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Jumpy
11-01-2008, 01:14 PM
I know, I know, this sounds like a DU post.. but honestly, I was a Ron Paul supporter, and now I will be cringing and voting for McCain, and against Obama.

My son has apparently been lost to the college libs.. he left for college as a voting conservative, and now he tells me that he is voting Obama. I threw the abortion issue at him, and while he is prolife, it did not phase him. That issue does matter more to my daughter, but not enough to convince her either. (She seems to want to vote Republican, but she is drawn to all of the hype over Obama) Neither one of my kids really care if "rich people" are taxed more.

So my son is lost.. but I can still probably offset his vote with my daughters.... outside of telling her that she is grounded if she does not vote republican, :) do ya'all have any really good ideas on what to tell her in time for Tuesday? This is her first presidential vote.

Any good simple links? Something that can be verified at www.politifact.org

Edited to add.. I have not listened to any political radio, and have not watched any of the tv pundits, or shows.. maybe I should've? Anyway, I am looking for something other than "they are bad.. we are good".

wilbur
11-01-2008, 02:06 PM
Republicans haven't been republican or conservative for a very long time now... I don't see the value in voting for them anymore. In fact, now that I think of it... I can't remember a time in my life where the republicans, as a party, actually did anything but act like democrats with social authoritariansm mixed in. So to that end, I have to wonder anymore why its even consequential that we have a republican over a democrat in the white house? They will both do their best to tank the economy will sucking up more power. Anyone with illusions that any of the main party candidates are more desirable to the other has simply fallen for the marketing of the campaign season. They are both pledged to continue to bleed us to death..

I would encourage her to throw away her vote on a third party.

BadCat
11-01-2008, 02:10 PM
Republicans haven't been republican or conservative for a very long time now... I don't see the value in voting for them anymore. In fact, now that I think of it... I can't remember a time in my life where the republicans, as a party, actually did anything but act like democrats with social authoritariansm mixed in. So to that end, I have to wonder anymore why its even consequential that we have a republican over a democrat in the white house? They will both do their best to tank the economy will sucking up more power. Anyone with illusions that any of the main party candidates are more desirable to the other has simply fallen for the marketing of the campaign season. They are both pledged to continue to bleed us to death..

I would encourage her to throw away her vote on a third party.

Still bitter that Dr.Nuts took your money and ran away, huh?

patriot45
11-01-2008, 02:10 PM
This is a good place to visit each day. Good articles from the top conservatives.

Town hall (http://www.google.com/url?q=http://townhall.com/columnists/&sa=X&oi=smap&resnum=1&ct=result&cd=1&usg=AFQjCNFa6LwLNMy9fB38jdAgYXabzxiKcQ)


Or else get your news from CU!!! :D

patriot45
11-01-2008, 02:12 PM
Republicans haven't been republican or conservative for a very long time now... I don't see the value in voting for them anymore. In fact, now that I think of it... I can't remember a time in my life where the republicans, as a party, actually did anything but act like democrats with social authoritariansm mixed in. So to that end, I have to wonder anymore why its even consequential that we have a republican over a democrat in the white house? They will both do their best to tank the economy will sucking up more power. Anyone with illusions that any of the main party candidates are more desirable to the other has simply fallen for the marketing of the campaign season. They are both pledged to continue to bleed us to death..

I would encourage her to throw away her vote on a third party.

That would be a vote for Obama. No one is totally happy with McCain, but the alternative is Baaad!

Phillygirl
11-01-2008, 02:14 PM
My top issues for talking to the kids about it (okay, only the 10 year old really engages with me...the 17 year old seemed to have little interest) are national security and the effect on taxes to the regular person.

But, when I talked to the 17 year old, who had no idea if he was a republican or a democrat, I just asked him questions about issues (I stayed away from abortion). As it turned out, his answers indicated he's a republican.

But it sounds like your daughter has more information than my nephew did in any event.

See my post about my 10 year old. I'll let you know what has swayed him. :D

Eyelids
11-01-2008, 02:23 PM
Funny how once somebody goes out and gets a real education they turn into a Democrat.

AlmostThere
11-01-2008, 02:49 PM
There are NUMEROUS videos available on the Internet of Obama, in his own words, from his own mouth, saying things that should scare the hell out of anyone not in a coma.

Ask your son if it matters who someone counts as his friends. An answer in the affirmative is more than enough reason why this man should not be the leader of the free world.

You might mention that RICH started out at 250K, then 200K, then 150K and as of today - 120K. That Obama has voted to raise taxes on anyone making more than $41,600. That he will be looking for a career soon and when the rich are used as Obama's piggy bank, it is unlikely that they will be hiring him because the money normally used to grow the business and hire new employees will be going to support Obama's welfare state. So if he is OK with Obama deciding what his standard of living should be and how much money he is ENTITLED to keep no matter how hard he works, go ahead and vote for Obama.

I'd then say, "Please, please, remember that I warned you of exactly what to expect and you chose not to believe me. It will not be my fault for the world you are forced to live in. And with liberals controlling Congress and the Executive branch, it will take at least a generation, if ever, to dig out of the welfare state in which we will have sunk. If that's what you want for YOUR children, YOUR family, go right ahead and vote for Mr. Obama. You WILL get what you've asked for."

Unfortunately, sometimes kids have to learn the hard way, no matter how obvious the true answer is. But it will be an extremely expensive lesson. One he will never forget.

wilbur
11-01-2008, 02:52 PM
Still bitter that Dr.Nuts took your money and ran away, huh?

No, just bitter that McCain/Obama have been complicit it either taking or devaluing much of my money (and yours) and running away.

Anyways.... Jumpy, can you debate your kids? Perhaps if you can't change their mind, you should consider changing yours;P

Jumpy
11-01-2008, 03:08 PM
Still bitter that Dr.Nuts took your money and ran away, huh?

No bitterness here. I never regret giving money towards something that I believe in. When your children are grown, why will they vote conservative? What will you tell them, outside of "we are good.. they are bad."?

linda22003
11-01-2008, 03:22 PM
I threw the abortion issue at him, and while he is prolife, it did not phase him. That issue does matter more to my daughter, but not enough to convince her either.

It's not a compelling voting issue for most people. As far as your children are concerned, it has "always" been legal, so even if they don't like it, it's a fact. I think that's true for a lot of voters.

megimoo
11-01-2008, 03:30 PM
This is a good place to visit each day. Good articles from the top conservatives.

Town hall (http://www.google.com/url?q=http://townhall.com/columnists/&sa=X&oi=smap&resnum=1&ct=result&cd=1&usg=AFQjCNFa6LwLNMy9fB38jdAgYXabzxiKcQ)


Or else get your news from CU!!! :DAnd don't for GODS sake pay any attention to DOOM AND GLOOM WILBER !

megimoo
11-01-2008, 03:55 PM
I know, I know, this sounds like a DU post.. but honestly, I was a Ron Paul supporter, and now I will be cringing and voting for McCain, and against Obama.

My son has apparently been lost to the college libs.. he left for college as a voting conservative, and now he tells me that he is voting Obama. I threw the abortion issue at him, and while he is prolife, it did not phase him. That issue does matter more to my daughter, but not enough to convince her either. (She seems to want to vote Republican, but she is drawn to all of the hype over Obama) Neither one of my kids really care if "rich people" are taxed more.

So my son is lost.. but I can still probably offset his vote with my daughters.... outside of telling her that she is grounded if she does not vote republican, :) do ya'all have any really good ideas on what to tell her in time for Tuesday? This is her first presidential vote.

Any good simple links? Something that can be verified at www.politifact.org

Edited to add.. I have not listened to any political radio, and have not watched any of the tv pundits, or shows.. maybe I should've? Anyway, I am looking for something other than "they are bad.. we are good".
Don't feel down .How many of my friends complain that they send a good, well brought up, Catholic kid to College and the get back a GODLESS little heathen liberal. College is a hotbed of liberals ideas and if a kid is a Christian and Conservative by family he is always fighting about his faith and politics. It's a phase they all go through and eventually most wake-up and start to think rationally again.It usually happens when they have their first large paycheck and look at all of the taxes taken out .To convince your kids to keep their politics to themselves while in school and when at work for them to survive in the business world .

Goldwater
11-01-2008, 04:13 PM
No bitterness here. I never regret giving money towards something that I believe in. When your children are grown, why will they vote conservative? What will you tell them, outside of "we are good.. they are bad."?

Maybe you should suggest an independant candidate like Barr or Baldwin (even Nader), and tell him that politics isn't a fashion craze.

megimoo
11-01-2008, 04:15 PM
[SIZE="3"]Catholic Vote 2008 - For Life, Family, Faith, Freedom!

Catholic Vote 2008,National Council of Churches, reports 67,515,016 registered members of the Roman Catholic Church.

24.5% of Americans are Catholics .

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61wj4tJICcc&eurl=http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2121967/posts

MrsSmith
11-01-2008, 07:29 PM
Abortion was huge with my kids. None of them believe in murdering kids. However, there is the current financial crisis, brought on by Democratic policies to which Obama subscribes, and which both the Bush administration and McCain tried to forestall by changing the regulations requiring banks to loan to those who were likely to default.

There is the worry of what war we will face in your children's future if we lose in Iraq and Afghanistan. There is the fact that the Democrats would draft not only young men, but also young women, if a draft becomes necessary. And, in the interests of "fairness," would send women into battle. They've also written bills that would remove any "excuse" for not serving...like going to college, or having young children.

There is the "fairness doctrine," which is in direct contradiction to free speech rights.

The Democrats were also the ones who invented "free speech zones" to limit the places where college kids are allowed to speak their minds...and they "own" the NEA, which controls colleges, so free speech will continue to be abused in colleges and public schools.

As it is, when your kids find work, they are likely to see 20% coming straight out of their check in taxes...much of which they may never see again. Remind them that this percentage will only grow under Democratic leadership. Obama can't possibly do any part of what he's promised without killing the Bush tax cuts. Remind your kids that, in addition to being forced to pay Social Security taxes all their lives, they will also be forced to save in a 401K if they actually want to retire...and now the Congress is considering yet another retirement scheme that will force them to pay into some third type of "safe" retirement account...and please make sure they know that Social Security is in danger because the government "borrowed" from it instead of holding it in trust for us. Please also look up the federal budget and show them that the largest spending category is social spending, not the military spending that many leftist sites lie about. (Although our federal government is constitutionally able to spend on military, while all the social spending is unconstitutional.)

Sonnabend
11-01-2008, 07:33 PM
Funny how once somebody goes out and gets a real education they turn into a Democrat.

Yeah..like Berkely and Bill Ayers..he's well educated.:rolleyes:

AmPat
11-02-2008, 03:22 AM
I know, I know, this sounds like a DU post.. but honestly, I was a Ron Paul supporter, and now I will be cringing and voting for McCain, and against Obama.

My son has apparently been lost to the college libs.. he left for college as a voting conservative, and now he tells me that he is voting Obama. I threw the abortion issue at him, and while he is prolife, it did not phase him. That issue does matter more to my daughter, but not enough to convince her either. (She seems to want to vote Republican, but she is drawn to all of the hype over Obama) Neither one of my kids really care if "rich people" are taxed more.

So my son is lost.. but I can still probably offset his vote with my daughters.... outside of telling her that she is grounded if she does not vote republican, :) do ya'all have any really good ideas on what to tell her in time for Tuesday? This is her first presidential vote.

Any good simple links? Something that can be verified at www.politifact.org

Edited to add.. I have not listened to any political radio, and have not watched any of the tv pundits, or shows.. maybe I should've? Anyway, I am looking for something other than "they are bad.. we are good".

You could remind them how "excited" the Germans were over the "change" the little Austrian preached.

AmPat
11-02-2008, 03:27 AM
Funny how once somebody goes out and gets a real education they turn into a Democrat.
Strange how that is as true as every other post you make.:rolleyes:

AlmostThere
11-02-2008, 04:05 AM
You could remind them how "excited" the Germans were over the "change" the little Austrian preached.
Or enough of the Cuban population to let Castro sweep into power.

patsfan
11-02-2008, 07:37 AM
It may be harsh, but I would ask them if they knew what partal birth abortion entailed. It might also work with your son.

Ree
11-02-2008, 11:25 AM
Funny how once somebody goes out and gets a real education they turn into a Democrat.
And even funnier..when they get out into the real world, they turn Conservative...Must be that shock when they get thir pay stubs...

Eyelids
11-02-2008, 11:55 AM
And even funnier..when they get out into the real world, they turn Conservative...Must be that shock when they get thir pay stubs...

Only 2 more days before everything you guys say gets trampled. I'm really excited.

Goldwater
11-02-2008, 11:58 AM
Jumpy some people just don't vote on abortion (rightly so when you see the results of doing it so far), what is important to your son?

Constitutionally Speaking
11-02-2008, 12:17 PM
I know, I know, this sounds like a DU post.. but honestly, I was a Ron Paul supporter, and now I will be cringing and voting for McCain, and against Obama.

My son has apparently been lost to the college libs.. he left for college as a voting conservative, and now he tells me that he is voting Obama. I threw the abortion issue at him, and while he is prolife, it did not phase him. That issue does matter more to my daughter, but not enough to convince her either. (She seems to want to vote Republican, but she is drawn to all of the hype over Obama) Neither one of my kids really care if "rich people" are taxed more.

So my son is lost.. but I can still probably offset his vote with my daughters.... outside of telling her that she is grounded if she does not vote republican, :) do ya'all have any really good ideas on what to tell her in time for Tuesday? This is her first presidential vote.

Any good simple links? Something that can be verified at www.politifact.org

Edited to add.. I have not listened to any political radio, and have not watched any of the tv pundits, or shows.. maybe I should've? Anyway, I am looking for something other than "they are bad.. we are good".

I would simply point out the similarities to Obama's policies and to Jimmy Carter's policies and then make sure she understands how badly Jimmy Carter damageds us.

He gave a HUGE boost to the rise of radical Islam with his handling of Iran. He was responsible for DOUBLE DIGIT unemployment - just as Reagan was taking office, interest rates nearly 19% and inflation at nearly 14%

Compare those to the economy we have now.

Then point out that Carter was Responsible for the Community Re-investment Act which mandated that banks make these bad loans or be investigated both criminally and be liable for discrimination lawsuits. Then point out that Obama, acting as a lawyer for ACORN actually SUED Citibank to FORCE them to make bad loans. The Democrats then gave incentives to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to guarantee these bad loans and then forced/incentified the banks to make MORE of these bad loans. The fannie and freddie guarantees also made possible the packaging of the derivatives and the whole mess that caused thefinancial problems we are now facing.


In other words,most of the problems we have now has been because of policies that Obama wants us to expand - including those spending excesses of the Bush Administration.

Obama's policies are nearly identical to the failed policies of Jimmy Carter, and where they DO differ, the ARE similar to George Bush's.

biccat
11-02-2008, 12:26 PM
Neither one of my kids really care if "rich people" are taxed more.

People making $42,000/year are considered "rich people"?

Tell your kids to look at Obama's record, not his talking points. What kind of tax policies has he voted for and endorsed? He has pledged to repeal the Bush tax cuts, which will impact everyone who pays taxes.

wilbur
11-02-2008, 06:37 PM
It may be harsh, but I would ask them if they knew what partal birth abortion entailed. It might also work with your son.

Partial birth is a red herring and really a non-issue.... there are extremely few of these performed, and in the vast majority of these very few cases it is for extreme medical circumstance... non-viable fetus, or danger to the mother if carried to term etc. In other words... very ugly situations where this ugly decision is probably the best one. You really won't be finding doctor's performing PB's because the mother just decided she didnt want a baby after all.

MrsSmith
11-02-2008, 07:05 PM
Partial birth is a red herring and really a non-issue.... there are extremely few of these performed, and in the vast majority of these very few cases it is for extreme medical circumstance... non-viable fetus, or danger to the mother if carried to term etc. In other words... very ugly situations where this ugly decision is probably the best one. You really won't be finding doctor's performing PB's because the mother just decided she didnt want a baby after all.
This is true. Most late term abortions are quite different. Instead, they use ultrasound to locate the baby's heart and insert a needle through the mother's abdomen and into the baby's heart. They then give a fatal dose of digoxin, enough to cause the baby's heart to literally beat so hard it explodes. Once the child has been safely murdered, they begin the procedure to deliver the dead baby. This is far less rare...and at least as horrifying, given the fact that the child's ability to feel pain is fully developed.

cowbell
11-02-2008, 07:15 PM
Well, either we have to massively cut spending or we have to increase taxing and cut spending. And, Obama is even decreasing taxing (which I think is stupid). But Bush's tax cuts are not sustainable, they doubled our debt in 8 years. I mean, 70 years of debt, we doubled in 8. That's preposterous. I'm just saying the Bush tax cuts are unsustainable, they have to be repealed. It is unconscionable to leave them. Someone has to pay them. At some point, someone has to give China the however many trillion dollars we owe them. And then, what are we going to do? You want to talk about American security? Talk about selling ourselves to China. I would like to have our destiny in our own pocket, not in their pocket.

xavierob82
11-02-2008, 07:15 PM
And even funnier..when they get out into the real world, they turn Conservative...Must be that shock when they get thir pay stubs...


They only "turn conservative" if they get brainwashed by an evangelical church or are still hung-up with trivial non-issues like abortion, gays, or guns.

Why else do you think cities and suburban areas outside those cities are liberal strongholds? Because that's where liberals move to after college to get jobs and start families, and turn those areas blue.;)

AmPat
11-02-2008, 07:28 PM
They only "turn conservative" if they get brainwashed by an evangelical church or are still hung-up with trivial non-issues like abortion, gays, or guns.

Why else do you think cities and suburban areas outside those cities are liberal strongholds? Because that's where liberals move to after college to get jobs and start families, and turn those areas blue.;)

Then they retire and run as fast as they can away from the cesspool they created because they can't afford to retire there. Then they begin the process of screwing up the neighboring state by bringing their failed political philosophy with them.

Old dogs don't seem to learn new tricks after all.:rolleyes:

MrsSmith
11-02-2008, 07:30 PM
They only "turn conservative" if they get brainwashed by an evangelical church or are still hung-up with trivial non-issues like abortion, gays, or guns.

Why else do you think cities and suburban areas outside those cities are liberal strongholds? Because that's where liberals move to after college to get jobs and start families, and turn those areas blue.;)

ROFL!!!BwaHaHa... trivial non-issues!! ROFL!!!

Troll
11-03-2008, 12:51 AM
They only "turn conservative" if they get brainwashed by an evangelical church or are still hung-up with trivial non-issues like abortion, gays, or guns.

I know you don't really mean that, but speaking only for myself, I 'turned conservative' when:

- I realized that the only thing the government does well is collect taxes.

- I realized that you continue building 'tolerance' for anything until it kills you.

- I realized that some people cannot be rehabilitated.

- I realized that handouts only breed dependence.

- I realized that I like keeping things that I worked to get.

- I realized that taking guns from people empowers criminals and the government.

- I realized that uncontrolled immigration is poison.

- I realized that anybody will say anything to get elected or re-elected.

- I realized that there are people who do nothing but think of ways to harm America.

- I realized that competition is good for both businesses and customers.

- I realized that 'democracy' is a pseudonym for 'mob rule'.

- I realized that, as Dr. Seuss said, 'A person's a person, no matter how small.'

- I realized that anything people will hate you for saying is probably true.

- I realized that communism and freedom are like oil and water.

- I realized that there is a government behind the government that controls both parties.

...And I didn't get any of that in church.

Constitutionally Speaking
11-03-2008, 04:39 AM
Well, either we have to massively cut spending or we have to increase taxing and cut spending. And, Obama is even decreasing taxing (which I think is stupid). But Bush's tax cuts are not sustainable, they doubled our debt in 8 years. I mean, 70 years of debt, we doubled in 8. That's preposterous. I'm just saying the Bush tax cuts are unsustainable, they have to be repealed. It is unconscionable to leave them. Someone has to pay them. At some point, someone has to give China the however many trillion dollars we owe them. And then, what are we going to do? You want to talk about American security? Talk about selling ourselves to China. I would like to have our destiny in our own pocket, not in their pocket.


Bush's tax cuts DID NOT double our our debt. SPENDING did. Revenues INCREASED in Bush's Presidency, it's just that spending increase more.


Bush's tax cuts took a time of DECREASING federal tax receipts and reversed it so that revenues were coming in hand over fist.

This is a LIE put out there by the left who I am convinced want to stifle free enterprise.

Lets look at the ACTUAL facts:
Federal Reciepts:

2000------2,025.5 billion
2001------1,991.4 First tax cut passed - to be phased in over 10 years
2002------1,853.4
2003------1,782.5 Tax cuts passed - investment incentives and acceleration of 2001 cuts
2004------1,880.3 Tax cuts actually in place
2005------2,153.9
2006------2,407.3
2007------2,568.2


Bush's first tax cut was passed in 2001 and the major provisions were to be phased in over a period of about 10 years. The tax cut of 2003 added investment incentives and accelerated the 2001 cuts so that they would start right away.

You will notice in the period BEFORE the tax cuts actually went into effect, Federal revenues were falling.

Only AFTER the main provisions of the two cuts went into effect, did we reverse that falling trend.

Why???? Because, in 2000, we had an economic event that put us on the path to a recession. It was the Dot.com bubble (or tech bubble) bursting. This occured in the first quarter of 2000 and the economy headed downhill from that point on.

It was the RECESSION that sapped the vast majority of federal revenues and the tax cuts brought us out of the recession. When people are out of work and businesses are not making profits, the government has less to tax. Once the tax cuts spurred economic growth, revenues reversed their downward trend and began climbing.


One side note. The ONLY provision of the 2001 tax cut that DID go into effect right away was the "rebate" check where govt. simply gave everyone a check.

You will notice that THAT type of tax cut did NOTHING to increase jobs and NOTHING to help the economy.

That is the type of cut that Obama is promising.

You will also notice that the investment credits - capital gains etc were enacted in 2003 - and THOSE were the types that actually got us out of the last recession.

THose are the types that Obama does NOT want.

Obama's plan is NOTHING more than political pandering while McCains plan actually has provisions to spur the economy.

Constitutionally Speaking
11-03-2008, 04:54 AM
Why else do you think cities and suburban areas outside those cities are liberal strongholds? Because that's where liberals move to after college to get jobs and start families, and turn those areas blue.;)

Cities are 'Blue" because the Democrats have addicted a large portion of their populations to welfare programs.

The Dems are like drug dealers - giving away "free" goodies to get people hooked on their product (in this case govt. assistance) and dependent on those govt. programs. They tell those hooked that they are watching out for them and only by voting for them will they keep getting their "goodies".

The dems have created a permanent slave class - except they have convinced them they are not slaves, they are here to help them.

They sell shit sandwiches and tell people it is fillet mignon. They point to the deep poverty in the Democrat controlled areas that THEY created and then point to the rich suburbs to create envy. They also play on the good nature of those in the suburbs and plead that they must "help" those less fortunate.

People are gullible enough to believe it despite the evidence that it is the Dem controlled areas where crime and poverty are the highest - yes even the rural poverty areas vote Dem far more than their more affluent neighbors. Areas of the greatest income disparity vote Dem.

Jumpy
11-03-2008, 06:46 AM
Abortion was huge with my kids. None of them believe in murdering kids. However, there is the current financial crisis, brought on by Democratic policies to which Obama subscribes, and which both the Bush administration and McCain tried to forestall by changing the regulations requiring banks to loan to those who were likely to default.

There is the worry of what war we will face in your children's future if we lose in Iraq and Afghanistan. There is the fact that the Democrats would draft not only young men, but also young women, if a draft becomes necessary. And, in the interests of "fairness," would send women into battle. They've also written bills that would remove any "excuse" for not serving...like going to college, or having young children.

There is the "fairness doctrine," which is in direct contradiction to free speech rights.

The Democrats were also the ones who invented "free speech zones" to limit the places where college kids are allowed to speak their minds...and they "own" the NEA, which controls colleges, so free speech will continue to be abused in colleges and public schools.

As it is, when your kids find work, they are likely to see 20% coming straight out of their check in taxes...much of which they may never see again. Remind them that this percentage will only grow under Democratic leadership. Obama can't possibly do any part of what he's promised without killing the Bush tax cuts. Remind your kids that, in addition to being forced to pay Social Security taxes all their lives, they will also be forced to save in a 401K if they actually want to retire...and now the Congress is considering yet another retirement scheme that will force them to pay into some third type of "safe" retirement account...and please make sure they know that Social Security is in danger because the government "borrowed" from it instead of holding it in trust for us. Please also look up the federal budget and show them that the largest spending category is social spending, not the military spending that many leftist sites lie about. (Although our federal government is constitutionally able to spend on military, while all the social spending is unconstitutional.)
I like that, Mrs.Smith. I will definitly use that on my daughter.

noonwitch
11-03-2008, 08:41 AM
I think it's hilarious that you have a daughter who is old enough to vote, yet young enough to ground! You must be a good parent, to be able to lay down that type of consequence on someone who is at least 18 and make it stick.

My mom tried to give me a curfew when I was 18 and home from college during the summer after my freshman year. My 16 year old sister cruised by her and told her "I'll be home when I'm home, but it'll be late". My mom told me to be home by midnight. I laughed, and told her I'd be home somtime after 2, because that was when Coral Gables closed.

As far as voting, my dad pointed out that if Reagan wasn't president, he wouldn't have made enough money to send us to college, but he never held our tuition over our head to try to get us to vote any certain way. We usually told him that if Carter had gotten another term, we would have been eligible for Pell Grants, so it wouldn't have mattered how much money he made. Every student whose parents made less than $30,000 a year was eligible for a Pell Grant under Carter. $30,000 a year was a lot of money in 1980.

I talked to Dad in Florida yesterday. I could not tell who he voted for-he won't tell me until after the election is done, and he is a swing voter, sometimes. He voted for Hillary in the primaries, but for the most part, he prefers veterens, so he probably voted McCain. But you never know, with him.

xavierob82
11-03-2008, 12:28 PM
Cities are 'Blue" because the Democrats have addicted a large portion of their populations to welfare programs.
.



Yeah, wealthy suburban areas are well-known for their population that is addicted to welfare. :rolleyes:

Constitutionally Speaking
11-03-2008, 08:28 PM
Yeah, wealthy suburban areas are well-known for their population that is addicted to welfare. :rolleyes:

Inner cities are and you surely noticed that I also said the Dems applealed to the kind nature of the wealthy and convinced them that they were helping the poor - despite all evidence to the contrary. That is where the suburbs came into the equation.

Try to brush up on your reading comprehension!

MrsSmith
11-03-2008, 08:37 PM
Yeah, wealthy suburban areas are well-known for their population that is addicted to welfare. :rolleyes:

The further in suburbia they are, the more likely they are to vote Republican. It's my firm belief that Dims get most of their votes from pollution. The more hours city-fold spend breathing it, the more likely they are to vote Dim.

MrsSmith
11-03-2008, 08:38 PM
I like that, Mrs.Smith. I will definitly use that on my daughter.

I hope it helps. My daughters didn't even register. :(:(

Molon Labe
11-04-2008, 11:22 AM
Well, either we have to massively cut spending or we have to increase taxing and cut spending. And, Obama is even decreasing taxing (which I think is stupid). But Bush's tax cuts are not sustainable, they doubled our debt in 8 years. I mean, 70 years of debt, we doubled in 8. That's preposterous. I'm just saying the Bush tax cuts are unsustainable, they have to be repealed. It is unconscionable to leave them. Someone has to pay them. At some point, someone has to give China the however many trillion dollars we owe them. And then, what are we going to do? You want to talk about American security? Talk about selling ourselves to China. I would like to have our destiny in our own pocket, not in their pocket.

Who passed 700 billion more in spending last month? Let's not forget which party overwhelmingly changed their votes in order to sustain the socialist plutocracy. The Bush tax cuts are not unsustainable. That's the problem with left wing solutions. You believe the only answer rests on the backs of the taxpayer. You've got it half right. There needs to be a serious look at ALL government spending.

wilbur
11-04-2008, 12:18 PM
Inner cities are and you surely noticed that I also said the Dems applealed to the kind nature of the wealthy and convinced them that they were helping the poor - despite all evidence to the contrary. That is where the suburbs came into the equation.

Try to brush up on your reading comprehension!

You should really worry more about rural areas... rural america is the most impoverished... and is starting to realize they vote against their interests by voting against welfare.

aerojarod
11-04-2008, 02:42 PM
You should really worry more about rural areas... rural america is the most impoverished... and is starting to realize they vote against their interests by voting against welfare.

I'm sick and freaking tired of this misnomer that people are "voting against their self interest" if they choose not to buy into some sort of social welfare program or tax credit give-away.

Have you libs ever stopped to think about the fact most people find it in their self interest to work hard, earn what they can, and feel good about themselves for doing what they can to provide for themselves and their families?

Studying hard and getting a B on a paper sure feels much better than cheating and getting an A.
A nice "tax credit" given to you by some politician might give you some extra short term financial security, but $500 EARNED from your own labor sure makes you feel a lot better about yourself, and teaches you the value and reward of hard work.

Give all the "fish" away you want- it won't teach anyone to go fishing for it themselves.
If anything, it will just make them more restentful and dependant on the fishermen for not given them more.

Constitutionally Speaking
11-04-2008, 05:45 PM
You should really worry more about rural areas... rural america is the most impoverished... and is starting to realize they vote against their interests by voting against welfare.

Sorry, but the impoverished rural people DO vote Dem. But even if I concede that point - how is it voting against a poverty TRAP voting against their self interests???

YupItsMe
11-04-2008, 05:49 PM
Funny how once somebody goes out and gets a real education they turn into a Democrat.

Funny how someone quits getting educated and actually gets a job they become a Republican.

YupItsMe
11-04-2008, 05:51 PM
It's not a compelling voting issue for most people. As far as your children are concerned, it has "always" been legal, so even if they don't like it, it's a fact. I think that's true for a lot of voters.



How sanctimoneous of you to declare what is and isn't an issue for most people. It is a very big issue for Christians who attend a "real" church.

YupItsMe
11-04-2008, 06:01 PM
Yeah, wealthy suburban areas are well-known for their population that is addicted to welfare. :rolleyes:



The Suburbs is not real the real vote numbers come from. Suburbs implies single family homes with probably only two voters per 1/4 acre. (Unless it's an Obama campaign supplied house with 13 new resident adults living in it) Want to really pump up the vote count per Sq mile you go to the "projects" The suburbs around metropolitan areas although probably Democrat are not nearly as high a ratio as the city. Nice try anyway, thanks for playing.

Jumpy
11-04-2008, 06:05 PM
I hope it helps. My daughters didn't even register. :(:(

It must've, as my daughter did vote Republican. wooohoooo!!!! :) We just finished voting. It was packed!

MrsSmith
11-04-2008, 06:58 PM
You should really worry more about rural areas... rural america is the most impoverished... and is starting to realize they vote against their interests by voting against welfare.

Whatever. :rolleyes: We know we don't want the government coming in with their money and red tape, messing everything up. :rolleyes:

MrsSmith
11-04-2008, 06:59 PM
It must've, as my daughter did vote Republican. wooohoooo!!!! :) We just finished voting. It was packed!

Very cool!! :D:D

Phillygirl
11-04-2008, 07:28 PM
It must've, as my daughter did vote Republican. wooohoooo!!!! :) We just finished voting. It was packed!

Hey, very cool!! I've been wondering how your chat with her went. I think it's great that you are able to discuss this with her and help to influence how she views things.

wilbur
11-04-2008, 09:33 PM
Sorry, but the impoverished rural people DO vote Dem. But even if I concede that point - how is it voting against a poverty TRAP voting against their self interests???

Rural poverty is just as bad if not worse than inner city poverty... especially the prospects for escape. Someone in rural poverty is more likely to spend their entire lives in poverty.. so it really is against their self-interest (from their POV anyhow) to vote against government programs to help their living situations.

07041776
11-05-2008, 09:10 AM
Funny how once somebody goes out and gets a real education they turn into a Democrat.
What? if thier education was just that getting educated a simple dose of econimics and the understanding of how capitalism works would be pretty hard to argue it is how the world works note the period!!!!.:eek:

crockspot
11-05-2008, 12:43 PM
And even funnier..when they get out into the real world, they turn Conservative...Must be that shock when they get thir pay stubs...

Yep, I came out of the University of California a brainwashed lib, took me decades to fully deprogram myself.

linda22003
11-05-2008, 12:45 PM
How sanctimoneous of you to declare what is and isn't an issue for most people. It is a very big issue for Christians who attend a "real" church.

I'm not the one declaring it. I'm talking about how it ranks in survey after survey of voters, and it's never above fifth.
Perhaps you're the sanctimonious one, declaring what constitutes a "real" church. ;)

Zathras
11-05-2008, 12:47 PM
Funny how once somebody goes out and gets a real education they turn into a brainwashed moron like me.

Fixed for accuracy

linda22003
11-05-2008, 12:48 PM
I hope it helps. My daughters didn't even register. :(:(

Why couldn't they be bothered to register? My grandmother ( a suffrage pioneer in the 1910s ) would have taken me apart piece by piece if I hadn't registered.

LauraH
11-05-2008, 01:11 PM
I am new here...well, not so new, but back from hiatus. I would tell you to let your children form their own opinions just as you have formed yours. I know it's hard, whether one is a Republican or a Democrat, but it's really not our life to live or our choice to make. Take care.

Constitutionally Speaking
11-05-2008, 01:19 PM
Rural poverty is just as bad if not worse than inner city poverty... especially the prospects for escape. Someone in rural poverty is more likely to spend their entire lives in poverty.. so it really is against their self-interest (from their POV anyhow) to vote against government programs to help their living situations.

Without the govt. welfare programs, more of them would have jobs and not be in poverty.