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txradioguy
08-10-2012, 07:52 AM
KABUL, AFGHANISTAN A man in an Afghan army uniform shot and killed three American service members on Friday morning in southern Afghanistan, the U.S. military command said, the third attack on coalition forces by their Afghan counterparts in a week. The Taliban claimed the shooter joined the insurgency after the attack.

The shooting took place in Sangin district of Helmand province, said U.S. military spokeswoman Maj. Lori Hodge. She gave no details and said the military were investigating.

Taliban spokesman Qari Yousef Ahmadi said by telephone that the attacker, whom he identified as a member of Helmand police named Asadullah, had joined the insurgency after his attack.

Ahmadi said the man had been helping U.S. forces train the Afghan Local Police troops.

The U.S. is hoping the Afghan Local Police will be a key force to fight the insurgency after most international troops withdraw.

The attack is the third this week on coalition soldiers by Afghans who are training to take over once most international forces leave in 2014.

On Tuesday, two gunmen wearing Afghan army uniforms killed a U.S. soldier and wounded two others in Paktia province in the east. And on Thursday, two Afghan soldiers tried to gun down a group of NATO troops outside a military base in eastern Afghanistan. No international forces were killed, but one of the attackers was killed as NATO forces shot back.

This year has seen a rising number of so-called "green-on-blue" attacks in which Afghan security forces, or insurgents disguised in their uniforms, kill their U.S. or NATO partners.

So far this year, 30 coalition troops have been killed in 20 such attacks, according to an Associated Press tally. That compares with 11 fatal attacks and 20 deaths the previous year. In 2007 and 2008 there was a combined total of four attacks and four deaths.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/08/10/three-us-troops-killed-by-man-in-afghan-army-uniform/

AmPat
08-10-2012, 09:56 AM
Too bad we can't equip these A-Hole the way our troops are when a DIMoRAT visits, totally disarmed.:livid:

Odysseus
08-10-2012, 11:16 AM
KABUL, AFGHANISTAN A man in an Afghan army uniform shot and killed three American service members on Friday morning in southern Afghanistan, the U.S. military command said, the third attack on coalition forces by their Afghan counterparts in a week. The Taliban claimed the shooter joined the insurgency after the attack.

The shooting took place in Sangin district of Helmand province, said U.S. military spokeswoman Maj. Lori Hodge. She gave no details and said the military were investigating.

Taliban spokesman Qari Yousef Ahmadi said by telephone that the attacker, whom he identified as a member of Helmand police named Asadullah, had joined the insurgency after his attack.

Ahmadi said the man had been helping U.S. forces train the Afghan Local Police troops.

The U.S. is hoping the Afghan Local Police will be a key force to fight the insurgency after most international troops withdraw.

The attack is the third this week on coalition soldiers by Afghans who are training to take over once most international forces leave in 2014.

On Tuesday, two gunmen wearing Afghan army uniforms killed a U.S. soldier and wounded two others in Paktia province in the east. And on Thursday, two Afghan soldiers tried to gun down a group of NATO troops outside a military base in eastern Afghanistan. No international forces were killed, but one of the attackers was killed as NATO forces shot back.

This year has seen a rising number of so-called "green-on-blue" attacks in which Afghan security forces, or insurgents disguised in their uniforms, kill their U.S. or NATO partners.

So far this year, 30 coalition troops have been killed in 20 such attacks, according to an Associated Press tally. That compares with 11 fatal attacks and 20 deaths the previous year. In 2007 and 2008 there was a combined total of four attacks and four deaths.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/08/10/three-us-troops-killed-by-man-in-afghan-army-uniform/

Okay, we need to do a bit of cultural thinking. What can we do that would resonate with the Afghans? If this had happened to another Afghan, there would be a blood feud and the perpetrator's whole clan would be targeted. The Afghans value family over everything else, and they do not have an understanding of individual responsibility. Any action that we take has to work on the clan or tribal networks. We don't necessarily have to go after the clan or tribe directly, but we can certainly provide support to rival clans with the understanding that we are doing that as a means of reprisal. Thus, if you hurt us, your rival clan gets money, weapons, traiining, the capacity to take the fight back to you in way that you will understand and fear and, in the long term, the honor of taking you down. These are tangible things that the Afghans understand under their honor code and customs and will provide the motivation that we need to get them to, if not be on our side, at least stop undermining us.

Cicero
08-10-2012, 12:52 PM
This is clearly a case of workplace violence rather than terrorism. Janet Napolitano can give you all the details. :bullshit:

Gina
08-10-2012, 01:38 PM
I realize it's important to get info from the Taliban, but is it just me or is it troubling that the AP has a contact within the Taliban? I wouldn't be a very good reporter because I'd give up the source and make sure he was captured or killed.

I really respect Richard Engel but I don't know how he can be in a war zone (Syria) and not give the US info that he doesn't report on TV. Maybe he does?

AmPat
08-10-2012, 02:28 PM
Okay, we need to do a bit of cultural thinking. What can we do that would resonate with the Afghans? If this had happened to another Afghan, there would be a blood feud and the perpetrator's whole clan would be targeted. The Afghans value family over everything else, and they do not have an understanding of individual responsibility. Any action that we take has to work on the clan or tribal networks. We don't necessarily have to go after the clan or tribe directly, but we can certainly provide support to rival clans with the understanding that we are doing that as a means of reprisal. Thus, if you hurt us, your rival clan gets money, weapons, traiining, the capacity to take the fight back to you in way that you will understand and fear and, in the long term, the honor of taking you down. These are tangible things that the Afghans understand under their honor code and customs and will provide the motivation that we need to get them to, if not be on our side, at least stop undermining us.
Ally in uniform. I say hang him for the murdering traitor that he is.

Odysseus
08-10-2012, 02:42 PM
Ally in uniform. I say hang him for the murdering traitor that he is.

Yes, but that doesn't solve the problem. He's a jihadi. Hanging him gives him entrance to paradise and 72 virgins, not to mention the fact that the Taliban or some other agency will pick up the tab for supporting his family. You have to punish him in a way that resonates with his tribe or clan, and which will put pressure on the next guy not to repeat the stupidity, and the way to do that is to punish the tribe or clan. We don't have a culture that will permit reprisals in kind against his family or tribe, so we have to use proxies. Bankrolling his tribal or clan enemies will effectively punish his tribe/clan, and let them know that future attacks will result in further weakening their status. The more dishonor that we impose on his support network of family, clan and tribe, the more shame they will impose on him, and we'll see fewer attacks.

AmPat
08-10-2012, 02:53 PM
Yes, but that doesn't solve the problem. He's a jihadi. Hanging him gives him entrance to paradise and 72 virgins, not to mention the fact that the Taliban or some other agency will pick up the tab for supporting his family. You have to punish him in a way that resonates with his tribe or clan, and which will put pressure on the next guy not to repeat the stupidity, and the way to do that is to punish the tribe or clan. We don't have a culture that will permit reprisals in kind against his family or tribe, so we have to use proxies. Bankrolling his tribal or clan enemies will effectively punish his tribe/clan, and let them know that future attacks will result in further weakening their status. The more dishonor that we impose on his support network of family, clan and tribe, the more shame they will impose on him, and we'll see fewer attacks.
Don't get me wrong, I agree. I'm saying he should be hanged as well. Hanging is a disgraceful way to die, even for a muzzie demon.

Odysseus
08-10-2012, 03:41 PM
Don't get me wrong, I agree. I'm saying he should be hanged as well. Hanging is a disgraceful way to die, even for a muzzie demon.

Beheading is considered worse. Personally, I think that he should be force-fed pork and then given a sex change and sent back to his tribe.

txradioguy
08-10-2012, 06:19 PM
I realize it's important to get info from the Taliban, but is it just me or is it troubling that the AP has a contact within the Taliban? I wouldn't be a very good reporter because I'd give up the source and make sure he was captured or killed.

I really respect Richard Engel but I don't know how he can be in a war zone (Syria) and not give the US info that he doesn't report on TV. Maybe he does?

The Taliban call the reporters in country. And they tend to call from a country code that locates them in Pakistan.

As much as I dislike AP...at least they're slightly better than The Nation when it comes to Taliban propaganda. The Nation online publishes Taliban propaganda statements without disclaimers of any kind.

Engel is no better than Bernard Shaw or any of these other idiots that seem to think the fact they're a journalist trumps any kind of allegiance to their country.

Shaw if you remember...famously refused to be debriefed about his experience in the al-Rasheed hotel in Baghdad the first night of the air campaign in 1991.

txradioguy
08-10-2012, 06:21 PM
Okay, we need to do a bit of cultural thinking. What can we do that would resonate with the Afghans? If this had happened to another Afghan, there would be a blood feud and the perpetrator's whole clan would be targeted. The Afghans value family over everything else, and they do not have an understanding of individual responsibility. Any action that we take has to work on the clan or tribal networks. We don't necessarily have to go after the clan or tribe directly, but we can certainly provide support to rival clans with the understanding that we are doing that as a means of reprisal. Thus, if you hurt us, your rival clan gets money, weapons, traiining, the capacity to take the fight back to you in way that you will understand and fear and, in the long term, the honor of taking you down. These are tangible things that the Afghans understand under their honor code and customs and will provide the motivation that we need to get them to, if not be on our side, at least stop undermining us.

That's crazy talk. How dare you suggest we adopt an ROE that actually works.

Odysseus
08-10-2012, 07:56 PM
That's crazy talk. How dare you suggest we adopt an ROE that actually works.

I credit my prior enlisted time for my common sense. :evil-grin:

Gina
08-11-2012, 12:44 PM
The Taliban call the reporters in country. And they tend to call from a country code that locates them in Pakistan.

As much as I dislike AP...at least they're slightly better than The Nation when it comes to Taliban propaganda. The Nation online publishes Taliban propaganda statements without disclaimers of any kind.

Engel is no better than Bernard Shaw or any of these other idiots that seem to think the fact they're a journalist trumps any kind of allegiance to their country.

Shaw if you remember...famously refused to be debriefed about his experience in the al-Rasheed hotel in Baghdad the first night of the air campaign in 1991.

What if we dipped our bullets in pig's blood? Or just made an announcement that we do?

Rumor has it someone I know well will be heading to Afghanistan in an undisclosed time frame. This whole development doesn't make me happy atal. 25 killings of US troops in about a month in this fashion? ugh

Odysseus
08-11-2012, 08:08 PM
What if we dipped our bullets in pig's blood? Or just made an announcement that we do?

They would riot and we'd have to use them. The problem is that we have demonstrated that we won't. They know it, and that gives them freedom of operation that we lack.


Rumor has it someone I know well will be heading to Afghanistan in an undisclosed time frame. This whole development doesn't make me happy atal. 25 killings of US troops in about a month in this fashion? ugh

He'll be okay. The bad guys only do this when they can make a quick exit. Unless he's involved with training the Afghans off post, he'll be safe.

Gina
08-11-2012, 08:23 PM
They would riot and we'd have to use them. The problem is that we have demonstrated that we won't. They know it, and that gives them freedom of operation that we lack.



He'll be okay. The bad guys only do this when they can make a quick exit. Unless he's involved with training the Afghans off post, he'll be safe.

He's an 88M. Good, he'll be ok! :smile-new: