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View Full Version : Two Students Yanked Out of Line at Graduation For Wearing Military Sashes



megimoo
06-13-2011, 11:32 PM
As the grandfather of a recent Fort Benning graduate now at Fort Gordon for advanced training this really sticks in my craw.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wrF3JsC1i7I&feature=youtu.be


http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2734194/posts

Novaheart
06-14-2011, 01:15 AM
We know it's not the same thing, but in the common understanding of "fairness" or "equal enforcement" I can see having a hard and fast policy.

The military sashes really have nothing to do with the HS graduation. If you allow that deviation, then it will open the door to all kinds of "expression".

How would we feel if little Omar and his asshole sympathizers wore Palestian table clothes around their shoulders on the stage? What's to keep the resident jackass on the football team from wearing a necklace of jockstraps? Surely a Confederate flag stole would start a riot. Flags, icons, swastikas..... these "kids" are notorious assholes at this age and will do almost anything to get attention.

djones520
06-14-2011, 01:18 AM
We know it's not the same thing, but in the common understanding of "fairness" or "equal enforcement" I can see having a hard and fast policy.

The military sashes really have nothing to do with the HS graduation. If you allow that deviation, then it will open the door to all kinds of "expression".

How would we feel if little Omar and his asshole sympathizers wore Palestian table clothes around their shoulders on the stage? What's to keep the resident jackass on the football team from wearing a necklace of jockstraps? Surely a Confederate flag stole would start a riot. Flags, icons, swastikas..... these "kids" are notorious assholes at this age and will do almost anything to get attention.

I understand the point your trying to make, but go back and reread what you just said.

You did just compair wearing something honoring the US Military, to nazi propaganda, or pro-terrorism.

It's called using Common Sense Nova. If we can't trust these people to use that appropriately, then why are we trusting them to educate our children?

lacarnut
06-14-2011, 01:43 AM
I understand the point your trying to make, but go back and reread what you just said.

You did just compair wearing something honoring the US Military, to nazi propaganda, or pro-terrorism.

It's called using Common Sense Nova. If we can't trust these people to use that appropriately, then why are we trusting them to educate our children?

I think he meant exactly what he said and the intent was there. I think it is time for this POS to go.

txradioguy
06-14-2011, 01:47 AM
How would we feel if little Omar and his asshole sympathizers wore Palestian table clothes around their shoulders on the stage?

As we've seen in this overly PC world we live in where we bend over to kiss the Islamic collective ass...that would be allowed and celebrated.



What's to keep the resident jackass on the football team from wearing a necklace of jockstraps? Surely a Confederate flag stole would start a riot. Flags, icons, swastikas..... these "kids" are notorious assholes at this age and will do almost anything to get attention.

You mean like insist on bringing their lesbian date to a prom and fighting it through the court system when they aren't allowed?

Oh wait...that's one of those PC things to be celebrated. :rolleyes:

CueSi
06-14-2011, 01:55 AM
I understand the point your trying to make, but go back and reread what you just said.

You did just compair wearing something honoring the US Military, to nazi propaganda, or pro-terrorism.

It's called using Common Sense Nova. If we can't trust these people to use that appropriately, then why are we trusting them to educate our children?

They are education majors in the schools, Jonesy. You lose that almost within your first semester. ;)

~QC

Rockntractor
06-14-2011, 02:02 AM
How would we feel if little Omar and his asshole sympathizers wore Palestian table clothes around their shoulders on the stage? What's to keep the resident jackass on the football team from wearing a necklace of jockstraps? Surely a Confederate flag stole would start a riot. Flags, icons, swastikas..... these "kids" are notorious assholes at this age and will do almost anything to get attention.

What the hell is the matter with you? Do you like posting here?

txradioguy
06-14-2011, 02:12 AM
What the hell is the matter with you? Do you like posting here?

Doesn't seem like it.

lacarnut
06-14-2011, 03:46 AM
What the hell is the matter with you? Do you like posting here?

Equating a sash to a table cloth or jockstrap smacks of disrespect for our soldiers. Nova is a POS.

Phillygirl
06-14-2011, 07:36 AM
I'm surprised to hear this happened in Schuykill County. Upstate PA is much more military friendly than the southeastern part of the state, as it has a stronger military population.

megimoo
06-14-2011, 08:16 AM
'Martyrdom' Graduation Sashes Incite Violence?
Muslim members of the University of California, Irvine's graduating class will wear green sashes emblazoned with the word "shahada" in Arabic along with their commencement robes in Saturday's ceremony – a reference some say is an incitement to violence that should not be allowed.

"Shahada" can be translated several ways, including as a declaration of faith in Islam, but it often is used in reference to "martyrdom" – especially martyrdom attained by suicide bombers.

Sally Peterson, dean of students at UCI, defended the university against critics who say the school shouldn't allow such a display.

Peterson admits the word "shahada," besides being a reference to Islam, "has also taken on many other meanings depending on where you sit. For some it is seen as 'kill all Jews' or it is seen as a reference to suicide bombers," she said.

Despite different meanings applied to the Arabic word, the administrator said UCI is not permitted to limit the Muslim Student Union members' freedom to wear the sashes


http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/non_aviation/print.main?id=628162

noonwitch
06-14-2011, 08:50 AM
They had enlisted to serve after graduation, so it is appropriate for them to wear the sashes to the ceremony. If they hadn't enlisted, it would be a disprespectful use of a military emblem.


Graduates wear the honor society medals and honor roll sashes with their caps and gowns. I see these sashes as a similar honor, and the school or teacher involved was way out of line in stopping them.

megimoo
06-14-2011, 09:49 AM
Alumni and Faculty all wear their University Graduate sashes at graduations .

California State University Graduation Sash

Students who studied abroad through Chico State for at least the summer may wear special SASH for graduation.
The sash will display the colors of the flag of the country where you studied....If you studied abroad in more than one country, you can get a sash that is half one country and half another, (up to 8 countries total).

Novaheart
06-14-2011, 11:46 AM
I understand the point your trying to make, but go back and reread what you just said.

You did just compair wearing something honoring the US Military, to nazi propaganda, or pro-terrorism.

It's called using Common Sense Nova. If we can't trust these people to use that appropriately, then why are we trusting them to educate our children?

I did. It's expression, the boys stated it clearly that they wore the stoles to speak to the audience about their after school choices. We live in a era of Zero Tolerance because we live in an era of litigation.

The principal should have consulted the district attorneys and found out if they could make a hard and fast rule allowing the military stoles, and limited them to the military of the United States. Maybe she did.

It also needs to be said that a graduation is a procession. Processions have rules. The persons in a graduation are ranked, and honors are given to those who have earned them and been awarded them by the authority conducting the procession. Now, I ask you, if you are at an Army awards ceremony where some people are going to get "best", some are going to get "gave it a good try" and some are going to get "good attendance"; should those in the good attendance group be allowed to wear gold stars on silk stoles simply because they want to stand out on the stage?

Novaheart
06-14-2011, 11:53 AM
A
You mean like insist on bringing their lesbian date to a prom and fighting it through the court system when they aren't allowed?

Everyone brings a date to the prom, not everyone wears a stole to a high school graduation.

Luanne bringing Zelda to the prom isn't an attack on my date, my religion, my country, or my values. Luanne wearing a Palestinian headrag, a Mexican flag, or a swastika is an assault on my religion, my country, and my values.

These boys wearing military stoles (which I have never seen before and I went to a lot of graduations with a lot of military families) isn't offensive or disruptive. But schools have to think farther in front of the moment then you apparently think is necessary.

Novaheart
06-14-2011, 11:54 AM
I think he meant exactly what he said and the intent was there. I think it is time for this POS to go.

Thank you for sharing.

Rockntractor
06-14-2011, 11:56 AM
I did. It's expression, the boys stated it clearly that they wore the stoles to speak to the audience about their after school choices. We live in a era of Zero Tolerance because we live in an era of litigation.

The principal should have consulted the district attorneys and found out if they could make a hard and fast rule allowing the military stoles, and limited them to the military of the United States. Maybe she did.

It also needs to be said that a graduation is a procession. Processions have rules. The persons in a graduation are ranked, and honors are given to those who have earned them and been awarded them by the authority conducting the procession. Now, I ask you, if you are at an Army awards ceremony where some people are going to get "best", some are going to get "gave it a good try" and some are going to get "good attendance"; should those in the good attendance group be allowed to wear gold stars on silk stoles simply because they want to stand out on the stage?

What you are being asked is why you chose "a necklace of jockstraps? Surely a Confederate flag stole would start a riot. Flags, icons, swastikas...." to compare Military Sashes to.

Novaheart
06-14-2011, 12:00 PM
What the hell is the matter with you? Do you like posting here?

I'm looking at this from what I think is an objective standpoint in consideration of how litigation might ensue. How you CHOOSE to view that is beyond my control. I made it very clear that I don't equate the stoles with offensive iconography, but that legally it might be all considered expression. Is logic and academic approach a banning offense here now?

Please instruct me here. Are we supposed to discuss things and look at them from multiple angles? Or are we all just supposed to jump up and down and scream about stuff like some folks on DU?

Novaheart
06-14-2011, 12:02 PM
What you are being asked is why you chose "a necklace of jockstraps? Surely a Confederate flag stole would start a riot. Flags, icons, swastikas...." to compare Military Sashes to.

I also wrote "it's not the same thing" but you chose to ignore that.

Rockntractor
06-14-2011, 12:05 PM
I'm looking at this from what I think is an objective standpoint in consideration of how litigation might ensue. How you CHOOSE to view that is beyond my control. I made it very clear that I don't equate the stoles with offensive iconography, but that legally it might be all considered expression. Is logic and academic approach a banning offense here now?

Please instruct me here. Are we supposed to discuss things and look at them from multiple angles? Or are we all just supposed to jump up and down and scream about stuff like some folks on DU?
How could you possibly think a statement like that wouldn't be disrespectful and inflammatory.
We have like two rules here and you find them and see if you can make a game out of seeing how close you can come to breaking them.

Rockntractor
06-14-2011, 12:18 PM
Nova, stay away from military related threads, they are read only for you.
Every time you get into one it seams to cause trouble.
I mean it.

Novaheart
06-14-2011, 12:21 PM
How could you possibly think a statement like that wouldn't be disrespectful and inflammatory.
We have like two rules here and you find them and see if you can make a game out of seeing how close you can come to breaking them.

Honestly it never occurred to me that anyone would take it that way. I am not a complicated or devious person. I have no reason to be coy with you people, I don't know a single one of you in real life. I say what I mean, and I am often quite emotionally detached. Since I arrived here, you have assumed that I was a masked man from DU who would one day reveal himself, and despite everything I have candidly told you about my family, my life, and my positions you still LOOK FOR opportunities to take something out of context or completely misread something and start on the warpath.

In case you haven't noticed, I have posted in the Veterans forum about twice, and once I removed it when I realized I was in the Vets forum. I don't expect to be a part of that, and since I don't share the emotional attachment there, then I stay out . But out here in General Discussion, I have always operated on the belief that these topics are for the discussion of issues in the general public. Sometimes those are military issues. Part of our unique design for this country is civilian control of the military, civilians are not without opinion are they? And yet, you seem to think that the only opinion I am entitled to on any issue remotely related to the military is agreement. Moreover, when I disagree with a policy, you convolute that to mean hatred for the military in general and the veterans here in particular even though some of them have said that they never took what I said the way you portrayed it.

So what is the real deal here? Are you really convinced that one day I am going to "show my colors" or are you simply amusing yourself at deciding if any given day is Kick Nova Day?

Rockntractor
06-14-2011, 12:24 PM
So what is the real deal here? Are you really convinced that one day I am going to "show my colors" or are you simply amusing yourself at deciding if any given day is Kick Nova Day?

I am not negotiating with you, read my last post above and get the chip of your shoulder.

lacarnut
06-14-2011, 12:39 PM
So what is the real deal here? Are you really convinced that one day I am going to "show my colors" or are you simply amusing yourself at deciding if any given day is Kick Nova Day?

Keep it up jackass and it will be kick Nova off CU for good.

Madisonian
06-14-2011, 06:00 PM
This will piss off a few people here, but I'm backing Nova on this one.

I did not read it as an insult to the military or to the students. I read it as an example of what could be next in the PC world schools and students now live in.

Common sense does not play into the educational system anymore. If it did, 6 yer old kids would not be getting thrown out of school for pointing a finger and going "bang" or drawing a picture of a gun (which not only gets you tossed, but sent for psych evaluation).

I think too many people like to read too much into what some posters put up and just look for a reason to be offended depending on the author.

JB
06-14-2011, 06:02 PM
Not sure what the problem is.

School policy is no sashes.
These two show up wearing sashes.
School tells them to take them off or don't walk down the aisle.
They decide to not walk down the aisle.

Isn't this what conservatives do? We follow the rules. We just don't show up and behave like DUmmy anarchists because it's something we feel like doing.

Maybe these boys actions will lead to a change in school policy and that would be a good thing. But to fault the school for the actions they took at this graduation is just wrong. They should have been yanked. And they were. Kudos to the school for standing that line.

Rockntractor
06-14-2011, 06:09 PM
This will piss off a few people here, but I'm backing Nova on this one.

I did not read it as an insult to the military or to the students. I read it as an example of what could be next in the PC world schools and students now live in.

Common sense does not play into the educational system anymore. If it did, 6 yer old kids would not be getting thrown out of school for pointing a finger and going "bang" or drawing a picture of a gun (which not only gets you tossed, but sent for psych evaluation).

I think too many people like to read too much into what some posters put up and just look for a reason to be offended depending on the author.

There was no problem with Nova agreeing with the school , the problem comes from him comparing the sashes to swastikas. I was told next mistake he was gone, I didn't do that and told him to stay away from military threads because there is always trouble when he get's involved in them.
How Nova is dealt with is no one Else's business and is between Nova and admin.