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View Full Version : Berg Case against Obama Thrown out by Fed Judge



megimoo
10-24-2008, 10:55 AM
Breaking: Obama Inelligable to Run Says Judge Surrick!!! (Court Case Ruling)
Court Docs ^


Judge Surrick ruled from the Eastern District of Pennsylvania that: "It is an ORDER of this Court that Barack Hussein Obama’s, et al name be removed from any and all ballots for the Office of the President of the United States."

Spread the word and get it in the media!!! Demand that your state take him off of the ballot due to this Federal Judge's ruling!!!

Ree
10-24-2008, 11:16 AM
Link???

I need more info...My google-fu isn't workin

jinxmchue
10-24-2008, 11:30 AM
It's an order that has been prepared, but not signed or dated yet:

http://docs.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/pennsylvania/paedce/2:2008cv04083/281573/27/

jediab
10-24-2008, 11:41 AM
Will it be signed and dated though any time soon?

Ree
10-24-2008, 11:43 AM
It's an order that has been prepared, but not signed or dated yet:

http://docs.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/pennsylvania/paedce/2:2008cv04083/281573/27/
Thanks...Cowboy found that doc....

sgrooms
10-24-2008, 11:44 AM
Um, wow. Is this going to be signed today? What's the status?

megimoo
10-24-2008, 11:54 AM
Link???

I need more info...My google-fu isn't workin
It's not signed .Just a verbal ruling without weight until he signs it !

megimoo
10-24-2008, 11:58 AM
Link???

I need more info...My google-fu isn't workinMore data from the doc. by Burg !
http://docs.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/pennsylvania/paedce/2:2008cv04083/281573/27/

jinxmchue
10-24-2008, 12:13 PM
More data from the doc. by Burg !
http://docs.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/pennsylvania/paedce/2:2008cv04083/281573/27/

*ahem*

*points up*

:D

GrumpyOldLady
10-24-2008, 12:16 PM
PLEASE O PLEASE O PLEASE ... I hope to GOD this is accurate and real.

If so - we should all hit the EMAILs hard with it.

Seriously!

LogansPapa
10-24-2008, 01:02 PM
Drudge?



Decapitated Mexican girls in Florida? :rolleyes:

lacarnut
10-24-2008, 01:09 PM
If the Judge signs it, all I can say is wow, wow, wow. I bet Hillary is licking her chops plus you know that the Clinton's have many in the Judicial field that are sympathetic to their causes.

cat714
10-24-2008, 01:38 PM
I'm keeping my fingers crossed. This would be major new, but of course it's all racially motivated, right?:rolleyes:

enslaved1
10-24-2008, 01:42 PM
If the Judge signs it, all I can say is wow, wow, wow. I bet Hillary is licking her chops plus you know that the Clinton's have many in the Judicial field that are sympathetic to their causes.

That's why this wouldn't necessarily be a good thing. While watching the left explode and implode simultaneously would be all kinds of entertaining, the likely result would be put Hillary up as the dem nominee. Which isn't any better than having the Barockstar.

Molon Labe
10-24-2008, 01:48 PM
PLEASE O PLEASE O PLEASE ... I hope to GOD this is accurate and real.

If so - we should all hit the EMAILs hard with it.

Seriously!

Don't get you're hopes too high....I've been following this since the primaries. The media won't touch it so far.


Here's the site.

http://obamacrimes.com/

LogansPapa
10-24-2008, 02:23 PM
I hear flies beginning to buzz and the fish is out in the sun. :cool:

LogansPapa
10-24-2008, 03:28 PM
http://www.insect-o-cutor.com/iocimages/iocfly.gif






The flies are starting to land.

cat714
10-24-2008, 04:32 PM
http://www.insect-o-cutor.com/iocimages/iocfly.gif






The flies are starting to land on me

It needed to be fixed. ;)

megimoo
10-24-2008, 04:36 PM
It needed to be fixed. ;)Tell him it's time to bathe and change his skivvies!

LogansPapa
10-24-2008, 04:36 PM
It needed to be fixed. ;)

http://www.angelfire.com/pa3/gifs4u/images/bikerfly.gif

Molon Labe
10-24-2008, 04:55 PM
I hear flies beginning to buzz and the fish is out in the sun. :cool:

Oh come on...where's your sense of adventure...

It would be fun if it's true.

Sonnabend
10-24-2008, 04:55 PM
Folks: 24 hr rule is recommended.

We wait.

biccat
10-24-2008, 05:01 PM
This is the proposed order, submitted by Berg.

Although it seems he does have good grounds for the motion, he submitted a request for admission to the defendants, who never responded. That counts as an admission.

'Course, I doubt he will get such an order, there's too much at stake.

LogansPapa
10-24-2008, 05:02 PM
We wait.

So be it. :cool:

JB
10-24-2008, 05:07 PM
Folks: 24 hr rule is recommended.

We wait.Is that a CU rule? If so, I've never heard of it.

InspiredHome
10-24-2008, 09:43 PM
Folks: 24 hr rule is recommended.

We wait.

Is that 24 business hours? :p

Constitutionally Speaking
10-24-2008, 09:46 PM
Let's not fall for a fitzmas thingy here. I'll wait till it is signed and it is in place.

Sonnabend
10-24-2008, 10:14 PM
Is that a CU rule? If so, I've never heard of it.

Nope.

24 hr rule = wait 24 hrs and see what happens. If it is real there will be more to follow..if not then it's just one more rumour.

24 hrs = time to separate fact from fiction.

Phillygirl
10-24-2008, 10:37 PM
It's not signed .Just a verbal ruling without weight until he signs it !

Where do you get the information that it was a verbal ruling?

patriot45
10-24-2008, 10:48 PM
InspiredHome;70334]Is that 24 business hours? :p[/QUOTE


Ha, Thats what I was thinking! :D

AlmostThere
10-24-2008, 11:03 PM
This is the proposed order, submitted by Berg.

Although it seems he does have good grounds for the motion, he submitted a request for admission to the defendants, who never responded. That counts as an admission.

'Course, I doubt he will get such an order, there's too much at stake.
What would be worse; the judge ruling that he has to submit or be removed OR Obama being elected and then to find out he is ineligible? The latter would trigger a Constitutional crisis like has never been seen before.

megimoo
10-24-2008, 11:37 PM
What would be worse; the judge ruling that he has to submit or be removed OR Obama being elected and then to find out he is ineligible? The latter would trigger a Constitutional crisis like has never been seen before.And no doubt a civil war !

verbum
10-25-2008, 03:12 AM
Analysis: U.S. District Judge R. Barclay Surrick opinion
http://www.law.com/jsp/article.jsp?id=1024078988240
Based on U.S. District Judge R. Barclay Surrick opinion of the above
case, he is on the side of our Constitution and of the U.S. Supreme Court.
P. Berg pleas reflect the constitutional rule. My good guess his
honorable U.S. District Judge R. Barclay Surrick will protect our Constitution.

mike128
10-25-2008, 05:22 AM
Breaking: Obama Inelligable to Run Says Judge Surrick!!! (Court Case Ruling)
Court Docs ^


Judge Surrick ruled from the Eastern District of Pennsylvania that: "It is an ORDER of this Court that Barack Hussein Obama’s, et al name be removed from any and all ballots for the Office of the President of the United States."

Spread the word and get it in the media!!! Demand that your state take him off of the ballot due to this Federal Judge's ruling!!!
Someone should tell Sean Hannity and Rush Limbaugh about this before it's too late! This information is way too critical to pass up! It could possibly swing this election McCain's way.

marinejcksn
10-25-2008, 05:24 AM
Don't forward this nonsense to anyone until it's verified. I heard this is all vanity and just a rumor.

If anything develops we should be all over this but in the meantime don't spread it around, it makes us look just as stupid as the 9/11 truthers and other conspiracy nuts.

JB
10-25-2008, 06:10 AM
Tossed (http://www.philly.com/philly/hp/news_update/20081025_Judge_rejects_Montco_lawyer_s_bid_to_have _Obama_removed_from_ballot.html)

Judge rejects Montco lawyer's bid to have Obama removed from ballot
By MICHAEL HINKELMAN
Philadelphia Daily News

A federal judge in Philadelphia last night threw out a complaint by a Montgomery County lawyer who claimed that Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama was not qualified to be president and that his name should be removed from the Nov. 4 ballot.

Celestron
10-25-2008, 06:22 AM
Problem #1: If you're going to try and make a good case in court, stating in a motion that one of your sources of information was Wikipedia is not a bright idea, especially since anyone can get on that sight and change the information about the subject.


"Upon investigation into the alleged birth of of Obama in Honolulu, HI, Obama's birth is reported as occuring at two (2) separate hospitals, Kapiolani Hospital and Queens Hospital. Wikipedia English Version, under the subject "Barack Obama," states Obama was born in Kapiolani Hospital. Wikipedia Italian Version under the subject "Queens Hospital," states Obama was born in Queens Hospital."

Page 21 of this motion
(http://docs.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/pennsylvania/paedce/2:2008cv04083/281573/8/)

Until I saw this, I actually thought the guy might have a case.

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 09:12 AM
24 hr rule, confirmed. :)

Phillygirl
10-25-2008, 09:29 AM
I changed the thread title.

marinejcksn
10-25-2008, 10:34 AM
Damn! Savage bought this hook, line and sinker too...bet he feels sheepish.

But what I can't understand is why would this guy do it if he didn't feel he had a case? This isn't some street bum, the guy was a Deputy Attorney General for crying out loud. And he said he had his paternal grandmother on tape saying he was born in Kenya, did they say anything about that? Very strange.

marinejcksn
10-25-2008, 10:37 AM
Oh good God, this Berg guy is a 9/11 truther. :rolleyes:

Link (http://www.911forthetruth.com/)

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 10:47 AM
Oh good God, this Berg guy is a 9/11 truther. :rolleyes:

Link (http://www.911forthetruth.com/)

When one throws in one's lot with dogs, etc., etc. BTW, wasn't this the same guy whose video was posted in another thread and when Vetwife objected that this was all a bit silly, the people here went after her?

SaintLouieWoman
10-25-2008, 10:57 AM
When one throws in one's lot with dogs, etc., etc. BTW, wasn't this the same guy whose video was posted in another thread and when Vetwife objected that this was all a bit silly, the people here went after her?

Gloating again. You love rubbing people's faces in whatever, don't you? It never takes long for you to make your comments. So predictable. :rolleyes:

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 11:00 AM
Gloating again. You love rubbing people's faces in whatever, don't you? It never takes long for you to make your comments. So predictable. :rolleyes:

Not gloating. Just pointing out the fact that Vetwife was viciously attacked for doubting Berg's case and no one said a word about it when he's revealed to be a true whack.

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 11:11 AM
Not gloating. Just pointing out the fact that Vetwife was viciously attacked for doubting Berg's case and no one said a word about it when he's revealed to be a true whack.Yes you are. Sod off.

Anyway, dont you have have a sooper seekrit CIA mission to complete?

You being a CIA agent and all...

Phillygirl
10-25-2008, 11:13 AM
Not gloating. Just pointing out the fact that Vetwife was viciously attacked for doubting Berg's case and no one said a word about it when he's revealed to be a true whack.

I haven't followed all the Berg threads (it was starting to annoy me that threads were being started claiming orders were signed that weren't), but at least in this thread it seems people were largely waiting to see what the truth was.

And Jackson clearly pointed out the whackiness of Berg's apparent affiliation.

As for Vetwife being jumped on, I'm sorry I don't recall that. I would have said something. Anytime an attorney is filing his own case you have to wonder about the merit of the case. It's how it generally goes. The only thing worse than dealing with a pro se party is dealing with a pro se party who happens to be an attorney.

SaintLouieWoman
10-25-2008, 11:13 AM
Not gloating. Just pointing out the fact that Vetwife was viciously attacked for doubting Berg's case and no one said a word about it when he's revealed to be a true whack.

Nobody has said a word about it? :rolleyes: Reread this thread.
And I do recall Vetwife called someone else here an old bag. There's blame all around. Feelings are high during this election.

Phillygirl
10-25-2008, 11:15 AM
Gloating again. You love rubbing people's faces in whatever, don't you? It never takes long for you to make your comments. So predictable. :rolleyes:


Yes you are. Sod off.

Anyway, dont you have have a sooper seekrit CIA mission to complete?

You being a CIA agent and all...

What's the gloat? Come on, some people have jumped on this case a bit early. The fact that the guy may be a whackadoodle is worth pointing out.

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 11:15 AM
Yes you are. Sod off.

No, I was actually defending (belatedly, as I wasn't here when it happened) Vetwife's pov for which she was attacked here. However, if you start believing the 9/11 whackies because YOUR SIDE (whichever one that is) is losing, you are becoming just like the DUmmies.

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 11:23 AM
However, if you start believing the 9/11 whackies because YOUR SIDE (whichever one that is) is losing, you are becoming just like the DUmmies.It comes down to this simple question: why wont he release his birth certificate and other documents?

Berg's lawsuit raised a valid issue. Hey CW, did the CIA give you one of these as well?

http://www.univie.ac.at/cga/art/shoe_phone.jpg

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 11:34 AM
It comes down to this simple question: why wont he release his birth certificate and other documents?

Berg's lawsuit raised a valid issue. Hey CW, did the CIA give you one of these as well?

http://www.univie.ac.at/cga/art/shoe_phone.jpg

I'm not sure what you're on about with your CIA routine? :confused: You're the one who thinks he's a Junior G Man, with your military maps, your phrasings, etc. I did some work for the CIA 19 years ago, but not as an employee, as a contractor working for what we then referred to as a "Beltway Bandit." It was actually a bit boring, doing reports in a SCIF and all.

I certainly have no desire to work directly for the government as I consider most government employees as underpaid (many have consciously accepted that in a trade for retirement). I do have a friend with whom I grew up and who's worked for the CIA for 25 years now as an analyst (he's a GS-14, I think). He makes a third of what I make! :eek: No thanks.

Tango, foxtrot, out.

patriot45
10-25-2008, 11:45 AM
So, I guess the mesiah came clean and does have a valid birth certificate? I'm gald that is settled! :rolleyes:

JB
10-25-2008, 03:47 PM
wasn't this the same guy whose video was posted in another thread and when Vetwife objected that this was all a bit silly, the people here went after her?Not exactly.

It was in that thread but not about the thread topic.

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 04:09 PM
Not exactly.

It was in that thread but not about the thread topic.

Uh, help me out here, JB. This is the thread's (http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showthread.php?t=6638&highlight=october) OP:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RfIV1ntYggc
.... Barack Obama - October Surprise

Isn't this the same character (in the video), the 9/11 truther, Berg? If not, I'm sorry for the confusion.

JB
10-25-2008, 04:43 PM
Uh, help me out here, JB. This is the thread's (http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showthread.php?t=6638&highlight=october) OP:

Isn't this the same character (in the video), the 9/11 truther, Berg? If not, I'm sorry for the confusion.Oh, it was that thread. She just wasn't commenting on the thread topic, which is why I said not exactly.

She was going off about Barry visiting granny and such. Not Berg or birth certificates.

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 05:21 PM
I'm not sure what you're on about with your CIA routine?Aren't you the one who aas a security clearance with the CIA? Special Agent CW?


You're the one who thinks he's a Junior G Man, with your military maps, your phrasings, My, aren't we superior....:rolleyes:


etc. I did some work for the CIA 19 years ago, but not as an employee, as a contractor working for what we then referred to as a "Beltway Bandit." It was actually a bit boring, doing reports in a SCIF and all.And I did fifteen years in the emergency services, where amongst other things I learned radio discipline and communications protocols. Incidentally, a lot of people have maps...there are thousands of Civil War enthusiasts and those who do recreations..also those who study ancient history, especially Rome, Greece, Sparta, the thalassocracies, they have lots of maps as well..they have to, the places in quesiton dont exist any more.

It's hard to envision the Anabasis without a map of the journey. (watch as the ever smug and superior CW runs to Google to find out what the Anabasis is)


I certainly have no desire to work directly for the government as I consider most government employees as underpaid (many have consciously accepted that in a trade for retirement)CIA = government. Just ask 99. Was she your boss? Or did you work with Larabee?

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 05:30 PM
Aren't you the one who aas a security clearance with the CIA? Special Agent CW?

I haven't had a security clearance in years. At one time I had a Top Secret. Whoopee Shit. Who cares? It was simply a means of making money when Ronnie and Georgie Senior were spending money in that arena.


My, aren't we superior....:rolleyes:

To some Aussie who's never been outside of his little provencial world? Weelll, yeah. Oh, I forgot, you've been to Vanuatu. The world traveller. I slept with a girl from Vanuatu once. Only cost me dinner and a few drinks. However, she wasn't very good.


And I did fifteen years in the emergency services, where amongst other things I learned radio discipline and communications protocols. Incidentally, a lot of people have maps...there are thousands of Civil War enthusiasts and those who do recreations..also those who study ancient history, especially Rome, Greece, Sparta, the thalassocracies, they have lots of maps as well..they have to, the places in quesiton dont exist any more.

It's hard to envision the Anabasis without a map of the journey. (watch as the ever smug and superior CW runs to Google to find out what the Anabasis is)

CIA = government. Just ask 99. Was she your boss? Or did you work with Larabee?

Uh, who cares? Do they all talk in emergency service code?

Foxtrot uniform, out.

JB
10-25-2008, 05:33 PM
http://www.ewh.ieee.org/r3/hampton_roads/images/Spy_vs_Spy.jpg

SaintLouieWoman
10-25-2008, 05:39 PM
I haven't had a security clearance in years. At one time I had a Top Secret. Whoopee Shit. Who cares? It was simply a means of making money when Ronnie and Georgie Senior were spending money in that arena.



To some Aussie who's never been outside of his little provencial world? Weelll, yeah. Oh, I forgot, you've been to Vanuatu. The world traveller. I slept with a girl from Vanuatu once. Only cost me dinner and a few drinks. However, she wasn't very good.



Uh, who cares? Do they all talk in emergency service code?

Foxtrot uniform, out.

Indeed. My sister is a paralegal and has a top secret clearance also.

JB
10-25-2008, 05:42 PM
At one time I had a Top Secret. Whoopee Shit. Who cares?I was on double secret probation once. It was back in the sixties but we had a really cool car.

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 05:49 PM
Indeed. My sister is a paralegal and has a top secret clearance also.

If you people think that clearances are sooo hard to get, you're simply demonstrating your ignorance about the process. Most contactors that work for government agencies, either DoD or the so called "black agencies," CIA, DIA, or NSA, will have a Secret or a Top Secret, minimally. It's really no big deal and not a particular "honor." It's simply part of doing business. Jeez. How is it out on the farm?

SaintLouieWoman
10-25-2008, 05:50 PM
I was on double secret probation once. It was back in the sixties but we had a really cool car.

Animal House was one of my favs. :D Double secret probation? I'm impressed. :p

SaintLouieWoman
10-25-2008, 05:54 PM
If you people think that clearances are sooo hard to get, you're simply demonstrating your ignorance about the process. Most contactors that work for government agencies, either DoD or the so called "black agencies," CIA, DIA, or NSA, will have a Secret or a Top Secret, minimally. It's really no big deal and not a particular "honor." It's simply part of doing business. Jeez. How is it out on the farm?

You're an insulting SOB. I think you're showing your ignorance. I was AGREEING with you when I said that it wasn't that big of a deal. I know many people with a top secret clearance---it's nothing much.

But what is disgusting is how you continually insult at the first chance. I've dealt with contractors for years over at Scott AFB, been in secure areas at the old Defense Mapping Agency routinely. I do understand security clearances.

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 05:59 PM
You're an insulting SOB. I think you're showing your ignorance. I was AGREEING with you when I said that it wasn't that big of a deal. I know many people with a top secret clearance---it's nothing much.

But what is disgusting is how you continually insult at the first chance. I've dealt with contractors for years over at Scott AFB, been in secure areas at the old Defense Mapping Agency routinely. I do understand security clearances.

I apologize if I misconstrued your comment; however, you must acknowledge that your usual comment to me is insult and/or snark. In point of fact, many people in this thread seem to think that having a TS is so incomprehensible that's it's beyond the realm of mortal man, including our Aussie friend.

BTW, I did not start the insults in this thread. Take a look in the mirror and at the Aussie.

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 06:02 PM
To some Aussie who's never been outside of his little provencial world? Weelll, yeah. Oh, I forgot, you've been to Vanuatu.Amongst other places.


The world traveller. I slept with a girl from Vanuatu once. Only cost me dinner and a few drinks. However, she wasn't very good.God's gift to woman speaketh.


.Uh, who cares? Do they all talk in emergency service code?Thought you said it was military.Cant even get that right.

You've travelled a lot, more than me, I am willing to concede that in all honesty. Hasn't done a thing to broaden your mind, has it? And here we see yet another "female conquest" used as "street cred"....lemme give you a hint, CW, no one wants to hear how many women you've paid for sex.

That avatar suits you perfectly.


In point of fact, many people in this thread seem to think that having a TS is so incomprehensible that's it's beyond the realm of mortal man, including our Aussie friend.

No, I just wondered if you'd ever been to Tiburon.

JB
10-25-2008, 06:11 PM
I apologize if I misconstrued your comment;You did in this case. When I read SLW's post I thought she was agreeing with you. In spite of the free for all that is/has been happening.

This thread is way off topic. :D

Berg lost and Barry's a non-American Muslim terrorist sympathizer socialist borderline communist cigarette smoking cokehead.

Who probably cheated on his wife within the last week but I don't want to start that rumor.

biccat
10-25-2008, 06:12 PM
No, I just wondered if you'd ever been to Tiburon.
He's probably got 3 ladies there that he rooms with from time to time.

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 06:23 PM
He's probably got 3 ladies there that he rooms with from time to time.

Ah, the flyover, $150/hr "lawyer" chimes in. And what expertise would you like to add to this thread? Can you tell us when the next ambulance is going by?

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 06:41 PM
And what expertise would you like to add to this thread?

You first.

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 07:15 PM
You did in this case. When I read SLW's post I thought she was agreeing with you. In spite of the free for all that is/has been happening.

This thread is way off topic. :D

Berg lost and Barry's a non-American Muslim terrorist sympathizer socialist borderline communist cigarette smoking cokehead.

Who probably cheated on his wife within the last week but I don't want to start that rumor.

I completely agree. And how did it get that way??? We were discussing Berg, his failed lawsuit, his 9/11 connections, and the tendency of some people to believe anyone or anything that suits their partisan cause. Then, of a sudden, the Koala Kub Scout starts talking about CIA, shoe phones, and clearances. I attempted to ignore his first post, yet he persisted. So, here we are, off topic.

As I'm sure you know, JB, that sort of tactic is typical of those who have nothing to argue. Certain posters here (case in point) completely rely upon that tact. They divert the argument through personal attacks and extraneous topics. But, who knows, perhaps that's considered proper discussion and subtle wit in the hinterlands.

JB
10-25-2008, 07:32 PM
I completely agree. And how did it get that way??? We were discussing Berg, his failed lawsuit, his 9/11 connections, and the tendency of some people to believe anyone or anything that suits their partisan cause. Then, of a sudden, the Koala Kub Scout starts talking about CIA, shoe phones, and clearances. I attempted to ignore his first post, yet he persisted. So, here we are, off topic.I'll give you that one. I see where the shit started on page 5.

There's also a shitload of guests reading this forum (maybe thread). I think an Echelon trigger got tripped. :p

I'm going out to surround myself with some baseball bandwagon groupies, providing it stops raining. Now there's a threadjack. And if you make one freaking comment about American cricket, I'll petition for your banning! /end threadjack

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 07:35 PM
I'll give you that one. I see where the shit started on page 5.

There's also a shitload of guests reading this forum (maybe thread). I think an Echelon trigger got tripped. :p

I'm going out to surround myself with some baseball bandwagon groupies, providing it stops raining. Now there's a threadjack. And if you make one freaking comment about American cricket, I'll petition for your banning! /end threadjack

Well, ManU drew today at Everton. The Gunners play tomorrow at West Ham. Is there a baseball game on tonight? :D

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 07:39 PM
the Koala Kub Scout


hinterlands.


Junior G Man


They live in very small worlds, so you will have to forgive them.


Wanna see my imitation of an Aussie accent? "Damn, shit, fuck, dickhead, fuckwad, ignorant asshole." :D


Come on, Sonna. You're the one who recently mentioned the maps on your wall. You're the one who talks in pseudo-military speech (Delta-Hotel?) in order to sound in ways you think "cool." You're the one who is preoccupied with military campaigns, carrier movements, all of those things about the big world that you've never seen. The only thing I surmised, but I bet it's true, is the toy soldiers arranged in positions re-enacting various historical battles. True or not?

Everyone here can see that you seem to be disappointed with yourself in that you were never in the military and compensate for that fact in your imaginary life. However, at some point, one has to grow up.

My, aren't we the superior one. I am not disappointed in myself at all..matter of fact I am damned proud of all that I have done and accomplished.

I could continue with the large number of condescending and patronising comments you've made..and all you can offer in reply is to brag of all the places you've been to and add that onto the number of prostitutes you've slept with.

I havent slept with half as many women than you have....having been married for seventeen years, I never saw the need.

Then again I dont consider my manliness or "qualifications" to include my bedroom exploits...somethng you keep mentioning.....is it to show us how worldly you are?

My my...you've paid for sex in a dozen countries or more.

Wow...I'm impressed......:rolleyes:

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 07:42 PM
My, aren't we the superior one. I am not disappointed in myself at all..matter of fact I am damned proud of all that I have done and accomplished.

I could continue with the large number of condescending and patronising comments you've made..and all you can offer in reply is to brag of all the places you've been to and add that onto the number of prostitutes you've slept with.

I havent slept with half as many women than you have....having been married for seventeen years, I never saw the need.

Then again I dont consider my manliness or "qualifications" to include my bedroom exploits...somethng you keep mentioning.....is it to show us how worldly you are?

My my...you've paid for sex in a dozen countries or more.

Wow...I'm impressed......:rolleyes:

Again, you seem to have nothing to say about the topic at hand. Not surprising. What did SLW say about me above? How predictable?

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 08:54 PM
Again, you seem to have nothing to say about the topic at hand.

I did comment. Read again.

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 09:07 PM
I did comment. Read again.

I think my reading skills might be slightly superior to yours.

Here's your first post in the thread...

Yes you are. Sod off.

Anyway, dont you have have a sooper seekrit CIA mission to complete?

You being a CIA agent and all...

That certainly added to the discussion and avoided any ad hominem attacks, didn't it?

Here's your second...


It comes down to this simple question: why wont he release his birth certificate and other documents?

Berg's lawsuit raised a valid issue. Hey CW, did the CIA give you one of these as well?

http://www.univie.ac.at/cga/art/shoe_phone.jpg

Some actual commentary!!! :eek: However, it's of the nature, "I'm right, you're wrong" and supplemented by your rather odd personal attack against me for something I may have mentioned in passing. Certainly nothing I've ever considered significant. Perhaps you consider it significant because you project so much into a life you never lived. Who knows? Who cares?

Here's your third post...



Aren't you the one who aas a security clearance with the CIA? Special Agent CW?

My, aren't we superior....:rolleyes:

And I did fifteen years in the emergency services, where amongst other things I learned radio discipline and communications protocols. Incidentally, a lot of people have maps...there are thousands of Civil War enthusiasts and those who do recreations..also those who study ancient history, especially Rome, Greece, Sparta, the thalassocracies, they have lots of maps as well..they have to, the places in quesiton dont exist any more.

It's hard to envision the Anabasis without a map of the journey. (watch as the ever smug and superior CW runs to Google to find out what the Anabasis is)

CIA = government. Just ask 99. Was she your boss? Or did you work with Larabee?

Again, a significant contribution to the discussion. Everyone here can see that, and are awed by your powers of argument and rational discussion, I'm sure.

I ask you again. Do you have anything to contribute to the topic or do you simply wish to continue to engage in personal attacks?

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 09:15 PM
It comes down to this simple question: why wont he release his birth certificate and other documents?

Berg's lawsuit raised a valid issue.BARACK OBAMA also known as
BARRY SOETORO also known as
BARRY OBAMA also known as
BARACK DUNHAM also known as
BARRY DUNHAM

The question of his citizenship, the question of his place of birth and the question of his eligibility to run have not yet been answered, nor I suspect will they ever be.

In the same way he lied about his relationship with Ayers, he is using the Ayers playbook. When you don't like the rules, don't follow them.

Berg's question remains valid, as does this one.

Why wont Obama release said documents? Whats he got to hide?


Perhaps you consider it significant because you project so much into a life you never lived.

Pot, kettle.

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 09:28 PM
BARACK OBAMA also known as
BARRY SOETORO also known as
BARRY OBAMA also known as
BARACK DUNHAM also known as
BARRY DUNHAM


Obama, Soetoro, and Dunham (obviously) simply represent his mother's various names, married and maiden. The Barry vs. Barack clearly was an attempt by a young man (or his mother) to fit in better. Who cares? Of what significance is this?


The question of his citizenship, the question of his place of birth and the question of his eligibility to run have not yet been answered, nor I suspect will they ever be.

As far as the Obama campaign and the vast majority of Americans are concerned, he has answered the question of his place of birth. It's only a small, but demented few, who continue to question that.


In the same way he lied about his relationship with Ayers, he is using the Ayers playbook. When you don't like the rules, don't follow them.

"Using the Ayers playbook" has nothing to do with the topic of this thread and is an extremely vague, opinion-filled, and general phrase.


Berg's question remains valid, as does this one.


Why wont Obama release said documents? Whats he got to hide?

The Obama campaign would say that they have released his birth certificate.


Pot, kettle.

While you seem particularly enamored with that phrase, you neglect to notice that both the pot and the kettle are the same color, a point I have often made regarding some (certainly not all) of the members here and those of DU.

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 09:41 PM
Obama, Soetoro, and Dunham (obviously) simply represent his mother's various names, married and maiden. The Barry vs. Barack clearly was an attempt by a young man (or his mother) to fit in better. Who cares? Of what significance is this?Of great significance if one name appears on the COLB (certificate of live birth which is NOT a birth certificate), and another on the actual birth certificate.

So where was he born. Hawaii? Or Mombasa?


As far as the Obama campaignLike I give a rats ass for their opinion. I have already identified a large number of their lies and distortions

Biden: "We never gave a penny to ACORN". Liar.
Obama: "I barely knew Ayers" Liar.


and the vast majority of Americans are concernedYou speak for hundreds of millions of Americans now? I'd say that there are a great number who would like to know the answer.


he has answered the question of his place of birth.No, he hasnt. He has released a single document.The one that will answer the questions is his vault certificate. When you consider that this has a bearing in whether or not he has violated the US Constitution,I'd say its very relevant.


It's only a small, but demented few, who continue to question that.Ah so anyone who questions The One™ is now demented.

Interesting (http://atlasshrugs2000.typepad.com/atlas_shrugs/2008/07/atlas-exclusive.html)

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 09:47 PM
Of great significance if one name appears on the COLB (certificate of live birth which is NOT a birth certificate), and another on the actual birth certificate.

So where was he born. Hawaii? Or Mombasa?

Like I give a rats ass for their opinion. I have already identified a large number of their lies and distortions

Biden: "We never gave a penny to ACORN". Liar.
Obama: "I barely knew Ayers" Liar.

You speak for hundreds of millions of Americans now? I'd say that there are a great number who would like to know the answer.

No, he hasnt. He has released a single document.The one that will answer the questions is his vault certificate. When you consider that this has a bearing in whether or not he has violated the US Constitution,I'd say its very relevant.

Ah so anyone who questions The One™ is now demented.

The vast majority of Americans don't consider this a valid issue, as evidenced by the fact that it is only circulating in extreme right wing circles and advanced by 9/11 truthers like Berg. If it did have any validity, it would be exposed by the MSM. And please, don't give me the right wing crazy crap about the MSM being in the Dims' pocket. Journalists are people as well and would betray their mother for a scoop like that. Keeping such a thing a secret through media conspiracy is as crazy as well.... oh wait, I know ... 9/11 conspiracy theories.

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 10:01 PM
The vast majority of Americans don't consider this a valid issue, as evidenced by the fact that it is only circulating in extreme right wing circles and advanced by 9/11 truthers like Berg. I can post a dozen places that do not fit that meme and ask the same questions.


If it did have any validity, it would be exposed by the MSM.*snorts coffee out nose*

You have got to be kidding me...the media have all but fellated this man and that's only a matter of time. The MSM is in the tank for Obama and has abandoned any and all pretense of fairness or impartiality. The MSM is a sick joke.


Please, don't give me the right wing crazy crap about the MSM being in the Dims' pocket. Yet it is. You're telling me the media isnt biased?


Journalists are people as well and would betray their mother for a scoop like that.

Like the media ignored the Killian memos until LGF rubbed their noses in it? Like the MSM was all over the Haditha Marines and has not to this date ever posted a retraction or apology for the crucifixiion of these men..even after they were exonerated?

Like the media convicted Lt ilario Pantano of murder before the trial was even held..and has not to this day ever apologised to him?.

Like the media has cravenly and continually demonised Pres Bush for the last eight years?

Like the media convicted the Duke team of rape,. and to this day has never published a headline "WE ARE SORRY WE WERE WRONG"..despite the fact that the prosecutor is now in prison for perverting the court of justice..and that they had been innocent all along?

Righttt....., seriously,what planet have you been on? The media has no intention of serving the truth or the public trust, and will lie, twist, distort, ignore or pervert anything that doesnt fit their goal to sell papers.

The media, when faced with the incontrovertible facts of Obama's close and continuing ties to a domestic terrorist, willingly turned a blind eye.

Media? Tell the truth??

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH......................

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 10:07 PM
I can post a dozen places that do not fit that meme and ask the same questions.

Such as?


*snorts coffee out nose*

You have got to be kidding me...the media have all but fellated this man and that's only a matter of time. The MSM is in the tank for Obama and has abandoned any and all pretense of fairness or impartiality. The MSM is a sick joke.

Yet it is. You're telling me the media isnt biased?

Like the media ignored the Killian memos until LGF rubbed their noses in it? Like the MSM was all over the Haditha Marines and has not to this date ever posted a retraction or apology for the crucifixiion of these men..even after they were exonerated?

Like the media convicted Lt ilario Pantano of murder before the trial was even held..and has not to this day ever apoligised to him?

Like the media has cravenly and continually demonised Pres Bush for the last eight years?

Like the media convicted the Duke team of rape,. and to this day has never published a headline "WE ARE SORRY WE WERE WRONG"..despite the fact that the prosecutor is now in prison for perverting the court of justice..and that they had been innocent all along?

Righttt.....sow, what planet have you been on? The media has no intention of serving the truth or the public trust, and will lie, twist, distort, ignore or pervert anything that doesnt fit their goal to sell papers.

The media, when faced with the incontrovertible facts of Obama's close and continuing ties to a domestic terrorist, willingly turned a blind eye.

Media? Tell the truth??

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAH......................

You're confusing media bias with self interest. In none of your examples would acting differently have significantly advanced the self interest of the individual journalist (or group of journalists). Being the person or news organization to expose Obama as not having been born in the US, particularly at this late juncture in the campaign, guarantees that individual celebrity status and a good deal of money. People, in general, will act according their ideological biases until the incentive not to do so surpasses a certain threshold. In this case, the rewards would be far to great to resist.

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 10:11 PM
Read. (http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showthread.php?t=6914)

Then tell me that.

Do you seriously think that a story like that would ever see the light of day?
Man, are you naive. No reporter would ever write that story, let alone try and break it.I have even less faith in individual journalists.

It would be stamped on by any and all of the major papers. NONE of the major media ever bothered to check the Killian memos, including CBS...Rather knew they were forgeries and did it anyway.

The rest of the media followed suit, then sneered at the "pyjamahadeen"....until the truth slapped them in the face.

Individual reporters? I'll give you a story, CW, of the "integrity" of individual journalists..

Some time ago, a report ricocheted around the world of a mass beheading in Iraq...and the news eventually filtered to the local command who went out to investigate.

He went to the village where this was supposed to have occurred, and was confronted by a bewildered village elder who, in broken English, asked him what the hell he was talking about?

A reporter in a hotel in the Green Zone reported a story as fact which had been relayed to him by a third party who had heard it from a third party....said incident of course had been anti American propaganda and which lie had been swallowed by the media, hook, line and sinker

Like the lies of chemical weapons being used in Fallujah, like IVAW, like the journalists that brought us Jesse MacBeth......they all stink, they are all biased, none of them can be trusted.

Had it occurred to you why there has been a deafening silence from reporters on Iraq? (http://jcrue.wordpress.com/2008/06/17/american-media-the-silence-is-deafening/)


The MSM has reduced its coverage of the war by ninety-two percent over the past year, (http://www.gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/05/as-surge-succeeds-iraq-coverage.html) conveniently since the US has been winning the war, and AP blames the lack of public attention on the public itself. As if the public sent a petition to the AP telling them “please embargo all information about any American/coalition victories in Iraq, we’d just really rather not know. Oh, PS, more Haditha and Abu Ghraib, yes please!”

Cold Warrior
10-25-2008, 10:20 PM
Read. (http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showthread.php?t=6914)

Then tell me that.

I read this when you posted it and just read it again. It argues for bias in the media, a case that can be certainly made. However, that does not negate my basic contention that if Obama were born in Kenya (or is it Iceland this week?) that this would have been exposed. Again, I would point out that greed outweighs ideology, particularly amongst large groups of people, every time.

Aaron Burr
10-25-2008, 10:41 PM
I intend to sue everyone on this thread for inducing narcolepsy. Who gives a fuck what some Aussie thinks, we killed their fuggin' Prime Minister in the 70's. An alleged C.I.A. job. Man, we kick ass.

I had a secret clearance back before the turn of the "Willenium." I think there are 14 or 15 other clearances higher than that. Leisure Suit Larry is right, the birth certificate deal is a non issue until someone other than a whack job makes it an issue.

The bigger issue is that Godbama flew to Hawaii to smother his grandma' with a pillow. She's a McCain supporter and most likely a bridge partner with McCain's mom. If that information were to reach the public, it would be the end of Godbamas chances.

Can't we all agree that Godbama likes to hang out in the back of limos doing crack and having oral sex with strangers?

biccat
10-25-2008, 10:43 PM
Ah, the flyover, $150/hr "lawyer" chimes in. And what expertise would you like to add to this thread? Can you tell us when the next ambulance is going by?
Lets see, I already commented. See...what, page 2?

I've noticed you're posting here a lot more. Have your checks to your "girlfriend" started bouncing already? Or did she realize that you're a womanizing prick who has nothing to offer in the way of a future?

Doesn't really matter, you're still a dick, everyone knows it. Your stories about your supposed "conquests" are a great source of humor. You do realize that no one here believes a single word that comes out of your cold-sore addled mouth, right?

Sonnabend
10-25-2008, 10:59 PM
I intend to sue everyone on this thread for inducing narcolepsy. Who gives a fuck what some Aussie thinks, we killed their fuggin' Prime Minister in the 70's. An alleged C.I.A. job. Man, we kick ass.Uh, no.


I had a secret clearance back before the turn of the "Willenium." I think there are 14 or 15 other clearances higher than that. Leisure Suit Larry is right, the birth certificate deal is a non issue until someone other than a whack job makes it an issue.More than a few people have made it an issue, and they are not "whack jobs". More will be involved as time goes on.


Can't we all agree that Godbama likes to hang out in the back of limos doing crack and having oral sex with strangers?Since the guy that made these allegations is a 'whackjob"..no.

I'd be more interested in what Tony Reszko has to say, or what else will evolve about Obama's involvement with ACORN voter fraud...none of which the media will ever report.

They'll be too busy having joygasms if he becomes President...little things like the truth take a back seat to the Obamessiah™.


However, that does not negate my basic contention that if Obama were born in Kenya (or is it Iceland this week?) that this would have been exposed.

You're the demented one..let me give you a corollary.

If tomorrow, the US Army found a huge pile of WMD, gas, bacterial weapons, and showed the world, I can fucking well GAURANTEE YOU that the very first words out of the media will be "They were planted"

The media are apologists for Kim Jong Il, Chavez, Castro, Sheehan, Kos, Soros....the media were well aware that when St Cindy of the Ditch went to Cuba, she was approached by the Cuban White Ladies to see real oppression and torture..she wasnt interested.

NOT ONE newspaper reported this fact, NOT ONE journalist ever to this day has asked her why she ignored the suffering and plight of real political prisoners..and to this day your own media and ours dont give a rats ass for what Castro does, he and Chavez (El Presidente for Life) and other dictators get a free pass.

I could walk into a newspaper office tomorrow with hard concrete proof if Obama not being an American citizen and ineligible...and I would be thrown out with the words"Take your right wing propaganda lies somewhere else"

The media would not recognise the truth if it came up to them in the middle of Times Square at midday and bit them.

Aaron Burr
10-25-2008, 11:09 PM
Uh, yes. At least that what all the Aussies I humped told me. Of course, the other theory is that the Russians picked up Holt in a submarine.

I doubt your essential Aussieness. I bet you're a fuggin' KIWI!!

Shannon
10-25-2008, 11:15 PM
Jesus wept. :rolleyes:

patriot45
10-25-2008, 11:22 PM
I intend to sue everyone on this thread for inducing narcolepsy. Who gives a fuck what some Aussie thinks, we killed their fuggin' Prime Minister in the 70's. An alleged C.I.A. job. Man, we kick ass.

I had a secret clearance back before the turn of the "Willenium." I think there are 14 or 15 other clearances higher than that. Leisure Suit Larry is right, the birth certificate deal is a non issue until someone other than a whack job makes it an issue.

The bigger issue is that Godbama flew to Hawaii to smother his grandma' with a pillow. She's a McCain supporter and most likely a bridge partner with McCain's mom. If that information were to reach the public, it would be the end of Godbamas chances.

Can't we all agree that Godbama likes to hang out in the back of limos doing crack and having oral sex with strangers?

Hilarious! As our libs would say.... Full Marks! Off to the dome with this!:D

LogansPapa
10-26-2008, 12:29 AM
Jesus wept. :rolleyes:

+1

The switch-hitter from the Bay Area is obviously not educated regarding the dangers of playing with some of Australia's more venomous creatures. There is a word for this, and that word is "stupid."

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 06:18 AM
Read. (http://www.conservativeunderground.com/forum505/showthread.php?t=6914)

Then tell me that.

Do you seriously think that a story like that would ever see the light of day?
Man, are you naive. No reporter would ever write that story, let alone try and break it.I have even less faith in individual journalists.

It would be stamped on by any and all of the major papers. NONE of the major media ever bothered to check the Killian memos, including CBS...Rather knew they were forgeries and did it anyway.

The rest of the media followed suit, then sneered at the "pyjamahadeen"....until the truth slapped them in the face.

Individual reporters? I'll give you a story, CW, of the "integrity" of individual journalists..

Some time ago, a report ricocheted around the world of a mass beheading in Iraq...and the news eventually filtered to the local command who went out to investigate.

He went to the village where this was supposed to have occurred, and was confronted by a bewildered village elder who, in broken English, asked him what the hell he was talking about?

A reporter in a hotel in the Green Zone reported a story as fact which had been relayed to him by a third party who had heard it from a third party....said incident of course had been anti American propaganda and which lie had been swallowed by the media, hook, line and sinker

Like the lies of chemical weapons being used in Fallujah, like IVAW, like the journalists that brought us Jesse MacBeth......they all stink, they are all biased, none of them can be trusted.

Had it occurred to you why there has been a deafening silence from reporters on Iraq? (http://jcrue.wordpress.com/2008/06/17/american-media-the-silence-is-deafening/)

Look. I'm going to attempt this one more time (I'm not sure why) and then give up. What you cite are instances of bias and unprofessionalism that may or may not be true (bias is often in the eye and the prejudices of the beholder).

What I am saying is that if what you and the extreme right sources and nutjobs like Berg are suggesting were true, it would be exposed by the media not because of any objectivity, not because of a desire to make the truth known, not for any "noble" reason, but rather for pure self-interest. A reporter or organization that could break such a scoop would have its ticket written. Look at what exposing Watergate did for Woodward, Bernstein, bradley, and the Post!

Money always trumps ideology, particularly when large numbers of people are involved.

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 06:24 AM
Lets see, I already commented. See...what, page 2?

I've noticed you're posting here a lot more. Have your checks to your "girlfriend" started bouncing already? Or did she realize that you're a womanizing prick who has nothing to offer in the way of a future?

Doesn't really matter, you're still a dick, everyone knows it. Your stories about your supposed "conquests" are a great source of humor. You do realize that no one here believes a single word that comes out of your cold-sore addled mouth, right?

I'm not sure I understand your reasoning here. First, if the checks from my girlfriend (if anyone uses checks anymore) were "bouncing" wouldn't I have to spend less time here as I would necessarily have to seek other sources of income? Scotch is not cheap, you know, or at least not any scotch worth drinking. Second, if I am a "womanizing prick" as you state, why would you not "believe a single word" regarding my supposed "conquests?" That seems a bit contradictory.

Are you really sure you're a lawyer as your analytical thinking seems very facile and you, as a poster, seem given to simply slinging insults -- which is ok, there are others like you -- but your insults have no logical consistency. I understand (or you've given us to believe) that you're not a trial lawyer, working instead primarily in intellectual property, but doesn't that endeavour take some critical faculties?

Sonnabend
10-26-2008, 06:44 AM
Look. I'm going to attempt this one more time (I'm not sure why) and then give up. What you cite are instances of bias and unprofessionalism that may or may not be true (bias is often in the eye and the prejudices of the beholder)."May not be"??? I am not in the habit of making things up. Every single one of them is 100% true.

Just ask Dan Rather..you can reach him at...oh wait...

I would be more than happy to tell the Haditha Marines that the fact they were crucified by the media "may or may not be true"...apart from the fact it is true.

Ilario Pantano's ordeal is documented fact.

What part of this don't you get?


What I am saying is that if what you and the extreme right sources and nutjobs like Berg are suggesting were true

The people discussing this are not "extreme right", they are nowhere near it...they, like myself, have serious questions that we would like answered.

Nice meme...it's a lie and a smear...but not bad.


it would be exposed by the media not because of any objectivity, not because of a desire to make the truth known, not for any "noble" reason, but rather for pure self-interest..and you are unbelievably naive. The proof that no chem weapons were used in Fallujah was handed to the media..they werent interested.

The proof that the Haditha Marines were innocent was shoved in their faces..they werent interested.

The media is not interested in the truth nor does it "serve their interests" when they are hellbent on seeing Obama elected and damn the consequences. Their "self interest" is their agenda, and no amount of truth will ever change that.

They, like you, stick their fingers in their ears and go "lalalala I cant hear yooouuu"..case in point, the massive proof of Obama's long involvement with Ayers...airbrushed over and dismissed out of hand.

His involvement with Wright...ignored.


A reporter or organization that could break such a scoop would have its ticket written.They'd be out of a job in 24 hrs. "The world wants Obama" scream the headlines.


Look at what exposing Watergate did for Woodward, Bernstein, bradley, and the Post!Look at what the Post has become in the present. Those days are dead, gone, buried under a pile of garbage. They, alonjg wioth the NY Slimes and other papers have been engaged in a campaign to smear everythng and everyone that dare oppose "The One™..and the Post and other papers have been running hit jobs on Palin and the others since day one.

You've been drinking their Kool-Aid, referring to Pres. Bush as "the idiot child"..quite frankly, he is way smarter than you will ever be.

He is a better man than you will ever be, and the vitriol and venom heaped upon him, egged on by willing "useful idiots" like you will remain a massive stain in the media forever.

You'd do better at DU..they'd be more your speed.


Money always trumps ideology, particularly when large numbers of people are involvedPrecisely..and promoting the Obamamessiah™ brings them revenue for papers and airtime. The truth doesnt sell paper, "if it bleeds it leads"....and the media have also been responsible for the lies and misinformation coming out of Iraq..we WON in Iraq..we stayed the course and we have won a massive victory.

Yet the media is silent.

I wonder why.:rolleyes:

Sonnabend
10-26-2008, 06:50 AM
I am curious, CW, do you believe as the revisionist media would tell you, that no veteran was ever spat upon and reviled by protestors?

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 07:32 AM
I am curious, CW, do you believe as the revisionist media would tell you, that no veteran was ever spat upon and reviled by protestors?

As I said, that was my last attempt. You don't seem to grasp the concept of self-interest vs ideology. Reporters, in your example, may or may not report just that, i.e., the spitting, because of their ideology, but would not necesarrily revise it to the truth because there's no fame or money in doing so.

As to your previous post, I consider you one of the more extreme right-wing posters on this board and I think most people here would agree.

Sonnabend
10-26-2008, 07:41 AM
As I said, that was my last attempt. You don't seem to grasp the concept of self-interest vs ideologyI grasp it fine. I just happen to believe that the media are deaf, dumb and blind to the truth and their own self interest, IMO, is served by their slavish following of the left leaning bias.

Their adulation of the One™ and their wilful ignorance of the many issues surrounding him is a good example. The fact that almost no media have ever gone hardball against Obama and asked him any tough questions is proof of that, the only one that did went after Biden and is now being pilloried by her media peers.


Reporters, in your example, may or may not report just that, i.e., the spitting, because of their ideology, but would not necesarrily revise it to the truth because there's no fame or money in doing so.Try again.The media, along with many others, are now pushing the meme that it never happened and it was a fabrication.

I stand witness it DID happen.

The media has taken the concept of "tell a lie often enough and people believe it to be the truth"...a meme you've swallowed hook line and sinker, in your case the "Bush is dumb" meme.

Its also called BDS.


As to your previous post, I consider you one of the more extreme right-wing posters on this board and I think most people here would agree.Okay, that's the third time you've used that label.

Define "extreme right wing."..and since when do you speak for anyone else except yourself? I don't give a rats ass what you "think" people will agree with, if they want to tell me, they will, they are more than capable of speaking for themselves.

Sonnabend
10-26-2008, 07:53 AM
Just took the test: wrong again, CW.

Your political compass Economic Left/Right: 0.75
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 0.77

http://www.politicalcompass.org/facebook/pcgraphpng.php?ec=0.75&soc=0.77

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 08:44 AM
Just took the test: wrong again, CW.

Oh I get it, I am "extreme right wing" because I dare question the ObamaMessiah™..well la di da... you are so superior..the rest of us all just whackjobs, or "whacky whacky" or "conspiracists"..:rolleyes:

..my arent we the smug one....:rolleyes:

Your political compass Economic Left/Right: 0.75
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 0.77

http://www.politicalcompass.org/facebook/pcgraphpng.php?ec=0.75&soc=0.77

Ah Jeez. You really have a low self-esteem, don't you? Couple that with nothing to do and you go take an internet personality test determined to prove you're not extreme right-wing and, surprise, surprise, it proves you're not extreme right-wing. I'd be interested in your "social libertarian" qualifications. Do you believe in (1) legalizing drugs, (2) legalizing prostitution, (3) same sex-marriage, (4) a woman's freedom of choice, (5) separation of church and state? Most social libertarians do.

However, refering to your previous post, you've asked me to define "extreme right-wing," so here you go...

The extreme right-wing mirrors the extreme left in that it tends to view the world in terms of "good vs evil," "us vs them," "black vs white," when, in fact, the world is much more nuanced (it's not a 1950s comic book; even Stan Lee knew that in the 60s). As a result of this view, extreme (right|left) wingers have tendencies to believe that life fits their ideology. Extreme left-wingers, for example, believe that GWB stole the elections through the use of Diebold, as such a belief fits their world view that since their side is "correct" there is no fair way they could lose. Extreme right wingers believe, for example, in a coordinated media conspiracy to foster leftist candidates and views and to defeat their champions, for exactly the same reason.

To focus upon the right-wingers and to provide a case-in-point from this board, one need only to look at McCain's choice of Sarah Palin as his running mate. I have often pointed out that the choice has gained him votes among the Republican base who might have sat out the election otherwise. That is an opinion generally shared here. However, when I point out that it has cost him votes among establishment conservatives, moderates, and independents, citing many, many well-known conservatives as proof (Will, Parker, Noonan, Buckley), people here violently disagree, resorting to calling me various liberal epithets, and accusing those cited as being "not one of us anyway." That's because they cannot conceive how such a statement can be true as it doesn't fit their world view. They can't conceive how Palin's views on abortion, same sex marriage, and abstinence-only education could alienate moderates, because deep down they really don't think moderates exist -- it's only us vs them. They can't conceive of how her demonstrated ignorance (which they not surprisingly enough blame on a hostile media, despite her blatant incompetence at answering some pretty straight-forward questions) on some basic governmental matters -- economics, foreign policy, the judicial system -- could alienate moderate conservatives who believe in competence and merit.

At the end, they're just like the extreme left, believing that whatever we do is right and whatever "the other side" does is wrong. The dear, departed MrBackoftheBus actually said that in a post I wish I'd saved. Addressing a liberal poster at the time (Buzzy, I think), who had pointed out some situation wherein MrBackoftheBus had condemned the left, but had failed to condemn the right, he actually said (paraphrasing only slightly), "When we do something it's right; when the left does the same thing, it's wrong." That view, unfortunately prevelant in both extremes, vividly illustrates what we're talking about here.

Finally, you again need to improve your reading skills. In my post, I said "I think most people here would agree with me." That is not speaking for others here, it is offering my opinion on their views.

Sonnabend
10-26-2008, 09:14 AM
Just a few comments on this little diatribe.


Ah Jeez. You really have a low self-esteem, don't you? Couple that with nothing to do and you go take an internet personality test determined to prove you're not extreme right-wing and, surprise, surprise, it proves you're not extreme right-wing. My, aren't we superior. I find it fascinating when you denigrate anyone who dares disagree with you by belittling them..that's a liberal meme "you're stupid".

"Nothing to do?" It's Sunday night, dipshit. Office is closed.


I'd be interested in your "social libertarian" qualifications. Do you believe in (1) legalizing drugs, (2) legalizing prostitution, (3) same sex-marriage, (4) a woman's freedom of choice, (5) separation of church and state? Most social libertarians do.Legalise drugs? No.
Legalise prostitution? Yes.
Same sex marraige? HELL NO..
A woman's freedom of choice: Abortion on demand? No.
Separation of church and state: Null issue. Relevance?


The extreme right-wing mirrors the extreme left in that it tends to view the world in terms of "good vs evil," "us vs them," "black vs white," Well, yes, I tend to consider someone who wants to kill me and my family, who wants to bomb buses, schools, nightclubs etc as "evil"....I'd be interested in what you'd call Amrozi..a freedom fighter?

Us vs Them? Yes.


When, in fact, the world is much more nuanced (it's not a 1950s comic book; even Stan Lee knew that in the 60s)."Nuanced"? Is that your word for "theyre not terrorists or murderers, just misunderstood" "they're freedom fighters..the fact they murdered 3000 people is just blowback for what we did"..?

You channelling Kerry?


Extreme right wingers believe, for example, in a coordinated media conspiracy to foster leftist candidates and views and to defeat their champions, for exactly the same reason.Pick up any paper recently and the leftist bias and agenda is plain as the nose on your face. You're telling me you believe the media is fair and balanced??

Bwahahah!!!!!

I can point to a hundred examples of media bias...here's another one for you. Remember the Israel Lebanon conflict? There were reports that the UN posts had been fired upon by the dastardly Israelis..what was ignored in the media even after it was reported to them was that the Lebanese were firing on them from those positions.

Pallywood anyone? Green Helmet Guy?

How about the sterling example of two BBC reporters who wanted to show the evils of the Israelis..and asked a ten year old boy to stand next to an unexploded 1000 lb bomb.

What would you call what happened to the Haditha Marines? Would you say the media coverage they were given was "fair"..or will you have the guts to admit they were subjected to trial by media and convicted before the enquiry had even begun?Ask the average person in the street if they can trust the media, more than 80 percent will say NO. This is..news...to you?

Re Palin, not interested in your opinion, we are well aware of where your ideals lie and the fact you have been here and actively shilling for Obama. Your sneering. dismissive attitude towards her and the President is quite obvious.


They can't conceive of how her demonstrated ignorance (which they not surprisingly enough blame on a hostile media, despite her blatant incompetence at answering some pretty straight-forward questions) on some basic governmental matters -- economics, foreign policy, the judicial system -- could alienate moderate conservatives who believe in competence and merit.

As opposed to Biden's outright lies in an interview the other day?

Sarah Palin is neither ignorant nor stupid, and was in a "gotcha" interview with Couric..who is hardly someone I'de call reputable.

Like the rest of the presstitutes, she had her own agenda as you do..the same liberal meme again "she's stupid" and then the other meme "repeat a lie and repeat it until it becomes the truth".

The repeat hit jobs on Sarah Palin and John McCain vs the media's outright worship of Obama have made this election one of the most disgusting displays of partisan politics and media betrayal of the public trust.


Another such admission was made earlier today by NBC anchor Brian Williams who said the following:I interviewed Lee Cowan, our reporter who covers Obama, while we were out yesterday and posted the interview on the web. Lee says it's hard to stay objective covering this guy. Courageous for Lee to say, to be honest.


Or this (http://www.nypost.com/seven/10222008/postopinion/opedcolumnists/bidens_bungles__a_blatant_bias_134700.htm)


Again the media showed their incredible bias by giving scattered coverage of Biden's statements. There were a few exceptions. On MSNBC's "Morning Joe," co-host Mika Brzezinski flipped incredulously through the papers, expressing shock at the lack of coverage of Biden's remarks. Guest Dan Rather admitted that if Palin had said it, the media would be going nuts.


Or this


The stock answer is: "It's just Biden being Biden." We all know how smart he is about foreign policy, so it's not the same as when Sarah Palin says something that seems off.

Yet, when Biden asserted incorrectly in the vice-presidential debate that the United States "drove Hezbollah out of Lebanon," nobody in the US media shrieked. (It was, however, covered with derision in the Middle East.)


Or when he confused his history by claiming FDR calmed the nation during the Depression by going on TV, the press didn't take it as evidence that he's clueless.


And Biden is the foreign-policy gravitas on the Democratic ticket, so his comments are actually even more disconcerting.


And you have the nerve to call Sarah Palin "ignorant"?


Finally, you again need to improve your reading skills. In my post, I said "I think most people here would agree with me." That is not speaking for others here, it is offering my opinion on their views.

Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

biccat
10-26-2008, 09:18 AM
Okay, that's the third time you've used that label.

Define "extreme right wing."..and since when do you speak for anyone else except yourself? I don't give a rats ass what you "think" people will agree with, if they want to tell me, they will, they are more than capable of speaking for themselves.
Honestly Sonna, I don't know why you bother trying to reason with a liberal. You've got more tolerance than I do. Everyone else can see he's not really engaging you in debate, but throwing out platitudes and personal insults.

While I agree he is good at this particular style of debate, it does get tiring pretty quickly.

Oh, and C.W: since you obviously missed it, I wanted to clarify one point:
Most men don't consider paying money to a woman to have her spend time with you or sleep with you a "conquest." Your definition may be different. Although this would suggest you consider paying money to go see a movie the equivalent to being invited to an opening premier.

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 09:23 AM
Just a few comments on this little diatribe.

My, aren't we superior. I find it fascinating when you denigrate anyone who dares disagree with you by belittling them..that's a liberal meme "you're stupid".

"Nothing to do?" It's Sunday night, dipshit. Office is closed.

Legalise drugs? No.
Legalise prostitution? Yes.
Same sex marraige? HELL NO..
A woman's freedom of choice: Abortion on demand? No.
Separation of church and state: Null issue. Relevance?

Well, yes, I tend to consider someone who wants to kill me and my family, who wants to bomb buses, schools, nightclubs ewtc as "evil"....I'd be interested in what you'd call Amrozi..a freedom fighter?

Us vs Them? Yes.

"Nuanced"? Is that your word for "theyre not terrorists or murderers, just misunderstood" "they're freedom fighters..the fact they murdered 3000 people is just blowback for what we did"..?

You channelling Kerry?

Pick up any paper recently and the leftist bias and agenda is plain as the nose on your face. You're telling me you believe the media is fair and balanced??

Bwahahah!!!!!

I can point to a hundred examples of media bias...here's another one for you. Remember the Israel Lebanon conflict? There were reports that the UN posts had been fired upon by the dastardly Israelis..what was ignored in the media even after it was reported to them was that the Lebanese were firing on them from those positions.

Pallywood anyone? Green Helmet Guy?

How about the sterling example of two BBC reporters who wanted to show the evils of the Israelis..and asked a ten year old boy to stand next to an unexploded 1000 lb bomb.

Ask the average person in the street if they can trust the media, more than 80 percent will say NO. This is..news...to you?

Re Palin, not interested in your opinion, we are well aware of where your ideals lie and the fact you have been here and actively shilling for Obama. Your sneering attitude towards her and the President is quite obvious.

Opinions are like assholes, everyone has one.

I gotta tell you. I don't think I could have written a parody of the extreme right-wing to match what you just posted! :D Perfect, right down to the "if you don't like Palin, you must support Obama" meme, the stated government-backed morals beliefs, and the name-calling. God, you are a prize!

As to my comment regarding "low self-esteem," don't you find it a little abnormal that an internets poster would observe another's political tendencies and the second would rush out to take an internet quiz to prove the first wrong? I find that just shouts to the rooftops, "I'm insecure." BTW, I can take that test and score in any of the four quadrants depending on where I want to end up.

Finally, just out of curiousity, what's your definition of extreme right-wing? Or does such a thing exist?

Sonnabend
10-26-2008, 09:46 AM
Tell ya what CW, why don't you take the time and address the points I raised instead.

G'night.

Lager
10-26-2008, 11:36 AM
The extreme right-wing mirrors the extreme left in that it tends to view the world in terms of "good vs evil," "us vs them," "black vs white," when, in fact, the world is much more nuanced (it's not a 1950s comic book; even Stan Lee knew that in the 60s). As a result of this view, extreme (right|left) wingers have tendencies to believe that life fits their ideology. Extreme left-wingers, for example, believe that GWB stole the elections through the use of Diebold, as such a belief fits their world view that since their side is "correct" there is no fair way they could lose. Extreme right wingers believe, for example, in a coordinated media conspiracy to foster leftist candidates and views and to defeat their champions, for exactly the same reason.

To focus upon the right-wingers and to provide a case-in-point from this board, one need only to look at McCain's choice of Sarah Palin as his running mate. I have often pointed out that the choice has gained him votes among the Republican base who might have sat out the election otherwise. That is an opinion generally shared here. However, when I point out that it has cost him votes among establishment conservatives, moderates, and independents, citing many, many well-known conservatives as proof (Will, Parker, Noonan, Buckley),

I agree with a lot of what you've stated here. But there are a couple of points I where I diverge from your view. It's true that many conservatives have come out against the pick of Palin. Will and Noonan are two of my favorite conservative writers. But unlike Buckley, I can't see those two or many other traditional, small government conseratives voting for a big government liberal like Obama, or third party simply in protest. So there's a little disagreement whether their disappointment in McCain has cost him their vote. But there's no doubt that a Palin pick was risky and history may judge that the gamble did not pay off. It's also quite possible that picking Lieberman would have been a worse mistake. It's even likely that had he run the most perfect of campaigns for a republican, he still could have come up short.

Secondly, I disagree with your assumption about the views of moderates mirroring those of your own, which you've described as social libertarian. I know many self described moderates, and their views don't always fall in line with your outline of them. It's quite possible to be personally against abortion or prostitution and still favor a strong government. I have a close friend who shares many conservative values but calls himself a democrat because he hates and distrusts big corporations.

The disagreement between you and many conservatives on this board seems to be that you believe McCain should have chosen a more moderate candidate to appeal to the center. Yet many conservatives feel McCain is already too moderate himself. (i.e. his mortgage bailout plan, McCain - Feingold, etc.). How could you expect that they'd go along with moving the party so far to the left simply to appeal to the center?

Since Lieberman seems to be a better fit for you, I maintain that the Dems have less of a distance to travel to arrive at your coordinates. To me, Lieberman isn't really a departure for them, he represents what they've moved away from. So I'm kind of confused why you don't believe your efforts aren't better spent trying to move a party that has more in agreement with you a short distance back to where they came from, rather than moving a party that's farther from you, a good bit of distance toward a place they've never been.

Phillygirl
10-26-2008, 01:02 PM
"Hinterlands", "flyover", "the farm"...CW...why do you hate America? :D
/toadie

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 03:05 PM
"Hinterlands", "flyover", "the farm"...CW...why do you hate America? :D
/toadie

I don't think you've got this toadie thing down quite right yet. :D

Phillygirl
10-26-2008, 03:14 PM
I don't think you've got this toadie thing down quite right yet. :D

I'll try harder, but I'm not drinking that nasty scotch you elitists are fond of.

JB
10-26-2008, 03:18 PM
Jesus wept. :rolleyes:So did Berg.

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 03:44 PM
First, let me thank you for your reasoned, rational response. It's a bit of a relief after dealing with previous posters in this thread.


I agree with a lot of what you've stated here. But there are a couple of points I where I diverge from your view. It's true that many conservatives have come out against the pick of Palin. Will and Noonan are two of my favorite conservative writers. But unlike Buckley, I can't see those two or many other traditional, small government conseratives voting for a big government liberal like Obama, or third party simply in protest. So there's a little disagreement whether their disappointment in McCain has cost him their vote. But there's no doubt that a Palin pick was risky and history may judge that the gamble did not pay off. It's also quite possible that picking Lieberman would have been a worse mistake. It's even likely that had he run the most perfect of campaigns for a republican, he still could have come up short.

I agree with you that McCain was between a "rock and a hard place," in the sense that the extreme right of his party distrusted him, so to pick up their votes (as opposed to allowing them to stay at home) he needed to pick an "anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage, anti-sex" (well, in the case of everyone excepting immediate family) candidate. My read of him is that he would have liked to have picked Lieberman or Ridge, but the "base" would have gone crazy. My observation, however, that I've been attacked here for making is that in making the choice he did, he cost himself significant votes amongst establishment Republicans, moderates, and independents. This is a result not only of Palin's extreme views, but also of the perception that McCain pandered to politics, hardly the right image for a "maverick."


Secondly, I disagree with your assumption about the views of moderates mirroring those of your own, which you've described as social libertarian. I know many self described moderates, and their views don't always fall in line with your outline of them. It's quite possible to be personally against abortion or prostitution and still favor a strong government. I have a close friend who shares many conservative values but calls himself a democrat because he hates and distrusts big corporations.

I don't think that most suburban soccer moms and other "moderate" demographics share all of my views, and that's why, although I pointed out to Sonna that true social libertarians favored legalization of drugs (hell, WFB favored legalizing marijuiana) and prostitution, I was careful not to include those in the list of Palin's attributes to which I think moderates object. I think all demographics show that most of America is "comfortable" with the legal status of abortion, although many who look think that Roe v Wade was a flawed decision (Alan Dershowitz, included). However, any move towards a consitutional amendment outlawing abortion is seen by the vast majority of Americans as extreme. Similar views are held against Palin's stand on gay marriage (she doesn't seem to even favor civil unions) and abstinence-only education. Moreover, her demonstrated ignorance on things like economics (that answer she gave to the "evil" Katy Couric was just wretched), supreme court decisions, and foreign policy have also alienated a good deal of "thinking," as opposed to emotional (on either side) America.


The disagreement between you and many conservatives on this board seems to be that you believe McCain should have chosen a more moderate candidate to appeal to the center. Yet many conservatives feel McCain is already too moderate himself. (i.e. his mortgage bailout plan, McCain - Feingold, etc.). How could you expect that they'd go along with moving the party so far to the left simply to appeal to the center?

Since Lieberman seems to be a better fit for you, I maintain that the Dems have less of a distance to travel to arrive at your coordinates. To me, Lieberman isn't really a departure for them, he represents what they've moved away from. So I'm kind of confused why you don't believe your efforts aren't better spent trying to move a party that has more in agreement with you a short distance back to where they came from, rather than moving a party that's farther from you, a good bit of distance toward a place they've never been.

If McCain had picked Lieberman, I would have voted for that ticket without hesitation. If Biden had won the Dim primary and picked Lieberman, the same. However, you misjudge me and the Republican party, I believe. The Democrats have moved so far towards big government, nanny-state, "blame America" politics that I think they are pretty much unredemable. However, and unfortunately, the Repubs seem to be moving towards the God, Guns, and (no-)Gays stance represented probably best by Huckaboom, Palin, and Fox News. I think at some point in the future you will see an alliance between the few national defense, limited government, secular Democrats and the establishment, northeastern, meritocratic Republicans, i.e., the true realization of Clinton and Blair's "third way," rather than seeing either party shift dramatically towards the center.

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 03:45 PM
I'll try harder, but I'm not drinking that nasty scotch you elitists are fond of.

Hey! I've only had two today. But, it's only 4:30 after all. :D

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 03:46 PM
Tell ya what CW, why don't you take the time and address the points I raised instead.

G'night.

Nooo. I'll tell you what, Sonna. I answered your question, now you answer mine. What do you consider are the characteristics of an extreme right-winger?

Shannon
10-26-2008, 03:50 PM
What do you consider are the characteristics of an extreme right-winger?

Anyone who loves the movie Red Dawn and hates the "sport" of soccer.:D

Sonnabend
10-26-2008, 03:50 PM
Nooo. I'll tell you what, Sonna. I answered your question, now you answer mine. What do you consider are the characteristics of an extreme right-winger?And I'll tell you to go screw yourself, and go look at a fucking clock. I have more important things to do.

Monday morning.

DUH.

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 03:51 PM
Anyone who loves the movie Red Dawn and hates the "sport" of soccer.:D

Here's a secret! I don't hate Red Dawn as I've never seen it. However, as I pointed out to JB in another thread, the Gunners won today! :D

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 03:52 PM
And I'll tell you to go screw yourself, and go look at a fucking clock. I have more important things to do.

Ohhh, go to your "important" job. I'm sure M is waiting on you.

Sonnabend
10-26-2008, 04:19 PM
Far more important than you. that's for certain. And more interesting. And more fun.

With an added benefit.,..they pay me, not the other way around.

JB
10-26-2008, 04:22 PM
Aye Carumba.

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 04:22 PM
Far more important than you. that's for certain. And more interesting. And more fun.

With an added benefit.,..they pay me, not the other way around.

I'm sure...


http://www.germes-online.com/direct/dbimage/10153407/Raw_Peanuts_in_Shell.jpg

Phillygirl
10-26-2008, 04:23 PM
Aye Carumba.

Hey, speak English, commie!

Shannon
10-26-2008, 04:26 PM
Here's a secret! I don't hate Red Dawn as I've never seen it.

Commie!!!!

JB
10-26-2008, 04:32 PM
Hey, speak English, commie!
Commie!!!!Commies!!!!!!!!

Judging by exclamation points, I win.

Cold Warrior
10-26-2008, 04:35 PM
Commie!!!!

I did see My Dinner with Andre, however. Is Red Dawn similar? :D