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  1. #1 Many dissatisfied with Mass. anti-bullying law 
    CU's Tallest Midget! PoliCon's Avatar
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    Sentinel & Enterprise
    Posted: 01/02/2011 06:38:11 AM EST

    By Sarah Favot

    Boston University Statehouse Program

    BOSTON -- After years of legislative wrangling it took a tragedy to get a tough new anti-bullying law approved on Beacon Hill this year.

    But not all are happy with the law that was passed after the suicide of 15-year-old Phoebe Prince, a South Hadley High School student bullied by classmates, made international headlines.

    Some school principals say they must rewrite successful anti-bullying programs that were in effect before the Legislature passed the new law in May. Anti-bullying advocates say the law doesn't go far enough. One legal expert warns that vague language could open the door to many cases that fall short of real bullying.

    Sean Varano, a criminal justice professor at Roger Williams University, says the law allows any student to file a complaint of bullying if he or she considers any kind of problem with a fellow student as emotionally harmful.

    Varano said under the definition, a kindergartner telling a classmate she wouldn't be invited to his birthday party could be charged with causing emotional harm.

    "I believe that the legislation as written was a disaster," Varano said in an interview. "The legislators created a Pandora's Box and I don't think they have any idea of the implications in schools."

    CONTINUED
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    Quote Originally Posted by PoliCon View Post
    Sentinel & Enterprise
    Posted: 01/02/2011 06:38:11 AM EST

    By Sarah Favot

    Boston University Statehouse Program

    BOSTON -- After years of legislative wrangling it took a tragedy to get a tough new anti-bullying law approved on Beacon Hill this year.

    But not all are happy with the law that was passed after the suicide of 15-year-old Phoebe Prince, a South Hadley High School student bullied by classmates, made international headlines.

    Some school principals say they must rewrite successful anti-bullying programs that were in effect before the Legislature passed the new law in May. Anti-bullying advocates say the law doesn't go far enough. One legal expert warns that vague language could open the door to many cases that fall short of real bullying.

    Sean Varano, a criminal justice professor at Roger Williams University, says the law allows any student to file a complaint of bullying if he or she considers any kind of problem with a fellow student as emotionally harmful.

    Varano said under the definition, a kindergartner telling a classmate she wouldn't be invited to his birthday party could be charged with causing emotional harm.

    "I believe that the legislation as written was a disaster," Varano said in an interview. "The legislators created a Pandora's Box and I don't think they have any idea of the implications in schools."

    CONTINUED
    Well, they say if you won't lead then you will be led. The schools haven't managed to deal effectively with bullying. Many of these schools have punished both the perp and the victim because they were too spineless to take the heat from the parents and communities defending the perps. I actually heard some school employee discussing the violent behavior of certain students as being consistent with their culture and territorialism, and this was a defense or a call for understanding on the part of victims and their parents. Bullshit.

    But the bullies also know that nothing is going to happen to them unless they kill someone or unless the effort rises to attempted murder. Even then, most expect that juvenile justice will be the venue.

    I have had a police officer tell me that when local kids are arrested, they berate the police all the way to the jail, and then scream and demand stuff when they get there.

    But god forbid someone should tan the hide of one of these little jackasses, because Early Childhood Development majors have told us that that doesn't work. Bullshit.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    Well, they say if you won't lead then you will be led. The schools haven't managed to deal effectively with bullying. Many of these schools have punished both the perp and the victim because they were too spineless to take the heat from the parents and communities defending the perps. I actually heard some school employee discussing the violent behavior of certain students as being consistent with their culture and territorialism, and this was a defense or a call for understanding on the part of victims and their parents. Bullshit.

    But the bullies also know that nothing is going to happen to them unless they kill someone or unless the effort rises to attempted murder. Even then, most expect that juvenile justice will be the venue.

    I have had a police officer tell me that when local kids are arrested, they berate the police all the way to the jail, and then scream and demand stuff when they get there.

    But god forbid someone should tan the hide of one of these little jackasses, because Early Childhood Development majors have told us that that doesn't work. Bullshit.
    You oughta have your ass whooped!
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    These policies are all about saving the government from lawsuits. Reality is - kids need to learn how to properly respond to bullying and the schools cannot allow those proper responses. You come across a bully - you fight back and turn the fear back upon the person doing the bullying. The best way to deal with a bully is to beat the shit out of em. Ralphie taught me that!
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XvijyBIgazE
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    Quote Originally Posted by PoliCon View Post
    These policies are all about saving the government from lawsuits. Reality is - kids need to learn how to properly respond to bullying and the schools cannot allow those proper responses. You come across a bully - you fight back and turn the fear back upon the person doing the bullying. The best way to deal with a bully is to beat the shit out of em. Ralphie taught me that!
    I agree that under certain circumstances the fight back technique does work. However, there are also conditions under which it is ineffective, even if you are successful in the incident.

    I also think that the dynamics have changed considerably in my lifetime. In my seventh grade year, DC schools went from having problems with bullies and fights, to having funerals. It was just one or two, but it's now 40 years later, and the level of violence is firmly coupled with a complete disregard for the consequences of ones actions in many schools.
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    My father told me that I wasn't to start a fight but if someone started with me, I could finish it. Bullying is a direct result of liberal policy. You can teach a child that it's not OK to fight but for God's sake, teach the kid that it's OK to defend yourself. What the left has to realize is that this will never be a kumbaya-everyone love everyone society. There are always going to be dickheads. And you should teach kids to properly deal with dickheads. Ignore them if you can but if they keep up, give them a souvenir black eye. There were times when I stood up for myself and still bought an ass kicking but it gained me respect and believe me, you might win the fight but you looked like you were in a fight. And after a while, no one fucked with me. This is what I will teach my children.
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJCardFan View Post
    My father told me that I wasn't to start a fight but if someone started with me, I could finish it. Bullying is a direct result of liberal policy. You can teach a child that it's not OK to fight but for God's sake, teach the kid that it's OK to defend yourself. What the left has to realize is that this will never be a kumbaya-everyone love everyone society. There are always going to be dickheads. And you should teach kids to properly deal with dickheads. Ignore them if you can but if they keep up, give them a souvenir black eye. There were times when I stood up for myself and still bought an ass kicking but it gained me respect and believe me, you might win the fight but you looked like you were in a fight. And after a while, no one fucked with me. This is what I will teach my children.
    You're trying to turn this into noble conservative versus pussy liberal thing. It wouldn't be an issue if it were so simple, or so inconsequential. You would not have finished the last fight at my junior high school before my parents moved me away. That kid is dead. His fists were no match for a length of pipe. His culture's rules of honorable combat were no match for a dishonorable ambush. I had been attacked in a stairwell only two weeks earlier, and when I insisted that the police be called, the principal talked me out of it. The other kid is dead. What political philosophy did his parents have? I'll almost guarantee you that the parents of the kids that killed that kid are democrats. Is there something to brag about here? Some stupid remark to make?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    You're trying to turn this into noble conservative versus pussy liberal thing. It wouldn't be an issue if it were so simple, or so inconsequential. You would not have finished the last fight at my junior high school before my parents moved me away. That kid is dead. His fists were no match for a length of pipe. His culture's rules of honorable combat were no match for a dishonorable ambush. I had been attacked in a stairwell only two weeks earlier, and when I insisted that the police be called, the principal talked me out of it. The other kid is dead. What political philosophy did his parents have? I'll almost guarantee you that the parents of the kids that killed that kid are democrats. Is there something to brag about here? Some stupid remark to make?
    No, but there is an incredible point missed.
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    Senior Member Madisonian's Avatar
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    This is a different time and culture then the one some of us older guys knew.
    When I went to school in the 60's to early 70's, you got in a fight and it was over, case closed.
    While that is still the case in some outer suburban and rural areas, in many neighborhoods a fight is just the beginning that escalates to gang attacks and drive by shootings.

    Just enter "fight drive by shooting" into any search engine and be not only amazed, but terrified by the results.
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    There are always bullies in real life. Does anyone think bullying stops when you graduated school? If you don't learn how to deal with getting bullied in school you are going to be in a world of hurt when you get your first job.
    Last edited by m00; 01-02-2011 at 08:24 PM.
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