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View Full Version : Should U.S. Forces Be Used to Create a No-Fly Zone Over Libya?



djones520
03-13-2011, 12:59 AM
As Muammar al-Qaddafi's regime shows growing confidence after retaking a strategic town near Tripoli following days of relentless shelling against rebels, Arab foreign ministers meet in Egypt to discuss a no-fly zone over Libya. Do you think America's military should be used to help create a no-fly zone over Libya?

Should U.S. Forces Be Used to Create a No-Fly Zone Over Libya?
Maybe -- I'm concerned about Americans being put in harm's way, and of another Middle East conflict. 7.21% (2,332 votes)


Yes -- It's important to limit Qaddafi's military options, and give the opposition a fighting chance. 30.05% (9,718 votes)


No -- This would be one step short of war, something we don't need right now. 59.93% (19,380 votes)


Other (post a comment) 2.81% (908 votes)

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2011/03/12/forces-used-create-fly-zone-libya/

I voted Other. I would like to see some of the Arab countries step up to the plate and enforce this. Egypt and Saudi Arabia both have modern Air Forces. I would not be against helping, as long as we were not the main ones providing.

lacarnut
03-13-2011, 01:13 AM
Not no, but hell no. The rebels are a rag tag bunch that do not stand a chance. They are getting their ass kicked badly and a no fly zone would do no good. An Army General that appeared on Fox said it is all over, and that the rebels are retreating like rats and will hightailing it to Egypt within a week. Government forces have won.

megimoo
03-13-2011, 01:15 AM
Not no, but hell no. The rebels are a rag tag bunch that do not stand a chance. They are getting their ass kicked badly and a no fly zone would do no good. An Army General that appeared on Fox said it is all over, and that the rebels are retreating like rats and will hightailing it to Egypt within a week. Government forces have won.
Let someone else do it for a change.We have enough on our plate with this half witted critter in the White House.

lacarnut
03-13-2011, 01:17 AM
Let someone else do it for a change.We have enough on our plate with this half witted critter in the White House.

For sure. He would f...it up and needlessly get some of our boys killed.

Rockntractor
03-13-2011, 01:20 AM
Make sure it all stays within Libya's borders and that both sides have plenty of small arms ammunition.

lacarnut
03-13-2011, 01:33 AM
Make sure it all stays within Libya's borders and that both sides have plenty of small arms ammunition.

Government jets, tanks and ships firing at rebels have overwhelmed them. The rebels have no organization or control centers. They are toast. Boy, did the administration, media and the pundits get it totally wrong. Made Obama and Hillary look like fools.

djones520
03-13-2011, 01:36 AM
Government jets, tanks and ships firing at rebels have overwhelmed them. The rebels have no organization or control centers. They are toast. Boy, did the administration, media and the pundits get it totally wrong. Made Obama and Hillary look like fools.

Latest news I'm reading today says that the Rebels are developing a centralized governing body. The eastern part of the country is still firmly in their hands, and they are receiving training from Army units that have defected.

I wouldn't say the fight is done yet. A No-Fly Zone would be a great morale boost for the rebels.

Rockntractor
03-13-2011, 01:38 AM
Government jets, tanks and ships firing at rebels have overwhelmed them. The rebels have no organization or control centers. They are toast. Boy, did the administration, media and the pundits get it totally wrong. Made Obama and Hillary look like fools.

So we will be stuck with the devil we know.
This will mean they won't be quite so bold in Saudi Arabia.

megimoo
03-13-2011, 01:53 AM
Government jets, tanks and ships firing at rebels have overwhelmed them. The rebels have no organization or control centers. They are toast. Boy, did the administration, media and the pundits get it totally wrong. Made Obama and Hillary look like fools.Hillary and Obama are in way over their heads.How do you think these Arab leaders feel when they have to sit next to an old lady from America too ugly for their harems and hold their hand out ?
Hillary's idea of Sec State is the Madeleine Albright school of diplomacy .Kiss the Arab Ass and hand him a bunch of our money .

lacarnut
03-13-2011, 01:54 AM
Latest news I'm reading today says that the Rebels are developing a centralized governing body. The eastern part of the country is still firmly in their hands, and they are receiving training from Army units that have defected.

I wouldn't say the fight is done yet. A No-Fly Zone would be a great morale boost for the rebels.

Let's stay out of it. We only get around 15% of our oil from the M.E. Much of the oil produced in that neck of the woods goes to Europe. Let them defend their own self interests for a change.

I am still laughing at your statement that the rebels are receiving training from Army soldiers that have defected. Shit, if they are that good we need them to train Afghans. Lets pay them; then we can bring all of our troops home.

djones520
03-13-2011, 02:05 AM
Let's stay out of it. We only get around 15% of our oil from the M.E. Much of the oil produced in that neck of the woods goes to Europe. Let them defend their own self interests for a change.

I am still laughing at your statement that the rebels are receiving training from Army soldiers that have defected. Shit, if they are that good we need them to train Afghans. Lets pay them; then we can bring all of our troops home.

Doesn't matter if their good or not compaired to us. They have the same training as the forces loyal to Qaddafi, so that will give them an edge.

lacarnut
03-13-2011, 02:07 AM
Hillary and Obama are in way over their heads.How do you think these Arab leaders feel when they have to sit next to an old lady from America too ugly for their harems and hold their hand out ?
Hillary's idea of Sec State is the Madeleine Albright school of diplomacy .Kiss the Arab Ass and hand him a bunch of our money .

Since Arabs have little regard for women, why in the world would you send a woman to negotiate with these heathens. That is just illogical, and the truth of the matter is they think we are weak by doing so. I am not bashing women; that is just their mindset and they do not respect American women. Period.

lacarnut
03-13-2011, 02:12 AM
Doesn't matter if their good or not compaired to us. They have the same training as the forces loyal to Qaddafi, so that will give them an edge.

Dream on. The rebels are getting their ass kicked. Small armament against tanks, planes and ships is no match for this rag tag outfit.

noonwitch
03-14-2011, 07:29 AM
We should not get involved unless it is a NATO move. I can see why european nations in the Med area might want a no fly zone enforced, and if so, they have the ability to do so with minimal american involvement.

Bailey
03-14-2011, 10:03 AM
I'm sick and tired of out boys dying for the savages in the ME, if the countries around libya dont like whats going in that country let them deal with it.

Adam Wood
03-14-2011, 10:20 AM
Hell no. We definitely don't need some sort of long-term entanglement like that for ... what?

Does anyone know who these rebels are? Where they came from? What their motivation is? What their end game is? Who's backing them? Who's agitating them? We sure as hell don't know any of that. None of our intel (at least that's been shared publicly) tells us anything about these characters. All we know is that they're mad, not afraid to kill people, and want to be in charge of a north African country currently ruled by an iron-fisted dictator, but they could just as easily replace one iron-fisted ruler for another.


Qaddafi is a shithead, but we don't have a damn clue who these other folks are. Unless and until we know for certain that they are out for a Western-style democracy, we need to stay out of it. Make some platitudes from the bully pulpit of the Presidency and the State Department? Sure. Work some back-channel diplomacy to find out what's going on and hopefully bring a swift end to the bloodshed? Absolutely. Commit our men and matériel to a fight about which we have no idea? No fucking way.

fettpett
03-14-2011, 11:27 AM
they are asking the US because they are cowards and don't want to do it themselves and they want something else to blame the US for.

On top of that, we're the only one with teeth enough to do anything about it....


that is if we didn't have a wennie for a Pres.

noonwitch
03-14-2011, 11:47 AM
they are asking the US because they are cowards and don't want to do it themselves and they want something else to blame the US for.

On top of that, we're the only one with teeth enough to do anything about it....


that is if we didn't have a wennie for a Pres.


The euro countries that I see that are most threatened are France, Spain and Italy. They could probably get something going, they just want the US to send aircraft carriers, which are likely superior to anything any of those three countries has at their disposal.

We already are in Iraq, Afganistan, and we need to have some ships in the Pacific to assist with relief efforts to Japan.

fettpett
03-14-2011, 01:21 PM
The euro countries that I see that are most threatened are France, Spain and Italy. They could probably get something going, they just want the US to send aircraft carriers, which are likely superior to anything any of those three countries has at their disposal.

We already are in Iraq, Afganistan, and we need to have some ships in the Pacific to assist with relief efforts to Japan.

yeah, but do we need another thing to do? particularly in a Country that they don't like us to much? All three of those countries have operational Aircraft Carriers (French having the biggest AC) and can easily enforce a No-Fly Zone

lacarnut
03-14-2011, 01:37 PM
yeah, but do we need another thing to do? particularly in a Country that they don't like us to much? All three of those countries have operational Aircraft Carriers (French having the biggest AC) and can easily enforce a No-Fly Zone

I think that we should start charging for the blood, guts and billions we that we have spend in these god forsaken countries. Let the Europeans and the camel jockeys pay up. We have too much on our plate now to get involved in another shit hole country. Plus, we are going broke.

noonwitch
03-14-2011, 01:44 PM
yeah, but do we need another thing to do? particularly in a Country that they don't like us to much? All three of those countries have operational Aircraft Carriers (French having the biggest AC) and can easily enforce a No-Fly Zone



I totally agree, I'm just saying that the french and others don't have anything as good as our carriers.


I think it's time for the euro-weenies to swallow their pride, and ally with Israel on this one. The Israelis usually have the best intel on middle east situations, and they have a strong military.

Chuck58
03-14-2011, 02:32 PM
For a change, we ought to keep our noses out of it. Anyway, by the time The One, or Dear Leader if you prefer, decides to do anything it will all be over.

If the Europeans are so concerned, let the EU do something. France could send in the Legion and fix the problem in a week. It only took a few hundred Legionnaires to run the Libyan army out of Chad a couple of decades ago.

This isn't our problem. Let Europe or the Arab League deal with it. Just once, I'd like to see America not offer to be the world's policeman.

fettpett
03-14-2011, 03:18 PM
I totally agree, I'm just saying that the french and others don't have anything as good as our carriers.


I think it's time for the euro-weenies to swallow their pride, and ally with Israel on this one. The Israelis usually have the best intel on middle east situations, and they have a strong military.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Charles_de_Gaulle_(R_91)

you are right, the Europeans don't know how to build large warships anymore, the de Gaulle was the first large warship built in Europe since 1951.

lacarnut
03-14-2011, 04:13 PM
For a change, we ought to keep our noses out of it. Anyway, by the time The One, or Dear Leader if you prefer, decides to do anything it will all be over.

If the Europeans are so concerned, let the EU do something. France could send in the Legion and fix the problem in a week. It only took a few hundred Legionnaires to run the Libyan army out of Chad a couple of decades ago.

This isn't our problem. Let Europe or the Arab League deal with it. Just once, I'd like to see America not offer to be the world's policeman.

We need to address our own problems here at home. The Arabs are so appreciative of our help in Iraq and Afghanistan that 95% of the oil leases that they let out recently went to countries other than the US.:mad: Majors like Exxon and Chevron did not bid because the profit margins are slim and in some cases the companies will be lucky if they break even. Their compensation is based on production rather than price and is as low as a few bucks a barrel. This is the kind of thanks we get.

Rockntractor
03-14-2011, 04:29 PM
If the rebels win in Libya it will embolden the ones in Saudi and Kuwait.
The rebels did just as much dancing and partying as the current government in Libya did when they returned the murderous bastard responsible for the Pan Am Flight 103 crash. I feel sorry for none of them.

Odysseus
03-14-2011, 06:21 PM
We gain nothing by either side winning. The rebels are primitives who make the DUmpsters look rational. Qaddafi is a thug who has murdered Americans. If Qaddafi cuts and runs, we should hunt him down and kill him for Lockerbie. If he wins, we should napalm his victory speech and barbecue his family along with him. Either way, our first act after a new government is formed should be to demand that Abdelbaset al-Megrahi be turned over to the US. Failure to do so will result in our declaration of Libya as a np-breathe zone, followed by strict enforcement. We can do that without endangering any of our people.

Calypso Jones
03-14-2011, 06:41 PM
I've lost track of this with the Japanese catastrophe. And first i've seen this topic. The Rebels. Are they Al Qaeda backed? Are they even Libyans?

Rockntractor
03-14-2011, 06:43 PM
I've lost track of this with the Japanese catastrophe. And first i've seen this topic. The Rebels. Are they Al Qaeda backed? Are they even Libyans?

They are Libyans, just more people that hate us but want our help.

lacarnut
03-14-2011, 08:59 PM
We gain nothing by either side winning. The rebels are primitives who make the DUmpsters look rational. Qaddafi is a thug who has murdered Americans. If Qaddafi cuts and runs, we should hunt him down and kill him for Lockerbie. If he wins, we should napalm his victory speech and barbecue his family along with him. Either way, our first act after a new government is formed should be to demand that Abdelbaset al-Megrahi be turned over to the US. Failure to do so will result in our declaration of Libya as a np-breathe zone, followed by strict enforcement. We can do that without endangering any of our people.

True. Using political/military capital to sway one side or the other side is a no win proposition. Just let these heathens kill each-other. The more the better.

Adam Wood
03-14-2011, 09:00 PM
I've lost track of this with the Japanese catastrophe. And first i've seen this topic. The Rebels. Are they Al Qaeda backed? Are they even Libyans?Nobody really knows. That's a great big festering sore of a problem.

Qaddafi claims that they're al-Qaeda, and maybe he's right, but he's not the most trustworthy of folks out there. They haven't really said anything about what they want other than Qaddafi out. It could very well be a case of Stalin overthrowing Castro, which is why we need to have nothing to do with it from a physical, tactile sense.

Odysseus
03-15-2011, 11:58 PM
I've lost track of this with the Japanese catastrophe. And first i've seen this topic. The Rebels. Are they Al Qaeda backed? Are they even Libyans?
They're Libyans. Probably have some al Qaeda support, along with the Muslim Brotherhood (remember that their spiritual leader demanded Qaddafi's murder).

True. Using political/military capital to sway one side or the other side is a no win proposition. Just let these heathens kill each-other. The more the better.

I'm truly amazed that Obama was able, very quickly, to manage to make himself look even more ineffectual than I thought possible, by demanding that Qaddafi lay off his people, then talking about a no-fly zone without actually moving any of our assets into the necessary positions from which to enforce one. He's managed to demonstrate that a petty dictator whose air force consists of aging Soviet-era crap is beyond our capacity to decisively engage.

fettpett
03-16-2011, 08:30 AM
He's managed to demonstrate that a petty dictator whose air force consists of aging Soviet-era crap is beyond our capacity to decisively engage.

man, one of our Refueling tankers could take out their "Air Force"

namvet
03-16-2011, 08:48 AM
I say no. if they challenge us then we have to kill their pilots and troops. we'll get the blame for killing ragheads and starting a war with another country. let someone else be the world cop for a change.

yankee stay home