Thread: Change

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  1. #1 Society, Our Nation, Change 
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    I wanted to talk with you about this country, our society, and my views on change--Not change in the Obama 2008 campaign manner--but change in the regular sense.

    I'm going to be honest with you. I despise sudden and rapid change. This is a normal human reaction of course, as change represents the unknown, and the natural inclination is to fear the unknown. To panic blindly in the dark. Change--gradual as the steady flow of a stream--is more natural; more comforting; more easy to bear.

    I think in some ways I can now understand the fears of you in November 2008 when you heard of Obama's plans for change. I can understand now the anxieties and anger of the Greatest Generation in the 1960s when they saw the youth attempting to denigrate all that they and their fathers have built. I'm a man deeply tied to my roots, to the past. I do not exist in the present, but drift in my mind from the past, with visions of the future.

    From the time I was born in the year 1990, and for about 100 years before that, our country in terms of it's government was center to center left. Programs like Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, regulations and the rest were the norm rather than the exception when I was born. As such, growing up with the government having the power it does, or the role in certain industries that it does, is something I'm accustomed to. I've never seen a problem with any of these programs, from an ideological or logical standpoint.

    My ideological standing, as that of a Liberal, is founded on my own principles, my own interpretation of the law, and my own sense of morality. Yours may differ, and all of us to greater or lesser degrees will disagree on what role the government should play, how it should behave; down to the little things like the character and manner of the President himself. I will agree that regulation should be tempered with common sense; That welfare should be tempered with merit. I will agree that our government could be run more efficiently and in a more focused manner.

    When I see people trying to radically change overnight what has existed with relatively little change for one hundred or more years;, to change the country as it was when I was born into it--It disturbs me. It's a change, and I do not believe change should come quick, but gradual. Liberalism to me, at least as it was say pre 2008, was the status quo. And I never saw anything wrong with it, and I do not now. I was raised to think that these programs, they were good, they helped people, etc. I was raised to think people like Teddy Roosevelt were heroic figures, men's men, public servants. And I still view them as such. My heroes will not change.

    The place I tend to find myself most comfortable in is the status quo. If the status quo was TRULY dark, or if we were TRULY in the depths of darkness and the clutches of tyranny, I would agree as many of you seem to feel that radical and rapid change is needed; that a radical and sudden shift in our steady course must occur. But I do not see tyranny in our land. I look abroad and see real tyranny. I do not see America teeteering on the edge of armageddon as some fear. I believe America can overcome any struggle presented to it; The insurmountable strength of the American spirit, and the cunning ingenuity of the American mind, has proven true time and again over the last 236 years.

    Now, to the negative changes I see:

    Socially, culturally, pop culture wise, politically, I see the world as radically departing from what I knew, or thought it to be. When I was a child, at least in my environment or in my household, I wasn't raised to consider religion being anything other than the norm in life. God was real, God was something to worship. Life had a purpose, a reason. An afterlife awaited us after this one, where we'd be reunited with all our loved ones. And now as I grow up, it's under attack. It's something which is often mocked, belittled and disagreed with.

    Our pop culture is one that uplifts cruelty, that uplifts bullying, that uplifts judging others solely on appearance. Look at the Rebecca Black thing. The girl is a 13 year old kid and she's getting millions of people telling her to "cut and die", "slit your wrists please" simply because she made a crappy song. I guess I'm very old fashioned, but I see such things as wrong...as immoral. I don't see how telling a young girl to kill herself because you hate her song is at all right, or proper, or good...yet it's accepted. Even encouraged by others.

    We live now in a time where the media is more shark like than ever, always looking for blood; for vulnerability on the part of a celebrity. For any little humanity or mistake on their part, and they pounce on it like a lioness on a zebra. We watch with glee celebrities destroy themselves. This is entertainment to our media and our society now; self destruction. It's no longer a "tragedy"--it's entertainment. Pop culture of my generation enjoys watching the trainwreck of Charlie Sheen's life and his insane rants. It almost comes off as sociopathic to me. It almost reminds me of the South Park episode about Britney Spears--that the media (and society in general) demands celebrities become sacrificial lambs of a sort, for entertainment. And if you say anything against this sort of shark like mentality, you're an old fashioned fool, you're stupid, you're a moral puritan. Or so I've been called when I say that mocking and wishing death on Rebecca Black is wrong.

    I grew up with the mindset that the world was a place of generally decent people. Yes, there were bad people, of course, evil people--but I grew up feeling that they weren't rewarded. That good people won in the end. Our pop culture uplifts the worst of morality, uplifts self proclaimed "gangstas", uplifts being a scumbag, a drug dealer or drug user and the like---And this radiates down to common culture in general. In my generation, talking like you're from the hood is cool; I come off odd because I talk proper. It's cool to take drugs, among people my age and where I come from. That was never my scene. I was never street wise, or taught to be, and it seems you need to be. I guess my perception of a lot of things was very idealized.

    I guess in many ways I just find how fast our country, and the world, is changing to be almost frightening. Our country, and the world, is changing faster than ever, and sometimes it feels like the world is becoming someplace alien to me.
    Last edited by CaughtintheMiddle1990; 03-26-2011 at 08:37 AM.
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  2. #2  
    Our widdle friend. Wei Wu Wei's Avatar
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    Change happens both in small increments and as sudden major shifts, but really they are the same motion of change.

    Small incrimental changes lead to large more radical changes, like when you heat water.

    Slowly but surely the water changes, but it remains liquid and only changes by 1 degree at a time, relatively slowly. However, 1 degree at a time it gets warmer until at a point where it erupts into boiling and undergoes a rapid change that appears tochange the very thing itself (a liquid into a gas).

    I would suggest that the perception of change here depends on your perspective, so it's easy to say you're okay with 1 type of change but not the other, until you see that they are in fact the same process.


    I grew up with the mindset that the world was a place of generally decent people. Yes, there were bad people, of course, evil people--but I grew up feeling that they weren't rewarded. That good people won in the end. Our pop culture uplifts the worst of morality, uplifts self proclaimed "gangstas", uplifts being a scumbag, a drug dealer or drug user and the like---And this radiates down to common culture in general. In my generation, talking like you're from the hood is cool; I come off odd because I talk proper. It's cool to take drugs, among people my age and where I come from. That was never my scene. I was never street wise, or taught to be, and it seems you need to be. I guess my perception of a lot of things was very idealized.
    Many children grow up beliving silly fantasies only to reach adulthood and realize it's all BS. Bad guys do win, they always have. Good and evil are not as simple as any cartoon makes it seem.


    You're transitioning from a comfortable coushined middle class baby life into a more adult life, and you're going to notice things as a result, things outside which match or reflect the struggles you are facing internally.

    As for people being obsessed with superficiality or talking "gangsta", just go to college man, you will find groups of people there who speak properly, who think like you do in terms our societal morals, and most importantly you can gain new perspectives from which to view the changing world so that it makes a lot more sense.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Smith - Wealth of Nations
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
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  3. #3  
    Our widdle friend. Wei Wu Wei's Avatar
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    Let me say a few things about my own personal opinions too.

    I was raised in a very religious household, and I consider matters of faith and spirituality to be very important to me today. I've looked into various religions and spent a lot of time doing honest questioning and searching and am still open today. I don't think religious practice or belief is something to be belittled or disrespected, I think often times it's a great thing.

    As for pop-culture, it's garbage. I cannot watch it. I don't watch all these garbage reality shows or american idols or most anything really. Other than movies or a few choice comedy shows that my gf and I watch together, we cannot stand that crap. I feel really sorry when I see someone who clearly puts pop culture as an important aspect of their stupid shallow identity. I think it reinforces a sort of morally bankrupt party mentality where everything is ME ME ME and MORE MORE MORE, with a total lack of reflection. I don't know about nor car about what Charlie Sheen said or any of that.

    I think talking "gangsta" is stupid, I think anyone who tries to show off how uneducated they are is not worth my time talking to. I don't bother trying to talk to people who start off sentences with "fucking shit bitch asshole". I am in a relationship but even if I'm single I have no interest in running around trying to get laid all day,.


    I know what you mean though, being that age is tough when you aren't totally running with the crowd. You're not alone though, there are MANY other young people who agree with me and agree with you.
    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Smith - Wealth of Nations
    It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion.
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  4. #4  
    Resident Grandpa marv's Avatar
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    You can imagine what I've seen in the past 72 years. The changes are too many to list, but putting it together over time, I've come out as a socially liberal, political and economic conservative, pro-life, atheist, sometimes optimistic and sometimes pessimistic individual.

    My last experience of real optimism, allbeit brief, was during the sixties culminating in our putting man on the moon - the growing drug culture aberration notwithstanding. But the apex of the "good times" was the fifties, and the nadir, unfortunately, came with the nineties - and remains today.

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  5. #5  
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    Quote Originally Posted by marv View Post
    You can imagine what I've seen in the past 72 years. The changes are too many to list, but putting it together over time, I've come out as a socially liberal, political and economic conservative, pro-life, atheist, sometimes optimistic and sometimes pessimistic individual.

    My last experience of real optimism, allbeit brief, was during the sixties culminating in our putting man on the moon - the growing drug culture aberration notwithstanding. But the apex of the "good times" was the fifties, and the nadir, unfortunately, came with the nineties - and remains today.
    God bless you for your 72 years, and may He grant you many more to come!
    A position I will always hold in my life is one of deep respect and admiration for the older members of our society. I may disagree with them on whatever petty issues--But I always respect the wisdom and experience of my elders, and I find their perspectives on life and the issues a lot more interesting than those of my contemporaries, the young in general or the middle aged. There is a certain mental or emotional balance to the aged that all other age groups lack.
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  6. #6  
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    Sometimes things don't need to change...

    Ingenuity has given way to complacency

    Self reliance has given way to dependence

    The drive to better ourselves has given way to wanting everything spoon fed to us

    Toughness has given way to wussification

    Yes things have changed in this country but most of it has been for the worse.
    The Obama Administration: Deny. Deflect. Blame.
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  7. #7  
    Senior Member MrsSmith's Avatar
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    I'd like to point out that no one was afraid of Obama's "change." Anyone that paid any attention knew that he was a talker, not a doer. Our main concern wasn't "change," it was destruction...and that is the only thing Obama has actually done, destroy. He's damaged the economy, kissed up to hostile foreign leaders, insulted allied foreign leaders, and acted like a child among adults. The only time he hasn't completely messed up was when he copied Bush's plans in Iraq and Afghanistan.

    The rest of the so-vaunted change is merely a switch from decent, hard-working citizens to indecent, lazy, government-supported citizens. We have evolved to a country where the loudest voice is that of those with no moral standards, willing to deny others every right in order to force through an agenda of self-serving laws so they can "feel better" about themselves. Actual "progress" is almost nil.
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    In actual dollars, President Obama’s $4.4 trillion in deficit spending in just three years is 37 percent higher than the previous record of $3.2 trillion (held by President George W. Bush) in deficit spending for an entire presidency. It’s no small feat to demolish an 8-year record in just 3 years.

    Under Obama’s own projections, interest payments on the debt are on course to triple from 2010 (his first budgetary year) to 2018, climbing from $196 billion to $685 billion annually.
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  8. #8  
    Super Moderator BadCat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wei Wu Wei View Post
    Let me say a few things about my own personal opinions too.

    I was raised in a very religious household, and I consider matters of faith and spirituality to be very important to me today. I've looked into various religions and spent a lot of time doing honest questioning and searching and am still open today. I don't think religious practice or belief is something to be belittled or disrespected, I think often times it's a great thing.

    As for pop-culture, it's garbage. I cannot watch it. I don't watch all these garbage reality shows or american idols or most anything really. Other than movies or a few choice comedy shows that my gf and I watch together, we cannot stand that crap. I feel really sorry when I see someone who clearly puts pop culture as an important aspect of their stupid shallow identity. I think it reinforces a sort of morally bankrupt party mentality where everything is ME ME ME and MORE MORE MORE, with a total lack of reflection. I don't know about nor car about what Charlie Sheen said or any of that.

    I think talking "gangsta" is stupid, I think anyone who tries to show off how uneducated they are is not worth my time talking to. I don't bother trying to talk to people who start off sentences with "fucking shit bitch asshole". I am in a relationship but even if I'm single I have no interest in running around trying to get laid all day,.


    I know what you mean though, being that age is tough when you aren't totally running with the crowd. You're not alone though, there are MANY other young people who agree with me and agree with you.
    I agree with you on all that shit.
    How did you end up so fucked up in the head?

    rm -rf obama*
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  9. #9  
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    Quote Originally Posted by BadCat View Post
    I agree with you on all that shit.
    How did you end up so fucked up in the head?
    Unnecessary Roughness!
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