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  1. #1 This Month's FairTax Thread 
    Senior Member Troll's Avatar
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    A recent post by FlaGator got me thinking.

    Too bad that we can't get two conservatives to agree on every point what conservates actually stand for.
    It is hard, even amongst mainly like-minded conservatives, to beat out a set of issues, platforms and tenets that we can all agree on. We all have our pet issues, to say nothing of our day-to-day concerns. However, there is one issue that we should all be able to come together on.

    That issue is the FairTax.

    For those of you unfamiliar with the FairTax, I'll briefly sum it up. The FairTax would take away the government's power to directly tax income, and replace all of our current 'on the book' taxes with a national retail sales tax. You no longer have to think about what your gross and net incomes are - if you're hired at $40K a year, you bring home $40K a year. You pay 23% extra at the register (actually about the same price since the FairTax eliminates the embedded tax in goods) for the things you buy, and you receive a 'prebate' every month to cover the sales tax on the basic necessities of life.

    Now I'd like to give you some of the implications of the FairTax. This would be a step in the right direction on our immigration problems, because only legal American citizens are eligible for the FairTax 'prebate'. This would be a step in the right direction in reducing the size of government, because the IRS would cease to exist in its current form. This would be a step in the right direction on the economy, because we would inject trillions more dollars just by bringing businesses operating overseas to American shores. This would be a step in the right direction on personal freedom, because any and all taxes you pay become voluntary.

    So here's my proposal:

    If you want tax reform,

    If you are concerned about illegal immigration,

    If you are concerned about government waste,

    If you are concerned about the size of government,

    If you would like to remove all involuntary taxes from your financial picture,

    If you want to see price competition at work in the economy,

    If you would like to start bringing businesses operating overseas into America,

    If you would like to see economic and personal liberty take a huge leap forward,

    look no further; the FairTax is your issue. Start writing your Congressmen about the FairTax. Tell them that the FairTax is the issue you're watching. Keep on top of them - they won't do this by themselves, because this is transferring power out of Washington directly to you. Are the 'tea parties' your thing? Bring FairTax signs to the next one.

    When we get the FairTax passed, all the conservatives of every stripe can all re-adopt our pet issues, be it gay marriage, immigration, abortion or pork-barrel spending. But I cannot think of another piece of legislation currently in Congress that would at least partially address so many other issues.

    Even to CU's lurking liberals, you should at least consider that the FairTax would completely remove the tax burden from the lower/middle class.

    See here for more answers:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FairTax

    http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer
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  2. #2  
    Senior Member FeebMaster's Avatar
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    Not that it wouldn't be nice, the black/gray market opportunities to avoid it would be amazing, but it is never going to happen. Ever. The people you guys repeatedly elect into government are not going to surrender power.

    If they decided to move in this direction, they'll corrupt it so they don't have to give up any control. They'd phase it in and you'd have an income tax alongside the national sales tax. Then they'd never phase out the income tax.

    You say it will only be at the retail level, but about nine seconds after they decide they need even more money, it's going to transform into a European style VAT.

    Imagine the income tax we have now combined with a 20% VAT. That is the future of FairTax.
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  3. #3  
    PORCUS MAXIMUS Rockntractor's Avatar
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    The politicians don't honor the Constitution or the laws we have now. There will never be a fair anything in this country.
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  4. #4  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockntractor View Post
    The politicians don't honor the Constitution or the laws we have now. There will never be a fair anything in this country.
    Sad to say, I agree.... :mad:

    The fair tax system I have in mind is everyone, corporations and individuals, pay 10% or so...

    No loopholes or deductions. Everyone wins.
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  5. #5  
    PORCUS MAXIMUS Rockntractor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Teetop View Post
    Sad to say, I agree.... :mad:

    The fair tax system I have in mind is everyone, corporations and individuals, pay 10% or so...

    No loopholes or deductions. Everyone wins.
    I would go with either tax in this thread. I listen to Neal Boortz every now and then how could you dissagree with it but it will never even come close to happening.
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  6. #6  
    Senior Member samurai's Avatar
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    Feeb is right, they'll never give up on the income tax, so this national sales tax will only be added IN ADDITION to what we are already paying.

    Other negatives:
    Every single person in the US will now be on the dole and dependent upon their government "prebate" check every month. Politicians (especially the left) will promise bigger "prebates" if you vote for them, and scare people by saying "the other guy will reduce/eliminate your prebate checks and starve poor people!" Think of the welfare rhetoric and fiddling, and the dependent psychology, and then expand it to EVERY US citizen...

    Massive incentives for black market sales of goods under the table to pay no sales tax.

    All online purchases that are currently free of taxes will then be taxed.

    Sales taxes are some of the hardest taxes to collect and account for properly.


    All in all, I think it's a bad idea and I don't know why people keep pushing it. Do they want nationwide universal welfare for all? Because that's what it amounts to.
    The problem in the next four years will be not just that the president of the United States serially does not tell the truth. Instead, the real crisis in our brave new relativist world will be that those who demonstrate that he is untruthful will themselves be accused of lying. - Victor Davis Hanson
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  7. #7  
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    Instead of the 30-40% sales tax which FairTax advocates propose, how about a combined sales-income tax: 15% income tax, 15% sales tax...both fixed rates. Just like most current sales taxes, certain things like unprocessed foods will be exempt.
    "Because we're a great nation, our challenges seem complex; it will always be this way. But as long as we remember our first principals and believe in ourselves, the future will always be ours." -Reagan
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  8. #8  
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    Quote Originally Posted by samurai View Post
    Feeb is right, they'll never give up on the income tax, so this national sales tax will only be added IN ADDITION to what we are already paying.

    Other negatives:
    Every single person in the US will now be on the dole and dependent upon their government "prebate" check every month. Politicians (especially the left) will promise bigger "prebates" if you vote for them, and scare people by saying "the other guy will reduce/eliminate your prebate checks and starve poor people!" Think of the welfare rhetoric and fiddling, and the dependent psychology, and then expand it to EVERY US citizen...

    Massive incentives for black market sales of goods under the table to pay no sales tax.

    All online purchases that are currently free of taxes will then be taxed.

    Sales taxes are some of the hardest taxes to collect and account for properly.


    All in all, I think it's a bad idea and I don't know why people keep pushing it. Do they want nationwide universal welfare for all? Because that's what it amounts to.
    The government can not run a whore house efficiently. How do you expect them to dole out prebate checks every month. The dummies at the IRS sent out those $250 checks to 35,000 dead people. The medicare/medicaid program, the post office, the defense department, etc, etc pisses away on average 20%of the money that they receive thru mismanagement and fraud. The fair tax would be a disaster. It will never happen because of the legal implications.
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  9. #9  
    HR Corporate Scum patriot45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AHeneen View Post
    Instead of the 30-40% sales tax which FairTax advocates propose, how about a combined sales-income tax: 15% income tax, 15% sales tax...both fixed rates. Just like most current sales taxes, certain things like unprocessed foods will be exempt.
    Wow, someone who hasn't read the fairtax is changing the wording to argue against it!

    Here are the 5 myths;

    The FairTax Five

    The gloves are off as critics try to pick apart the FairTax. Trouble is, it's just a replay of the same five FairTax myths:

    "The 23% rate is misleading. It's actually 30%"
    Well, actually...
    "It's not enforceable and evasion will be rampant"
    Well, actually...
    "It will not be revenue neutral at 23%"
    Well, actually...
    "The FairTax is not politically viable"
    Well, actually...
    "The FairTax is regressive and shifts the tax burden onto lower and middle income people"
    Well, actually...

    Any one can argue that it won't work or whatever, but the first thing you do is change the way it is written, thats not a fair assessment. Go here FairTax.org and check it out the way it is meant to be.

    and here for more info.

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  10. #10  
    Senior Member FeebMaster's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AHeneen View Post
    Instead of the 30-40% sales tax which FairTax advocates propose, how about a combined sales-income tax: 15% income tax, 15% sales tax...both fixed rates. Just like most current sales taxes, certain things like unprocessed foods will be exempt.
    Yes. A federal sales tax and a federal income tax. That would be awesome. Why not go for the trifecta and have a federal property tax too?
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