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Sonnabend
12-28-2008, 03:29 PM
ISRAELI troops massed along the border with Gaza before what could be a large-scale invasion of the tiny coastal strip, following attacks at the weekend that killed more than 280 Palestinians and wounded 800.

The Israeli Defence Minister, Ehud Barak, vowed the Israeli Defence Forces would expand and deepen their operations in Gaza "as much as necessary".


Israel faces the prospect of a return to suicide bombings within its borders as Hamas vowed to avenge weekend attacks against its forces in Gaza - home to 1.5 million Palestinians.

http://www.smh.com.au/



Not one word about the hundreds of rockets fired into Israel. Not one word about the terrorism of HAMAS.

No..what we get is sympathetic pictures of "Palestinian" children.

The media bias is sickening.

Note this part

"Israel launched the attacks as part of what it said was an attempt to defend itself against the hundreds of rockets launched by Gazan militants since the collapse of a ceasefire earlier this month, and create a "new security reality in the region"."

I.e sneering "that's what they say"

wiegenlied
12-29-2008, 10:37 AM
Hamas, a radical muslim militant terrorist who is addicted doing jihad. How many suicide bombings they have done against the Jews!

It is interesting to wait and see what the president elect and the secretary of state to-be are going to do to address this situation.

Lars1701a
12-29-2008, 11:10 AM
Hamas, a radical muslim militant terrorist who is addicted doing jihad. How many suicide bombings they have done against the Jews!

It is interesting to wait and see what the president elect and the secretary of state to-be are going to do to address this situation.

I for one can't wait.


The magic negro will through Israel right under the bus. (btw it sure is getting crowded under there :) )

Odysseus
12-29-2008, 11:43 AM
Hamas, a radical muslim militant terrorist who is addicted doing jihad. How many suicide bombings they have done against the Jews!

It is interesting to wait and see what the president elect and the secretary of state to-be are going to do to address this situation.

He'll be "present" for the crisis.

When the Moslem Brotherhood threatened Assad in Syria, he surrounded the city of Hama with artillery and reduced it to rubble, killing over 20,000 people. The media barely noticed it, but when a Palestinian gets a splinter, they're all over Israel. It's beyond despicable. The worst thing is that if the jihadis win (and Hamas is part of the global jihad, bankrolled by Iran, trained by Syria), the media will be the first ones to be viciously restricted. They're feeding the dog that's planning to maul them.

PoliCon
12-29-2008, 03:10 PM
I'm tell'n ya. Israel should carpet bomb the whole area. Melt the sand into glass. END this crap once and for all because they will NEVER be willing to live in peace with Israel. It's against Islamic law. Israel MUST not exist. Any land once held by msulim hands MUST REMAIN in muslim hands for ever. Should that land ever end up in non-muslim hands - good mulsims are obliged to take it back by force.

Sonnabend
12-29-2008, 05:14 PM
News from the Front

1. Eighty missiles have been fired by Hamas into Israel since this morning. A missile hit a car in the center of Ashdod. Two young women were critically injured, and three others wounded. A long range missile fell in Ashkelon, killing one and injuring 9.

Two of those injured are Arabs, a Palestinian construction worker from Hebron, and a Bedouin from Rahat. They were taken to Barzilai Hospital in Ashkelon. "Rockets don't
distinguish between blood and blood," said the Hebron man's relative. The doctor
caring for them is Jewish.

The hospital has moved it's patients underground and evacuated all but the most seriously ill patients, fearing further attacks. A Palestinian woman from Gaza, a cancer patient, cared for in Israel, is now well enough to go home, but she can't because Gaza's gates are closed. Hamas didn't have long range missiles until Israeli politicians (the same ones who are now going to war) agreed to the disengagement and the ceasefire. How many soldiers and citizens will now die for these critical misjudgments?

2. A soldier waiting in his tank on the border of Gaza, ready to roll in: "We came from the North. We are happy to be here to defend our people in the South."

3. Ashkelon's streets are empty tonight. Children in the affected areas will not be returning to school.

4. A Bar Mitzvah party in Sderot was celebrating on the roof of a building when a kassam flew right over their heads, crashing into the building next door. The celebrants continued to rejoice. The boy read his haftorah. Only afterwards, will he be going up North for a vacation. The people of Sderot are filled with the different spirit. They are willing to suffer the reprisals of the Hamas if only the IDF does it job and makes
their lives safer in the future. Unlike other towns under fire, their streets are full.

5. The despicable demonstrations in London talking about a "holocaust" in Gaza show once again it has become Londonstan. I pity the Brits.

6. Israeli television continues to do its best for our enemies, interviewing a doctor from the hospital in Gaza about shortages and an influx of patients.

Let him complain to his government, who instead of medical supplies, bought rockets to log at innocent civilians across the border. The bombing of Dresden also killed many people. Did the Allies broadcast pictures and interview Nazi doctors to demoralize their soldiers and civilians from fighting? The people responsible for editing the news should be fired.

AmPat
12-29-2008, 11:27 PM
Hamas is the elected gov't in Gaza.
Hamas is firing rockets into a sovreign nation.
That is an act of war. Israel has a right of self protection. Politics shoulkd not be allowed to confuse the facts. Let Israel take the garbage out.

No quarter. If you are Arab and wish to leave, you have 5 days, period. After that, you are the enemy and we will shoot to kill.

Leave no cockroach alive.

OK, if I were ruler for a day.:(

PoliCon
12-30-2008, 09:52 AM
Hamas is the elected gov't in Gaza.
Hamas is firing rockets into a sovreign nation.
That is an act of war. Israel has a right of self protection. Politics shoulkd not be allowed to confuse the facts. Let Israel take the garbage out.

No quarter. If you are Arab and wish to leave, you have 5 days, period. After that, you are the enemy and we will shoot to kill.

Leave no cockroach alive.

OK, if I were ruler for a day.:(I wouldn't even give a time limit. The cockroaches might escape with the "people." BESIDES - these "people" know full well what their leaders are doing and are up to - and the fact that they have not taken up arms against said leaders shows me that they are complicit.

Odysseus
12-30-2008, 10:26 AM
News from the Front
5. The despicable demonstrations in London talking about a "holocaust" in Gaza show once again it has become Londonstan. I pity the Brits.
London? Try New York City! Tammy Bruce had this on her website this morning:

Death to the Joooooooooish Juice!
How crazy are Jew-haters? Completely. Here's a pic from yesterday's pro-"Palestinian" rally demanding death to Jewish...juice. (HT LGF). Even the freakish Jew-hating Arab realized his sign was just a tad stoopid. Just above the word "Juice" is "Zionist" written in parenthesis. Just to make sure we know he's only against that Jewish Juice.
http://tammybruce.com/Juicedeath.jpg
http://tammybruce.com/Juicedeath.jpg
This is in NYC, where Islamist lunatics murdered almost 3,000 people on 9/11. It's the city with the largest Jewish population in the world outside of Israel. If there's any place in the world where a pro-Palestinian terrorist rally ought to inspire violent outrage, it's NYC. Of course, it's also the place with dozens of colleges and universities, and this clown, who is probably on a student visa, couldn't spell "Jews." On the bright side, maybe he thought that OJ Simpson should have gotten a harsher sentence.

6. Israeli television continues to do its best for our enemies, interviewing a doctor from the hospital in Gaza about shortages and an influx of patients.
Let him complain to his government, who instead of medical supplies, bought rockets to log at innocent civilians across the border. The bombing of Dresden also killed many people. Did the Allies broadcast pictures and interview Nazi doctors to demoralize their soldiers and civilians from fighting? The people responsible for editing the news should be fired.
The news media in democracies has degenerated from the mindless yellow journalism of the Hearst and Pulitzer papers, which created a war with Spain in order to boost circulation, to a suicidal liberalism that advocates for our enemies while losing readers. The First Amendment assumes that a free press will also be a patriotic press. If the media becomes an adjunct of our enemies' propaganda machine, then does it still warrant protection?

I wouldn't even give a time limit. The cockroaches might escape with the "people." BESIDES - these "people" know full well what their leaders are doing and are up to - and the fact that they have not taken up arms against said leaders shows me that they are complicit.
This is going to go the way that it always does. The Israelis will go in, achieve incredible successes within the first few days, then the global community of appeasers will step in to negotiate a truce that will save Hamas, which will then claim victory for having survived the Israeli attack. No mention will be made of Hamas' murderous conduct, which precipitated the attack, nor will Hamas be held responsible for its monstrous activities. Six months from now, they'll be right back where they started. :mad:

PoliCon
12-30-2008, 10:55 AM
This is going to go the way that it always does. The Israelis will go in, achieve incredible successes within the first few days, then the global community of appeasers will step in to negotiate a truce that will save Hamas, which will then claim victory for having survived the Israeli attack. No mention will be made of Hamas' murderous conduct, which precipitated the attack, nor will Hamas be held responsible for its monstrous activities. Six months from now, they'll be right back where they started. sad - but so very true. Those damn evil Jews. :rolleyes:

Odysseus
12-30-2008, 11:55 AM
sad - but so very true. Those damn evil Jews. :rolleyes:

That's Juuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuice! Get it right if you're going to sub for Gator. :D

PoliCon
12-30-2008, 12:39 PM
That's Juuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuice! Get it right if you're going to sub for Gator. :DNo thanks. I'm prolly the only one on this board that can say I have been in Israel - for quite a few months no less. I've seen first hand the crap - and let me tell you - while the Israeli are not pure and innocent - they are not the ebil monsters the press wants to paint them as.

Odysseus
12-30-2008, 02:05 PM
No thanks. I'm prolly the only one on this board that can say I have been in Israel - for quite a few months no less. I've seen first hand the crap - and let me tell you - while the Israeli are not pure and innocent - they are not the ebil monsters the press wants to paint them as.

Nobody is pure and innocent, at least not in the real world, but think of it this way, if Israel and Hamas have a ceasefire, Israel will use the time to repair and improve infrastructure, educate their citizens (producing doctors, nurses, firefighters, police, teachers, Soldiers and every other job required by a modern society), produce new technologies, grow and distribute food and basically maintain and improve their living standards and means of self-defense. Hamas will spend the time strapping bombs on children and sending them to kill Jews.

PoliCon
12-30-2008, 02:18 PM
Nobody is pure and innocent, at least not in the real world, but think of it this way, if Israel and Hamas have a ceasefire, Israel will use the time to repair and improve infrastructure, educate their citizens (producing doctors, nurses, firefighters, police, teachers, Soldiers and every other job required by a modern society), produce new technologies, grow and distribute food and basically maintain and improve their living standards and means of self-defense. Hamas will spend the time strapping bombs on children and sending them to kill Jews.which is why I honestly believe that Israel should carpet bomb the whole strip. Enough is enough.

Odysseus
12-30-2008, 03:01 PM
which is why I honestly believe that Israel should carpet bomb the whole strip. Enough is enough.

Hamas has claimed that Jews love life, while they seek death. We should take them at their word and deliver what they seek.

lacarnut
12-30-2008, 03:48 PM
Hamas has claimed that Jews love life, while they seek death. We should take them at their word and deliver what they seek.

Syria and Iran fund, train and provide weapons to terrorist which have killed thousands of our soldiers. For the life of me, I do not see why we have not rained missiles on both of these countries in an effort to kill their leaders. We did that with Kadafi and it seemed to work. If we kill thousands of civilians, tough shit. Truman had enough balls to end the war; I guess all we have is chicken shit leaders.

Diplomacy has not worked and will never work between the US/Israel and these outlaw organizations and countries. Pussies like Jimmy Carter tried it and it did not work. Does not take a mental giant or a expert on foreign affairs to figure out that diplomacy is a losing cause.

Constitutionally Speaking
12-30-2008, 05:07 PM
For diplomacy to work, BOTH sides must want peace. Hamas does not want peace. Iran does not want peace. Radical Islam does not want peace.


They want only an Islamic world govt - and it is not negotiable. There can be no diplomacy with them. NONE.

The ONLY way to deal with them is to destroy them - utterly and completely.

Harsh, but that is the way I see it.


We in the US need to let Israel go after Hamas and Syria and Iran unrestrained by world opinion. ONLY then will there be real peace. ONLY then can we work to improve the lives of the moderate Arabs and those in the middle east.

Odysseus
12-31-2008, 11:00 AM
Syria and Iran fund, train and provide weapons to terrorist which have killed thousands of our soldiers. For the life of me, I do not see why we have not rained missiles on both of these countries in an effort to kill their leaders. We did that with Kadafi and it seemed to work. If we kill thousands of civilians, tough shit. Truman had enough balls to end the war; I guess all we have is chicken shit leaders.
Iran shouldn't be bombed, for the simple reason that the vast majority of Iranians loathe their regime and love us. We should avoid alienating them. Instead, we should be bankrolling and arming the opposition so that a counterrevolution can take place, one that is friendly to us. That's the greatest fear among the mullahs. As for Syria, we should be bombing the training camps and staging bases, as well as allowing Israel to engage Hezbollah without constraints. The Europeans will not do anything except talk, and their talk is going to be anti-Israeli no matter what happens, because they are terrified of their own Moslem populations. We need to ignore their blather and do what needs to be done.

Diplomacy has not worked and will never work between the US/Israel and these outlaw organizations and countries. Pussies like Jimmy Carter tried it and it did not work. Does not take a mental giant or a expert on foreign affairs to figure out that diplomacy is a losing cause.
Every American president since Johnson has tried to deal with the Palestinian issue, and it has failed. The Palestinians don't want peace, the Arabs don't want the Palestinians, and the Israelis don't want to die so that the Europeans can feel good about themselves. As long as the Palestinians are a propaganda tool in the ongoing war to destroy Israel (and that's all they are to the Arabs), nothing that Israel offers will be sufficient.

For diplomacy to work, BOTH sides must want peace. Hamas does not want peace. Iran does not want peace. Radical Islam does not want peace.
They want only an Islamic world govt - and it is not negotiable. There can be no diplomacy with them. NONE.
The ONLY way to deal with them is to destroy them - utterly and completely.
Harsh, but that is the way I see it.
We in the US need to let Israel go after Hamas and Syria and Iran unrestrained by world opinion. ONLY then will there be real peace. ONLY then can we work to improve the lives of the moderate Arabs and those in the middle east.
Or at least destroy their will to fight and raise that will among the remaining western nations that aren't willing to descend into dhimmitude.

NC Blue
12-31-2008, 02:06 PM
No..what we get is sympathetic pictures of "Palestinian" children.



How sickening, indeed, reporting on suffering children. Yuck. Where's the glory?!

BTW, why the quotes on Palestinian? Are you suggesting they are not really Palestinian?

Sonnabend
12-31-2008, 04:02 PM
How sickening, indeed, reporting on suffering children. Yuck. Where's the glory?!

Pallywood (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_B1H-1opys)


BTW, why the quotes on Palestinian? Are you suggesting they are not really Palestinian?

There is no Palestine.

Sonnabend
12-31-2008, 04:17 PM
More Pallywood

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bYf9ieC5m9A

NC Blue
12-31-2008, 07:58 PM
Pallywood (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_B1H-1opys)



There is no Palestine.

Right. And Australia is still a penal colony, Bruce.

Sonnabend
12-31-2008, 08:02 PM
Right. And Australia is still a penal colony, Bruce.Hello there, LiberalGuy.


...well, he sounds like him....:D:D

AmPat
12-31-2008, 09:58 PM
Good grief, did somebody leave the gate open again? Looks like we have a new resident retard to train.:cool:

lacarnut
12-31-2008, 10:45 PM
Iran shouldn't be bombed, for the simple reason that the vast majority of Iranians loathe their regime and love us. We should avoid alienating them. Instead, we should be bankrolling and arming the opposition so that a counterrevolution can take place, one that is friendly to us. That's the greatest fear among the mullahs.
.

There are no good solutions because the leaders in Iran are hard liners that have no intention of . negotiating. They will eventually get a nuclear weapon. Then what. They will hand it over to some terrorist group so their hands will not look so dirty when they use it against us or our allies. I don't want to take the chance of hoping for a revolution which may never come. Let's try to kill a bunch of their leaders by way of missiles at strategic targets. If the bombing works, the chance of overthrowing the current leadership may be enhanced. Kadafi turned a new leaf after the attack on him and his family. Death has a way of getting most sane people's attention.

Sonnabend
12-31-2008, 11:52 PM
Someone slapped me...tsk tsk....:D

djones520
01-01-2009, 11:08 AM
Right. And Australia is still a penal colony, Bruce.

The Palestinians where given the option to have their own internationally recognized country back in 1947. They refused.

There is no Palestine.

tranquill
01-01-2009, 12:35 PM
Israeli dissident analytic writes that IDF op in Gaza is already stuck, Israelis are bogged down, and basically that's the end of the war: http://samsonblinded.org/news/israeli-attack-on-gaza-loses-momentum-5424

djones520
01-01-2009, 12:40 PM
Israeli dissident analytic writes that IDF op in Gaza is already stuck, Israelis are bogged down, and basically that's the end of the war: http://samsonblinded.org/news/israeli-attack-on-gaza-loses-momentum-5424

Did you bother reading the story?

It says nothing of the like.

Man... your an interesting little troll... he seems to hop to all types of differant forums from ones solely to discussing Israel, to ones about Jazz. He has no more then 4 posts on any of them, and he always links to the same website. A lot of his posts look to be identical cut and pastes as well from forum to forum.

I almost think you are the guy who writes those articles, trying to pimp your wares.

NC Blue
01-01-2009, 03:58 PM
The Palestinians where given the option to have their own internationally recognized country back in 1947. They refused.

There is no Palestine.

Another Western construct like Iraq.

...except it goes back to the Biblical Romans who named it after the term "Philistine." And since there are 10 million people who claim ethnic heritage based in the region, it's as valid a "nation" as the modern state of Israel.

I find it funny that the "philistine" (lower case "p") who subscribe to World Net Daily for their position points, deny the existence of Philistines. Heh-heh...

Constitutionally Speaking
01-01-2009, 04:07 PM
Another Western construct like Iraq.

...except it goes back to the Biblical Romans who named it after the term "Philistine." And since there are 10 million people who claim ethnic heritage based in the region, it's as valid a "nation" as the modern state of Israel.

I find it funny that the "philistine" (lower case "p") who subscribe to World Net Daily for their position points, deny the existence of Philistines. Heh-heh...


You miss the point NC, Palastine has never been a country - a region of other countries, yes - but that is like saying there once was an autonomous state called the ozarks.

Until they INVENTED the notion, after the establishment of Israel, they were part of Jordan and they did not dispute that.

NC Blue
01-01-2009, 05:31 PM
You miss the point NC, Palastine has never been a country - a region of other countries, yes - but that is like saying there once was an autonomous state called the ozarks.

Until they INVENTED the notion, after the establishment of Israel, they were part of Jordan and they did not dispute that.

So political boundaries tell us that 10 million people who consider themselves ethnically Palestinian should be invalidated in their claim to a homeland? The popular right-wing insult of denying Palestinian existence is like saying the Roma don't exist.

You might have a valid point if Palestinians had the same rights (including not being fenced) as Jews in Israel. That would be a more accurate manifestation of your position.

Claiming Palestinians don't exist as a people is one of the more dehumanizing rhetorical tools I've seen on this board in a while.

Sure, Palestinian terrorists firing rockets into Israel should be apprehended and punished as the murderous criminals they are. But denying ethnic identity to a people who can trace their lineage back just as far as the Jews is heinous and will contribute to digging the right-wing into an even deeper hole of irrelevance.

NC Blue
01-01-2009, 05:34 PM
Until they INVENTED the notion, after the establishment of Israel...

And who invented the political state of Israel? That doesn't mean Israelites don't exist. It just means their political boundaries are as much "invented" as Palestine's.

NC Blue
01-01-2009, 06:09 PM
The media bias is sickening.



Yes, even the Israeli press has troubling questions.

Vis a vis your thread title, I guess the "time for fighting" was set ahead of time.



Long-term preparation, careful gathering of information, secret discussions, operational deception and the misleading of the public - all these stood behind the Israel Defense Forces "Cast Lead" operation against Hamas targets in the Gaza Strip, which began Saturday morning.

Source: http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1050426.html

PoliCon
01-01-2009, 09:00 PM
How sickening, indeed, reporting on suffering children. Yuck. Where's the glory?!

BTW, why the quotes on Palestinian? Are you suggesting they are not really Palestinian?You mean the ARABS peoples that come from the exact same stock and speak the exact same language as the people of Jordan - syria - egypt . . . . those people?

PoliCon
01-01-2009, 09:01 PM
The Palestinians where given the option to have their own internationally recognized country back in 1947. They refused.

There is no Palestine.
HUH? They didn't refuse - they had and still have it. It's called JORDAN now.

PoliCon
01-01-2009, 09:04 PM
Another Western construct like Iraq.

...except it goes back to the Biblical Romans who named it after the term "Philistine." And since there are 10 million people who claim ethnic heritage based in the region, it's as valid a "nation" as the modern state of Israel.

I find it funny that the "philistine" (lower case "p") who subscribe to World Net Daily for their position points, deny the existence of Philistines. Heh-heh...rotfl. Do you honestly think that the palestinians are descendants of the philistines? They're ARABS.

PoliCon
01-01-2009, 09:16 PM
So political boundaries tell us that 10 million people who consider themselves ethnically Palestinian should be invalidated in their claim to a homeland? Ethnically palestinians? POLITICALLY palestinians yes -ethnically they're ARABS.



The popular right-wing insult of denying Palestinian existence is like saying the Roma don't exist. The roma are a fixed ethnic group with traditions, language, customs, and characteristics unique and separate from other peoples. Kinda like the Jews. The "palestinians" speak arabic - have arabic customs - etc. There is not a separate palestinian people.


You might have a valid point if Palestinians had the same rights (including not being fenced) as Jews in Israel. That would be a more accurate manifestation of your position.Ignorant fool. Arabs in Israel who are citizens there have the same rights as the Jews they live along side. Palestine is fenced in because they act like animals. Attacks on and the deaths of civilians in Israel dropped drastically after the fence was put up. On a side note - why don't you object to the walls that ARABS have put up which are worse than these securitiy barriers Israel has built. You might want to do a little research on the topic. Go and read about how MUSLIMS put up walls to keep other muslims out.


Claiming Palestinians don't exist as a people is one of the more dehumanizing rhetorical tools I've seen on this board in a while. You should listen to the people on your side more. They have some very wonderful arguments for dehumanizing the unborn.


Sure, Palestinian terrorists firing rockets into Israel should be apprehended and punished as the murderous criminals they are. But denying ethnic identity to a people who can trace their lineage back just as far as the Jews is heinous and will contribute to digging the right-wing into an even deeper hole of irrelevance. lol arabs. They can trace their ancestry back to ARABIA not PHILISTIA.

Sonnabend
01-02-2009, 06:06 AM
There is no Palestine. (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=28222)

Zuhir Muhsein

Quote:
The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct "Palestinian people" to oppose Zionism.

For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa, while as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan. Oh and thanks for the comment of me being a "hateful f***"..you really made a good first impression....or is it a previous one..LiberalGuy?

(P.S The "Bruce" moniker was a dead giveaway,.,there is one, and only one person who ever used that. You. LiberalGuy.)


...except it goes back to the Biblical Romans who named it after the term "Philistine." And since there are 10 million people who claim ethnic heritage based in the region, it's as valid a "nation" as the modern state of Israel.Israel is a recognised nation under the auspices and created by the UN.

There is no Palestine, it is not a nation, it has no flag, no currency, it has no legitimacy and they are displaced Arabs..nothing more. if the other UAE nations are that torqued???..let THEM give them a State.

The stated goal and specific aim of HAMAS is the destruction of Israel. Far as I am concerned, that they continue in this aim and have now reaped the whirlwind?? Too bad.

Israel has sat by whilst thousands of rockets have been fired....they have turned the other cheek until it bled.

Two words and one sentiment: NEVER AGAIN.


Claiming Palestinians don't exist as a people is one of the more dehumanizing rhetorical tools I've seen on this board in a while.Don't like? Dont read.


Sure, Palestinian terrorists firing rockets into Israel should be apprehended and punished as the murderous criminals they are.Whaddya suggest, arrest them and read them their rights, then give em three hots, a cot, lawyers and Cindy SheeHag? I have a better idea.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qG0CzM_Frvc

Incidentally, note how the brave "freedom fighters" position their weapons in the middle of a residential area? The same way they hid behind UN observation posts then screamed "war crime" when the Israelis fired back?

Snivelling, craven cowards describes them better.

They started it, they continued in ceasefires, they send suicide bombers into civilian areas (the same bombers paid by Saddam Hussein...and please dont tell me thats a "right wing" lie, because it is the truth and you know it), they use mentally challenged children, they use women, they bomb buses.


Long-term preparation, careful gathering of information, secret discussions, operational deception and the misleading of the public - all these stood behind the Israel Defense Forces "Cast Lead" operation against Hamas targets in the Gaza Strip, which began Saturday morning.That's called preparing to destroy your enemy.

I stand with Israel.

Sonnabend
01-02-2009, 06:46 AM
one of the more dehumanizing rhetorical tools Y'know, I almost missed this.

Before we go any further, would you care to address this statement in the light of the foul and venomous slander and epithets thrown at the entire Bush family, their family and forebears, the Palin family, the Palin babies, any and all conservatives, and anyone else who falls within your interest?

Shall we discuss the thousands of evil cartoons, lampoons and caricatures of the President...shall we discuss the death threats against him?

You want the definition of dehumanising?? Take a look at your own conduct over the last eight years.

You, sir, are a raving hypocrite

Constitutionally Speaking
01-02-2009, 07:02 AM
So political boundaries tell us that 10 million people who consider themselves ethnically Palestinian should be invalidated in their claim to a homeland? The popular right-wing insult of denying Palestinian existence is like saying the Roma don't exist.

You might have a valid point if Palestinians had the same rights (including not being fenced) as Jews in Israel. That would be a more accurate manifestation of your position.

Claiming Palestinians don't exist as a people is one of the more dehumanizing rhetorical tools I've seen on this board in a while.

Sure, Palestinian terrorists firing rockets into Israel should be apprehended and punished as the murderous criminals they are. But denying ethnic identity to a people who can trace their lineage back just as far as the Jews is heinous and will contribute to digging the right-wing into an even deeper hole of irrelevance.

Sorry NC, the Palestinians were ONLY constructed to defeat Israel. That was the PURPOSE of inventing a Palestinian state.

Therin lies the difference. "Palestine" is a tool used to justify genocide.

Constitutionally Speaking
01-02-2009, 09:12 AM
HUH? They didn't refuse - they had and still have it. It's called JORDAN now.

They were offered ANOTHER one. They did refuse that one.

Sonnabend
01-02-2009, 11:56 AM
http://www.news.com.au/story/0,27574,24867930-23109,00.html


ISRAELI warplanes it Gaza targets including a mosque and a house where three young brothers were killed as Hamas supporters staged angry protests against Israel's week-old offensive.Funny how they didn't protest when HAMAS was lobbing thousands of rockets into Israel.

You'd think that one or two of them would wise up to the fact that, sooner or later, Israel would want to kick the living shit out of them.Seems to me they should be angry at HAMAS for bringing this catastrophe down on their heads.


A missile from one of 30 new Israeli raids hit a house and killed the boys, aged from seven to 10, emergency services said.Uh huh...and how close was the HAMAS rocket launcher at the time?


At least 430 "Palestinians" (displaced Arabs) have been killed and 2250 people wounded in the raids, according to Gaza officials.That's what you get for pissing off your neighbour. Maybe if you had honoured the peace agreement, maybe if you had had the brains to simply accept Israels right to exist and bargained in good faith...this could have been avoided.

Too bad, so sad.


The new strikes came as Israeli troops gathered on the Gaza border and thousands of Hamas faithful attended the funeral of Nizar Rayan, the most senior Hamas leadership victim of the offensive, who was killed with his four wives and 11 of his children in another Israeli raid on Thursday.Translated as " legitimate military target neutralised".


According to the Israeli government, Rayan's house served as an arms and ammunition warehouse and as a Hamas communications center at the time of the attack.The Israeli military said that the many secondary explosions were triggered by the weapons stockpile stored within his house.Say bye bye, birdie.


Rayan and his family were wrapped in green Hamas flags for their burials, during which Hamas vowed that it would not be bowed by the killings.If you dont like getting a bloody nose, dont start wars with your neighbour.


"I call on the resistance to continue pounding Jewish settlements and cities," said Sheikh Abdelrahman al-Jamal. "We will remain on the path of jihad until the end of days."You wanted war? You got it. Prepare to get your ass kicked.


Hamas has warned it could resume suicide attacks against Israel for the first time since January 2005 to avenge the death of Rayan, the most senior Islamist killed by Israel since Abdel Aziz al-Rantissi in 2004....giving Israel every right and reason to send in ther tanks, and turn Gaza into a parking lot.


But reporters did not go into Gaza despite a Supreme Court ruling that eight foreign media should be allowed into the territory after the foreign press group objected to the government demand to choose two of the journalists.No problem,...the reporters will do what they always do anyway...make it up regardless.The more lies they tell, the more propaganda they write in favour of HAMAS...that's why they call it Pallywood.


Seven days into the offensive, Israeli jets staged more than 30 new raids on the densely populated territory, which it said targeted rocket launching sites and Hamas buildings.

Three young brothers - Iyad, Mohammed and Abdelsattar al-Astal - died in a raid that appeared to target a rocket launcher near their house near the city of Khan Yunis, emergency services said.Site weapons next to civilians..my my, how brave of them....:rolleyes:


A mosque in the northern town of Jabaliya that the military said was a "terror hub" used to stockpile weapons was also hit.Note, btw, the same tactic was used in Iraq, frequently, against US soldiers. There have been no reports of HAMAStinians using babies as personal shields...but I am sure that will come one of these days...

http://www.command-post.org/oped/2_archives/arab-jew-baby-carriages.jpg

NC Blue
01-02-2009, 12:12 PM
(P.S The "Bruce" moniker was a dead giveaway,.,there is one, and only one person who ever used that. You. LiberalGuy.)

He got it from me, Sonnabruce.

Of the half dozen or so Australians I know on various political boards, I'm always fascinated by what a Bush toady you are. Perhaps the only Australian Bush sycophant on all the Internets?

Sonnabend
01-02-2009, 12:16 PM
He got it from me, Sonnabruce.

My compliments on your singular lack of originality.


Of the half dozen or so Australians I know on various political boards, I'm always fascinated by what a Bush toady you are. Perhaps the only Australian Bush sycophant on all the Internets?

Care to address the actual topic?

Zeus
01-02-2009, 12:21 PM
What I don't get is that when certain parties have sworn to wipe you off the face of the earth and then continuously attack you how can any response by you be considered a "A Disproportionate Response"?

djones520
01-02-2009, 12:28 PM
My compliments on your singular lack of originality.



Care to address the actual topic?

Guess he hasn't met LC EFA yet.

And whats a Bush Toadie?

djones520
01-02-2009, 12:28 PM
What I don't get is that when certain parties have sworn to wipe you off the face of the earth and then continuously attack you how can any response by you be considered a "A Disproportionate Response"?

You don't hate Israel, thats why it doesn't make sense to you.

Sonnabend
01-02-2009, 12:33 PM
And whats a Bush Toadie?

Anyone not infected with a severe case of PDS and BDS.

Sonnabend
01-02-2009, 12:54 PM
Hey NCBlue, why dont you turn your towering intellect onto this article

January 2, 2009 New Mishmeret Yesha Update

The roads of Yesha and some of the roads inside the green line are under siege and are being closed and reopened on and off.

They are not being "rocketed" (yet) and "land mined" but they are being stoned and firebombed constantly and pipe bombs and other explosive devices are being tossed at moving vehicles.

There have also been many cases of attempted murder by stabbing and attempts to run people over. Hundreds of Jews have been injured by rocks some seriously, mostly children.

The level of alert is very high because of the increasing pressure by Hamas on its forces in Judea and Samaria to exact revenge and show that they are a force to be reckoned with, and deservingly hold the reigns of power especially as we approach January 9th: the day Abu Mazen's ( Mohamed Abbas's) term as head of the P.A. expires.


Isn't that strange..the media isnt reporting this.I wonder why....:rolleyes:

NC Blue
01-02-2009, 12:57 PM
Y'know, I almost missed this.



Glad you didn't! See below.





Before we go any further, would you care to address this statement in the light of the foul and venomous slander and epithets thrown at the entire Bush family, their family and forebears, the Palin family, the Palin babies, any and all conservatives, and anyone else who falls within your interest?

Shall we discuss the thousands of evil cartoons, lampoons and caricatures of the President...shall we discuss the death threats against him?

You want the definition of dehumanising?? Take a look at your own conduct over the last eight years.

You, sir, are a raving hypocrite


I'm not talking about insults to liberal politicians. That's not being "hateful."

My opinion of you as expressed here is based on past reading but specifically the callous disregard for human suffering that you express in this thread. Regardless of your opinion of the cause of the war, nobody can deny that innocent people are being killed and harmed at a much higher rate than before.

Based on your writing, anyone on the receiving end of the might of a very formidable military gets what they deserve.

I can understand people taking sides with Israel. Israel has a legitimate cause for action.

Yet, you have attempted to invalidate an entire ethnic group and consign them to physical suffering with great relish and unctuous praise for violence.

It's apparent that Conservative Underground has evolved some since my previous visits and I regret any implication of personal insult to any of the members with whom I have shared sincere bonhommerie*. But you seem to still me floundering on the beach with fin-feet.


*C-Speak, SubmarinePainter, and others come visit Political Hotwire sometime. Now that LU is gone, I never see you! http://www.ballot.com/forum

Sonnabend
01-02-2009, 01:05 PM
My opinion of you as expressed here is based on past reading but specifically the callous disregard for human suffering that you express in this thread.It's called "you started a war now you get to wear it"


Regardless of your opinion of the cause of the war, nobody can deny that innocent people are being killed and harmed at a much higher rate than before. Then maybe they shouldn't have been lobbing thousands of rockets into Israel, should they. If the neighbouring state suddenly started sending rockets into your city...just how long would you sit still and take it?

Your concern for the people of Israel is touching. Typical liberal.


Based on your writing, anyone on the receiving end of the might of a very formidable military gets what they deserve. Hey..they started this war.Now they wear it.


I can understand people taking sides with Israel. Israel has a legitimate cause for action. Yes, they do, and they are taking action.They intend to smash this menace now and forever. They have had a gutful, and I cant say as I blame them.

Y'know, this is how the last war started...remember that? The one where Israels borders were invaded and three men kidnapped?

The men who were promised to be released after the war??..finally two dead bodies were handed back and the HAMAstinians still have Gilad Shalit, whom they use as a bargaining chip?

I can see where your sympathies lie, NCBlue...I see all too clearly.


Yet, you have attempted to invalidate an entire ethnic group and consign them to physical suffering with great relish and unctuous praise for violence. I cannot invalidate that which was never valid.There is no Palestine.


It's apparent that Conservative Underground has evolved some since my previous visits and I regret any implication of personal insult to any of the members with whom I have shared sincere bonhommerie*. But you seem to still me floundering on the beach with fin-feet. It's spelled "bonhomie"..speaking of floundering, would you care to address the topic at hand?

Sonnabend
01-02-2009, 04:13 PM
NCBlue: I will make this clear and concise, and this, as usual, is the bottom line.

If you wish to hold anyone responsible for the deaths in Gaza..if you wish to place blame for the deaths of civilians where it truly belongs, place it squarely and firmly upon the heads of HAMAS, who deliberately and continually use the civilians as human shields, who cowardly and cravenly use homes, shopping centres, mosques as firebases, ammo dumps and weapons caches.

The Israelis take massive pains to ensure as few civilians die as possible, HAMAS has no such qualms. They in fact take glee in those deaths, for they fuel the anti Israeli hysteria surrounding their perverted, death filled "cause".

HAMAS stated goal from day one has been, and always will, be the destruction of Israel.You, it appears, are more than willing to offer them aid and sympathy.

I am sick and tired of the moral equivocating from people like you, I have no truck and no time and no patience for those who sympathise with"men" who use women and children as shields from the retribution they have earned.

You and Cynthia McKinney are two of a kind, in many ways you are living examples of what were once called "the useful idiots of the West"..and it is clear that in fifty years, neither she nor you have learned a fucking thing.

What's past is prologue,and you, NCBlue, are stark examples of Santayana's wisdom.

"Those who forget the past are doomed to relive it...those who forget the lessons of the past, are simply doomed."

Sonnabend
01-02-2009, 11:19 PM
I find the growing "Muslim outrage"..amusing, considering that in the wake of Mumbai..all we heard was silence.

Nubs
01-03-2009, 12:59 AM
I find it perplexing that those that support the UN are not in favor of supporting/enforcing a UN mandate.

PoliCon
01-03-2009, 12:37 PM
I find it perplexing that those that support the UN are not in favor of supporting/enforcing a UN mandate. the do like UN mandates and/or resolutions when they are against the US or Israel. Otherwise - they are only symbolic mandates/resolutions. :rolleyes:

Sonnabend
01-04-2009, 07:54 AM
Gee..where did NCBlue go? :rolleyes:

Odysseus
01-05-2009, 01:08 PM
Yet, you have attempted to invalidate an entire ethnic group and consign them to physical suffering with great relish and unctuous praise for violence.
This is patently false. The Palestinians were never an "ethnic group," except to the extent that they are Arabs, but their "Palestinian" identity was manufactured as a propaganda campaign to discredit Israel. Don't believe me? Take it up with the PLO leadership, which routinely admitted it. And it wasn't the Israelis who fenced them in, it was their fellow Arabs. The refugee camps were establish in 1948, not 1967, when Jordan occupied the West bank and Egypt occupied Gaza, both illegal occupations, especially in view of the fact that they invaded the mandate area without any provocation on the part of the Israelis (unless you, like them, consider the very act of breathing by a Jew to be a provocation). From 1948 to 1967, the Palestinians were kept in camps while Egypt and Jordan refused to allow them to assimilate, finding them more valuable as a source of international aid (to be looted) and propaganda (to be exploited). The PLO, which came into being before the Six-Day-War, had no problem with the Egyptian and Jordanian occupations, but was focused entirely on attacking Israel. It wasn't until the Israelis took the West Bank and Gaza in 1967 that the PLO began to demand an independent homeland there, and even then, they continued to demand it as part of their claim to all of the region. BTW, even after 1967, the surrounding states have refused to permit Palestinian Arabs to become citizens, and have had forced them out of their own territory. Jordan expelled the PLO in 1970, after they attempted to build a state-within-a-state and overthrow the monarchy. Lebanon didn't force them out, and came to regret it as the PLO destroyed the only Arab democracy that ever existed. Kuwait had to expel its Palestinian laborers after they sided with Saddam during his invasion.

Gee..where did NCBlue go? :rolleyes:
No doubt he's trying to organize a pro-Hamas protest somewhere.