Lee County Sherff Scott ethics inquiry to take weeks

[LogansPapa]

Will settle whether Sheriff Scott violated federal act


http://ms2.naplesnews.com/npdn/content/img/photos/2008/10/06/081006NS-da-PALINRALLY772_t220.jpg

By Rachel Myers
rmyers@news-press.com

Federal and state investigations into allegations that Lee County Sheriff Mike Scott acted illegally or unethically by speaking at a political rally while on duty and in uniform could take weeks - or possibly months - to complete.

Scott has denied any wrongdoing after he referred to the Democratic presidential candidate by his full name, Barack Hussein Obama, at a rally for Republican vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin on Monday.

Critics say that by doing so, Scott implied Obama is a Muslim. Obama, who is named for his Kenyan father, is a Christian.

Representatives with the U.S. Office of Special Counsel and the Florida Commission on Ethics say it is too soon to determine whether Scott has broken federal laws or state ethics policies.

At the county level, statutes govern employees' political actions while in uniform. The sheriff is an elected official, not an employee. His office's budget is approved by county commissioners, but his salary is paid by the governor's office.

http://www.news-press.com/article/20081009/NEWS01/810090380/1075

[Rebel Yell]

I don't have a problem with hm callnig the prophet by his earthly name.

I DO have a problem with him speaking at a campaign rally in uniform. I don't care which candidate it's for.

[Chuck58]

How about investigations into all those times politicians appear with cops, firemen, et al lined up behind them in uniform? Wanna bet whether they're all on duty? They're usually selected by their Chief or Sheriff and told to appear - in full uniform. So, what's wrong with a Sheriff, the Chief Law Enforcement officer of a County appearing in uniform?

Henceforth, every post I make anywhere on any forum, every email I send, every time I mention the savior by name, I'm going to include his full name. Barack HUSSEIN Obama.

And, on those sites where it's possible, it will appear as Barack HUSSEIN Obama, with HUSSEIN in bold.

It's occurred to me - I'm a bit slow sometimes - that when was the last time we've heard Barack HUSSEIN Obama mention his full name.......anywhere? The middle name seemed to cease to exist when he began running for POTUS.

[Cold Warrior]

...
It's occurred to me - I'm a bit slow sometimes - that when was the last time we've heard Barack HUSSEIN Obama mention his full name.......anywhere? The middle name seemed to cease to exist when he began running for POTUS.

Did he use it before running for POTUS? Most people don't. I mean, when's the last time Sidney mentioned his middle name?

[SarasotaRepub]

Did he use it before running for POTUS?

Who cares? But he certainly seems to have a problem with anyone using it now.
Funny that...and tough shit too.

:p

[SaintLouieWoman]

I don't have a problem with hm callnig the prophet by his earthly name.

I DO have a problem with him speaking at a campaign rally in uniform. I don't care which candidate it's for.

At my former home in a municipality in StL County, the members of the police department and fire department went door to door, campaigning for a specific candidate. I had a problem with that, big time. If you didn't agree with their choice, would they let your house burn to the ground or let a 911 call go unheeded?

There seems to be a lot of outrage over this particular person----probably because he's for McCain.

Where's the outrage over the Acorn folks blatant stealing of the election? Oh, wait, they support the Annointed One.

[LogansPapa]

So, what's wrong with a Sheriff, the Chief Law Enforcement officer of a County appearing in uniform?.

Elected. Against the law? Hello?

[Elspeth]

Elected. Against the law? Hello?

Yes. That is the issue.

But using Barry's middle name? Hell, he used it himself. That's already out there.

[Chuck58]

Nonsense. You see Sheriffs campaiging for election in uniform. You'll see the IACP endorse a candidate with a Chief in full regalia shaking the candidates hand and a whole raft of politically appointed Chiefs standing in the background, all in full uniform - maybe for the first time since being appointed to the job.

I tend to think he stressed the name HUSSEIN in his speech and that lit off somebody.

[LogansPapa]

Hatch Act for State and Local Employees

* Permitted Activities
* Prohibited Activities
* Penalties for Violating the Hatch Act
* Advisories for State and Local Employees

http://www.osc.gov/hatchact.htm

[Chuck58]

Hatch Act for State and Local Employees

* Permitted Activities
* Prohibited Activities
* Penalties for Violating the Hatch Act
* Advisories for State and Local Employees

http://www.osc.gov/hatchact.htm

Yes, I'm familiar with it.

Permitted Activities

Covered state and local employees may-

* run for public office in nonpartisan elections
* campaign for and hold office in political clubs and organizations
* actively campaign for candidates for public office in partisan and nonpartisan elections
* contribute money to political organizations and attend political fundraising functions

Now, being Federal and written by lawyers, I've little doubt any of the act is so cut and dried. What I see above, says he can campaign if he wants. That's entirely too simple though. No Fed law is ever written to be easily understandable to human beings.

[LibraryLady]

The statement from Sheriff Mike Scott (who was elected as a Republican Sheriff)



• Everyone seems to agree on the underlying issue…my mention of a Presidential candidate’s full, legal name of record. There were no accusations, innuendos, untruths, or malicious words before or after the candidate’s name; although many others have made inflammatory statements about the candidate’s character, etc. I did not change my tone or otherwise punctuate or repeat the name with any verbal or physical emphasis.

• “Why” did I use the Candidate’s full, legal name of record? Despite varying inferences, interpretations, opinions, and extrapolations; the answer is because I wanted to, much like I wanted to voice my support for the Barron Collier Marching Band.

• The issue of my status as an elected official participating in a political rally has been raised along with the suggestion that this somehow clouds my representation of all constituents. I have not heard similar concern over the many other elected officials that day and everyday engaging in the same activities across our state and country. For example – Governor Crist is the Governor of all Florida’s people and his support of the Republican ticket in no way implies diminished concern for anyone opposing his political choice. Likewise, my political choices against the backdrop of my proven record of service, in no way suggest diminished concern for any individual or group.

• The issue of my appearance at the rally in uniform has been raised. It is noteworthy that I recently completed my primary campaign and continue my general campaign in the same uniform. My practice has been to wear the uniform at all times and as is undisputed, I am on duty 24/7 and 365. It is also noteworthy that I joined my fellow Florida Sheriffs in Tampa very recently for a political rally…all were in full uniform. At no time during this week’s rally did I mention the agency I represent; however, I was introduced by my official title. Given the introduction and my widespread name and face recognition in this area, I am satisfied that my apparel is irrelevant and the same reactions would have resulted had I been wearing a suit and tie.

• The issue of the NAACP and Coalition for Justice instigating the “race card” and somehow deciding that my political choice and/or use of a candidate’s full, legal name of record makes me a racist flies in the face of reason. The strong support these groups have always provided me is rooted in my tireless efforts to work equally hard for all of Lee County. I delivered the Dunbar Community Policing Office and shocked business owners along MLK Jr. Blvd. by regularly stopping in to say hello during my first term as Sheriff. If their support is so shallow as to wane over one (1) word that was legal, accurate, and void of supporting malice beyond dispute, then I will respectfully move on without their political support and without change to my loyalty to them or their constituents.

• Finally, the complaint made to Federal authorities relative to the first four (4) items listed above. Much as when our agency or yours is called with accusations of wrongdoing, we receive the concern and begin an initial inquiry to determine if further investigation is warranted. I have not been contacted by any authority at this point and am completely unaware of any rules or regulations violated. If “elected officials” are governed by the Hatch Act or similar laws governing political activity…I refer you back to item three (3) above and the fact that everyday and nearly around the clock across our country, elected officials are engaged in political activities. In short, I expect to be fully cleared of any wrongdoing.

I noticed they said many of the calls were from out-of-state - DUers at work!!



According to the Florida Sheriff’s Association in Tallahassee, a sheriff can wear his uniform however he sees fit.

“It is up to his discretion,” said William Powers, general legal council for the association. “Deputies can not campaign in their uniforms, but the incumbent can, because he’s an elected official.”
http://www.news-press.com/article/20081008/NEWS01/81008001/1002/NEWS01

[Cold Warrior]

Who cares? But he certainly seems to have a problem with anyone using it now.
Funny that...and tough shit too.

:p

I don't care, but Chuckie seems to...


Originally Posted by Chuck58
...
It's occurred to me - I'm a bit slow sometimes - that when was the last time we've heard Barack HUSSEIN Obama mention his full name.......anywhere? The middle name seemed to cease to exist when he began running for POTUS.

[Chuck58]

I don't care if he changes his name to John Smith.

It seems to bother him, or his campaign, that somebody mentions his middle name though.

[LogansPapa]

Why doesn’t McCain use Obama’s middle name then? Oh wait - he uses euphemisms like "that one." ;)

[Chuck58]

Dunno why McCain doesn't use Barack HUSSEIN Obama's middle name. If I see him, I'll be sure to ask him - after I ask why he sided with kerry the Traitor and signed off on the Traitor's Senate Select Committee on POW/MIA affairs a dozen or so years ago. I mean, I'll ask McCain if he'll still talk to me after I finish questioning him about the committee findings.

[Cold Warrior]

Dunno why McCain doesn't use Barack HUSSEIN Obama's middle name. If I see him, I'll be sure to ask him - after I ask why he sided with kerry the Traitor and signed off on the Traitor's Senate Select Committee on POW/MIA affairs a dozen or so years ago. I mean, I'll ask McCain if he'll still talk to me after I finish questioning him about the committee findings.

I agree. I think McCain should use it all the time and should invite those KKK folks who some here want to support him to his rallies. After picking Palin, it really doesn't matter.

[Constitutionally Speaking]

Elected. Against the law? Hello?


I don't know the law where this person lives, but where I live Sheriffs are elected as members of a political Party - usually Republican or Democrats.

I don't see any problem here, unless the laws in that area are different.

[AmPat]

Did he use it before running for POTUS? Most people don't. I mean, when's the last time Sidney mentioned his middle name?

Baines and Milhouse were commonly known. I saw no outrage then, why now? Is something shameful about being named Hussein?

[Sonnabend]

Hey LP

I'll meet your Hatch act and raise you an Obama breaking the Logan Act. Or being investigated for ACORN vote fraud.

By the way, when do we get to see Barry Soetero's birth certificate?
His certificate of US Citizenship?
His Oath of Allegiance?

[Goldwater]

Cops at an event for security get forced into photo ops with politicians all the time, poor guys.

[Cold Warrior]

Baines and Milhouse were commonly known. I saw no outrage then, why now? Is something shameful about being named Hussein?

Milhouse

http://wiw.org/~jess/wp-content/uploads/2007/07/milhouse.gif

Milhous

http://images.businessweek.com/ss/07/04/0426_dow/image/4_richard-nixon.jpg

[Goldwater]

Nixon got viciously attacked for that middle name, it's a miracle he won.

[PoliCon]

the only thing I see that is unethical is taking away the free speech rights of someone just because you might not like what they have to say.

[AmPat]

Milhouse

http://wiw.org/~jess/wp-content/uploads/2007/07/milhouse.gif

Milhous

http://images.businessweek.com/ss/07/04/0426_dow/image/4_richard-nixon.jpg

Your not-so-subtle point is noted. You apparently got the point but chose to pick on spelling. :rolleyes:

[Cold Warrior]

Your not-so-subtle point is noted. You apparently got the point but chose to pick on spelling. :rolleyes:

I wasn't making much of a point, rather just taking advantage of an opportunity to post a funny similarity in the poses of the two. And, btw, I voted for Nixon in 72 and, to my recollection, he was always referred to as "Richard M Nixon" if his full name was used during the campaign. Could be wrong on that (it's been 30+ years), but I looked back at some of the commercials on both sides and none used "Milhous."

[AmPat]

I wasn't making much of a point, rather just taking advantage of an opportunity to post a funny similarity in the poses of the two. And, btw, I voted for Nixon in 72 and, to my recollection, he was always referred to as "Richard M Nixon" if his full name was used during the campaign. Could be wrong on that (it's been 30+ years), but I looked back at some of the commercials on both sides and none used "Milhous."

Wow! Your'e OLD. :D Me too. :(

[biccat]

Hatch Act for State and Local Employees
Is an elected official an employee?

I would say no.

[PoliCon]

Is an elected official an employee?

I would say no.good point. And even if he was - Does being an employee mean that you sacrifice your right to a political opinion or your rights to free speech?

[LogansPapa]

another example of why not:

New York teachers sue over ban on campaign buttons
By LARRY NEUMEISTER – 1 day ago

NEW YORK (AP) — The teachers' union for the nation's largest public school system accused the city on Friday of banning political campaign buttons and sued to reverse the policy, declaring that free speech rights were violated.

United Federation of Teachers President Randi Weingarten announced at a news conference that a lawsuit had been filed in U.S. District Court in Manhattan to challenge the enforcement of the policy.

"We couldn't believe it," said Weingarten, who wore a Barack Obama lapel button. The American Federation of Teachers, including its UFT delegates, voted over the summer to endorse Obama's presidential candidacy.

Weingarten said schools Chancellor Joel Klein urged principals more than two weeks ago to enforce a Department of Education policy requiring complete political neutrality.

City lawyer Paul Marks said officials were still evaluating the lawsuit.

"However, we're confident that when the court has had the opportunity to fully consider this matter, the city's position will be upheld," he said.

http://ap.google.com/article/ALeqM5j8F3h6gdaoZX_evZJQCJG78W02wQD93NTGBO0

[biccat]

good point. And even if he was - Does being an employee mean that you sacrifice your right to a political opinion or your rights to free speech?
I think it's a good policy. Employees in positions of authority (teachers, cops, military) should not be allowed to campaign for politicians in their official capacity. It lends the appearance of impropriety.

But for elected officials, the public knows that the speaker is political, and expects that person to campaign for reelection and make political decisions to that end.

[PoliCon]

I think it's a good policy. Employees in positions of authority (teachers, cops, military) should not be allowed to campaign for politicians in their official capacity. It lends the appearance of impropriety.

But for elected officials, the public knows that the speaker is political, and expects that person to campaign for reelection and make political decisions to that end. Look - as an elected official - a shariff as the same rights as anyone else elected or who may be seeking election to endorse or to campaign for whomsoever he will. DO you make the same point that Sen. Clinton cannot campaign for good ol' Barry O because she is in a position of authority? She does so all the time in the exact same clothes she wears to represent you or I on the floor of the senate. Why is that not an issue just the same as the sheriff?

NOW - the only restriction I can justifiably see putting on any of the people listed in on teachers WHILE IN THE CLASS ROOM and that would be because of the captive audience of skulls full of mush. But we don't see an outcry when teachers pander, politic, campaign, and brain wash our youth into being good little socialists looking to the government for their solutions - with RARE EXCEPTION.

[Bubba Dawg]

IMHO, the Hatch Act applies to employees and not elected officials. Elected officials belong to a certain party in most types of elections. I would expect that a sheriff in most places is a partisan elected position.

Whether or not the voters object to his campaigning is a matter to be decided at the polls unless he violated some rules and regulations of the county or municipality.

[LibraryLady]

He is an elected republican. and I think he got 91% of the vote in his last primary.

[PoliCon]

IMHO, the Hatch Act applies to employees and not elected officials. Elected officials belong to a certain party in most types of elections. I would expect that a sheriff in most places is a partisan elected position.

Whether or not the voters object to his campaigning is a matter to be decided at the polls unless he violated some rules and regulations of the county or municipality.I can agree with that - but the law IMO should not exist.