Thread: For the Atheists: Other ways to think about God / spirituality.

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  1. #1 For the Atheists: Other ways to think about God / spirituality. 
    Our widdle friend. Wei Wu Wei's Avatar
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    I find that many atheists have interesting ways of conveying what they consider to be the silliness of religious believe. I find many of their examples and metaphors to fall short, preferring a simplistic idea of God that is easy to discount.

    I'm sure most are familiar with the idea of Flatland, a 2D world often used to explain higher dimensional movement.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWyTxCsIXE4

    Starting with a 0-dimensional point, you can move up a dimension by moving away from that point.

    Here you have a 1-dimensional line. In this direction, there are only 2 directions, forward and backward. There is no such thing as width, it's nonsense in this dimension. However, to move up a dimension, the idea is similar: you must move in a direction that takes you further away from every point on the line, simultaneously. This cannot be done by moving forward or backwards, because any motion in those directions would bring you further from some points and closer to others. In order to move away from every point at once, you'd have to move sideways.

    This creates a brand new dimension, what we know as width. if we equally fill in the space between all the points we want with a finite length, we end up with a 2 dimensional Circle. Here we have a 2-dimensional figure.

    Again, a similar move can be made to jump up into the inconceivable-to-a-flat-lander 3rd dimension. Starting at the center of the circle, you have to move in a direction that takes you away from every point on/in the circle simultaneously. there is no direction like this in 2 dimensions, and it requires the mind-blowing jump up a dimension, as illustrated in the flatland example.


    So here we are in 3 dimensions. 3 or 4 when you consider time as a function of space.


    Now, if we were all 2 dimensional, and someone spoke of a 3rd dimension we'd think they are crazy. If they said that through this direction that cannot be explained, they are able to have knowledge of everything, inside and out, albeit in a way that is almost impossible to explain in a 2-dimensional framework. This direction would allow for incredible insights and self-knowledge, even though it would be impossible in 2-dimensions. A scientific community that looks only at empirical, measurable reality would totally miss the "extra" dimension, because the reality they know lacks any tools or even reference points for this extra dimension: there simply is no such thing as "up".


    Imagine that spirituality functions is a similar way, perhaps through prayer, meditation, or other spiritual practices, one can experience another dimension of reality, one that allows movement towards and away from everything that exists, simultaneously. One that offers insight, foresight, and self-understanding in a way that is simply incomprehensible in our rigid empirical understanding of our world-as-we-experience it.

    If you asked a flatlander about the scientific plausibility of a third dimension, they'd say it's nonsense that can only be taken by weak faith, as opposed to empiricism and rationality which explains their 2-dimensional world perfectly and consistently.

    Is that not analogous to the scientific position on spirituality?


    Some more to come.....
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Smith - Wealth of Nations
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
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  2. #2  
    Zoomie djones520's Avatar
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    I don't find it silly. And I personally find it offensive when other atheists voice that they do. Sick of ass hats like you making me look bad.
    In most sports, cold-cocking an opposing player repeatedly in the face with a series of gigantic Slovakian uppercuts would get you a multi-game suspension without pay.

    In hockey, it means you have to sit in the penalty box for five minutes.
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  3. #3  
    Senior Member Apache's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djones520 View Post
    I don't find it silly. And I personally find it offensive when other atheists voice that they do. Sick of ass hats like you making me look bad.
    So you're an atheist, or agnostic?
    Government is not the solution to our problem, government is the problem.
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    We could say they are spending like drunken sailors. That would be unfair to drunken sailors, they're spending their OWN money.
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  4. #4  
    Zoomie djones520's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apache View Post
    So you're an atheist, or agnostic?
    Atheist.
    In most sports, cold-cocking an opposing player repeatedly in the face with a series of gigantic Slovakian uppercuts would get you a multi-game suspension without pay.

    In hockey, it means you have to sit in the penalty box for five minutes.
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  5. #5  
    Senior Member Apache's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djones520 View Post
    Atheist.
    So for you there is no doubt, whatsoever, there is no God?
    Government is not the solution to our problem, government is the problem.
    Ronald Reagan

    We could say they are spending like drunken sailors. That would be unfair to drunken sailors, they're spending their OWN money.
    Ronald Reagan

    R.I.P. Crockspot
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  6. #6  
    Zoomie djones520's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Apache View Post
    So for you there is no doubt, whatsoever, there is no God?
    Of course there is. I cannot inequivocally prove that there is no god/higher power. It's a decision I've made on faith.

    It is one that all Atheists make on faith, whether they realize it or not.
    In most sports, cold-cocking an opposing player repeatedly in the face with a series of gigantic Slovakian uppercuts would get you a multi-game suspension without pay.

    In hockey, it means you have to sit in the penalty box for five minutes.
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  7. #7  
    Senior Member Apache's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djones520 View Post
    Of course there is. I cannot inequivocally prove that there is no god/higher power. It's a decision I've made on faith.

    It is one that all Atheists make on faith, whether they realize it or not.
    At least you're honest about it. I don't agree with your stand, but I will show the same respect you've shown on this matter... ;)
    Government is not the solution to our problem, government is the problem.
    Ronald Reagan

    We could say they are spending like drunken sailors. That would be unfair to drunken sailors, they're spending their OWN money.
    Ronald Reagan

    R.I.P. Crockspot
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  8. #8  
    NeunElfer SuperMod hampshirebrit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djones520 View Post
    Atheist.
    Yaaay.

    GO CU ATHEISTS :D
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    nie vergessen, nie verzeihen.
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  9. #9  
    PORCUS MAXIMUS Rockntractor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by hampshirebrit View Post
    Yaaay.

    GO CU ATHEISTS :D
    Go where, you have no where to go, you will die like a possum by the road!
    Have a nice day!:D
    How is obama working out for you?
    http://i686.photobucket.com/albums/vv230/upyourstruly/5d569df9-186a-477b-a665-3ea8a8b9b655_zpse9003e54.jpg
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  10. #10  
    Zoomie djones520's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockntractor View Post
    Go where, you have no where to go, you will die like a possum by the road!
    Have a nice day!:D
    Nothing wrong with that. Better then what you folks think will happen to us. ;)
    In most sports, cold-cocking an opposing player repeatedly in the face with a series of gigantic Slovakian uppercuts would get you a multi-game suspension without pay.

    In hockey, it means you have to sit in the penalty box for five minutes.
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