Rate President Obama.

[Odysseus]

The absolute, unadulterated, acid test for the worst. All other future screw-ups, dilletantes and incompetents will by judged on the Obama scale, just as they used to be judged against Jimmy Carter.

I'll give him a 2, just for giving the order to take out the pirates that had American hostages.

Obama actually hit the roof when the SEALs took out the pirates. He took credit for it after the fact.

3-not the worst, but he could be better.

Who in the name of national security was worse?

[noonwitch]

The absolute, unadulterated, acid test for the worst. All other future screw-ups, dilletantes and incompetents will by judged on the Obama scale, just as they used to be judged against Jimmy Carter.

Obama actually hit the roof when the SEALs took out the pirates. He took credit for it after the fact.

Who in the name of national security was worse?

Hoover, Taft, Carter, Wilson to name a few.

[Arroyo_Doble]

Who in the name of national security was worse?

Several prior to the 20th Century (Buchanan will always be the worst ... until we have another civil war, anyway) but recently, I would say both George W. Bush and Jimmy Carter were worse. George W. Bush is the modern Mendoza Line for presidents. Obama isn't even close to that.

[Apache]

Several prior to the 20th Century (Buchanan will always be the worst ... until we have another civil war, anyway) but recently, I would say both George W. Bush and Jimmy Carter were worse. George W. Bush is the modern Mendoza Line for presidents. Obama isn't even close to that.

You got that right! He'd hafta do one bang up job the rest of his term, to even reach that high...

[RobJohnson]

He created a victory for the right in 2010....I think he is a god. :p

[Apache]

He created a victory for the right in 2010....I think he is a god. :p

Put down the bottle, and back away slowly.....:eek:

[Odysseus]

Hoover, Taft, Carter, Wilson to name a few.

Several prior to the 20th Century (Buchanan will always be the worst ... until we have another civil war, anyway) but recently, I would say both George W. Bush and Jimmy Carter were worse. George W. Bush is the modern Mendoza Line for presidents. Obama isn't even close to that.

Sorry, but no. First, W. isn't even remotely as screwed up as the Community Organizer in Chief. In terms of every possible area, Bush comes off as better than Obama. Spending into a hole? Bush was bad, but Obama has set a new standard for profligacy. Executive overreach in foreign policy? Bush went to congress before invading Iraq and Afghanistan. Obama didn't, and say what you wil, but everybody and their brother thought that Saddam had WMDs (and there is significant evidence today that he did, but that's another argument), but there is no US interest served by siding with al Qaeda against Qaddafi. As for the others...

Hoover: Inept, certainly, but engaged. No one ever called him lazy. Obama? Can't even be bothered to read his own signature piece of legislation.

Carter: The former gold standard of incompetence, Mr. Malaise sucked up to our enemies and attacked our friends, but when it came down to it, Carter didn't spend the hostage crisis on the golf course. He was clueless, but dedicated.

Taft: Not even close. Although he annoyed TR enough to launch the Bull Moose Party (and hand the presidency to Woodrow Wilson, who also deserves to be on the list), Taft gets an unfair rap from historians. He was actually more effective at busting trusts than Roosevelt, for one thing. Regardless of what you thought of his policies, he wasn't incompetent. Sorry, but not even close.

Wilson: A fascist who tried to impose socialism, codified bigotry into the Federal Register, and a pie-eyed fool in foreign policy, but a man of genuine accomplishment prior to his election and a hard-working executive. Certainly in the bottom three, with Carter and the Big O.

And now, the Obama indictment:

Politicized the Justice Department: Did Wilson use the DOJ to pursue an agenda? Absolutely. But even Wilson stopped short of attacking states for enforcing the law, and if he was overly zealous in prosecuting people who spoke out against him, he at least prosecuted people who broke the law, as well. Obama's DOJ dropped open and shut cases against the New Black Panthers for voter intimidation and refused to defend laws passed by congress.

Incompetence: Didn't like how W. handled Katrina? Then the Gulf Oil Spill must've been a real burn for you. Not only did Obama not act, but he refused to allow other nations with available equipment and skills to assist. His administration falsified parts of the report from the experts to create the impression that they favored his drilling moratorium, and is currently in contempt of court for refusing to lift it.

Corruption: Thought Clinton was corrupt? How about Harding? Did either of them take over two of the largest corporations in the US and violate the bankruptcy laws to hand equity to union cronies? How about annexing 1/7 of the economy and then issuing waivers to his political allies, who fought for his takeover in the first place? Still not enough? Nixon was excoriated for stonewalling congress, but Obama has raised it to an art.

Fecklessness: Carter thought that Arafat was a swell guy, but at least he didn't bow to him. We've had other presidents who've been hostile to one or two allies, but never in the history of the United States have we had one who seems to take delight in casually insulting and alienating our allies and sucking up to our enemies. Obama's snubs to our allies in Britain, Egypt, Israel, South Korea and Honduras would be bad enough, but his refusal to criticize the mullahs when they slaughtered the Irania opposition may be the single most disgraceful thing that he has done in foreign policy, with the possible exception of his apology tour.

His detachment from his duties is legendary. Obama has spent more time golfing than he has spent on national security. He met his Afghanistan commander once, and couldn't be bothered to actually read up on the war before the meeting, waited months to decide whether or not to approve a plan that he eventually (and arbitrarily) gutted, but when Rolling Stone did a hatchet job on GEN McChristol, Obama had him on the carpet within a day. He's thin-skinned, petty and utterly lacking in leadership skills. He's filled his cabinet with corrupt, incompetent ideologues whose only merit in his eyes is that they seem to loathe America as much as he does.

He's not just an empty suit, he's an empty suit who can't be bothered to put on a tie when he's discussing the murders of 13 of his Soldiers, who thinks that a shout out before dealing with a terrorist act is appropriate, who loves our enemies and attacks our allies, who can't be bothered to do his job, but who will make damned sure that the Governor of Arizona can't do hers, who sticks his nose into a minor disturbance without knowing any of the facts and ends up insulting every police agency in the country, who has added more debt in two years than all of his predecessors combined, and who lacks even the most basic understanding of just how badly he's bungled his job.

[Apache]

Sorry, but no. First, W. isn't even remotely as screwed up as the Community Organizer in Chief. In terms of every possible area, Bush comes off as better than Obama. Spending into a hole? Bush was bad, but Obama has set a new standard for profligacy. Executive overreach in foreign policy? Bush went to congress before invading Iraq and Afghanistan. Obama didn't, and say what you wil, but everybody and their brother thought that Saddam had WMDs (and there is significant evidence today that he did, but that's another argument), but there is no US interest served by siding with al Qaeda against Qaddafi. As for the others...

Hoover: Inept, certainly, but engaged. No one ever called him lazy. Obama? Can't even be bothered to read his own signature piece of legislation.

Carter: The former gold standard of incompetence, Mr. Malaise sucked up to our enemies and attacked our friends, but when it came down to it, Carter didn't spend the hostage crisis on the golf course. He was clueless, but dedicated.

Taft: Not even close. Although he annoyed TR enough to launch the Bull Moose Party (and hand the presidency to Woodrow Wilson, who also deserves to be on the list), Taft gets an unfair rap from historians. He was actually more effective at busting trusts than Roosevelt, for one thing. Regardless of what you thought of his policies, he wasn't incompetent. Sorry, but not even close.

Wilson: A fascist who tried to impose socialism, codified bigotry into the Federal Register, and a pie-eyed fool in foreign policy, but a man of genuine accomplishment prior to his election and a hard-working executive. Certainly in the bottom three, with Carter and the Big O.

And now, the Obama indictment:

Politicized the Justice Department: Did Wilson use the DOJ to pursue an agenda? Absolutely. But even Wilson stopped short of attacking states for enforcing the law, and if he was overly zealous in prosecuting people who spoke out against him, he at least prosecuted people who broke the law, as well. Obama's DOJ dropped open and shut cases against the New Black Panthers for voter intimidation and refused to defend laws passed by congress.

Incompetence: Didn't like how W. handled Katrina? Then the Gulf Oil Spill must've been a real burn for you. Not only did Obama not act, but he refused to allow other nations with available equipment and skills to assist. His administration falsified parts of the report from the experts to create the impression that they favored his drilling moratorium, and is currently in contempt of court for refusing to lift it.

Corruption: Thought Clinton was corrupt? How about Harding? Did either of them take over two of the largest corporations in the US and violate the bankruptcy laws to hand equity to union cronies? How about annexing 1/7 of the economy and then issuing waivers to his political allies, who fought for his takeover in the first place? Still not enough? Nixon was excoriated for stonewalling congress, but Obama has raised it to an art.

Fecklessness: Carter thought that Arafat was a swell guy, but at least he didn't bow to him. We've had other presidents who've been hostile to one or two allies, but never in the history of the United States have we had one who seems to take delight in casually insulting and alienating our allies and sucking up to our enemies. Obama's snubs to our allies in Britain, Egypt, Israel, South Korea and Honduras would be bad enough, but his refusal to criticize the mullahs when they slaughtered the Irania opposition may be the single most disgraceful thing that he has done in foreign policy, with the possible exception of his apology tour.

His detachment from his duties is legendary. Obama has spent more time golfing than he has spent on national security. He met his Afghanistan commander once, and couldn't be bothered to actually read up on the war before the meeting, waited months to decide whether or not to approve a plan that he eventually (and arbitrarily) gutted, but when Rolling Stone did a hatchet job on GEN McChristol, Obama had him on the carpet within a day. He's thin-skinned, petty and utterly lacking in leadership skills. He's filled his cabinet with corrupt, incompetent ideologues whose only merit in his eyes is that they seem to loathe America as much as he does.

He's not just an empty suit, he's an empty suit who can't be bothered to put on a tie when he's discussing the murders of 13 of his Soldiers, who thinks that a shout out before dealing with a terrorist act is appropriate, who loves our enemies and attacks our allies, who can't be bothered to do his job, but who will make damned sure that the Governor of Arizona can't do hers, who sticks his nose into a minor disturbance without knowing any of the facts and ends up insulting every police agency in the country, who has added more debt in two years than all of his predecessors combined, and who lacks even the most basic understanding of just how badly he's bungled his job.

Damn. Ouch. Mark.

[RobJohnson]

Originally Posted by Odysseus
<snip>

[Arroyo_Doble]

Sorry, but no. First, W. isn't even remotely as screwed up as the Community Organizer in Chief.

Good to see you take the conversation seriously.

Regardless:

In terms of every possible area, Bush comes off as better than Obama. Spending into a hole? Bush was bad, but Obama has set a new standard for profligacy.

Without the Reconciliation Acts of the early Aughts and the Trillion Dollar (probably more) Blunder, we aren’t having this conversation. The fiscal mess started prior to January of 2009.

Executive overreach in foreign policy? Bush went to congress before invading Iraq and Afghanistan. Obama didn't,

Let me know when we mobilize to invade and occupy another nation. As far as air strikes, I doubt every president who has engaged in such action has first gotten a vote in Congress (I know for a fact St Reagan didn’t). Also, the vote on the first Gulf War occurred January 12, 1991. How many assets did Bush the Greater move before that date?

that and say what you wil, but everybody and their brother thought that Saddam had WMDs (and there is significant evidence today that he did, but that's another argument), but there is no US interest served by siding with al Qaeda against Qaddafi. As for the others...

The invasion and occupation of Iraq was the greatest strategic blunder in the history of the United States since Ft Sumter was fired upon. Waffle fries about WMD is embarrassing. I am surprised you went to it.

Hoover: Inept, certainly, but engaged. No one ever called him lazy. Obama? Can't even be bothered to read his own signature piece of legislation.

The Legislative Branch of the United States writes law. The Executive can suggest, help, cajole, whatever but when it comes down to it, the only “signature” that matters on legislation is whether or not his will be on it after it is passed. And even then, with enough congressman, not even that.

Carter: The former gold standard of incompetence, Mr. Malaise sucked up to our enemies and attacked our friends, but when it came down to it, Carter didn't spend the hostage crisis on the golf course. He was clueless, but dedicated.

What is it with you guys not wanting Obama on the golf course? It is getting weird.

Politicized the Justice Department: Did Wilson use the DOJ to pursue an agenda? Absolutely. But even Wilson stopped short of attacking states for enforcing the law, and if he was overly zealous in prosecuting people who spoke out against him, he at least prosecuted people who broke the law, as well. Obama's DOJ dropped open and shut cases against the New Black Panthers for voter intimidation and refused to defend laws passed by congress.

You cannot be serious invoking that Fox “News” bullshit scary black guy crap? A couple of douchebags play acting thug is what you have? Really? If white people are being intimidated at the polls so bad by all these scary black guys, with the sanction of the scary black guy Attorney General and scary black guys at the DOJ, why do you only have some gonzo “journalist” tape from years ago (with white people walking around decidedly un-intimidated)? I would think there would be scores of video.

Incompetence: Didn't like how W. handled Katrina? Then the Gulf Oil Spill must've been a real burn for you. Not only did Obama not act, but he refused to allow other nations with available equipment and skills to assist. His administration falsified parts of the report from the experts to create the impression that they favored his drilling moratorium, and is currently in contempt of court for refusing to lift it.

Katrina embarrassed us. Watching what has happened in Japan makes it even worse.

Not sure what equivalency you are trying to make with that and the Gulf Oil Spill unless you are talking about government agency incompetence.

Corruption: Thought Clinton was corrupt?

No, not really.

How about Harding? Did either of them take over two of the largest corporations in the US and violate the bankruptcy laws to hand equity to union cronies?

Too funny. The fact that Obama (and Bush) saved GM, and probably the entire parts chain and therefore American automobile manufacturing, at near zero cost galls you guys. You would rather have American workers by the millions unemployed than for Obama to succeed so all you can do from the peanut gallery is whine about unions. Unbelievable.

How about annexing 1/7 of the economy and then issuing waivers to his political allies, who fought for his takeover in the first place?

Find a way to do it better and get a waiver. You don’t have to be an “ally” of Obama.

Also, The Affordable Care Act is a law, not an Executive Order.

Still not enough?

No enough? It’s not anything but typical affirmation radio garbage used to stroke the like minded. Trying to find a valid criticism in that is like trying to find a wholesome meal for the family in a kettle of cotton candy.

Nixon was excoriated for stonewalling congress, but Obama has raised it to an art.

That’s vague enough to skip.

Fecklessness: Carter thought that Arafat was a swell guy, but at least he didn't bow to him.

Obama bowed to Arafat?

We've had other presidents who've been hostile to one or two allies, but never in the history of the United States have we had one who seems to take delight in casually insulting and alienating our allies and sucking up to our enemies. Obama's snubs to our allies in Britain, Egypt, Israel, South Korea and Honduras would be bad enough, but his refusal to criticize the mullahs when they slaughtered the Irania opposition may be the single most disgraceful thing that he has done in foreign policy, with the possible exception of his apology tour.

Good lord, I’ll just read Weekly Standard if I want to see so much nonsensical pearl clutching. Christ, George Herbert Walker Bush was the last president to actually stand up to Israel. Obama hasn’t even come close to having the balls to do so yet.

His detachment from his duties is legendary. Obama has spent more time golfing than he has spent on national security.

Waka waka waka … A parakeet, a goat and a Vulcan walk into a bar ….

He met his Afghanistan commander once, and couldn't be bothered to actually read up on the war before the meeting, waited months to decide whether or not to approve a plan that he eventually (and arbitrarily) gutted, but when Rolling Stone did a hatchet job on GEN McChristol, Obama had him on the carpet within a day. He's thin-skinned, petty and utterly lacking in leadership skills. He's filled his cabinet with corrupt, incompetent ideologues whose only merit in his eyes is that they seem to loathe America as much as he does.

Really? You think it is a good idea to have openly disrespectful military leadership in the chain of command? In a combat zone? At first, I though it showed weakness on Obama’s part in firing the general but now, I am not so sure. I like the American style civilian control of the military and if a soldier doesn’t, and cannot respect the chain of command, he should resign. MacArthur found that out the hard way.

He's not just an empty suit, he's an empty suit who can't be bothered to put on a tie when he's discussing the murders of 13 of his Soldiers, who thinks that a shout out before dealing with a terrorist act is appropriate, who loves our enemies and attacks our allies, who can't be bothered to do his job, but who will make damned sure that the Governor of Arizona can't do hers, who sticks his nose into a minor disturbance without knowing any of the facts and ends up insulting every police agency in the country, who has added more debt in two years than all of his predecessors combined, and who lacks even the most basic understanding of just how badly he's bungled his job.

This isn’t an argument; this is just bile.