Constitution in favor of the Pentateuch. None. Nada. Zip. There is no Jewish equivalent of the Muslim Brotherhood that is seeking to impose Sharia-like laws on non-believers. There is one, I say again, One Jewish state in the world, and it's only goal is to live in peace with its neighbors, not to export Judaism to the rest of the world.

Top authorities within the religion saying a thing that is anti-American-freedom. Should we treat Judaism the same way Islam is treated around these parts?
No, because we don't want the special privileges that Islam demands, we don't expect submission to our laws and we don't riot whenever we are marginally slighted. We don't expect Obama to come out and take everyone to task whenever a Jew is attacked by anyone (and anti-Semitic acts outnumber anti-Muslim acts in the US by about 10:1). We don't expect get our way on building a tax-exempt center wherever we want.

It takes *A LOT* of interpretive licence to make the Torah the holy book of a peaceful religion...

Though I do have to wonder... what would the Jews need protecting from if the Goyim didn't exist (and therefore could never try to exterminate them).
History has taught us an important lesson. When somebody starts talking about murdering Jews, chances are, they are going to do it. Throughout our history, our enemies have been very open about their intentions for us. If you can't see that Hamas and Hezbollah, the PA and Iran have the intent to murder as many Jews as they can, they they simultaneously deny the Holocaust while celebrating it, and are amassing the means to accomplish their goals, then you really have no clue.

Was he joking?

I don't know any jews who would agree with him.
I certainly don't. And even if I did, my Gentile wife wouldn't let me get away with it.

He's a leading Jewish authority in Israel.

Where are all the jewish people standing up and denouncing this guy?? I don't see them!
Have you bothered looking? Here are the groups and people that you can't see (perhaps you need glasses, or a white cane and a service dog?):
ADL Throws Criticism at Rabbi Ovadia Yosef for “Hateful” Statements Against Non-Jews (http://www.emunahmagazine.com/adl-throws-criticism-at-rabbi-ovadia-yosef-for-hateful-statements-against-non-jews-2822/)
PM pulls back from Yosef’s words (http://www.jpost.com/Israel/Article.aspx?id=186372)
A Special Place in Hell / Celebrate Jewish New Year with a De-Occupation Seder (http://www.haaretz.com/blogs/a-special-place-in-hell/a-special-place-in-hell-celebrate-jewish-new-year-with-a-de-occupation-seder-1.311068)
"Goyim Were Born Only To Serve Us": The Moral Wisdom Of Rabbi Ovadia Yosef (http://www.tnr.com/blog/the-spine/78490/goyim-were-born-only-serve-us-the-moral-wisdom-rabbi-ovadia-yosef?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+kramerlinks+(Linkage+by+Marti n+Kramer))
Please stop apologizing for Rav Ovadia Yosef (http://israelmatzav.blogspot.com/2010/09/please-stop-apologizing-for-rav-ovadia.html)
Reform Movement Condemns Rabbi Ovadia Yosef's Inflammatory Comments (http://rac.org/Articles/index.cfm?id=21622&pge_prg_id=12907)
Hagon Chacham Ovadia Yosef Slammed By Abe Foxman And The ADL (http://www.theyeshivaworld.com/news/Headlines+&+Breaking+Stories/72798/Hagon+Chacham+Ovadia+Yosef+Slammed+By+Abe+Foxman+A nd+The+ADL.html)
Hateful Words From A Rabbi (http://www.thejewishweek.com/blogs/gary_rosenblatt/hateful_words_rabbi)
Jewish groups react to Rabbi Yosef (http://www.thejewishweek.com/blogs/political_insider/update_jewish_groups_react_rabbi_yosef)

That last one is especially good, because it quotes a number of other Jewish groups that have condemned the rabbi:


Today leaders of the Conference of Presidents of Major American Jewish Organizations had this to say: “We are disturbed by the reported comments of Rabbi Ovadia Yosef. We share the concern of the government of Israel, which disassociated itself from, and expressed deep dismay at the remarks. Our tradition teaches that we must be careful with our words. This is particularly true for leaders, all the more so at this sensitive time when direct negotiations are being launched.”

The Conference could have taken the politically easy route and added something about Palestinian incitement being much more prevalant, which would have been true – but it would also have diminished the power of the statement, reducing it to just one more “who's the worst offender” Middle East argument.

As I reported in updates yesterday, the Reform movement and J Street both responded fairly quickly with strong statements.

ADL leader Abe Foxman, who continues to take hits for his involvement in the New York Islamic Center controversy, said “We are outraged by the offensive and incendiary comments made by Rav Ovadia Yosef. Particularly on the eve of renewed peace talks, and on the eve of the Jewish New Year, one would have hoped that Rav Yosef could have inspired his students and followers with a message of hope, humility, repentance and forgiveness.”

Rabbi David Saperstein, director of the Religious Action Center of Reform Judaism, called Yosef's comments “morally reprehensible. We utterly reject such sentiments as anathema to Jewish values and the beliefs of the Jewish people. Sadly, this is far from the first time that Rabbi Yosef has engaged in the most outrageous types of hate speech.”

And J Street's Hadar Susskind said “Just as we have consistently called for an need to end incitement on the Palestinian side, so too we call for Israeli leaders and public figures to be held to those same rightly high standards."

I don't see them. I don't know what you are talking about. If most Jewish people do not agree with what this Rabbi is saying then why havn't I heard them denounce it? Why Have I Not Heard Them Denounce it?:

It's a simple question. Until I personally hear the majority of Jewish people denounce it I won't accept any of these apologetics.

It's up to the Jewish community to speak out against extremists like this (who isn't just some lone nut but actually a high-ranking member of the Jewish community).

I am Jewish, I will take this opportunity to state that I do not condone these comments and consider Rabbi Ovadia Josef to be wrong on this and a host of other issues and I condemn him in the strongest possible terms.


Where are they? I don't see them!

That's because you are willfully avoiding looking. I've given you plenty of links, not that I expect you to bother with them. Your response to being refuted is to run and start another thread. But, since you want to play moral equivalence, let's compare and contrast the reactions to this statement by Rabbi Josef and, say, the FT Hood shootings by a radical Muslim and a treasonous army officer, MAJ Nidal Hasan:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W5BtQgTGOI4&feature=related
Have you picked up the difference yet?


That good enough for you? What am I saying? Of course it isn't. Nothing is. You are impervious to facts.

JB
10-21-2010, 04:29 PM
Poor wee-wee. Trying so hard to be an Islamist apologist.

And then pwned by Ody. I guess we won't see him in this thread again.

Odysseus
10-21-2010, 05:38 PM
Poor wee-wee. Trying so hard to be an Islamist apologist.

And then pwned by Ody. I guess we won't see him in this thread again.

Of course not. He'll just wait until the subject can be brought up in another thread and then pretend that my response never happened.

Rockntractor
10-21-2010, 06:52 PM
Of course not. He'll just wait until the subject can be brought up in another thread and then pretend that my response never happened.

That is exactly what he does, when he is beaten in a debate he just drops the thread and waits a few days, he then posts it again like it has never been argued. He complains when we call him on it saying it's not fair.
CU is turning into his play ground.

I still am curious what his DU name is.