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namvet
02-22-2011, 10:00 AM
got an email from ABC news. but its not front page yet. I did however find it here. how will Obama respond???

Report: 4 Americans on Yacht Hijacked by Somali Pirates Killed


OMAN (KTLA) -- The four Americans being held hostage on their yacht by pirates off the coast of Somali have been killed, a U.S. defense official tells CNN.

On Friday, a distress signal was sent by a yacht -- named the Quest -- from the middle of the Indian Ocean.

The boat was headed toward the Somali coast, and was being trailed by a U.S. Navy warship and helicopters.

Gunshots were heard aboard the yacht, and the Navy responded. All four Americans aboard were dead, apparently killed by their hijackers.

CBS News reports there were more than a dozen pirates on board. Some of them were killed and others were captured.

The yacht belonged to a couple from Orange County, Scott and Jean Adam. Two other Americans -- Phylis Macay and Bob Riggle -- were also aboard the boat with the Adams.

The Adam's were traveling with a group called Blue Water Rally, a sailing group that travels together through a dangerous section of the Indian Ocean.

According to the group, the Adam's broke off from the group just days before their yacht -- the S/V Quest -- was hijacked.

The Adam's were traveling the world delivering Bibles to schools and churches. They started their world tour in 2004.

Friends said they were experienced boaters and belonged to the Del Rey Yacht Club, in Marina Del Rey.

Fellow boaters said the couple was aware of the danger from pirates in the area, but were determined to make the journey themselves rather than shipping their boat.

source (http://www.ktla.com/news/landing/ktla-oc-yacht-couple-hijacked-somali-pirates,0,4704165.story)

linda22003
02-22-2011, 11:06 AM
That's a shame, but they should have had the basic intelligence to avoid the Gulf of Aden. :(

namvet
02-22-2011, 11:10 AM
no way im going in there. unless im armed to the teeth

ironhorsedriver
02-22-2011, 02:40 PM
I guess my question to our Commander in Chief is, Why are these thugs still breathing air?

linda22003
02-22-2011, 02:44 PM
I guess my question to our Commander in Chief is, Why are these thugs still breathing air?

"US Central Command said four Navy warships were deployed in an effort to secure the Americans' release, and "negotiations were ongoing" when the shooting occurred at 1 a.m. today. Upon hearing gunfire, US forces boarded the Quest and confronted the pirates, capturing 13 and killing two."

- from today's Christian Science Monitor.
http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Africa/2011/0222/Why-did-Somali-pirates-kill-four-American-yachters

Novaheart
02-22-2011, 02:48 PM
I guess my question to our Commander in Chief is, Why are these thugs still breathing air?

We keep getting told that this expanse of water is too large to effectively clear.

I find that difficult to believe that with the combined navies of the world's major powers they can't just go down to the dump and shoot the rats.

Odysseus
02-22-2011, 03:00 PM
Sounds like we need to get back to basics, and by basics, I mean Barbary Pirates basics. A punitive expedition to Somalia for the sole purpose of punishing the pirates' base of operations would do a world of good in discouraging attacks on Americans.

Stephen Decatur, where are you?

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/a/a2/Burning_of_the_uss_philadelphia.jpg

linda22003
02-22-2011, 03:03 PM
Sounds like we need to get back to basics, and by basics, I mean Barbary Pirates basics. A punitive expedition to Somalia for the sole purpose of punishing the pirates' base of operations would do a world of good in discouraging attacks on Americans.

Stephen Decatur, where are you?


Shot to death in a duel.

Odysseus
02-22-2011, 03:24 PM
Shot to death in a duel.

Don't be so danged literal. :p

I wonder how many of the current administration even know who he was...

linda22003
02-22-2011, 03:51 PM
Don't be so danged literal. :p

I wonder how many of the current administration even know who he was...

He's a neighbor, right there on Lafayette Square. :)

Articulate_Ape
02-22-2011, 04:20 PM
Time to bring back letters of marque.

Zathras
02-22-2011, 07:29 PM
Time to bring back letters of marque.

Or make the waters off Somalia a free fire zone and let the merchant ships arm themselves with lethal force.

ironhorsedriver
02-22-2011, 07:56 PM
Not going to happen, especially since the UN got involved with what it calls, "The Laws of the Sea". They have wanted to ban firearms, of any kind, from civilian flagged carriers. They seem to think that includes the pirates, if they got this passed they would all lay down their RPGs and their AK's. Go figure.

namvet
02-22-2011, 08:02 PM
a pre emptive strike against Somalia would slam the point home. ain't gonna happen with Osama. he'll push this one off on the next prez. there has been no comment from him today at all. I doubt he'll even attend the funnerals.

Zathras
02-22-2011, 08:28 PM
Not going to happen, especially since the UN got involved with what it calls, "The Laws of the Sea". They have wanted to ban firearms, of any kind, from civilian flagged carriers. They seem to think that includes the pirates, if they got this passed they would all lay down their RPGs and their AK's. Go figure.

Too bad there isn't one civilian flagged carrier (or more) that will tell the UN to go fuck themselves and arm their ships for self protection. The only "law of the sea" regarding pirates is to shoot first and aim for center mass.

Novaheart
02-22-2011, 08:30 PM
a pre emptive strike against Somalia would slam the point home. ain't gonna happen with Osama. he'll push this one off on the next prez. there has been no comment from him today at all. I doubt he'll even attend the funnerals.

From what I have read "sending a message" to Somalia would be like shooting a jellyfish, the only effective thing to do is killed the entire organism.

Kay
02-22-2011, 09:37 PM
Sounds like we need to get back to basics, and by basics, I mean Barbary Pirates basics. A punitive expedition to Somalia for the sole purpose of punishing the pirates' base of operations would do a world of good in discouraging attacks on Americans.

Stephen Decatur, where are you?

Funny you mention this...just this evening I was watching the news about Libya and all that's going on there. They were showing the map and saying Qaddafi says he is still in the capitol of Libya, which is of course, Tripoli. So I was humming to myself "to the shores of Tripoli....." and thinking in light of the pirates and the terrors of Qaddafi, what we need over there is Lt. Presley O'Bannon.

For those who don't know the stories of Stephen Decatur or Lt. O'Bannon it is some good reading:

http://www.marines.com/main/index/winning_battles/history/missions/battle_of_derna

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Tripoli_Harbor



I wonder how many of the current administration even know who he was...

I doubt any of them.

MountainMan
02-22-2011, 09:56 PM
I'm sorry the four American civilians died but you know what, when you are too stupid or arrogant and leave the relative safety of the sailing group you are with and go off on your own, you end up paying the price.

There was no reason for this to happen.

Kay
02-22-2011, 10:19 PM
Exactly right. They sailed right into it on their own knowing the risk.

Kay
02-22-2011, 10:56 PM
Upon hearing gunfire, US forces boarded the Quest and confronted the pirates, capturing 13 and killing two."

This makes me irritated that they killed 2 and captured 13. In this situation it is not like you can extract valuable information out of the captured pirates like you would POWs. They serve no useful purpose to mankind and I would like to have read that we "confronted the pirates killing all 15". There should be a no-quarter policy towards pirates caught in the act.

Odysseus
02-23-2011, 10:02 AM
Not going to happen, especially since the UN got involved with what it calls, "The Laws of the Sea". They have wanted to ban firearms, of any kind, from civilian flagged carriers. They seem to think that includes the pirates, if they got this passed they would all lay down their RPGs and their AK's. Go figure.
Perhaps if a few UN bureaucrats sailed up to the Somali coast with some guitars and sang a chorus of Kumbaya...?

a pre emptive strike against Somalia would slam the point home. ain't gonna happen with Osama. he'll push this one off on the next prez. there has been no comment from him today at all. I doubt he'll even attend the funnerals.
Of course not. Those people weren't in his social circle. They were giving out Bibles, which makes them religious extremists in his view. I'm sure that he'll apologize to the pirates, though.

Too bad there isn't one civilian flagged carrier (or more) that will tell the UN to go fuck themselves and arm their ships for self protection. The only "law of the sea" regarding pirates is to shoot first and aim for center mass.
Or drumhead court and hanging.

From what I have read "sending a message" to Somalia would be like shooting a jellyfish, the only effective thing to do is killed the entire organism.
Yes, but there are ways and there are ways. See below.

I'm sorry the four American civilians died but you know what, when you are too stupid or arrogant and leave the relative safety of the sailing group you are with and go off on your own, you end up paying the price.

There was no reason for this to happen.
Yes and no. They were taking a risk, but the fact is that American citizens should be secure in international waters. Our failure to enforce the security of our citizens (not just in this case, but also the hikers taken by Iran, the CIA officer being illegally held in Pakistan, the border patrol agents killed in Mexico, etc.) has sent a message that it is open season on Americans. After the Barbary Pirate Wars, the pirates kept clear of our shipping because they understood the consequences.

This makes me irritated that they killed 2 and captured 13. In this situation it is not like you can extract valuable information out of the captured pirates like you would POWs. They serve no useful purpose to mankind and I would like to have read that we "confronted the pirates killing all 15". There should be a no-quarter policy towards pirates caught in the act.

Agreed, but as I said above, there are ways and there are ways. First, the capture pirates should have been questioned and their port of origin identified. Then, the fleet should have hit that port, secured it, and held the pirates' trial in full view of the locals. Upon conviction, hang them then and there. Let their families, clans and tribes see them dangle and then, after they've been cut down, burn the town. Leave the locals with nothing but the memory of what happens when you kill Americans. Word will get out.

Rockntractor
02-23-2011, 10:05 AM
Agreed, but as I said above, there are ways and there are ways. First, the capture pirates should have been questioned and their port of origin identified. Then, the fleet should have hit that port, secured it, and held the pirates' trial in full view of the locals. Upon conviction, hang them then and there. Let their families, clans and tribes see them dangle and then, after they've been cut down, burn the town. Leave the locals with nothing but the memory of what happens when you kill Americans. Word will get out.

All of the above but I would take their most beautiful young virgins too, just sayin'

Madisonian
02-23-2011, 10:08 AM
All of the above but I would take their most beautiful young virgins too, just sayin'

Unless you are taking 9 year olds, there probably aren't any available.

Odysseus
02-23-2011, 10:28 AM
All of the above but I would take their most beautiful young virgins too, just sayin'


Unless you are taking 9 year olds, there probably aren't any available.

Hell, let's take all of their kids. Muslims aren't the only ones who can recruit janissaries.

Kay
02-23-2011, 02:06 PM
Agreed, but as I said above, there are ways and there are ways. First, the capture pirates should have been questioned and their port of origin identified. Then, the fleet should have hit that port, secured it, and held the pirates' trial in full view of the locals. Upon conviction, hang them then and there. Let their families, clans and tribes see them dangle and then, after they've been cut down, burn the town. Leave the locals with nothing but the memory of what happens when you kill Americans. Word will get out.

Righteous plan. :cool:

Madisonian
02-23-2011, 02:31 PM
Don't Naval vessels usually dump their human waste at sea?
Somali pirates, human excrement, one could easily be confused between the 2.

Odysseus
02-23-2011, 02:44 PM
Don't Naval vessels usually dump their human waste at sea?
Somali pirates, human excrement, one could easily be confused between the 2.

Obama believes in outreach, so let's make each pirate our "chum".

noonwitch
02-23-2011, 03:49 PM
I heard that the 4 americans were missionaries, and that they were bringing Bibles around the world, to places that were difficult to reach.

Not that I think that was why the pirates killed them, at least not the direct reason. The fact that they had Bibles instead of money or saleable goods may be part of it, but it's more because the pirate who we have in custody for the attack a while back got a life sentence. The pirates allegedly now have stated that any rescue attempt of hostages will now be met with dead bodies.

Odysseus
02-23-2011, 03:55 PM
I heard that the 4 americans were missionaries, and that they were bringing Bibles around the world, to places that were difficult to reach.

Not that I think that was why the pirates killed them, at least not the direct reason. The fact that they had Bibles instead of money or saleable goods may be part of it, but it's more because the pirate who we have in custody for the attack a while back got a life sentence. The pirates allegedly now have stated that any rescue attempt of hostages will now be met with dead bodies.

The Bibles marked them as Christians, which was one strike against them. They didn't have any ransom value, so that was strike two.

If the pirates have stated that they will kill hostages in the event of any rescue attempt, then the hostages are KIA in all but name. Hostage rescuers should assume that they will only survive if all pirates are killed, and act accordingly. If the pirates don't like life sentences, then hang the vermin in front of their clans and tribes.

Madisonian
02-23-2011, 05:40 PM
If they want to act like middle age pirates, they should be treated and executed like middle age pirates.

From Wiki

In the cases of more famous prisoners, usually captains their punishments extended beyond death. Their bodies were enclosed in iron cages (for which they were measured before their execution) and left to swing in the air until the flesh rotted off them- a process that could take as long as two years. The bodies of captains such as William Kidd, Charles Vane, William Fly, and Jack Rackham were all treated this way.

Then burn the village.

Odysseus
02-23-2011, 06:13 PM
If they want to act like middle age pirates, they should be treated and executed like middle age pirates.

From Wiki


Then burn the village.

Hang them first, then burn the villages. The rotting thing can take two years, which is too long to wait for the village to burn.

noonwitch
02-24-2011, 11:26 AM
The Bibles marked them as Christians, which was one strike against them. They didn't have any ransom value, so that was strike two.

If the pirates have stated that they will kill hostages in the event of any rescue attempt, then the hostages are KIA in all but name. Hostage rescuers should assume that they will only survive if all pirates are killed, and act accordingly. If the pirates don't like life sentences, then hang the vermin in front of their clans and tribes.



You know, the ironic thing about it all is that the pirate who got the life sentence will enjoy a much higher standard of living in a US federal prison than as a Somali pirate.

South Park re-ran the Somali pirate episode last night.