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megimoo
05-25-2011, 10:59 PM
The Police State Is Personal....Does America now qualify as a police state? And, if so, where do you or will you personally draw a hard line and say, "No! That is a law or a police order I refuse to obey"?

As an anarchist, I view all states as police states, because every law is ultimately backed by police force against the body or property of a scofflaw, however peaceful he may be. I see only a difference of degree, not of kind. But even small differences in the degree of repression can be matters of life or death, and so they should not be trivialized.

A police state is more commonly described as a totalitarian government that exerts extreme social, political, and economic control. It maintains this control by a pervasive surveillance of its own citizenry, by draconian law enforcement, and by granting or withholding "privileges" such the ability to travel. Typically, there is a special police force, such as a Stasi, that operates with no transparency and few restraints. Unlike traditional policemen, who respond to crime, the purpose of such state police is to monitor and control society.

Let me restate my opening question: does America now embody this common description of a police state?

Clearly it does.
The American government exerts extreme control over society, down to dictating which foods you may eat. Its economic control borders on the absolute. It politicizes and presides over even the traditional bastion of privacy the family. Camera and other surveillance of daily life has soared, with the Supreme Court recently expanding the "right" of police to perform warrantless searches.

Enforcement is so draconian that the United States has more prisoners per capita than any other nation; and over the last few years, the police have been self-consciously militarizing their procedures and attitudes.

Travel, formerly a right, is now a privilege granted by government agents at their whim. Several huge and tyrannical law-enforcement agencies monitor peaceful behavior rather than respond to crime.

These agencies operate largely outside the restrictions of the Constitution; for example, the TSA conducts arbitrary searches in violation of Fourth Amendment guarantees.

http://mises.org/daily/5317/The-Police-State-Is-Personal

Rockntractor
05-25-2011, 11:07 PM
Soft tyranny.

ABC in Georgia
05-26-2011, 12:09 AM
Police state?

No, not at the moment. Will see what happens if Obama should be re-elected, however, and is given full reign, with no fear of the consequences of his actions.

He and his corrupt minions have no respect for the rule of law now and heaven help us, if he wins a second term.

My husband and I left Canada and became citizens of the USA, 31 years ago, for the freedom afforded to us in this once wonderful country.

If he is allowed to continue on in his, I believe,*intentional* way ... I fear not only for this country, but for the future freedom of the whole western world.

Big sounding words, I know, coming from me, but Dear God, this man scares me. I do believe he is a puppet backed by big-time anti-capitalists bent on destroying the USA.

~ ABC

Novaheart
05-26-2011, 12:29 AM
Police state?

No, not at the moment. Will see what happens if Obama should be re-elected, however, and is given full reign, with no fear of the consequences of his actions.

He and his corrupt minions have no respect for the rule of law now and heaven help us, if he wins a second term.

My husband and I left Canada and became "nationalized citizens" of the USA, 31 years ago for the freedom afforded to us in this once wonderful country.

If he is allowed to continue on in his, I believe,*intentional* way ... I fear not only for this country, but for the future freedom of the whole western world.

Big sounding words, I know, coming from me, but Dear God, this man scares me. I do believe he is a puppet backed by big-time anti-capitalists bent on destroying the USA.

~ ABC

Michigan Dept. of State Police v. Sitz

DUI checkpoints (Violation of the Fourth Amendment) were approved by four Reagan

and one Kennedy appointee to the USSC.



I know it's fun to hate Obama, but what do you think he has done to erode your civil rights?

Rockntractor
05-26-2011, 12:33 AM
Michigan Dept. of State Police v. Sitz

DUI checkpoints (Violation of the Fourth Amendment) were approved by four Reagan

and one Kennedy appointee to the USSC.



I know it's fun to hate Obama, but what do you think he has done to erode your civil rights?

Curtailing your drunk driving has not made you less free, it has made us safer.

ABC in Georgia
05-26-2011, 12:37 AM
Novaheart ...

Nothing at the moment.

It is the future I fear under this man. Thankfully, so far our lives have not changed.

And no, I do not hate him. I find him completely beneath contempt. :D

~ ABC

Novaheart
05-26-2011, 01:07 AM
Curtailing your drunk driving has not made you less free, it has made us safer.

So would a house to house search for illegal weapons and wanted criminals.

marv
05-26-2011, 02:16 AM
Just today....
US to store passenger data for 15 years (http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/25/us-to-store-passenger-data)

TSA officials had warned [Texas lawmaker] passing the bill "could close down all the airports in Texas" (http://www.infowars.com/financial-terrorism-tsa-holds-texas-flights-hostage/)

Obama: We're Working on Gun Control 'Under the Radar' (http://nation.foxnews.com/guns/2011/05/25/obama-were-working-gun-control-under-radar)

Obama skirts rule of law to reward pals, punish foes (http://washingtonexaminer.com/politics/2011/05/obama-skirts-rule-law-reward-pals-punish-foes)

USDA fines Missouri family $90k for selling rabbits without license (http://news.yahoo.com/s/dailycaller/20110524/pl_dailycaller/usdafinesmissourifamily90kforsellingafewrabbitswit houtalicense)

I'm a long, long way from being an anarchist, but yes, I believe that our country is evolving into a police state.

noonwitch
05-26-2011, 01:19 PM
There were no government agents preventing me from getting a Filet o Fish on Friday at the Okemos McDonalds. Maybe if I was still morbidly obese, they would have sprung out to stop me?

pyackog
05-26-2011, 03:22 PM
As time has passed, we have lost freedoms regardless of who has been in office. The fact though that we can debate this subject on a public message board pretty much says that we are not living in a police state.

At least not yet.

megimoo
05-26-2011, 05:54 PM
As time has passed, we have lost freedoms regardless of who has been in office. The fact though that we can debate this subject on a public message board pretty much says that we are not living in a police state.

At least not yet.

White house adds new Czar titled Director of Progressive Media & Online Response

Do not post any negative info on THE ONE online or else...

http://www.mediabistro.com/fishbowlny/white-house-dedicates-new-position-to-deal-with-unfavorable-online-media_b36292

FlaGator
05-26-2011, 05:58 PM
Michigan Dept. of State Police v. Sitz

DUI checkpoints (Violation of the Fourth Amendment) were approved by four Reagan

and one Kennedy appointee to the USSC.



I know it's fun to hate Obama, but what do you think he has done to erode your civil rights?

The SCOTUS has ruled that DUI checkpoints aren't a violation of the 4th Amendment because driving is a regulated and licensed activity.

FlaGator
05-26-2011, 06:02 PM
As time has passed, we have lost freedoms regardless of who has been in office. The fact though that we can debate this subject on a public message board pretty much says that we are not living in a police state.

At least not yet.

Freedom is such a subjective thing.

Rockntractor
05-26-2011, 06:03 PM
So would a house to house search for illegal weapons and wanted criminals.

Not a relevant comparison.

FlaGator
05-26-2011, 06:04 PM
Not a relevant comparison.

I was going to point out that you nor I nor anyone else has to be tested and licensed to prove we can safely live in a house.

Rockntractor
05-26-2011, 06:10 PM
I was going to point out that you nor I nor anyone else has to be tested and licensed to prove we can safely live in a house.

Good point! I should add that I think there are better ways to apprehend drunk drivers but there really is nothing illegal about a road block. They quit doing them here because they were catching too many illegal aliens without drivers licenses.

pyackog
05-26-2011, 08:13 PM
White house adds new Czar titled Director of Progressive Media & Online Response

Do not post any negative info on THE ONE online or else...

http://www.mediabistro.com/fishbowlny/white-house-dedicates-new-position-to-deal-with-unfavorable-online-media_b36292

Ah, he's just going to be a PR guy.

HarryHeart
05-27-2011, 01:38 PM
So far, not yet, but...should Obama get elected again and the Repubs do not take the Senate and keep the House, we are SOL. I've never been so glad to be older in my life.

And of course, the new PR guy is only going to correct the misinformation on Leftist websites. And of course, you can't have the Secret Service go through your house because of an anti-Obama sign you have in your car. Oh wait. That already happened.

megimoo
05-27-2011, 01:48 PM
Ah, he's just going to be a PR guy.
Just watch and pay attention to how many of the 'One's' critics end up on the DHS's no fly list !....These people dont 'fool' around, they'll go after anyone whom they preceive to be the enemy .The White House is a fortress these days with it's own Quasi-Military Organization and the power of the full Federal government behind it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9dvvLzNC3hE

NBC2012
05-30-2011, 06:11 PM
The Police State Is Personal....Does America now qualify as a police state? And, if so, where do you or will you personally draw a hard line and say, "No! That is a law or a police order I refuse to obey"?

As an anarchist, I view all states as police states, because every law is ultimately backed by police force against the body or property of a scofflaw, however peaceful he may be. I see only a difference of degree, not of kind. But even small differences in the degree of repression can be matters of life or death, and so they should not be trivialized.

A police state is more commonly described as a totalitarian government that exerts extreme social, political, and economic control. It maintains this control by a pervasive surveillance of its own citizenry, by draconian law enforcement, and by granting or withholding "privileges" such the ability to travel. Typically, there is a special police force, such as a Stasi, that operates with no transparency and few restraints. Unlike traditional policemen, who respond to crime, the purpose of such state police is to monitor and control society.

Let me restate my opening question: does America now embody this common description of a police state?

Clearly it does.
The American government exerts extreme control over society, down to dictating which foods you may eat. Its economic control borders on the absolute. It politicizes and presides over even the traditional bastion of privacy the family. Camera and other surveillance of daily life has soared, with the Supreme Court recently expanding the "right" of police to perform warrantless searches.

Enforcement is so draconian that the United States has more prisoners per capita than any other nation; and over the last few years, the police have been self-consciously militarizing their procedures and attitudes.

Travel, formerly a right, is now a privilege granted by government agents at their whim. Several huge and tyrannical law-enforcement agencies monitor peaceful behavior rather than respond to crime.

These agencies operate largely outside the restrictions of the Constitution; for example, the TSA conducts arbitrary searches in violation of Fourth Amendment guarantees.

http://mises.org/daily/5317/The-Police-State-Is-Personal

one should not think that the above started in January of 2009 or even in January of 2001.The erosion of constitutional freedom in the USA has been a thing of generations going back to the 1920's in some ways and to the 1860's in others. I am not even sure that all that many Americans really want the Constitution restored per the Founders original intent.

NJCardFan
05-30-2011, 08:11 PM
So would a house to house search for illegal weapons and wanted criminals.

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRCUAhcUudZgNboCIQ9ZGXSQ11p-e0E92Oi7MByXvIpNPAe_WjP&t=1

Not even in the same ballpark. Hell, it's not even the same sport. Houses are private property and per the 4th amendment, a warrant is needed to search same. However, a public road is just that, a public road. A car, while it is your own private property, is driving on these public roads and in order to do such, you are expected to follow the rules. If you violate those rules, you will be penalized. One of the more serious violations is driving while intoxicated/impaired. Setting up check points on weekends or drinking holidays is not a violation of the 4th amendment because you are not being searched in any way. Hell, the most I ever had to do during a sobriety check point is speak to the officer. If speaking to a police officer is a constitutional violation then we have differing views on what a real violation is. Hell, random pat downs at an airport is more of a violation of our Constitutional rights than any sobriety check point.