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Perilloux
06-13-2011, 02:05 PM
Amerigo Vespucci (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-13-11 01:36 PM
Original message
GOP hopeful Herman Cain admits he refused pizza to black neighborhood (http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x1288470)

http://i52.tinypic.com/2ajuixt.jpg

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/06/13/gop-hopeful-herma... /

In a startling admission recently, Republican presidential hopeful Herman Cain, the former CEO of Godfather's Pizza, said that he would apply his experience in business to a potential job in the White House: specifically, his experience in denying pizza deliveries to a black neighborhood in Omaha, Nebraska.

Cain, who is himself black, said that because the neighborhood was violent he refused to send delivery drivers there, and that he'd apply the same logic to his foreign policy decisions.

“When I first became president of Godfather’s Pizza, there was a very dangerous part of town in the black community where I wouldn’t allow my restaurants to deliver because we had kids beat, robbed,” he reportedly said.

"And I said ‘if I won’t send my son over there, I’m not going to send someone else’s son or daughter over there.’ Last week in Omaha, Nebraska, that same neighborhood that I wouldn’t deliver in — that they are delivering in now — a Pizza Hut driver was killed."



Wait for it ....


Liberal_Stalwart71 (1000+ posts)Mon Jun-13-11 01:40 PM
Response to Original message
1. O.K., can we NOW officially call him an Uncle Tom??!?!?! n/t

Edited on Mon Jun-13-11 01:43 PM by Liberal_Stalwart71


There it is, first response.

pyackog
06-13-2011, 02:10 PM
At least some of the DUers are sane about it. I delivered pizzas for Pizza Hut when I was in college. Most of the other delivery guys were black. Most of the neighborhoods we delivered to were black. We stopped delivering to one all black area after the black delivery drivers kept getting robbed. Its the only the thing to do sometimes.

Perilloux
06-13-2011, 02:14 PM
There are more responses now, but I'm on my son's laptop & you would not believe how long it took me to post this OP. Anyone else want to bring over some more responses, feel free.

NJCardFan
06-13-2011, 02:44 PM
I like the knee jerk response instead of trying to find out why.

ralph wiggum
06-13-2011, 03:09 PM
A response to #1:


pipi_k (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-13-11 01:49 PM
Response to Reply #1
3. No.

He didn't deny pizza to the neighborhood because it was black.

He denied delivery to the neighborhood because it was violent. And just happens to be black at the same time.

I don't give a shit what color someone is. Refusing to send one's employees to an area known for violence is the sane thing to do.

You don't get points for "proving" how unracist you are by knowingly putting others' lives in danger.


democrat_patriot (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-13-11 01:44 PM
Response to Original message
2. Why is it wrong to not deliver in a violent area?

If my kid worked for his pizza chain, I'd commend his action not to put my kid in danger.

Black neighborhood - Uncle Tom?
Hispanic/white neighborhood - racist?

Very dangerous neighborhood where pizza delivery people are targeted, robbed, beaten and killed? - ???


tkmorris (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-13-11 02:09 PM
Response to Original message
12. Cain may be a jackass but I don't see a problem here.
A dangerous neighborhood is a dangerous neighborhood, and pizza delivery drivers are notorious targets for thieves. There are easily enough real issues to discredit this man, attempting to create controversy where none exists is not necessary.

Some rare moments of sanity from the DUmmies.


pipi_k (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-13-11 01:53 PM
Response to Reply #2
4. OK, you know what it is?
If it's a black Democrat who refuses to do that, it's perfectly fine.

If it's a black Republican who refuses to do it, it's "racism".


Hypocrisy. Pure and simple...

FDK
06-13-2011, 03:27 PM
Blasphemer (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-13-11 02:10 PM
Response to Original message
13. So instead of usinging his influence to try to improve the quality of life in that area

He simply refused to do business there. Yes, that's a wonderful solution. I understand that delivery drivers are in a job that can put them at risk but there are many ways in which risk can be minimized. I wonder if he ever hired anyone who actually lived in this neighborhood?

Yes, I'm sure delivering pizzas to the area would have lowered the crime rate and greatly improved the quality of life there.

There's a reason why we call them DUmmies.

Odysseus
06-13-2011, 06:53 PM
Blasphemer (1000+ posts) Mon Jun-13-11 02:10 PM
Response to Original message
13. So instead of usinging his influence to try to improve the quality of life in that area

He simply refused to do business there. Yes, that's a wonderful solution. I understand that delivery drivers are in a job that can put them at risk but there are many ways in which risk can be minimized. I wonder if he ever hired anyone who actually lived in this neighborhood?

Ways to mitigate risk for pizza delivery guys and the kneejerk responses that they will entail from DUmmies:


Arm them: "What??? That just perpetuates the evil of guns! What was he thinking, trying to turn Nebraska into the Wild West or something? Gun control makes everybody safer, except for delivery drivers..."
Restrict delveries to daylight hours: "That's just as racist! What, only white people eat pizza at night?"
Pair up teams of driver/delivery guy, but in order to maintain the same payroll, expand the delivery areas, which would mean longer waiting time for pizza: "So, blacks only get cold pizza while whites get theirs hot? Still racist!"
Eliminating deliveries from a white neighborhood so that everybody suffers: "Well, that's how Title IX works, but it's still racist to deny black people pizza deliveries. How about transferring the drivers from the white neighboods to the black neighborhood and doubling up, and that way, only whites will be punished, for having perpetuated slavery and not paying reparations?"
Hire stupid liberals to drive in the black neighborhood, if you can find any who will actually take a job: "Uh, I'd like to do it, but I'm working on my sociology thesis right now, and, uh, my unemployment benefits still have a few months to go, and besides, it's not a union shop, so I couldn't take the job in good conscience."

Cain got it right, and until these idiots are willing to drive in that neighborhood, late at night, unarmed, with enough cash to make change, they really have nothing to say on the subject, especially since they are just looking for excuses not to vote for a black Republican. BTW, does anyone think for a second that Obama would have gone into those neighborhoods without an escort during his community organizer days? Or that he could have delivered pizza or performed any other job?

NJCardFan
06-13-2011, 07:05 PM
How the hell does delivering pizza improve the quality of life?

Rockntractor
06-13-2011, 07:10 PM
Like okay this is hard, I think the constitution even says somewhere that we have a right to Pizza given by our Creator, but you gotta pay for it!:confused:






(Lanie mode off)

AmPat
06-13-2011, 08:06 PM
Like okay this is hard, I think the constitution even says somewhere that we have a right to Pizza given by our Creator, but you gotta pay for it!:confused:

(Lanie mode off)

"you gotta pay for it?" Are you crazy. Pizza is a God given right. It's in the same clause as the right to somebody else paying for your health insurance and any other entitlement the left promotes.

Odysseus
06-13-2011, 08:38 PM
How the hell does delivering pizza improve the quality of life?

Are you sure that you're from Jersey? :D

txradioguy
06-14-2011, 01:41 AM
How the hell does delivering pizza improve the quality of life?

Bringing nutrition to those that live in a "food desert". :p

djones520
06-14-2011, 03:14 AM
When I was stationed at Shaw, the local Domino's did the same thing.

When you rob the pizza man, expect to stop getting deliveries. Is it really that hard to understand?

txradioguy
06-14-2011, 03:18 AM
When I was stationed at Shaw, the local Domino's did the same thing.

When you rob the pizza man, expect to stop getting deliveries. Is it really that hard to understand?

I've known pizza joints that didn't deliver to military bases...PRE 9/11.

Never thought of them as "anti-military".

djones520
06-14-2011, 03:22 AM
I've known pizza joints that didn't deliver to military bases...PRE 9/11.

Never thought of them as "anti-military".

Oh they delivered on base, but they certainly didn't deliver to most places off base after a certain time.

CueSi
06-14-2011, 03:36 AM
I've known pizza joints that didn't deliver to military bases...PRE 9/11.

Never thought of them as "anti-military".

Prolly not enough of their people passed a security clearance for it to be feasable? :p

~QC

txradioguy
06-14-2011, 08:12 AM
Prolly not enough of their people passed a security clearance for it to be feasable? :p

~QC

LOL! well...even in an institution like the military there are a few bad apples...and the local pizza joints got tired of having their pizzas stolen.

noonwitch
06-14-2011, 08:42 AM
Domino's in Detroit only delivers to office buildings and secure apartment/condo complexes. One of my friends used to do singing telegrams in the area, and they had the same policy regarding Detroit calls.


The only places that deliver pizza to houses in Detroit are local-owned businesses, and a rapidly-expanding local chain called Happy's Pizza. And Happy's had a driver robbed and killed a few years ago, before they expanded into the suburbs.

I always ordered and picked up my pizza from the original Buddy's on Conant and McNichols. It's still pretty close to where I live in the burbs. It's safe because the cops all eat there, plus the COs from the two prisons nearby. They also have security guards in their parking lot. It's one of the last vestiges of the Detroit of my childhood.

Odysseus
06-14-2011, 10:34 AM
Remember what the pizza delivery guys at FT Dix had planned. They were jihadis who intended to smuggle weapons onto the post and shoot up everybody in sight.

Hmmm.... Now if some of those guys were available to deliver pizza is bad neighborhoods, that might solve the problem. :D

Novaheart
06-14-2011, 11:23 AM
At least some of the DUers are sane about it. I delivered pizzas for Pizza Hut when I was in college. Most of the other delivery guys were black. Most of the neighborhoods we delivered to were black. We stopped delivering to one all black area after the black delivery drivers kept getting robbed. Its the only the thing to do sometimes.

One of my apartments in San Francisco was on the black side of the race line between Alamo Square (the postcard Victorians, white holdout enclave at the time) and the black section which is now white again as well.

Anyway... some pizza places wouldn't come there and some taxi requests would get lost in dispatch. While it pissed me off, and I did accuse one pizza place (run by Arabs) of racial discrimination, if these places would simply have done what delivery places do now and put a delivery map on their menu, it would have stopped a lot of annoyance.

The irritating part wasn't being in the no-go zone, it was the inconsistency and uncertainty. This was also before telephone credit card charges, which I would imagine makes a huge difference as does enhanced caller ID.

But business has to accept the bargain as well. If you aren't going to deliver to 99150 or if you aren't going to deliver "above Divisidero" then you have to accept that you can't deliver to the pockets of desirable business that you have always made an exception for. It's either/or. You can gerrymander but you can't spot-zone.

Novaheart
06-14-2011, 11:30 AM
Remember what the pizza delivery guys at FT Dix had planned. They were jihadis who intended to smuggle weapons onto the post and shoot up everybody in sight.

Hmmm.... Now if some of those guys were available to deliver pizza is bad neighborhoods, that might solve the problem. :D

I think I recall reading a few years back that a Washington Post reporter had arranged with the manager of a Pizza Hut to let him know when there were late night or exceptionally large orders at the Pentagon.

Even with all the security measures, people who sit in one place are in a position to observe change.

pyackog
06-14-2011, 11:33 AM
One of my apartments in San Francisco was on the black side of the race line between Alamo Square (the postcard Victorians, white holdout enclave at the time) and the black section which is now white again as well.

Anyway... some pizza places wouldn't come there and some taxi requests would get lost in dispatch. While it pissed me off, and I did accuse one pizza place (run by Arabs) of racial discrimination, if these places would simply have done what delivery places do now and put a delivery map on their menu, it would have stopped a lot of annoyance.

The irritating part wasn't being in the no-go zone, it was the inconsistency and uncertainty. This was also before telephone credit card charges, which I would imagine makes a huge difference as does enhanced caller ID.

But business has to accept the bargain as well. If you aren't going to deliver to 99150 or if you aren't going to deliver "above Divisidero" then you have to accept that you can't deliver to the pockets of desirable business that you have always made an exception for. It's either/or. You can gerrymander but you can't spot-zone.

I would mostly agree with that. In the instance I referred to at my old job, it was two apartment buildings that were across the street from each other that both had a lot of drug dealing going on and junkies hanging around outside. They even got hip to what was going on because after awhile before we stopped going to those buildings, they would hang outside and try to buy the pizzas from us for like $5 each and they would tell us to just tell the manager they stole it from us when we got back.

There was one crackhouse I used to love delivering to because they kept everybody inside on the main guy always order about 10 pizzas and was good for at least a $50 tip. :D

CueSi
06-14-2011, 02:17 PM
LOL! well...even in an institution like the military there are a few bad apples...and the local pizza joints got tired of having their pizzas stolen.

I was thinking the delivery drivers. There's always a couple potheads/functional drug addicts who work for the occasional free pizza and stuff. :p

~QC

Adam Wood
06-14-2011, 04:50 PM
LOL! well...even in an institution like the military there are a few bad apples...and the local pizza joints got tired of having their pizzas stolen.I would imagine just the hassle of getting on base, even before 9/11, would be a deterrent to delivering pizzas on a base. Back when I drove a cab in the early '90s, I'd get airborne flying into BNA and drive them up to Fort Campbell. Even in an obvious taxi with two or three uniformed soldiers with orders in hand, it would be probably a 10-15 minute procedure of car inspection, asking questions, etc. before we were let in the gate.

Arroyo_Doble
06-14-2011, 04:54 PM
I would imagine just the hassle of getting on base, even before 9/11, would be a deterrent to delivering pizzas on a base. Back when I drove a cab in the early '90s, I'd get airborne flying into BNA and drive them up to Fort Campbell. Even in an obvious taxi with two or three uniformed soldiers with orders in hand, it would be probably a 10-15 minute procedure of car inspection, asking questions, etc. before we were let in the gate.

In the mid-80's, we got pizza on Campbell all the time. Dominos. I liked black olive and mushroom, myself.

Jumpy
06-14-2011, 11:03 PM
When I was stationed at Shaw, the local Domino's did the same thing.

When you rob the pizza man, expect to stop getting deliveries. Is it really that hard to understand?

I delivered for Dominos many years ago, and we had areas within a few miles of the store, where we would not deliver to because of the crime rate in the area. It had nothing to do with race.

Im with you... this is not rocket science.

NJCardFan
06-15-2011, 12:44 AM
I delivered for Dominos many years ago, and we had areas within a few miles of the store, where we would not deliver to because of the crime rate in the area. It had nothing to do with race.

Im with you... this is not rocket science.
OK. Let me ask you this. How many white neighborhoods are hard to deliver to because of the high crime rate?

Elspeth
06-20-2011, 11:30 PM
How the hell does delivering pizza improve the quality of life?

Especially most pizzas, which taste like cardboard.

Odysseus
06-20-2011, 11:53 PM
Especially most pizzas, which taste like cardboard.

To a native New Yorker, that is sacrilege. :mad:

Elspeth
06-20-2011, 11:57 PM
To a native New Yorker, that is sacrilege. :mad:

I live in California. All our pizza tastes like cardboard. I'm guessing New York's is pretty good?

Odysseus
06-21-2011, 12:22 AM
I live in California. All our pizza tastes like cardboard. I'm guessing New York's is pretty good?

New York is the gold standard for pizza. When I lived in L.A., I used to have withdrawal symptoms. New Yorkers in Los Angeles complain about the absence of real pizza, real bagels and real breasts.

Rockntractor
06-21-2011, 12:28 AM
New York is the gold standard for pizza. When I lived in L.A., I used to have withdrawal symptoms. New Yorkers in Los Angeles complain about the absence of real pizza, real bagels and real breasts.

New York for thin crust and Chicago for deep dish.

Odysseus
06-21-2011, 12:33 AM
New York for thin crust and Chicago for deep dish.

Agreed. And California for... I dunno, earthquakes?

Rockntractor
06-21-2011, 12:38 AM
Agreed. And California for... I dunno, earthquakes?

I had a pizza in Santa Fe New Mexico from a place that moved there from California, it was made out of a railroad depot and had an excellent veggie pizza. That is probably the closest I can come to saying something nice about California.

FDK
06-21-2011, 06:23 AM
I had a pizza in Santa Fe New Mexico from a place that moved there from California, it was made out of a railroad depot and had an excellent veggie pizza. That is probably the closest I can come to saying something nice about California.

California: the land of fruits, nuts and vegetables. And that's just the population.

Adam Wood
06-21-2011, 07:37 AM
I had a pizza in Santa Fe New Mexico from a place that moved there from California, it was made out of a railroad depot and had an excellent veggie pizza. That is probably the closest I can come to saying something nice about California.I have a hard time believing that pizza made out of a railroad depot is very tasty at all.

SarasotaRepub
06-21-2011, 07:58 AM
Beat me to it. :D

Speedy
06-21-2011, 11:58 AM
OK. Let me ask you this. How many white neighborhoods are hard to deliver to because of the high crime rate?

This is something I often ask when having spirited discussions on race, "What city can you name where the Black or Latino side of town, not the white part is the best part of town."

Odysseus
06-21-2011, 12:05 PM
Beat me to it. :D

Ditto.

Although compared to the pizza normally served in CA, railroad ties would probably make a better crust.

CueSi
06-21-2011, 12:19 PM
This is something I often ask when having spirited discussions on race, "What city can you name where the Black or Latino side of town, not the white part is the best part of town."

Atlanta is mixed and there are black neighborhoods that are good AND black neighborhoods that are bad. My brother lives in a black/mixed neighborhood in Powder Springs that he chose deliberately because of the safety.

The Richmond Heights of my childhood was a safe black neighborhood. Now it's more Latino. Still pretty safe, though. :p

~QC

noonwitch
06-21-2011, 02:25 PM
Atlanta is mixed and there are black neighborhoods that are good AND black neighborhoods that are bad. My brother lives in a black/mixed neighborhood in Powder Springs that he chose deliberately because of the safety.

The Richmond Heights of my childhood was a safe black neighborhood. Now it's more Latino. Still pretty safe, though. :p

~QC


My brother lived for a while in a very nice, mixed neighborhood in Decatur. I remember visiting him and commenting on how integrated the suburbs were-this was in the early 90s, when Detroit suburbs were still pretty segregated (except Southfield).

Elspeth
06-21-2011, 08:17 PM
Ditto.

Although compared to the pizza normally served in CA, railroad ties would probably make a better crust.

I've been deprived! :eek:

pyackog
06-21-2011, 09:42 PM
New York is the gold standard for pizza. When I lived in L.A., I used to have withdrawal symptoms. New Yorkers in Los Angeles complain about the absence of real pizza, real bagels and real breasts.

Amen. I still have good pizza cravings regularly and I left NY 11 years ago. And nobody here even believes me about the bagels.

Adam Wood
06-21-2011, 10:21 PM
Amen. I still have good pizza cravings regularly and I left NY 11 years ago. And nobody here even believes me about the bagels.There used to be a fantastic bagel shop at 88th and Lex that I went to when my brother lived in the neighborhood. Fabulous garlic bagels toasted hot and absolutely outstanding lox on them for I think it was $1.50 at the time (two halves). Of course, this was 20 years ago, but still, it was a good bargain and some absolutely killer bagels. The lox was so tender you'd think it could just be spread on like butter, but it was just a fantastic thin slice of salmon.

MAN, that was good stuff. You just can't get that kind of killer bagel anywhere else.

Odysseus
06-21-2011, 10:52 PM
Amen. I still have good pizza cravings regularly and I left NY 11 years ago. And nobody here even believes me about the bagels.
Best pizza I ever had was a little hole-in-the-wall place on Avenue J in Brooklyn, right by the D train. It was called DiFara's and the old man who ran it used to make it from scratch, with all fresh ingredients. As good as the stuff in Manhattan was, and even the worst Manhattan pizza was better than the best CA pizza, this guy's was an order of magnitude better. You couldn't get in there on a Friday night. I try to get there whenever I'm in NYC, but it's far enough out of my way that it's tough to do, but it's always worth it.

There used to be a fantastic bagel shop at 88th and Lex that I went to when my brother lived in the neighborhood. Fabulous garlic bagels toasted hot and absolutely outstanding lox on them for I think it was $1.50 at the time (two halves). Of course, this was 20 years ago, but still, it was a good bargain and some absolutely killer bagels. The lox was so tender you'd think it could just be spread on like butter, but it was just a fantastic thin slice of salmon.

MAN, that was good stuff. You just can't get that kind of killer bagel anywhere else.
I used to go to a bagel place on W14th street, just past 8th Ave, that made their own. The onion and the garlic bagels were amazing. My favorite lunch was beef salami and swiss on an onion bagel with a bit of mustard, but they also did egg bagels which were great with just butter.

I've been deprived! :eek:

You don't know the half of it.

pyackog
06-21-2011, 10:58 PM
There used to be a fantastic bagel shop at 88th and Lex that I went to when my brother lived in the neighborhood. Fabulous garlic bagels toasted hot and absolutely outstanding lox on them for I think it was $1.50 at the time (two halves). Of course, this was 20 years ago, but still, it was a good bargain and some absolutely killer bagels. The lox was so tender you'd think it could just be spread on like butter, but it was just a fantastic thin slice of salmon.

MAN, that was good stuff. You just can't get that kind of killer bagel anywhere else.

I was never a big lox guy, usually just did cream cheese (half a package of Philadelphia cream cheese too, not a "pat" of cream cheese like you get everywhere else). I used to hang out in a bar on Long Island that was across the street from a 24 hour bagel place that supplied bagels to a lot of shops in the area. We'd go in there at 4am for bagels and you NEVER had a hangover the next morning, lol.

They go a little more than a buck fifty now but are still a lot cheaper than everywhere else and the bagels are half the size everywhere else.

pyackog
06-21-2011, 11:01 PM
Best pizza I ever had was a little hole-in-the-wall place on Avenue J in Brooklyn, right by the D train. It was called DiFara's and the old man who ran it used to make it from scratch, with all fresh ingredients. As good as the stuff in Manhattan was, and even the worst Manhattan pizza was better than the best CA pizza, this guy's was an order of magnitude better. You couldn't get in there on a Friday night. I try to get there whenever I'm in NYC, but it's far enough out of my way that it's tough to do, but it's always worth it.


I'm a Long Island guy and know the places there a lot better than a lot of the NYC places but used to eat a lot at a place on the corner of Ave A and St. Marks that was awesome. I've never had CA pizza but anyone who puts shit like pineapples onto a pizza is wrong on principle alone.

The ingredients in most of the NYC, NJ and Long Island places were usually quite good because the mob made sure that certain ingredients that they sold were used pretty much exclusively (pretty much all the cheeses) and they were selling high quality stuff.

Elspeth
06-21-2011, 11:27 PM
The ingredients in most of the NYC, NJ and Long Island places were usually quite good because the mob made sure that certain ingredients that they sold were used pretty much exclusively (pretty much all the cheeses) and they were selling high quality stuff.

Probably the only good thing the mob ever did. :)

Odysseus
06-22-2011, 10:15 AM
I'm a Long Island guy and know the places there a lot better than a lot of the NYC places but used to eat a lot at a place on the corner of Ave A and St. Marks that was awesome. I've never had CA pizza but anyone who puts shit like pineapples onto a pizza is wrong on principle alone.

There's also a pizza/bagel place on the corner of St. Marks and Third that would make a pizza bagel, with all of the pizza ingredients we'd come to love on top of (usually) an onion or garlic bagel, but they would make them to order, too. That's about the only variation on pizza that I'll go for with any enthusiasm.

My British wife will order Hawaiian pizza whenever she gets the chance, but I've warned her that if she did that in NYC, she would be taken to New Jersey and left there.


The ingredients in most of the NYC, NJ and Long Island places were usually quite good because the mob made sure that certain ingredients that they sold were used pretty much exclusively (pretty much all the cheeses) and they were selling high quality stuff.
Polly-O makes a great mozzarella, but it never occurred to me that they were mobbed up.

Probably the only good thing the mob ever did. :)

The mob has done a few good things. They've given us a whole genre of entertainment (Godfather, Goodfellas, the Sopranos, etc.) and they were into recycling long before the environmentalists got into it (Jimmy Hoffa got as green a disposal as you could ask for). Also, mob fashions have their place. There's nothing like a black shirt with a black suit and white tie to say "don't mess with me", and who else would wear velvet sweatsuits to anything? :D

txradioguy
06-22-2011, 12:48 PM
The mob has done a few good things. They've given us a whole genre of entertainment (Godfather, Goodfellas, the Sopranos, etc.) and they were into recycling long before the environmentalists got into it (Jimmy Hoffa got as green a disposal as you could ask for). Also, mob fashions have their place. There's nothing like a black shirt with a black suit and white tie to say "don't mess with me", and who else would wear velvet sweatsuits to anything? :D

And lets not forget the intel work they did for the U.S. on the docks along the East Coast in War Two.

Hawkgirl
06-22-2011, 05:17 PM
the REAL question is....Did the Chinese deliver there??



:cool: