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  1. #11  
    Senior Member LogansPapa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by patriot45 View Post
    There’s insufficient evidence for a long-term warming trend
    The earth’s warming is not historically significant
    The warming is not anthropogenic
    The benefits of a warmer earth exceed the costs
    Stopping warming is economically impractical or undesirable
    Implementing government controls is the wrong response to climate change
    There is no evidence that would convince you. Nothing. Half the Manhattan skyline could be under water within the decade and that wouldn’t convince you. Arrogance is fueling the global warming ignorance and childish denial, and our great-grandchildren will hate us for it.
    At Coretta Scott King's funeral in early 2006, Ethel Kennedy, the widow of Robert Kennedy, leaned over to him and whispered, "The torch is being passed to you." "A chill went up my spine," Obama told an aide. (Newsweek)
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  2. #12  
    HR Corporate Scum patriot45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LogansPapa View Post
    There is no evidence that would convince you. Nothing. Half the Manhattan skyline could be under water within the decade and that wouldn’t convince you. Arrogance is fueling the global warming ignorance and childish denial, and our great-grandchildren will hate us for it.
    Lets just go bankrupt now! You are right there is no evidence to convince me.
    This year my pool water hasn't gotten over 90 yet.

    Here is a copy and paste-

    This doesn’t mean that you can’t challenge absurd claims. If someone claims that the temperature will rise 10 degrees, and oceans will rise 20 feet in the next 100 years, you can point out that temperature rose at less than 1 degree in the 20th century, and oceans are rising at 1-3mm per year according to the alarmists themselves.

    : “Grow your own dope. Plant a liberal.”
    ” Obummercare, 20 percent of the time it works everytime.
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  3. #13  
    Sonnabend
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    Could the Chicken Littles and the rest of the doomsayers kindly go climb a tree?

    The world hasnt warmed since 1998, we are into cooling, not warming, the IPCC them,selves screwed up, there will be no seven metre sea level rises (the IPCC changed its mind and now says seven centimetres)

    No its a scientific theory which is nearly unanimously accepted among climatologists (the people who actually make a living studying this stuff)
    .

    Thats a lie.
    Philip Stott, Professor Emeritus of Biogeography at the University of London, wonders how much longer the media can ignore what’s really happening with our climate:

    But that is precisely what is happening. Since 1998, according to all the main world temperature records, including the UK Met Office’s ‘HadCRUT3’ data set [a globally-gridded product of near-surface temperatures consisting of annual differences from 1961-90 normals], the world average surface temperature has exhibited no warming whatsoever…

    And now a Mexican expert, Victor Manuel Velasco Herrera (National Autonomous University of Mexico), is warning that the Earth will enter a new ‘Little Ice Age’ for up to 80 years due to decreases in solar activity… He describes the predictions of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) as “erroneous”.

    If this cooling phase really does persist, it will be illuminating to observe how long our media can maintain its befuddled state of ‘cognitive dissonance’.
    Dr Tim Ball, Natural Resources Stewardship Project chairman and former climatology professor at the University of Winnipeg, agrees the climate just isn’t behaving as the warming alarmists says it should:

    “There is not a single case for any period of any duration where CO2 increase precedes temperature increase. All records show temperature increase precedes CO2 increase. But the IPCC have ‘proved’ with computer models they are 90% certain that the current warming is due to anthropogenic greenhouse gases, namely CO2. This is pre-determined because the computer model is programmed to have an increase in temperature if CO2 increases. By their own definitive statements, temperatures cannot go down as long as CO2 increases. Trouble is CO2 has continued to increase but temperatures have declined and many scientists expect them to go lower until at least 2030.

    Freeman Dyson says no


    I do not "believe in" global warming, I also dont believe in the Easter Bunny, Santa Claus, honest politicians, fairies at the bottom of the garden or that Eyelids has anything even closely resembling brain matter.

    "Believe" is religion, not science, science is fact, the fact is that there is no
    "consensus", it is a blatant lie to say that it is "nearly unanimously accepted" when it is NOT, and quite frankly, if I had a dollar for every end of the world scenario I've heard, I'd be Donald Trump.

    Global warming
    before that global cooling
    before that the Saturn Conjunction that would send us into the sun
    before that the terror that nuclear bombs would send us out of orbit

    ..whats next, a giant mutant star goat?

    Also here

    In fact, many astronomers have announced that Pluto has been experiencing global warming,
    ..must be all those SUV's..

    ..oh wait.....
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  4. #14  
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    If all sea ice were to melt tomorrow, sea level would not rise 1 inch
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  5. #15  
    HR Corporate Scum patriot45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nubs View Post
    If all sea ice were to melt tomorrow, sea level would not rise 1 inch
    Ya mean if my ice cubes melt in my full drink it would not spill over!?! :D

    : “Grow your own dope. Plant a liberal.”
    ” Obummercare, 20 percent of the time it works everytime.
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  6. #16  
    Senior Member The Night Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonnabend View Post

    The world hasnt warmed since 1998, we are into cooling, not warming...
    The temperature trend for roughly the past 10 years has been nearly flat but temperatures over any given decade are not necessarily indicative of climate. Scientists typically look at a span of 30 years to establish a climate baseline.
    Last edited by The Night Owl; 08-25-2008 at 10:28 PM.
    Ubi Dubium Ibi Libertas
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  7. #17  
    Sonnabend
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    The temperature trend for roughly the past 10 years has been nearly flat but temperatures over any given decade are not necessarily indicative of climate. Scientists typically look at a span of 30 years to establish a climate baseline.
    Which means the models are just that, models, and no one knows for certain. "Science by consensus" reminds me of "If all your friends jumped off a cliff, would you jump too??"

    AGW is a lie, a myth, scaremongering, panic merchanting.

    No its a scientific theory which is nearly unanimously accepted among climatologists (the people who actually make a living studying this stuff)
    Here is a partial list of people who say otherwise.

    W. Dansgaard et al., “North Atlantic Climatic Oscillations Revealed by Deep
    Greenland Ice Cores,” in Climate Processes and Climate Sensitivity (1984), ed., F. E.
    Hansen and T. Takahashi, Geophysical Monograph 29, (Washington, D.C.,
    American Geophysical Union).
    W. Dansgaard, University of Copenhagen, Denmark
    Hans Oeschger, deceased, retired from the University of Bern, Switzerland
    W Dansgaard et al., “Evidence for general instability of past climate from a 250-kyr
    ice-core record,” Nature 364 (1992): 218-220
    W. Dansgaard, University of Copenhagen, Denmark
    S. J. Johnson, University of Iceland
    H.B. Clausen, University of Copenhagen, Denmark
    D. Dahl-Jensen, University of Copenhagen, Denmark
    N.S. Gundestrup, University of Copenhagen, Denmark
    C.U. Hammer, University of Copenhagen, Denmark
    C.S. Hvidberg, University of Copenhagen, Denmark
    J. P. Steffenson, University of Copenhagen, Denmark
    A. E. Sveinbjornsdottir, University of Iceland
    J. Jouzel, French Atomic Energy Commission
    G. Bond, Lamont-Doherty Geological Observatory, New York.
    Claude Lorius et al., “A 150,000-Year Climatic Record from Antarctic Ice, “Nature,
    Vol. 316, pp. 591-96, 1985.
    Claude Lorius, French National Center for Scientific Research
    C. Ritz, French National Center for Scientific Research
    J. Jouzel, Geochemical Isotope Laboratory, France
    L. Merlivat, Geochemical Isotope Laboratory, France
    S. Korotkevich, Geochemical Isotope Laboratory, France
    N. I>. Barkov, Arctic and Antarctic Research Institute, Leningrad
    V. M. Kotlyakov, Russian Institute of Geography
    T. Cronin, “Climatic Variability in the Eastern U.S. over the past Millennium from
    Chesapeake Bay Sediments, Geology, Vol. 28, p 3-6, 2000
    T. Cronin, USGS
    D. Willard, USGS
    A Karlsen, USGS
    S. Ishman, USGS
    S. Verardo, USGS
    J/. McGeehin USGS
    Kerhin, Maryland Geological Survey, Baltimore, MD
    C Holmes, USGS
    S. Colman, USGS
    A. Zimmerman, Virginia Inst. Of Marine, Science, Gloucester Pt, VA
    Gerald H. Haug, “Climate and the Collapse of Maya Civilization,” Science 299
    (2003): 1731-1735.
    Gerald H. Haug, Geopforschungszenfrum, Potsdam, Germany
    Detlef Gunther, ETH, Zurich, Switzerland
    Larry C. Peterson, University of Miami
    Daniel M. Sigman, Princeton University
    Konrad A Hughen, Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution
    Beat Aeschlimann, ETH, Zurich, Switzerland
    David Hodell et al., “Solar Forcing of Drought Frequency in the Maya Lowlands,”
    Science 292 (2001): 1367-70.
    David Hodell, University of Florida
    Mark Brenner, University of Florida
    Jason H. Curtis, University of Florida
    Thomas Guilderson, Livermore National Lab, Livermore, CA
    Nicolas Caillon et al., “Timing of Atmospheric CO2 and Antarctic Temperature
    Changes Across Termination III,” Science 299 (2003): 1728-31.
    Nicolas Caillon, Scripps Institutionion of Oceanography
    Jeffrey P. Severinghaus, Scripps
    Jean Jouzel, French Atomic Energy Commission
    Jean-Marc Barnola, Laboratory of Glaciology and Geophysics Environment, France
    Jiancheng Kang, Polar Research Institute of China
    Volodya Lipenkov, Arctic and Antarctic Research Institute, St. Petersburg, Russia
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  8. #18  
    Sonnabend
    Guest
    Here are some more

    . Balling, University of Aarhus, Denmark
    Paul A. Mayewski et al., “Major features and forcing of high-latitude northern
    hemisphere atmosphere circulation using a 110,000-year-long glaciochemical
    series,” Journal of Geophysical Research, 102 (1997): 26,345-26,356.
    Paul A. Mayewski, Loren D. Mekker, U. N>H>,
    Mark S. Twickler, University of New Hampshire
    Sallie Whitlow, University of New Hampshire
    Qunzhao Yang, University of New Hampshire
    W. Berry Lyons, University of Alabama
    Michael Prentice, University of New Hampshire
    Sharon E Nicolson, “The nature of rainfall variability over Africa on time scales of
    decades to millennia,” Global and Planetary Changes 26 (2000): 137-158.
    Sharon Nicholson, Florida State
    Henry Lamb, “Vegetation Response to Rainfall Variation and Human Impact in
    Central Kenya during the Past 1,100 Years” The Holocene 13 (2003):258–92.
    Henry Lamb, Institute of Geography and Earth Science, University of Wales
    Iain Darbyshire, Institute of Geography and Earth Science, Univ. of Wales
    Dirk Verschuren, Institute of Geography and Earth Science, Univ. of Wales
    Bettina Schilman et al., “Global Climate Instability Reflected by Eastern
    Mediterranean Marine Records during the Late Holocene, Paleogeography,
    Paleoclimatology, Paleoecology 176 (2001): 157-76.
    Bettina Schilman, Geological Survey of Israel
    Miryam Bar-Matthews, Geological Survey of Israel
    Ahuva Almogi-Labin, Geological Survey of Israel
    Boaz Luz, Hebrew University of Jerusalem
    N/ Shaviv and J. Veizer, “Celestial Driver of Phanerozoic climate?” Geological
    Society of America 13 (2003): 4-10.
    Nir Shaviv, Hebrew University of Jerusalem
    Jan Veizer, University of Ottawa, Canada
    Hubert H. Lamb, Climate, history and the Modern World (New York: Rutledge
    1982), 191.
    Hubert H. Lamb, East Anglia University, UK
    Kang Chao, Man and Land in China: An Economic Analysis (Palo Alto, CA:
    Stanford University Press, 1986).
    Kang Chao, Tunghai University, China
    L. G. Thompson, T. Yao, “A High Resolution Millennial Record of the South Asian
    Monsoon from Himalayan Ice Cores,” Science Vol. 289 (2000) 1916-1919.
    L. G. Thompson, Ohio State T. Yao, Chinese Academy of Sciences
    E. Mosley-Thompson, Ohio State
    M. E. Davis, Ohio State
    K.A. Henderson, Ohio State
    P.-N. Lin, Ohio State
    Gerard Bond et al., “A Pervasive Millennial-Scale Cycle in North Atlantic Holocene
    and Glacial Climates,” Science, Vol., 278 (1997) 1257-1266.
    Gerard Bond, Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory, New York.
    William Showers, North Carolina State
    Maziet Cheseby, Lamont-Doherty Institute
    Rusty Lotti, Lamont-Doherty
    Peter deMenocal, Lamont-Doherty
    Paul Priore, Lamont-Doherty
    Heidi Cullen, Lamont-Doherty
    Irka Hadas, ETH, Zurich
    Georges Bonani, ETH, Zurich,
    Peter Almasi, Lamont-Doherty
    Gerard Bond et al., “Persistent Solar Influence on North Atlantic Climate during
    the Holocene,” Science 294 (2001): 2130-2136.
    Gerard Bond, Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory, New York
    Bernd Kromer, Heidelbert Academy of Sciences, Germany
    Juerg Beer, Eidgenossische Anstalt fur Wasserversorgung, Switzerland
    Raimund Muscheler, University of Arizona
    Michael N Evans, University of Arizona
    William Showers, North Carolina State University
    Sharon Hoffman, Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory
    Rusty Lotti-Gond, Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory
    Irka Hajdas, Accelrator Mass Spectrometry
    Georges Bonani, Accelerator Mass Spectrometry
    P. M. Liew et al., “Holocene thermal optimal and climate variability of East Asian
    monsoon inferred from forest reconstruction of a subalpine pollen sequence,
    Taiwan,” Earth and Planetary Science Letters 250 (2006): 596-605.
    P. M. Liew, National Taiwan University
    C.Y. Lee, National Taiwan University
    C.M. Kuo, Chinese Petroleum Corporation, Taipei
    L. Keigwin, “The Little Ice Age and Medieval Warm Period in the Sargasso Sea,”
    Science Vol., 274(1996) 1503-1508.
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  9. #19  
    Senior Member The Night Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sonnabend View Post
    No its a scientific theory which is nearly unanimously accepted among climatologists (the people who actually make a living studying this stuff)
    Here is a partial list of people who say otherwise.
    Not so fast. The list you provided comes from the following webpage promoting the idea that the global warming going on now is part of a natural cycle...

    http://www.cgfi.org/2007/10/04/the-l...arming-scares/

    Figuring prominently at the top of the list is a bit of text which I can only assume you omitted on purpose because it undermines your point...

    CITATION OF THE WORK OF THE FOLLOWING SCIENTISTS DOES NOT IMPLY THAT THEY NECESSARILY SUPPORT OUR CONCLUSIONS


    What? Did you honestly think I wouldn't check?

    :D

    Which means the models are just that, models, and no one knows for certain.
    The instrumental temperature record is not a climate model. The instrumental temperature record is just that... a record of temperatures based on measurements by instruments such as satellites and surface stations. Models are used for prediction purposes.
    Last edited by The Night Owl; 08-26-2008 at 09:06 AM.
    Ubi Dubium Ibi Libertas
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  10. #20  
    Power CUer FlaGator's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LogansPapa View Post
    There is no evidence that would convince you. Nothing. Half the Manhattan skyline could be under water within the decade and that wouldn’t convince you. Arrogance is fueling the global warming ignorance and childish denial, and our great-grandchildren will hate us for it.
    I don't buy in to man made global warming either. Is there climatic change happening? It seems that way. Is man the cause? No one is sure. More and more scientists are now reexamining their position on man made global warming and are leaning to it being a cyclical event. According to the geological record we have been living in an unusually stable period for the climate and change was inevitable with or without mankind’s presence. Can you offer me solid evidence that man is responsible for the current state of climate change?

    I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
    C. S. Lewis
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