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ABC in Georgia
02-02-2012, 01:36 PM
Obama: I Pushed Dodd-Frank And Health Care Reform Because Of Christ
At National Prayer Breakfast, Obama grounds his controversial policies in the Bible. Tax hikes for rich “[coincide] with Jesus's teaching.”


"And so when I talk about our financial institutions playing by the same rules as folks on Main Street, when I talk about making sure insurance companies aren’t discriminating against those who are already sick, or making sure that unscrupulous lenders aren’t taking advantage of the most vulnerable among us, I do so because I genuinely believe it will make the economy stronger for everybody. But I also do it because I know that far too many neighbors in our country have been hurt and treated unfairly over the last few years, and I believe in God’s command to 'love thy neighbor as thyself."


"And when I decide to stand up for foreign aid, or prevent atrocities in places like Uganda, or take on issues like human trafficking, it’s not just about strengthening alliances, or promoting democratic values, or projecting American leadership around the world, although it does all those things and it will make us safer and more secure. It’s also about the biblical call to care for the least of these — for the poor; for those at the margins of our society.
To answer the responsibility we’re given in Proverbs to 'Speak up for those who cannot speak for themselves, for the rights of all who are destitute."

http://www.buzzfeed.com/zekejmiller/obama-i-pushed-dodd-frank-and-health-care-reform

Did any of you catch this blasphemy this morning? This man is truly beneath contempt! :mad: :mad: :mad:

It made me so angry, this time I truly screamed at the TV ... and raised my blood pressure several notches.

As someone wrote in the comments that followed ...


God will not be mocked!

~ ABC

AmPat
02-02-2012, 02:57 PM
Obama: I Pushed Dodd-Frank And Health Care Reform Because Of Christ
At National Prayer Breakfast, Obama grounds his controversial policies in the Bible. Tax hikes for rich “[coincide] with Jesus's teaching.”





http://www.buzzfeed.com/zekejmiller/obama-i-pushed-dodd-frank-and-health-care-reform

Did any of you catch this blasphemy this morning? This man is truly beneath contempt! :mad: :mad: :mad:

It made me so angry, this time I truly screamed at the TV ... and raised my blood pressure several notches.

As someone wrote in the comments that followed ...

~ ABC
He was in a foul mood because his handlers suggested he not bring his prayer mat.

Bailey
02-02-2012, 03:07 PM
I love how he totally takes scripture out of context, makes me want to puke.

noonwitch
02-02-2012, 04:15 PM
How is any of that blasphemy or mocking God?

You might disagree with his interpretation of "Love thy neighbor as thyself" or feel that Jesus instructions for how we should treat people as individuals should not apply to the government, but nothing in either of the paragraphs posted amounts to blasphemy.

DumbAss Tanker
02-02-2012, 04:21 PM
Oh man, don't even play that, Barry.

:bullshit::bullshit::bullshit:

Apache
02-02-2012, 04:35 PM
How is any of that blasphemy or mocking God?

You might disagree with his interpretation of "Love thy neighbor as thyself" or feel that Jesus instructions for how we should treat people as individuals should not apply to the government, but nothing in either of the paragraphs posted amounts to blasphemy.

Because the man intentionally took from the Bible passages that he knows little/nothing about and twisted them to fit his own agenda. He has no divine inspiration or aspiration for his progams and policies. He wants to end this country as it is known and will stoop to new lows to achive his goal...

Apache
02-02-2012, 04:36 PM
Oh man, don't even play that, Barry.

:bullshit::bullshit::bullshit:

A little late...

He already did. I bet the DUmp is just lapping it up too....:rolleyes:

noonwitch
02-02-2012, 05:21 PM
Because the man intentionally took from the Bible passages that he knows little/nothing about and twisted them to fit his own agenda. He has no divine inspiration or aspiration for his progams and policies. He wants to end this country as it is known and will stoop to new lows to achive his goal...


How do you know that he knows nothing about the Bible? You don't like the way he applies scripture. That doesn't make his statements blasphemous.


But I know, only fundamentalists are really christians in a fundamentalist's worldview.

Lager
02-02-2012, 05:52 PM
Just as Justice is supposed to be blind, governments should not be run and motivated by emotion or sympathy. The only consideration in governing should be the rule of law. The emotion should remain with individuals who exercise their freedom to elect officials or lobby for legislation that echos their sentiments. If the President is going to take action anywhere in the world where circumstances solicit our sympathies, than he had better reconsider the large military cuts he is presiding over, because we in the Armed Forces are going to be busy.

Janice
02-02-2012, 06:02 PM
How do you know that he knows nothing about the Bible?


Of course this will make no sense to those who are not spiritually discerned but for the rest of us:

15 Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. 16 You will know them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles? 17 So, every sound tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears evil fruit. 18 A sound tree cannot bear evil fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. 19 Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 20 Thus you will know them by their fruits. -- Matthew 7:15-20

He has a track record now. Its just a weeeeeeeee bit obvious which category 0bama falls under to most of us. So his use of scripture would simply be towards selfish/secular ends.

And that just isnt how it "works". But I wouldnt doubt that it makes him "feel better" somehow. And his "followers". Sort of like the "blind leading the blind".

ABC in Georgia
02-02-2012, 07:33 PM
How is any of that blasphemy or mocking God?



To mock God is to pretend to love and serve Him when you are not a believer.

This man is not the least bit sincere and uses scripture to serve his own ends.

He truly disgusts me!

~ ABC

ABC in Georgia
02-02-2012, 07:41 PM
FlaGator ...

I have not studied the Bible, and do believe that you have.

Would love to hear from you as well on this topic, if at all possible.

~ ABC

Apache
02-02-2012, 08:57 PM
How do you know that he knows nothing about the Bible?Because he took the scriptures out of context to fit his own thinking, that's how...
You don't like the way he applies scripture. That doesn't make his statements blasphemous.Oh yes ma'am it does. He is using the Word of God to get his own way, not in service to the Lord. THAT is blasphemy...



But I know, only fundamentalists are really christians in a fundamentalist's worldview.

Ah ha, so anyone who knows that Zero took those quotes out of context has a narrow worldview... gotcha :thumbsup:

THE Gypsy
02-02-2012, 11:04 PM
What's amazing is there is no outcry on the separation of church and state. And no seething toward a politician that openly admits he allows his "faith" to influence his political decisions.

Apache
02-02-2012, 11:29 PM
What's amazing is there is no outcry on the separation of church and state. And no seething toward a politician that openly admits he allows his "faith" to influence his political decisions.

That's because there is no "faith" involved. Instead it is empty, meaningless platitudes served up in some biblical sounding blather...

AmPat
02-03-2012, 09:59 AM
How do you know that he knows nothing about the Bible? You don't like the way he applies scripture. That doesn't make his statements blasphemous.


But I know, only fundamentalists are really christians in a fundamentalist's worldview.

The accusation that O Blah Blah "knows nothing about the Bible" is based upon his continued misinterpretation of its contents. The only other accusations that make sense is that he is stupid, ignorant, or using Scripture passages to push his Marxist message. Which of these other options is more palatable to you?:rolleyes:

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 10:17 AM
Do you guys really think that there are no liberal Christians? Seriously?

Bailey
02-03-2012, 10:41 AM
Do you guys really think that there are no liberal Christians? Seriously?

Well they can call themselves Christians all they want but for some reason I dont think the Lord is into Abortion and high tax rates or any number of liberal ideas floating out there.

AmPat
02-03-2012, 10:46 AM
Do you guys really think that there are no liberal Christians? Seriously?They are nearly as rare as Unicorns and Intelligent liberals.

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 10:49 AM
They are nearly as rare as Unicorns and Intelligent liberals.

When confronted with objective reality, how do you react? I am sure it has to occur every once in awhile.

noonwitch
02-03-2012, 11:12 AM
When confronted with objective reality, how do you react? I am sure it has to occur every once in awhile.

Fundamentalist and conservative christians do not believe that one can be a liberal and a christian, because they think that only they are the real christians. Anyone who accepts gays and believes that abortion should be legal is not qualified to call herself a christian by that standard. There are plenty of liberal christians who are equally close-minded about those who take the opposite position on those issues.

As far as my own faith is concerned, I am a firm believer in the Sermon on The Mountain like most liberal christians. "Love thy neighbor as thyself" doesn't have exceptions for gays, muslims and people whose politics I disagree with.

AmPat
02-03-2012, 11:14 AM
When confronted with objective reality, how do you react? I am sure it has to occur every once in awhile.

That objective reality is rarely presented by a liberal. It is as rare as Unicorns and intelligent liberals.

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 11:32 AM
Fundamentalist and conservative christians do not believe that one can be a liberal and a christian, because they think that only they are the real christians. Anyone who accepts gays and believes that abortion should be legal is not qualified to call herself a christian by that standard. There are plenty of liberal christians who are equally close-minded about those who take the opposite position on those issues.

As far as my own faith is concerned, I am a firm believer in the Sermon on The Mountain like most liberal christians. "Love thy neighbor as thyself" doesn't have exceptions for gays, muslims and people whose politics I disagree with.

It really is weird.

But there are a great many sects to choose from. If the Red Letters make you uncomfortable, it is easy to find a preacher who ignores them.

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 11:33 AM
That objective reality is rarely presented by a liberal. It is as rare as Unicorns and intelligent liberals.

Ah. Denial.

AmPat
02-03-2012, 11:33 AM
[QUOTE]Fundamentalist and conservative christians do not believe that one can be a liberal and a christian, because they think that only they are the real christians. Anyone who accepts gays and believes that abortion should be legal is not qualified to call herself a christian by that standard. Wow, talk about close minded. This is why you are not even qualified to speak on this topic, completely clueless. Let's start with a Linda#s type correction. If you claim to be a Christian, I suggest you would be more credible if you CAPITALIZED the word Christianity.
Real Christians don't exclude gays or liberals. Did you finally get that or are your liberal blinders still on? Real Christians understand that gays are welcome into Christianity but their sins are not excused or accepted. Christ does not change the rules of salvation for liberals or gays anymore than for adultery or murder.
Do you actually believe that Christ would accept the practice of sticking a knife into a womb and scrambling a baby or sticking a penis into a rectum as Christian behavior? Christ died to forgive this kind of sin, not to tolerate it. Christians don't make the rules of Christianity, Christ does. Whatever you feel comfortable with when you bow your knee before Him and call Him Lord of all, feel free. I don't believe your quibbling over women's or gay rights are going very far in His presence.


As far as my own faith is concerned, I am a firm believer in the Sermon on The Mountain like most liberal christians. "Love thy neighbor as thyself" doesn't have exceptions for gays, muslims and people whose politics I disagree with.How very gracious, and arrogant of you to exclude Conservative Christians from your back slapping party. Conservative Christians feel the same toward, and accept these same groups, we just don't embrace the sin that Christians should be avoiding.

AmPat
02-03-2012, 11:34 AM
Ah. Denial.

No, "Objective reality."

AmPat
02-03-2012, 11:37 AM
It really is weird.

But there are a great many sects to choose from. If the Red Letters make you uncomfortable, it is easy to find a preacher who ignores them.

Only weird if you accept the "weird" and false premise as presented by the resident liberals. But I understand that liberals are more comfortable with the lie as it suits their false impression and bolsters their hatred of the Conservative Christians that they look down upon.;)

linda22003
02-03-2012, 11:37 AM
[QUOTE=noonwitch;480170] Wow, talk about close minded. This is why you are not even qualified to speak on this topic, completely clueless. Let's start with a Linda#s type correction. If you claim to be a Christian, I suggest you would be more credible if you CAPITALIZED the word Christianity.


Point well taken; I would have zeroed in on that "Sermon on the Mountain" thing, myself. :p

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 11:42 AM
Only weird if you accept the "weird" and false premise as presented by the resident liberals. But I understand that liberals are more comfortable with the lie as it suits their false impression and bolsters their hatred of the Conservative Christians that they look down upon.;)

You seem angry. Alot. Since Matthew 5 has been brought into to the conversation, you should read it again.

txradioguy
02-03-2012, 12:05 PM
When confronted with objective reality, how do you react? I am sure it has to occur every once in awhile.

We all think the same thing about you.

Not that we could ever pin you down long enough to give us a yes or no answer.

txradioguy
02-03-2012, 12:05 PM
You seem angry. Alot. Since Matthew 5 has been brought into to the conversation, you should read it again.

Perhaps you should actually open the Bible for the first time in your life.

AmPat
02-03-2012, 12:08 PM
You seem angry. Alot. Since Matthew 5 has been brought into to the conversation, you should read it again.

You seem stoopid "alot" (sic). Have you thought about electro-shock therapy?:rolleyes:

AmPat
02-03-2012, 12:09 PM
Perhaps you should actually open the Bible for the first time in your life.

Water on a Witch Tex.:cool:

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 12:11 PM
Perhaps you should actually open the Bible for the first time in your life.

Now that, is funny.

txradioguy
02-03-2012, 12:14 PM
Water on a Witch Tex.:cool:

Pretty much.

Libtards are good at recycling cherry picked parts of certain chapters of the Bible. YOu know the ones they pick up off of KOS or DU.

But actually opening a Bible is something they never do.

Odysseus
02-03-2012, 12:45 PM
Do you guys really think that there are no liberal Christians? Seriously?

Sure, there are liberal Christians. Calling Obama a Christian is a stretch, not because I think that he's a secret Muslim, but because he has never demonstrated any understanding of, or belief in, Christianity. Obama's entire experience with Christianity appears to have been limited to his twenty years in Jeremiah Wright's church, where he managed to avoid actually listening to any of the sermons or dealing with anyone. Wright's brand of Black Liberation theology is a violent revolutionary doctrine of racial separation that uses superficial trappings of Christianity and misrepresents it in order to have it serve as a delivery system for Wright's Marxism and racism.

BTW, given how little Obama has learned from his time in college and government, I'm perfectly willing to believe that he spent twenty years in the pews without noticing anything that was going on around him. His self-absorption and narcissism make it unlikely that he was able to focus on worship of anything but himself.

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 01:00 PM
Sure, there are liberal Christians. Calling Obama a Christian is a stretch, not because I think that he's a secret Muslim, but because he has never demonstrated any understanding of, or belief in, Christianity. Obama's entire experience with Christianity appears to have been limited to his twenty years in Jeremiah Wright's church, where he managed to avoid actually listening to any of the sermons or dealing with anyone. Wright's brand of Black Liberation theology is a violent revolutionary doctrine of racial separation that uses superficial trappings of Christianity and misrepresents it in order to have it serve as a delivery system for Wright's Marxism and racism.

BTW, given how little Obama has learned from his time in college and government, I'm perfectly willing to believe that he spent twenty years in the pews without noticing anything that was going on around him. His self-absorption and narcissism make it unlikely that he was able to focus on worship of anything but himself.

That's all just personal animus directed at the Executive on your part.

txradioguy
02-03-2012, 01:29 PM
That's all just personal animus directed at the Executive on your part.

You got that right fanboy!!!


:rolleyes:

FlaGator
02-03-2012, 01:44 PM
Since I have been asked for my two cents here, I will put them in. First of all there are no conservative or liberal Christians. There are just Christians who live the word and then there are those people who don't. Simply calling oneself a Christian doesn't make one a Christian. Going to a church or some type of worship service does not mean that one is a believer. C. S. Lewis stated something like "going to church does not make one a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes one a car".

That being said, I don't believe that Obama blasphemed. To call him a blasphemer is to believe that he understands what he is talking about and is rejecting truth in favor of falsehood. I don't think he gets it.

Christ never spoke about governments other than how a believer is to interact with them "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's." Jesus never asked a government to do anything that some liberals attribute to him. He never spoke about a ruling body performing revenue redistribution or governments giving aid to the poor. In fact he never addressed non-believers need to assist the poor at all. His call to feed and cloth the hungry was aimed directly at believers.

The things Jesus wants of us is to recognize that we are sinful people and to repent of these sins and to accept him as our Lord and Savior. Out of love for Him and in thanksgiving for our salvation we are asked to help those who need it. Helping others should not be forced, it should come from the heart. I don't give money to a charity because Jesus wants me to, I give money or time or whatever to aid another because I love Jesus, I am grateful for what he has done for me and I want to, in some small measure, do for others what HE has done for me.

Finally, what I believe about Obama's words is that I don't think Christ would like for someone to be compelled to do something that he or she doesn't want to do. If you want to force people to pay money so that something good can be done would in no way fit in with the expectations of Christ. I think Christ would be happy that people would be helped but I don't believe he is an ends versus the means type of God. Obama twisted scripture for his own purposes but since he is not a believer he doesn't perceive that he is doing anything wrong. He may have to answer to God for that. Then again he may give his life and heart to Jesus tomorrow and be forgiven for his sins. In the end that is what Christ is all about.

linda22003
02-03-2012, 01:47 PM
Well said! :bravo:

noonwitch
02-03-2012, 02:10 PM
I appreciate your comments, Flagator.

AmPat
02-03-2012, 02:36 PM
That's all just personal animus directed at the Executive on your part.
Yet all based upon direct observation with a logical conclusion.

You got that right fanboy!!!
:rolleyes:
No, he is reflexively defending the Marxist and ignoring the actual proof of Ody's words. A liberal's God must be defended at all cost.

Well said! :bravo:Yes, well said but still ignores the resident liberal's attacks on "Conservative Christians."

The liberals here are vomiting the approved party-line talking points about Conservative Christians being hateful toward or not including gays, liberals, blah, blah, blah.

True, there are no categories of Christians when Christians are narrowly (and correctly) defined as those who have accepted Jesus Christ as Lord and Savior. There are however, Christians that are Conservative and Liberal with respect to their interpretation of the Bible, their lifestyle, and their political ideology.

I don't believe that Christ gives a hoot in Hell for political ideology. He does however care about morals and lifestyles. If liberal Christians believe that Christ doesn't care about whether or not a follower destroys and supports destroying fetus' in the womb (in the millions) or whether His followers "follow" the lifestyle of Sodom and Gomorah, that's their problem. They can explain their "opinion" to the Almighty.

Now if one commits to the Lordship of Jesus Christ, and is willing to repent of past sins, Christ will, and his followers should, embrace and include them. If they believe they can continue with their sinful lifestyle after committing to Christ and a Christian lifestyle, they need to re-read the Bible, again---------and again!

Bailey
02-03-2012, 02:44 PM
Since I have been asked for my two cents here, I will put them in. First of all there are no conservative or liberal Christians. There are just Christians who live the word and then there are those people who don't. Simply calling oneself a Christian doesn't make one a Christian. Going to a church or some type of worship service does not mean that one is a believer. C. S. Lewis stated something like "going to church does not make one a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes one a car".

That being said, I don't believe that Obama blasphemed. To call him a blasphemer is to believe that he understands what he is talking about and is rejecting truth in favor of falsehood. I don't think he gets it.

Christ never spoke about governments other than how a believer is to interact with them "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's." Jesus never asked a government to do anything that some liberals attribute to him. He never spoke about a ruling body performing revenue redistribution or governments giving aid to the poor. In fact he never addressed non-believers need to assist the poor at all. His call to feed and cloth the hungry was aimed directly at believers.

The things Jesus wants of us is to recognize that we are sinful people and to repent of these sins and to accept him as our Lord and Savior. Out of love for Him and in thanksgiving for our salvation we are asked to help those who need it. Helping others should not be forced, it should come from the heart. I don't give money to a charity because Jesus wants me to, I give money or time or whatever to aid another because I love Jesus, I am grateful for what he has done for me and I want to, in some small measure, do for others what HE has done for me.

Finally, what I believe about Obama's words is that I don't think Christ would like for someone to be compelled to do something that he or she doesn't want to do. If you want to force people to pay money so that something good can be done would in no way fit in with the expectations of Christ. I think Christ would be happy that people would be helped but I don't believe he is an ends versus the means type of God. Obama twisted scripture for his own purposes but since he is not a believer he doesn't perceive that he is doing anything wrong. He may have to answer to God for that. Then again he may give his life and heart to Jesus tomorrow and be forgiven for his sins. In the end that is what Christ is all about.

You said what I feel :)

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 02:48 PM
Since I have been asked for my two cents here, I will put them in. First of all there are no conservative or liberal Christians. There are just Christians who live the word and then there are those people who don't. Simply calling oneself a Christian doesn't make one a Christian. Going to a church or some type of worship service does not mean that one is a believer. C. S. Lewis stated something like "going to church does not make one a Christian any more than standing in a garage makes one a car".

That being said, I don't believe that Obama blasphemed. To call him a blasphemer is to believe that he understands what he is talking about and is rejecting truth in favor of falsehood. I don't think he gets it.

Christ never spoke about governments other than how a believer is to interact with them "render unto Caesar what is Caesar's." Jesus never asked a government to do anything that some liberals attribute to him. He never spoke about a ruling body performing revenue redistribution or governments giving aid to the poor. In fact he never addressed non-believers need to assist the poor at all. His call to feed and cloth the hungry was aimed directly at believers.

The things Jesus wants of us is to recognize that we are sinful people and to repent of these sins and to accept him as our Lord and Savior. Out of love for Him and in thanksgiving for our salvation we are asked to help those who need it. Helping others should not be forced, it should come from the heart. I don't give money to a charity because Jesus wants me to, I give money or time or whatever to aid another because I love Jesus, I am grateful for what he has done for me and I want to, in some small measure, do for others what HE has done for me.

Finally, what I believe about Obama's words is that I don't think Christ would like for someone to be compelled to do something that he or she doesn't want to do. If you want to force people to pay money so that something good can be done would in no way fit in with the expectations of Christ. I think Christ would be happy that people would be helped but I don't believe he is an ends versus the means type of God. Obama twisted scripture for his own purposes but since he is not a believer he doesn't perceive that he is doing anything wrong. He may have to answer to God for that. Then again he may give his life and heart to Jesus tomorrow and be forgiven for his sins. In the end that is what Christ is all about.

For a bit, you made sense.

They you decided you knew what was in the another man's heart and head. You set yourself up as the Judge. I direct you to Acts 17:30-31 to find out Who gets to do that.

ABC in Georgia
02-03-2012, 02:48 PM
Since I have been asked for my two cents here, I will put them in.

Thank you. It is much appreciated FlaGator!


Then again he may give his life and heart to Jesus tomorrow and be forgiven for his sins. In the end that is what Christ is all about.

Wow!

That ... is definitely what I would call a different take on "Hope and Change." :D

~ ABC

FlaGator
02-03-2012, 02:53 PM
For a bit, you made sense.

They you decided you knew what was in the another man's heart and head. You set yourself up as the Judge. I direct you to Acts 17:30-31 to find out Who gets to do that.

No, I simply based an opinion by viewing his behavior which is what Jesus tells me to do


By their fruit you will recognize them. Do people pick grapes from thornbushes, or figs from thistles? Likewise, every good tree bears good fruit, but a bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot bear bad fruit, and a bad tree cannot bear good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus, by their fruit you will recognize them.
Matthew 7:16-20

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 03:00 PM
No, I simply based an opinion by viewing his behavior which is what Jesus tells me to do


Matthew 7:16-20


Obama doesn't claim to be a prophet.

AmPat
02-03-2012, 03:13 PM
No, I simply based an opinion by viewing his behavior which is what Jesus tells me to do

Matthew 7:16-20
See, once you departed the general, non-threatening answers and remotely approached the liberal sensitivity zone, you became a target. Liberals like the peacemaker as long as he agrees with them. That's why they cherry pick the Bible, especially the Sermon on the Mount.

Obama doesn't claim to be a prophet.

Shhh! Don't tell him, he would be very upset with you. He would rather be viewed as a God however, but Prophet will do.;)

Apache
02-03-2012, 03:16 PM
Obama doesn't claim to be a prophet.

No. No, he thinks he's higher up than that...

Apache
02-03-2012, 03:18 PM
No, I simply based an opinion by viewing his behavior which is what Jesus tells me to do


Matthew 7:16-20

Hey FlaGator:p I like the insight you bring to the discussion...;)

Apache
02-03-2012, 03:19 PM
Shhh! Don't tell him, he would be very upset with you. He would rather be viewed as a God however, but Prophet will do.;)

Dangit! I gots beated to it :(

FlaGator
02-03-2012, 03:30 PM
I think that we can use Christ's teaching on false prophets to determine if someone is a person of faith or not.

I do not know what is in Obama's heart nor do I pretend to. I can only make a guess based on what I see and what I see causes me to pray for his salvation. If someone looks at me and draws the conclusion based on my behavior that I am not acting as a Christian then I hope they would take it a step farther and pray for me.

Lord knows that I am in need of all the prayer I can get. Maybe one day it will make me a better person. Until then I'll just do my best to live as I believe God wants me.

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 04:03 PM
I think that we can use Christ's teaching on false prophets to determine if someone is a person of faith or not.

You are free to use it however you like. It doesn't change what He was talking about.

Apache
02-03-2012, 05:25 PM
You are free to use it however you like. It doesn't change what He was talking about.

See, this is exactly where the Left goes wrong in trying to use scripture to prove a point. They know one verse and one verse only. You have to understand the rest of the Bible as well...

If you go around looking for the easiest part/s of the Bible to live by, you're going to be sorely surprised when your time comes Arroyo...

Arroyo_Doble
02-03-2012, 06:02 PM
See, this is exactly where the Left goes wrong in trying to use scripture to prove a point. They know one verse and one verse only. You have to understand the rest of the Bible as well...

I am not the one that used that truncated bit of Matthew 7. As to your second point, add Matthew 24 to it and it probably makes more sense.


If you go around looking for the easiest part/s of the Bible to live by, you're going to be sorely surprised when your time comes Arroyo...

I agree to a certain extent. It is why I think homosexual conduct is so vilified by some Christians more than the many other transgressions; the sin you are not tempted by is the easiest to condemn.

FlaGator
02-03-2012, 06:11 PM
You are free to use it however you like. It doesn't change what He was talking about.

No it doesn't, thankfully.

Rockntractor
02-03-2012, 06:38 PM
I am not the one that used that truncated bit of Matthew 7. As to your second point, add Matthew 24 to it and it probably makes more sense.



I agree to a certain extent. It is why I think homosexual conduct is so vilified by some Christians more than the many other transgressions; the sin you are not tempted by is the easiest to condemn.

Do you have anything better to do than troll conservative boards, did the Emo board get tired of you?

Hawkgirl
02-03-2012, 06:45 PM
I'm surprised no one has brought it up...but what happened to the separation of Church and State? It is certainly blasphemy when the President brings up religion for the sole purpose of pushing his own agenda.

FlaGator
02-03-2012, 06:46 PM
I am not the one that used that truncated bit of Matthew 7. As to your second point, add Matthew 24 to it and it probably makes more sense.



I agree to a certain extent. It is why I think homosexual conduct is so vilified by some Christians more than the many other transgressions; the sin you are not tempted by is the easiest to condemn.

I don't think that is really true. I have found that the sins I find abhorrent in others are the sins that I tend to be guilty of myself. I get mad when someone lies to me but how many times in my life have I lied to cover my butt? Since I recognize my need lie why can't I extend the same courtesy to another? Because basically I know that I am wrong to lie and since it is hard to condemn myself I condemn someone else for acting like I know I shouldn't.

Why do people condemn homosexuality over say something like adultery when both are prohibited behaviors? I suspect it is a way to excuse our own short comings. "I may be an adulterer but at least I'm not one of them faggots." A modern day version of "God, I thank you that I am not like other people—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector."

It is easy to look at others failings because it distracts us from our own. As a recovering alcoholic I can tell you that when I drank I imbibed with people who drank as much or more than me. That way I wouldn't have my abuse of drink staring me in the face. I believe that when it comes to our vices we want watch a movie instead of looking in a mirror.

On as side note, as you probably noticed I greatly reduced my posting here and I did so for many reasons. The main one, however, was that it brought out the worse in me. I would get pissed of and respond in ways that I, at the end of the day, was not proud of. I treated some people poorly and contemptuously. I love to debate points of view, but it seems some people have other intentions whether they realize them or not. For example, they will take a post and latch on to one small facet of that post that they the believe they can use to take someone down a peg or as a segue to a flame war. I got tired of doing this and having it done to me so I reduced my posting to an occasional drive by remark. Some one asked me to weigh in on this topic and it looked like a good one to discuss so I said why not.

What I've discovered, however, is that somethings never change...

Hawkgirl
02-03-2012, 06:55 PM
On as side note, as you probably noticed I greatly reduced my posting here and I did so for many reasons. The main one, however, was that it brought out the worse in me. I would get pissed of and respond in ways that I, at the end of the day, was not proud of. I treated some people poorly and contemptuously. I love to debate points of view, but it seems some people have other intentions whether they realize them or not. For example, they will take a post and latch on to one small facet of that post that they the believe they can use to take someone down a peg or as a segue to a flame war. I got tired of doing this and having it done to me so I reduced my posting to an occasional drive by remark. Some one asked me to weigh in on this topic and it looked like a good one to discuss so I said why not.

What I've discovered, however, is that somethings never change...

I'm sorry to hear this...but this is a discussion board...I have been on the different forums for many, many years and I have to say, THIS particular board is one of the most respectable ones out there. Yes, some issue do rile us up and tempers can flare..but for the most part..I find this board to be more harmonious than others. Like Ody stated in another thread, this board can be used for a few things, like sharpening your debate skills, learning about important issues we face today, as americans, and seeing other viewpoints, to name a few. I would even go on a limb and say it's a fun board. If you find yourself being pulled into negativity, just step back for a few moments or "walk it off".

Rockntractor
02-03-2012, 06:56 PM
I don't think that is really true. I have found that the sins I find abhorrent in others are the sins that I tend to be guilty of myself. I get mad when someone lies to me but how many times in my life have I lied to cover my butt? Since I recognize my need lie why can't I extend the same courtesy to another? Because basically I know that I am wrong to lie and since it is hard to condemn myself I condemn someone else for acting like I know I shouldn't.

Why do people condemn homosexuality over say something like adultery when both are prohibited behaviors? I suspect it is a way to excuse our own short comings. "I may be an adulterer but at least I'm not one of them faggots." A modern day version of "God, I thank you that I am not like other people—robbers, evildoers, adulterers—or even like this tax collector."

It is easy to look at others failings because it distracts us from our own. As a recovering alcoholic I can tell you that when I drank I imbibed with people who drank as much or more than me. That way I wouldn't have my abuse of drink staring me in the face. I believe that when it comes to our vices we want watch a movie instead of looking in a mirror.

On as side note, as you probably noticed I greatly reduced my posting here and I did so for many reasons. The main one, however, was that it brought out the worse in me. I would get pissed of and respond in ways that I, at the end of the day, was not proud of. I treated some people poorly and contemptuously. I love to debate points of view, but it seems some people have other intentions whether they realize them or not. For example, they will take a post and latch on to one small facet of that post that they the believe they can use to take someone down a peg or as a segue to a flame war. I got tired of doing this and having it done to me so I reduced my posting to an occasional drive by remark. Some one asked me to weigh in on this topic and it looked like a good one to discuss so I said why not.

What I've discovered, however, is that somethings never change...

Another very good post.
I know that often it does bring out the worst, sometimes it is just better to vent and get it out.
You're views are always welcome even though sometimes we don't always agree. Your opinions are well thought out and from the heart.

Apache
02-03-2012, 07:35 PM
I am not the one that used that truncated bit of Matthew 7. As to your second point, add Matthew 24 to it and it probably makes more sense.



I agree to a certain extent. It is why I think homosexual conduct is so vilified by some Christians more than the many other transgressions; the sin you are not tempted by is the easiest to condemn.

The use, in this case, of Matthew 7 was very fitting. Zero is not doing these things for the greater glory of God. if he were, he'd dig into his OWN pockets not everyone else's.

Meshuga Mikey
02-03-2012, 10:10 PM
scripture must be read in light of all of the material IN the Bible. Neither Ozombie nor his handlers know or would care about that.

Eisegesis (eye-si JEE-sis): it means reading into a text something that simply is not there. Usually expresses the interpreters own opinions, bias, etc., rather than the true meaning of what the author had intended.

http://www.answerbag.com/q_view/277307#ixzz1lNJTQk8L

ozombie knows no shame

AmPat
02-04-2012, 11:16 AM
I am not the one that used that truncated bit of Matthew 7. As to your second point, add Matthew 24 to it and it probably makes more sense.

I agree to a certain extent. It is why I think homosexual conduct is so vilified by some Christians more than the many other transgressions; the sin you are not tempted by is the easiest to condemn.
Ah, there it is. Another typical liberal opinion. Wrong as usual but it works well for liberals to hide behind this lie.

Homosexual conduct, and I'll throw in abortion as well, are not "vilified by Christians" because of Christian attitudes. The vilification you blame on Christians, is due to the politicization of these issues by liberals and their gods in the government. These issues are continually shoved in Christian's faces and forced on them by homosexuals and fervent, rabid, baby killing advocates.

Keep your sexual perversions in the bedroom and out of headlines and government, and it wouldn't be such an issue. Prohibit the forcing of Christian taxpayers to pay for abortions, and Christians wouldn't make such a fuss over the issue. If you want to kill your baby, it's your decision, NOBODY else should be FORCED to pay for your poor decision.

Novaheart
02-04-2012, 11:54 AM
Pretty much.

Libtards are good at recycling cherry picked parts of certain chapters of the Bible. YOu know the ones they pick up off of KOS or DU.

But actually opening a Bible is something they never do.

My experience is that liberals who were raised in mainstream Protestant and Catholic churches, often having attended religious schools, taken religion classes, been baptized and confirmed by actual ordained priests who actually have degrees in theology from actual seminaries often find themselves beating down backwoods nondenominationals, converted storefront, and Southern Baptists who think that by hanging their telltale dialect on the s sound in Christian makes them somehow more educated on the subject. In fact, some of these rubes would actually have you believe that you have to believe in the mythology to understand it, and if you understood it then you would believe it. Does that sum up your bullshit nicely? I think so.

Novaheart
02-04-2012, 12:03 PM
If you want to kill your baby, it's your decision, NOBODY else should be FORCED to pay for your poor decision.

So your true objection is the cost of abortion not the morality of abortion. Fascinating.

And your liver transplant? Should we be forced to pay for it?

AmPat
02-04-2012, 12:13 PM
So your true objection is the cost of abortion not the morality of abortion. Fascinating.
Nope, as usual, a liberal is wrong. Re-read and do your homework. Maybe you'll graduate high school with your grandchildren (or grand nephews).


And your liver transplant? Should we be forced to pay for it?

No you shouldn't and won't as I pay for my own responsibilities (look up the word). Now if you want to pay for my medical insurance, I'd accept your CHARITY. Are you offering? :rolleyes:

Janice
02-04-2012, 01:27 PM
Obie-Wan calculates that there is a certain number of people in America whose values are from religion. But, he also calculates that his sheep get their values from the State. So Zippy reads confiscation into Scripture.

Biblical charity, as is all charity, is voluntary. 0bama's statements about biblical matters reveal an ignorance of Jesus and His statements, and their relationship to conscience of which he appears to have little use for.

Even the devil quoted Scripture when it suited him. And how many calamities in this world began with the population first being "cleansed" of their religious values?

This man is sick. His disdain for all things christian and/or American aside.

fettpett
02-04-2012, 05:30 PM
Obie-Wan calculates that there is a certain number of people in America whose values are from religion. But, he also calculates that his sheep get their values from the State. So Zippy reads confiscation into Scripture.

Biblical charity, as is all charity, is voluntary. 0bama's statements about biblical matters reveal an ignorance of Jesus and His statements, and their relationship to conscience of which he appears to have little use for.

Even the devil quoted Scripture when it suited him. And how many calamities in this world began with the population first being "cleansed" of their religious values?

This man is sick. His disdain for all things christian and/or American aside.


hey now, don't be insulting the late great Alec Guinness like that :mad::mad: :D

Apache
02-04-2012, 05:48 PM
My experience is that liberals who were raised in mainstream Protestant and Catholic churches, often having attended religious schools, taken religion classes, been baptized and confirmed by actual ordained priests who actually have degrees in theology from actual seminaries often find themselves beating down backwoods nondenominationals, converted storefront, and Southern Baptists who think that by hanging their telltale dialect on the s sound in Christian makes them somehow more educated on the subject. In fact, some of these rubes would actually have you believe that you have to believe in the mythology to understand it, and if you understood it then you would believe it. Does that sum up your bullshit nicely? I think so.

:rolleyes:

Loads, right? I bet your "experience" is a load of crap...


Go to the garden section. They'll buy what you're selling...

Odysseus
02-04-2012, 06:43 PM
That's all just personal animus directed at the Executive on your part.
Hmmm... for that statement to be true, my statement would have to be devoid of facts. Allow me to parse myself:

Sure, there are liberal Christians. Calling Obama a Christian is a stretch, not because I think that he's a secret Muslim, but because he has never demonstrated any understanding of, or belief in, Christianity.
Has Obama ever demonstrated an understanding of scripture or Christianity or belief in it? He's paid lip service to it when it suited him, but his quotations from scripture are invariably shallow and lack any understanding of the underlying doctrines.


Obama's entire experience with Christianity appears to have been limited to his twenty years in Jeremiah Wright's church, where he managed to avoid actually listening to any of the sermons or dealing with anyone.
Again, I don't see how this is not factual. Obama was raised by his mother, a leftist and atheist. His grandparents were leftists and atheists. His father, Barack Hussein Obama Sr., was a Muslim. His stepfather, Lelo Soetero, was also a Muslim. His only sustained period of church-going was his time at Jeremiah Wright's church. Do you dispute that?

As for his not listening to any of the sermons or dealing with anyone, by his own admission, Obama spent twenty years in that church, but managed to avoid all of the controversial sermons.


Wright's brand of Black Liberation theology is a violent revolutionary doctrine of racial separation that uses superficial trappings of Christianity and misrepresents it in order to have it serve as a delivery system for Wright's Marxism and racism.
Do you deny this? If so, here's a taste of Rev. Wright's comments:


"The government lied about Pearl Harbor too. They knew the Japanese were going to attack. Governments lie. The government lied about the Gulf of Tonkin Incident. They wanted that resolution to get us in the Vietnam War. Governments lie. The government lied about Nelson Mandela and our CIA helped put him in prison and keep him there for 27 years. The South African government lied on Nelson Mandela. Governments lie."
>SNIP<
"The government lied about inventing the HIV virus as a means of genocide against people of color. Governments lie."
>SNIP<
"The government lied about weapons of mass destruction in Iraq being a threat to the United States peace. And guess what else? If they don't find them some weapons of mass destruction, they gonna do just like the LAPD, and plant the some weapons of mass destruction. Governments lie."
>SNIP<
"And the United States of America government, when it came to treating her citizens of Indian descent fairly, she failed. She put them on reservations. When it came to treating her citizens of Japanese descent fairly, she failed. She put them in internment prison camps. When it came to treating her citizens of African descent fairly, America failed. She put them in chains, the government put them on slave quarters, put them on auction blocks, put them in cotton field, put them in inferior schools, put them in substandard housing, put them in scientific experiments, put them in the lowest paying jobs, put them outside the equal protection of the law, kept them out of their racist bastions of higher education and locked them into positions of hopelessness and helplessness. The government gives them the drugs, builds bigger prisons, passes a three-strike law and then wants us to sing 'God Bless America.' No, no, no, not God Bless America. God damn America — that's in the Bible — for killing innocent people. God damn America, for treating our citizens as less than human. God damn America, as long as she tries to act like she is God, and she is supreme. The United States government has failed the vast majority of her citizens of African descent.."

And that was just from one sermon. Wright accused the US government of allowing Pearl Harbor, imprisoning Nelson Mandela, framing OJ, creating AIDS, and you know that he believed that long before he got up and preached it. And the audience knew it too. Nobody walked out of his sermon. Nobody stood up and said, "Bull". They sat there and gave him every Amen that he asked for. But somehow, Obama didn't notice that this was what the pastor who brought him into his church, who officiated at his wedding, who baptized his daughters and who provided the title for one of his autobiographies was a racist, hateful whackjob. Go figure.

BTW, given how little Obama has learned from his time in college and government, I'm perfectly willing to believe that he spent twenty years in the pews without noticing anything that was going on around him. His self-absorption and narcissism make it unlikely that he was able to focus on worship of anything but himself.
If Obama's grades were any good, he'd have unsealed them. The man is not modest about his accomplishments, although the accomplishments certainly are. This brings us to his narcissism. This really ought be its own thread, but the symptoms of malignant narcissism have been well documented, and are easily observed in Obama:


An unrealistic sense of superiority ("Grandiose")
Ever heard one of his speeches?
Pursues power at all costs, lacks normal inhibitions in its pursuit
Been watching how he governs? How his health care bill was passed? His stimulus bill? How he disregards congressional oversight?
Concerns limited to expressing socially appropriate response when convenient; devalues and exploits others without remorse
Notice that Obama has no close friends.
Lacks values; easily bored; often changes course
These traits have been repeatedly observed in Obama. He even admitted as such.
Traumatic childhood undercutting true sense of self-esteem and/or learning that he/she doesn't need to be considerate of others
Abandoned by his father, then his mother, and raised by his grandparents, who left him with a radical pedophile as a mentor, sounds traumatic to me.

Yet all based upon direct observation with a logical conclusion.
See, you used the word "logical"... Now he's all confused.


Obama doesn't claim to be a prophet.
Being a prophet is a step down from being the messiah.

Novaheart
02-04-2012, 10:43 PM
No you shouldn't and won't as I pay for my own responsibilities (look up the word). Now if you want to pay for my medical insurance, I'd accept your CHARITY. Are you offering? :rolleyes:

But according to you, you aren't paying for it. You keep insisting that when we have Single Payer, and citizens are paying into the system for it, that they will be socialism, or an idiot's idea of free, or whatever screw you have loose that week. But you don't regard your government healthcare as free, you think you pay for it. You don't. You pay a portion of the administrative cost in a self (US Treasury) insured system and a fraction of what it will actually cost through the end of your life unless you simply drop dead.

Novaheart
02-04-2012, 10:47 PM
[INDENT]Obama's entire experience with Christianity appears to have been limited to his twenty years in Jeremiah Wright's church, where he managed to avoid actually listening to any of the sermons or dealing with anyone.

What a twisted world we live in where the Church Of Christ is not considered Christian, but the Latter Day Saints are simply because they have "Jesus Christ" on the marquee.

The Mormon Church is much closer to the Church of Scientology in its creation and design than any mainstream Christian denomination. But put an R in front of it, and it becomes palatable to you? Now that is twisted.

Novaheart
02-04-2012, 10:52 PM
[INDENT]"The government lied about Pearl Harbor too. They knew the Japanese were going to attack. .

This is or was a fairly commonly held belief amongst some people all over the political spectrum. SOME Right Wingers believe "Rosenberg (Roosevelt) knew" and sacrificed American lives to bring us into the war at the behest of "The Joos". SOME Left Wing believes that the industrialists wanted us in the war to open up the treasury and make billions in munitions. The real out there folks have intricate conspiracy theories variously involving the Royal Family, Jewish Bankers (always a favorite) and international communists.

Odysseus
02-05-2012, 01:38 AM
This is or was a fairly commonly held belief amongst some people all over the political spectrum. SOME Right Wingers believe "Rosenberg (Roosevelt) knew" and sacrificed American lives to bring us into the war at the behest of "The Joos". SOME Left Wing believes that the industrialists wanted us in the war to open up the treasury and make billions in munitions. The real out there folks have intricate conspiracy theories variously involving the Royal Family, Jewish Bankers (always a favorite) and international communists.

Yes, and we call these people nutjobs. Wright also accused the US government of manufacturing AIDS. Again, a fundamental difference between left and right is that the vast majority of conservatives have no patience for birthers, Pearl Harbor conspirators and the like, but the left almost never calls out its fringe. For example, look at the various 9/11 truthers who hold prominent positions in academia, the media and even the Obama administration. For example, the petition that got Van Jones in hot water had a number of prominent signatories from the left, including Ed Asner, Medea Benjamin, Daniel Ellsberg, Jodie Evans, Richie Havens,Mimi Kennedy, Rabbi Michael Lerner, Cynthia McKinney and Howard Zinn. Benjamin and Evans are serious fundraisers for Obama. Lerner was Hillary Clinton's adviser on a number of issues. McKinney was a member of congress, and Zinn's books are used throughout the US educational system.

AmPat
02-05-2012, 11:29 AM
[QUOTE][QUOTE=Novaheart;480658]But according to you, you aren't paying for it. LIAR! I keep telling your idiot @$$ just the opposite.


You keep insisting that when we have Single Payer, and citizens are paying into the system for it, that they will be socialism, or an idiot's idea of free, or whatever screw you have loose that week. LIAR! I don't keep insisting that, but it is nevertheless true.


But you don't regard your government healthcare as free, you think you pay for it. You don't. You pay a portion of the administrative cost in a self (US Treasury) insured system and a fraction of what it will actually cost through the end of your life unless you simply drop dead.

I realize that you are a stoopid liberal and that anything I say that goes against your liberal gods is threatening to you, but do try to keep up. If possible, I would write this to you in Crayon to keep it from being too adult for your feeble little brain, but alas, not possible. The cost of my health care is not the discussion, my health INSURANCE WAS. Do you understand the difference between the two?:rolleyes:

Now for little Retard boy who cannot understand simple concepts:
I Pay For My Health Insurance just like Teachers pay for theirs. Is that clear enough? I Chose to spend 26 years of my life in the military, a VALID expense for the government. That qualified me to PAY for post service INSURANCE.
I worked those 26 years.
I earned the right to retire.
I PAY FOR MY INSURANCE! Did you get that DUmmy? I PAY for it with the proceeds of my EARNED retirement.
No liberal Jackass pays it, I do. ( I will accept your charity however if you desire to continue your idiocy).

I'm not concerned about fractions of cost etc, or anything else as it is the system I paid 26 years of my life into and now pay directly. I get that you want to justify your socialism using whatever means, it just won't work. I pay to a health insurance and receive health CARE from a HOSPITAL when I need it. That HEALTH CARE does not have US ARMY written on it. It is a local, PRIVATE Health CARE center. Pull the finger out of your nose for a minute and try to get that through your diseased, atrophied brain. There is a world of difference between health CARE and health INSURANCE.


Now for homework, go write the definitions for health INSURANCE and health CARE 1000 times each. Class dismissed!

Novaheart
02-05-2012, 11:58 AM
The cost of my health care is not the discussion, my health INSURANCE WAS. Do you understand the difference between the two?:rolleyes:

Now for little Retard boy who cannot understand simple concepts:
I Pay For My Health Insurance just like Teachers pay for theirs. Is that clear enough? I Chose to spend 26 years of my life in the military, a VALID expense for the government. That qualified me to PAY for post service INSURANCE.

It looks like insurance, but it isn't. The government is self-insured, ie they pay for all of your covered health care expenses. You may well have a layer on top of that which appears to be an insurance company, but they are actually a delivery system ie administrative. It's like Medicare Advantage; the premium paid to Humana or United in a Medicare advantage program is not a premium in the sense that you are buying a policy from them, it's a program participation fee negotiated between the government and the company for administrative costs and profit.

What is Tricare premium? Something between $53 and $197 a month? That might get you a catastrophic policy with a $10,000 deductible in the real insurance market. When you pay $17 a day to be in the hospital, the rest of the negotiated fee is paid by the taxpayers.

Meshuga Mikey
02-05-2012, 12:52 PM
Barry wants to make it possible for Mooselims to engage in sharia law...in America.

hes never said anything regarding our Liberties as Christians.

hes a marxist FIRST.....a muslim by accident....and a ficitonal "Christian" last for convenience sake
"

AmPat
02-05-2012, 01:03 PM
It looks like insurance, but it isn't. The government is self-insured, ie they pay for all of your covered health care expenses. You may well have a layer on top of that which appears to be an insurance company, but they are actually a delivery system ie administrative. It's like Medicare Advantage; the premium paid to Humana or United in a Medicare advantage program is not a premium in the sense that you are buying a policy from them, it's a program participation fee negotiated between the government and the company for administrative costs and profit.

What is Tricare premium? Something between $53 and $197 a month? That might get you a catastrophic policy with a $10,000 deductible in the real insurance market. When you pay $17 a day to be in the hospital, the rest of the negotiated fee is paid by the taxpayers.

Call it what you want, I pay for it. I don't set the cost or price, I simply pay the monthly premium. I paid for group health care as a teacher also, do you attack them as well? Why not? It's less than other GROUP HEALTH INSURANCE! TRICARE is Insurance regardless your euphemistic semantics. Simply because you weren't man enough, or brave enough to qualify or join an Armed Service is not a good reason to attack the services provided to braver men than you. You were wrong and cannot stomach the thought that you were thoroughly schooled,,,,,,,again by a Conservative. Now take your wounded ego and move on to something a little less complicated.