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  1. #1 Per Ginger's request...from the Kids Hearing Christian Music thread 
    Senior Member MrsSmith's Avatar
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    Is it irrational for a person to support abortion while also insisting that God does not have the right to take the unborn, infants, and children Home?
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    In actual dollars, President Obamaís $4.4 trillion in deficit spending in just three years is 37 percent higher than the previous record of $3.2 trillion (held by President George W. Bush) in deficit spending for an entire presidency. Itís no small feat to demolish an 8-year record in just 3 years.

    Under Obamaís own projections, interest payments on the debt are on course to triple from 2010 (his first budgetary year) to 2018, climbing from $196 billion to $685 billion annually.
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  2. #2  
    What a sweetheart! Finally, somebody has taken the bold move and made a new thread. I'm grateful. :)

    Can we clarify the question a little?
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  3. #3  
    Senior Member MrsSmith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gingersnap View Post
    What a sweetheart! Finally, somebody has taken the bold move and made a new thread. I'm grateful. :)

    Can we clarify the question a little?
    Quote Originally Posted by The Night Owl View Post
    Can we say that Saul was following the Golden Rule when he and his men, acting on orders from God, slaughtered the children of the Amalekites? I don't think we can.

    The only way we can say that the Bible establishes moral absolutes is if we define morality to be that which pleases God. In other words, if the story of the Amalekites is to be believed then that which pleases God is not necessarily moral by human standards.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Night Owl View Post
    Irrelevant. The children of the Amalekites did not deserve to be slaughtered for the crimes of their parents. Punishing the innocent for the crimes of the guilty is the epitome of injustice.



    Feel free to provide a reasonable justification for the slaughter of infants and children.

    I see statements like this from abortion-supporting people on a fairly regular basis. I believe that it is irrational to support abortion "rights" while simultaneously standing in judgement of the actions of God. I am curious about the thoughts of others...especially those that made these statements.
    Last edited by Gingersnap; 03-19-2009 at 08:02 PM.
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    In actual dollars, President Obamaís $4.4 trillion in deficit spending in just three years is 37 percent higher than the previous record of $3.2 trillion (held by President George W. Bush) in deficit spending for an entire presidency. Itís no small feat to demolish an 8-year record in just 3 years.

    Under Obamaís own projections, interest payments on the debt are on course to triple from 2010 (his first budgetary year) to 2018, climbing from $196 billion to $685 billion annually.
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  4. #4  
    Ah! So we are talking about The Problem of Evil. This issue has an actual title and entire books have been devoted to this subject because believers and unbelievers have been talking about it for centuries.

    When discussing TPOE, I find that it's useful to clarify even basic points on both sides. Sadly, neither side shares a common vocabulary when discussing "innocence", "love", "cruelty", "justice" or "mercy".

    Generally, the Your God Is An angry God side will attempt to posit that the Christian God cannot be merciful or just if He allows toddlers to be crushed by semi-tractor trailers. The Traditional Christian side will discuss the Potter and the Potter's vessels as well as a completely different interpretation of "innocents". How it goes depends largely on the flavor of Christianity involved: the Reformed inclining toward a sovereign view and the Liturgical inclining toward a Grace-infused view. Either way, it's always interesting.
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  5. #5  
    Senior Member MrsSmith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gingersnap View Post
    Ah! So we are talking about The Problem of Evil. This issue has an actual title and entire books have been devoted to this subject because believers and unbelievers have been talking about it for centuries.

    When discussing TPOE, I find that it's useful to clarify even basic points on both sides. Sadly, neither side shares a common vocabulary when discussing "innocence", "love", "cruelty", "justice" or "mercy".

    Generally, the Your God Is An angry God side will attempt to posit that the Christian God cannot be merciful or just if He allows toddlers to be crushed by semi-tractor trailers. The Traditional Christian side will discuss the Potter and the Potter's vessels as well as a completely different interpretation of "innocents". How it goes depends largely on the flavor of Christianity involved: the Reformed inclining toward a sovereign view and the Liturgical inclining toward a Grace-infused view. Either way, it's always interesting.
    That sounds about right. :D However, I have a specific question to ask Night Owl...or anyone else with the same view of God's actions. If, that is, any of them join the thread.
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    In actual dollars, President Obamaís $4.4 trillion in deficit spending in just three years is 37 percent higher than the previous record of $3.2 trillion (held by President George W. Bush) in deficit spending for an entire presidency. Itís no small feat to demolish an 8-year record in just 3 years.

    Under Obamaís own projections, interest payments on the debt are on course to triple from 2010 (his first budgetary year) to 2018, climbing from $196 billion to $685 billion annually.
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  6. #6  
    Quote Originally Posted by MrsSmith View Post
    That sounds about right. :D However, I have a specific question to ask Night Owl...or anyone else with the same view of God's actions. If, that is, any of them join the thread.
    Oh, I doubt they be able to resist over the next few days. I look forward to it!
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  7. #7  
    Senior Member The Night Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrsSmith View Post
    I see statements like this from abortion-supporting people on a fairly regular basis. I believe that it is irrational to support abortion "rights" while simultaneously standing in judgement of the actions of God. I am curious about the thoughts of others...especially those that made these statements.
    For the record, I'm against the abortion of embryos older than 3 weeks. I don't consider an embryo younger than 3 weeks old to be a child because it lacks a brain and a nervous system and has no consciousness whatsoever.

    Now to turn the tables... how do you justify the slaughter of the Amalekite children?
    Last edited by The Night Owl; 03-20-2009 at 11:19 AM.
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  8. #8  
    Senior Member The Night Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrsSmith View Post
    That sounds about right. :D However, I have a specific question to ask Night Owl...or anyone else with the same view of God's actions. If, that is, any of them join the thread.
    For me, responding to challenges is a matter of when not if.
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  9. #9  
    Senior Member The Night Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gingersnap View Post
    Ah! So we are talking about The Problem of Evil. This issue has an actual title and entire books have been devoted to this subject because believers and unbelievers have been talking about it for centuries.

    When discussing TPOE, I find that it's useful to clarify even basic points on both sides. Sadly, neither side shares a common vocabulary when discussing "innocence", "love", "cruelty", "justice" or "mercy".

    Generally, the Your God Is An angry God side will attempt to posit that the Christian God cannot be merciful or just if He allows toddlers to be crushed by semi-tractor trailers. The Traditional Christian side will discuss the Potter and the Potter's vessels as well as a completely different interpretation of "innocents". How it goes depends largely on the flavor of Christianity involved: the Reformed inclining toward a sovereign view and the Liturgical inclining toward a Grace-infused view. Either way, it's always interesting.
    I'm not talking about God letting bad things happen though I can if you want me to. I'm talking about God commanding Saul to kill infants and children.
    Last edited by The Night Owl; 03-20-2009 at 11:20 AM.
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  10. #10  
    Quote Originally Posted by The Night Owl View Post
    I'm not talking about God letting bad things happen though I can if you want me to. I'm talking about God commanding Saul to kill infants and children.
    Okay, what is your specific question?
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