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  1. #171  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wei Wu Wei View Post
    A girl is raped as a teenager, becomes pregnant. She's forced to drop out of school to take care of her baby. She has no resources, money for child care or people to help her. She has a hard time getting work, holding only unskilled positions at near-minimum wage. She can barely afford rent and food, she relocates homes often and stops by food banks for help. She can barely afford a cell phone, which she needs as an unchanging number to give potential employers. She gets sick, she needs medical attention but she doesn't have insurance. The ER determines she is not in urgent danger so they hand her some pills and she checks out until she's sick enough that the ER cannot turn her away.

    Do you honestly saying that you are totally opposed to her government helping her pay some bills or getting her medical attention just because some 20 year old losers might try to milk the system?

    If that's how you really feel then there's not much else I can say, that's just where we disagree.
    You know, I have never, not once run into a girl like the one in your example. But I havr run into countless girls like my girlfriend's niece. She has two kids (3 and 2). The father of the oldest one is a piece of shit Mexican nation who was deported. The father of the second is a piece of shit Mexican national who will be deported once he completes his prison sentence. Her lasy boyfriend was a guy that beat her and her boys. She is stupid enough to MAKE THE CHOICE to get in with pieces of shit like that. She makes her own decisions and she should live with them.

    The sad part is that she could do so much better. She is stunningly gorgeous and smart enough that school was never a problem. Instead, she CHOSE to be a slut. She CHOSE to have kids thinking that that was a way to hold on to a man. I don't care that she did not intend to become pregnant, she engaged in the very behavior that causes pregnancy.

    I have told my girlfriend that she better not ask me for anything if she ever give that girl anything. How that little whore lives and what she goes through is something I had nothing to do with and should not effect me in any way at all.

    That is where our tax dollars are going. Not to poor girls who's rape induced pregnancy ruined their plans for college.
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  2. #172  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speedy View Post
    You know, I have never, not once run into a girl like the one in your example. But I havr run into countless girls like my girlfriend's niece. She has two kids (3 and 2). The father of the oldest one is a piece of shit Mexican nation who was deported. The father of the second is a piece of shit Mexican national who will be deported once he completes his prison sentence. Her lasy boyfriend was a guy that beat her and her boys. She is stupid enough to MAKE THE CHOICE to get in with pieces of shit like that. She makes her own decisions and she should live with them.

    The sad part is that she could do so much better. She is stunningly gorgeous and smart enough that school was never a problem. Instead, she CHOSE to be a slut. She CHOSE to have kids thinking that that was a way to hold on to a man. I don't care that she did not intend to become pregnant, she engaged in the very behavior that causes pregnancy.

    I have told my girlfriend that she better not ask me for anything if she ever give that girl anything. How that little whore lives and what she goes through is something I had nothing to do with and should not effect me in any way at all.

    That is where our tax dollars are going. Not to poor girls who's rape induced pregnancy ruined their plans for college.
    Ditto. Again, hypotheticals are all well and good, however, I can give a thousand examples of teens, or other women, having children as the result of unprotected sex. Irresponsible behavior. My niece for example. She wasn't raped. She was irresponsible. Thankfully for her, she has a good family structure. My half sister is another. Her oldest son was from her first marriage. Her other son and daughter, not so much and she's on public assistance. My wife's step brother is one of the biggest leeches I know. My inlaws even got him a job at my jail which was complete with benefits and a good salary. He ended up quitting(in truth, he stopped coming to work) because the money he was making didn't allow for him and his family(son and then fiancée, they've since married) to stay in their low rent housing. Again, the biggest leech I know(and if you knew my father-in-law, you'd see his children and think, 'wtf'). These people have children out of wedlock not by rape or incest but by their own irresponsible behavior.
    Progressivism is a bottomless pit of absurdity.
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  3. #173  
    Senior Member malloc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wei Wu Wei View Post
    I do what I can, and of course it's never enough. It's good when anyone does charitable acts but charity alone simply cannot solve the problems caused by American "Capitalism"
    Quote Originally Posted by Constitutionally Speaking View Post
    American capitalism is the CURE for most of the need for charity.
    Amen. Wee Wee is so misguided he dumbly puts his favorite collective ideology over history and facts. Capitalism has created a society within America where even our poor are wealthy when compared to a vast majority of the world, and only through capitalism is it possible for any significant portion of the poor to become fat. Capitalism has increased the average lifespan of people in capitalist nations from less than 50 years to over 75 from 1810 to 2010. Furthermore, capitalism has exported these benefits to even the poorest regions of the world. Capitalism has benefited our standard of living through innovations like cell phones, space age technology, and nuclear power. American capitalism drives the U.S. to deliver an average of 18,000 scientific units of advancement a year. More than 5 times the amount of our nearest competitor, the U.K., and up to hundreds of times more advancements than almost any other socialist nation.

    When one looks at historical fact over ideological collectivist fiction, capitalism has brought more good and less evil into this world than any other socioeconomic system ever devised, and by a very, very large margin. I think this fact upsets Wee Wee, which in turn fuels his stubborn fixation with obsolete class warfare models. Wee Wee cannot reconcile reality with his own world view. Therefore he chooses to believe in a fictional version of economic reality in order to sustain his personal illusion that he is some sort of idolized, morally superior, crusader in a battle to right the wrongs of the world. This hallucination is necessary to sustain the outright narcissism Wee Wee displays in his posts. After all, if his philanthropy were genuine he would be crusading against the North Korean and Cuban systems which institutionalize poverty instead of cheerleading for them. Since the humanitarian angle he showcases is disingenuous, he must project the characteristics of poverty inducing socioeconomic systems onto the poverty solving capitalistic system in order to have a windmill to tilt against. It's hard to feel any empathy towards narcissists due to the repulsiveness of their arrogance, but occasionally I pity the guy. It must be very depressing indeed to have to make up a completely baseless version of reality in order to maintain the illusion of being a champion for the poor.
    Last edited by malloc; 12-10-2010 at 08:52 AM.
    "In England a king hath little more to do than to make war and give away places; which in plain terms, is to impoverish the nation and set it together by the ears. A pretty business indeed for a man to be allowed eight hundred thousand sterling a year for, and worshipped into the bargain! Of more worth is one honest man to society and in the sight of God, than all the crowned ruffians that ever lived."
    —Thomas Paine, Common Sense
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  4. #174  
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJCardFan View Post
    Um, no I don't. Because there are some things that have to be paid for. Infrastructure, police, fire, prisons, military, courts, are all necessary AND enumerated in the Constitution. See, since you don't seem to have a working brain cell, let me post something for you:
    Fire departments enumerated in the constitution? LOL! Roads?! Ha!

    Its by no means a given that a government *must* or *should* pay for those things. But the belief is widely accepted, that the benefits those services provide are so great, that they override the objections of any particular individual who may not want to pay for them. We don't give those individuals the option to opt out, do we?

    We take their money by force. You take their money by force.
    Last edited by wilbur; 12-10-2010 at 11:30 AM.
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  5. #175  
    Senior Member Molon Labe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilbur View Post
    Fire departments enumerated in the constitution? LOL! Roads?! Ha!

    Its by no means a given that a government *must* or *should* pay for those things. But the belief is widely accepted, that the benefits those services provide are so great, that they override the objections of any particular individual who may not want to pay for them. We don't give those individuals the option to opt out, do we?

    We take their money by force. You take their money by force.
    There are plenty of free market answers to all of these dilemmas....but it requires a paradigm shifting.
    Gun Control: The theory that a woman found dead in an alley, raped and strangled with her panty hose, is somehow morally superior to a woman explaining to police how her attacker got that fatal bullet wound - Unknown


    The problem is Empty People, Not Loaded Guns - Linda Schrock Taylor
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  6. #176  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Constitutionally Speaking View Post
    American capitalism is the CURE for most of the need for charity.
    This makes no sense. If the Americansystem is the cure for poverty, then there should be no poverty in America.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Smith - Wealth of Nations
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
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  7. #177  
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilbur View Post
    Fire departments enumerated in the constitution? LOL! Roads?! Ha!

    Its by no means a given that a government *must* or *should* pay for those things. But the belief is widely accepted, that the benefits those services provide are so great, that they override the objections of any particular individual who may not want to pay for them. We don't give those individuals the option to opt out, do we?

    We take their money by force. You take their money by force.
    You are such an asshole it's sad. And you so don't get it that it's even sadder. Yeah, keeping the roads in good shape and giving money to assholes like you so you can stay home and jerk off all day is exactly the same. Tell us, what do you do for a living? Do you even do anything productive?
    Progressivism is a bottomless pit of absurdity.
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  8. #178  
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJCardFan View Post
    You are such an asshole it's sad. And you so don't get it that it's even sadder.
    Good point smart guy.

    Yeah, keeping the roads in good shape and giving money to assholes like you so you can stay home and jerk off all day is exactly the same.
    Exactly the same? Who said that?
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Smith - Wealth of Nations
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
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  9. #179  
    Senior Member The Night Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJCardFan View Post
    See? Establish. Insure. Provide. Secure. Is there anything ambiguous about this? How about we find the definitions of each of those words:

    Establish-1.
    a. To set up; found. See Synonyms at found1.
    b. To bring about; generate: establish goodwill in the neighborhood.
    2.
    a. To place or settle in a secure position or condition; install: They established me in my own business.
    b. To make firm or secure.
    3. To cause to be recognized and accepted: a discovery that established his reputation.
    4. To introduce and put (a law, for example) into force.
    5. To prove the validity or truth of: The defense attorneys established the innocence of the accused.
    6. To make a state institution of (a church).http://www.thefreedictionary.com/establish

    Insure-1.
    a. To provide or arrange insurance for: a company that insures homeowners and businesses.
    b. To acquire or have insurance for: insured herself against losses; insured his car for theft.
    2. To make sure, certain, or secure.http://www.thefreedictionary.com/insure

    Provide-1. To furnish; supply: provide food and shelter for a family.
    2. To make available; afford: a room that provides ample sunlight through French windows.
    3. To set down as a stipulation: an agreement that provides deadlines for completion of the work.
    4. Archaic To make ready ahead of time; prepare.
    v.intr.
    1. To take measures in preparation: provided for the common defense of the states in time of war.
    2. To supply means of subsistence: She provides for her family by working in a hospital.
    3. To make a stipulation or condition: The Constitution provides for a bicameral legislature.http://www.thefreedictionary.com/provide

    Secure-1. Free from danger or attack: a secure fortress.
    2. Free from risk of loss; safe: Her papers were secure in the vault.
    3. Free from the risk of being intercepted or listened to by unauthorized persons: Only one telephone line in the embassy was secure.
    4. Free from fear, anxiety, or doubt.
    5.
    a. Not likely to fail or give way; stable: a secure stepladder.
    b. Firmly fastened: a secure lock.
    6. Reliable; dependable: secure investments.
    7. Assured; certain: With three goals in the first period they had a secure victory, but somehow they lost.
    8. Archaic Careless or overconfident.http://www.thefreedictionary.com/secure

    Pretty straight forward, yes? Now...

    Promote-1.
    a. To raise to a more important or responsible job or rank.
    b. To advance (a student) to the next higher grade.
    2. To contribute to the progress or growth of; further. See Synonyms at advance.
    3. To urge the adoption of; advocate: promote a constitutional amendment.
    4. To attempt to sell or popularize by advertising or publicity: commercials promoting a new product.
    5. To help establish or organize (a new enterprise), as by securing financial backing: promote a Broadway show.http://www.thefreedictionary.com/promote

    Promote, to put it simply, means to suggest. Again, the Constitution is not ambiguous. I, and others like me, don't mind taxes when we get something back in return like police protection, protection from foreign invaders, a great highway system, ect. Giving some shlub money so they can sit home and be a shlub does nothing for me.
    Fail. The US Constitution contains two clauses pertaining to the general Welfare. You provided one. Here is the 2nd:

    The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

    Provide for the common Defence and general Welfare. Like you said, there is nothing ambiguous about that.
    Last edited by The Night Owl; 12-10-2010 at 01:11 PM.
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  10. #180  
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Night Owl View Post
    Fail. There are two clauses pertaining to the general Welfare of the United States. You provided only one. Here is the 2nd:

    The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States;

    Okay?
    That's general welfare, not provide a living for millions. OK? Another leech I presume. Read the Federalist papers asshole.
    Last edited by NJCardFan; 12-10-2010 at 01:13 PM.
    Progressivism is a bottomless pit of absurdity.
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