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  1. #11  
    CU Royalty JB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    Oh poor babies. <snip>
    You probably had a console TV without remote in your living room once. Then you had a remote controlled TV after that. Then maybe a TV/VCR combo. And right now you might have a 50" flatscreen hanging on your wall.

    Should you get a 3D TV for free because you bought TVs in the past?

    No one made you buy MP3s to replace your collection. I bet your 8 tracks, vinyl and cassettes work just fine. Probably no need to replace what you already own. You just want the latest tech. Doesn't mean you can just steal it.

    And for the record...this has nothing to do with concert tickets. Completely different conversation.
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  2. #12  
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    That's what music thieves tell themselves to justify their theft of music. Have any links to back that claim?
    Downloading pirated movies, music, software etc, is not stealing - its copyright infringement
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  3. #13  
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    You probably had a console TV without remote in your living room once. Then you had a remote controlled TV after that. Then maybe a TV/VCR combo. And right now you might have a 50" flatscreen hanging on your wall.

    Should you get a 3D TV for free because you bought TVs in the past?

    No one made you buy MP3s to replace your collection. I bet your 8 tracks, vinyl and cassettes work just fine. Probably no need to replace what you already own. You just want the latest tech. Doesn't mean you can just steal it.

    And for the record...this has nothing to do with concert tickets. Completely different conversation.
    Not analogous, at all.

    What is one really buying when you buy some music? Are you buying the physical medium its distributed on, or are you buying the content?

    Well, you buy both, actually. But the content is the important part... and content comes with fair use rights, which allow you to back up or copy the content onto other mediums, and things of that nature. So, I'm not sure if it holds water or not, but "fair use" could at least be somewhat plausibly leveraged to justify downloading copies of content that you have already own. By downloading content, you don't actually deprive anyone of anything, like you would if you stole a physical object.
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  4. #14  
    Senior Member enslaved1's Avatar
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    Vaguely related to the thread falling apart into an argument about artists losing money over downloads. Use free music to grow your fanbase

    There are people at fault on both sides. The record business had a case of tunnel vision, many of the artists making the most noise are the ones who are making plenty of money without the record sales (I take the indie label griping about a reviewer/journalist posting his advance copies of releases to be downloaded a lot more seriously than James Hetfield griping from behind his endorsed guitars press release here scroll down a ways to read the article) The fans who think the bands somehow owe them and don't buy the albums or the concert tickets or the tshirts or anything else.
    I can't claim to be a saint in the musical download realm, but I do try and support groups that I sneak stuff from (usually by recording streams of songs or the occasional finding out of print albums in torrent form. Splitting hairs, so shoot me) by including them in my various libraries like lastfm, figuring that if industry folks are smart, fans on such legal streaming sites are worth as much, if not more than a single album sale. With more and more 3 and 4G mobile coverage, streaming music is more and more accessible all the time, not just at home sitting at the computer, and is likely the future of music broadcasting.
    The best answer, IMHO, is to avoid all the baloney sause and stick with the artist who happily give their stuff away, and support them by telling your friends, going to the shows, and buying the tshirts and stickers. Show the RIAA and the pretentious ones that it's possible to make a living making music without suing everyone in sight or sounding like a holier than thou butt monkey.
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  5. #15  
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilbur View Post
    Not analogous, at all.

    What is one really buying when you buy some music? Are you buying the physical medium its distributed on, or are you buying the content?

    Well, you buy both, actually. But the content is the important part... and content comes with fair use rights, which allow you to back up or copy the content onto other mediums, and things of that nature. So, I'm not sure if it holds water or not, but "fair use" could at least be somewhat plausibly leveraged to justify downloading copies of content that you have already own. By downloading content, you don't actually deprive anyone of anything, like you would if you stole a physical object.
    You're denying the artist royalties.

    Fair use does permit copying for personal use, but it's hard to prove that you own a vinyl album to a website that allows MP3 downloads. The issue is that the copyright holders have a right to expect payment for their products. By not working with the new technologies, the RIAA and MPAA have created a black market and exacerbated the problem. If they had embraced downloading MP3s and made it as convenient and cheap as possible, they'd have raked in $billions, just as they did when the eventually stopped fighting the home video market.

    If nothing else, they ought to make old, sold-out material available, as the cost of putting old vinyl into digital formats is negligible compared to the potential payback. If the record label can't be bothered to keep their inventory available, then they have no one to blame but themselves if people look for alternatives.
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  6. #16  
    Best Bounty Hunter in the Forums fettpett's Avatar
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    A couple years ago Barenaked Ladies (I think) released an album that was on a flash drive. another band told their fan's that they didn't care if they downloaded their music and released the album with a blank CD and bonus stuff on jacket
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  7. #17  
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilbur View Post
    Downloading pirated movies, music, software etc, is not stealing - its copyright infringement
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  8. #18  
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    You probably had a console TV without remote in your living room once. Then you had a remote controlled TV after that. Then maybe a TV/VCR combo. And right now you might have a 50" flatscreen hanging on your wall.

    Should you get a 3D TV for free because you bought TVs in the past?

    No one made you buy MP3s to replace your collection. I bet your 8 tracks, vinyl and cassettes work just fine. Probably no need to replace what you already own. You just want the latest tech. Doesn't mean you can just steal it.

    And for the record...this has nothing to do with concert tickets. Completely different conversation.
    According to the RIAA , I am not buying the recording, because if I were then I could use it as I choose. According to the RIAA all I am buying is essentially permission to liten to the song when I choose as long as I am not making money off it. In that case, I should only have to pay once.
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  9. #19  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    According to the RIAA , I am not buying the recording, because if I were then I could use it as I choose. According to the RIAA all I am buying is essentially permission to liten to the song when I choose as long as I am not making money off it. In that case, I should only have to pay once.
    it's the same idea that the software and gaming companies have been using with DRM and Licensing.
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  10. #20  
    CU Royalty JB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wilbur View Post
    "fair use" could at least be somewhat plausibly leveraged to justify downloading copies of content that you have already own.
    I'll give you that.

    But downloading something you don't own, but should have paid for, is stealing. No matter how it's justified. And saying people are downloading singles and then buying the album is ridiculous.
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