Rate President Obama.

[txradioguy]

3.

He's moving to reform things that need to be reformed but when it actually comes down the actual reform itself its just the same garbage ideas aimed at keeping the rich richer and middle class as the rich's pinata. I guess it might be the thought that counts but I'm so used to this crap that I'm fairly convinced he's just the digestable face put on undigestable legislation.

What keeps from being a 2 is he does carry the country as a whole pretty well. Buys us some international cred and peopel elsewhere generally dont mind the guy. If people follow his model of cultural consideration and open-mindedness about the rest of the world it'll probably soften the inevitable collapse of the American Empire.

Wow you really broke out your knee pads for this one didn't you troll?

[Sonnabend]

International cred???? That imbecile insulted every ally the US has, has proven grossly incompetent when BRIEFED on terror threats on this side of the pond, ignored one of his biggest allies after a major terrorist strike, is and was a pathetic bungler who didn't even have the brains to make sure the cheapass DVD set he gave away even WORKED... the man is so far out of his depth it's almost humiliating to watch him.

[AmPat]

To answer the Major's question about National Security and who was worse...I'd have to say Clinton for two reasons.

1. To my knowledge Obama has never ducked calls from the situation room when his approval was needed on an air strike on a known terrorist.


Did I mention the calls that Clinton avoided were in relation to an airstrike that could have taken out bin Laden?

2. President Obama has never...to anyone's knowledge...lost the launch codes for our nuclear arsenal. Codes that by the way...were never found.


Those two incidents right there put Billy Jeff at the top of the worst in handling National Security by a President list bar none.

You forgot: selling missile technology to the Chinese and Hillary's perusing FBI files of political enemies. Both criminal and/or anti-American traitorous acts.
:mad:
Had a Conservative president done this, the press would have been in high wail mode. Since it was BJ Klintoon and his Kankle mate, no big deal.:mad: Somehow, Nixon is a criminal for his involvement in the breakin, the Clintons? Much loved by the liberal minions.

[NJCardFan]

Without the Reconciliation Acts of the early Aughts and the Trillion Dollar (probably more) Blunder, we aren’t having this conversation. The fiscal mess started prior to January of 2009.

Yep, you're right. However, things didn't begin to go into the crapper until the Democrats retook congress. Funny how you left that out. And tell these people that Saddam didn't have WMD's:

[Odysseus]

Good to see you take the conversation seriously.

I do take it seriously. He has the power to make my wife a widow.

Regardless:
Without the Reconciliation Acts of the early Aughts and the Trillion Dollar (probably more) Blunder, we aren’t having this conversation. The fiscal mess started prior to January of 2009.

You must learn to link cause and effect. Exactly how can you blame Bush for the insolvency of Fannie and Freddy? For the "stimulus" bill (the single most expensive piece of legislation in US history, and the least effective)

Let me know when we mobilize to invade and occupy another nation. As far as air strikes, I doubt every president who has engaged in such action has first gotten a vote in Congress (I know for a fact St Reagan didn’t). Also, the vote on the first Gulf War occurred January 12, 1991. How many assets did Bush the Greater move before that date?

Doesn't matter how many he moved, what matters is that he went to congress before crossing a hostile border. And Reagan was retaliating for an act of war on Qaddafi's part. Remember the 5 April 1986, "La Belle" nightclub bombing in West Berlin that killed three people (including two American military personnel) and injured 229 more? That was an act of war against the US, and the single raid in response did not reflect anywhere near the commitment that we have now incurred in taking sides in a civil war between Qaddafi and al Qaeda.

The invasion and occupation of Iraq was the greatest strategic blunder in the history of the United States since Ft Sumter was fired upon. Waffle fries about WMD is embarrassing. I am surprised you went to it.

No, the greatest strategic blunder in US history was allowing Khomeini to return to Iran, then not allowing the Shah to fight his revolt. And if you want to claim that Saddam didn't have WMDs, well, good luck with that, but in fact, he had nine working nuclear research facilities at the time of the invasion, and according to UNSCOM Saddam had failed to account for 600 metric tons of chemical agents, including mustard gas, VX and sarin, and nearly 25,000 rockets and 15,000 artillery shells, with chemical agents. We now know, thanks to the Israelis, that Saddam's WMD program was trucked to Syria during the two years that we played with the UN. But, hey, it's the only talking point that you have, so go with it.

The Legislative Branch of the United States writes law. The Executive can suggest, help, cajole, whatever but when it comes down to it, the only “signature” that matters on legislation is whether or not his will be on it after it is passed. And even then, with enough congressman, not even that.

The Executive Branch drafts budgets (or used to, before Obama abrogated that responsibility), and often provides draft legislation to the congress. That's why Clinton had his task force (led by Hillary) preparing the draft of what became known as Hillarycare. As a general rule, if you propose a piece of legislation, you also provide the draft. Obama couldn't be bothered.

What is it with you guys not wanting Obama on the golf course? It is getting weird.

It's not just golf. It's also multiple vacations (including vacations disguised as state visits), pickup basketball games, gala parties, trips to Broadway shows (on the taxpayers' dime), putting his NCAA brackets together instead of addressing a massive disaster that struck our closest Pacific ally and a host of other events that have nothing to do with doing his job, which reflects the fact that Obama wants nothing to do with doing his job. Does this guy do any work? Ever?

You cannot be serious invoking that Fox “News” bullshit scary black guy crap? A couple of douchebags play acting thug is what you have? Really? If white people are being intimidated at the polls so bad by all these scary black guys, with the sanction of the scary black guy Attorney General and scary black guys at the DOJ, why do you only have some gonzo “journalist” tape from years ago (with white people walking around decidedly un-intimidated)? I would think there would be scores of video.

You cannot be minimizing voter intimidation and threats along racial lines, and you certainly can't be dismissing the sworn testimony of DOJ lawyers that they were ordered to ignore cases brought against black plaintiffs? I guess some animals are more equal than others.

Katrina embarrassed us. Watching what has happened in Japan makes it even worse.

Katrina embarrassed us, all right, but most of the embarrassment was at the state and local level. Of course, the reporting on Katrina would have embarrassed our media if they were capable of feeling embarrassment, but that's beside the point. Understand that within the National Response Plan, disaster response and planning starts at the local government level. Mayor Nagin failed to execute the New Orleans disaster plan. For example, the plan called for the use of the city's school buses in evacuating residents, but the city never deployed the buses, but left them parked in an open lot, where they were destroyed by the flood. Another example? After the last scheduled AMTRAK train left New Orleans, Amtrak ran a special train with room for several hundred passengers, and they offered these seats to the city. The city declined so the train left New Orleans with no passengers. As for the state, do you really want to talk about Gov Blanco's performance? Louisiana National Guard troops were responsible for establishing order in advance of humanitarian relief efforts, but didn't. Federal troops couldn't do this because of the Posse Comitatus Act, which bars the federal military from enforcing state and local laws. Bush sent Blanco a request to take over command of law enforcement under the Insurrection Act, which is one of the few exceptions to the law, but she refused. She did request additional Guard troops (filed with National Guard Bureau a full two days after the hurricane hit and when much of the city was already under water). Had she done what Governor Barbour had done in Mississippi, which was activate the compact with the other states that would have allowed her to bypass NGB, she'd have had a full division at her command. Mayor Nagin accused Blanco of delaying federal aid, saying, "I was ready to move today. The governor said she needed 24 hours to make a decision. It would have been great if we could have [...] told the world that we had this all worked out. It didn't happen, and more people died." The Congressional Research Service investigation concluded, that Blanco never requested assistance with evacuation.

Not sure what equivalency you are trying to make with that and the Gulf Oil Spill unless you are talking about government agency incompetence.

So, you blame Bush for the Katrina response, but don't blame Obama for the Gulf Oil Spill response? And, as I pointed out above, it wasn't Bush who was derelict during Katrina, it was the local and state governments. But in the Gulf Spill, Obama took specific actions that exacerbated the crisis. He refused to relax federal regulations that would have allowed foreign skimmer craft in to help contain the spill (they weren't manned by union crews, you see...). When Louisiana went out and rented their own skimmers, Obama's Coast Guard rep siezed them. When Governor Jindal met Obama in New Orleans two weeks after the spill (yes, it was 2 weeks before Obama bothered to show up) he attacked Jindal for a letter sent the Secretary of Agriculture requesting aid in the form of food stamps for those who had been thrown out of work because of the spill, but didn't discuss anything else with Jindal, because in Obama's world, a slight is more important than actually taking action to protect the people who he governs.

[Odysseus]

No, not really.

You must not have been paying attention. Here's a partial list. Have fun:

• Whitewater (and the Whitewater billing records stonewall)
• Hillary's Cattle Futures Lie
• Travelgate
• Filegate
• Vince Foster
• Paula Jones
• Lincoln bedroom bed and breakfast
• White House coffees
• Donations from convicted drug and weapons dealers
• Buddhist Temple fundraiser
• Web Hubbell hush money
• Lewinsky Affair
• Perjury and jobs for Lewinsky
• Kathleen Willey assault and cover up
• Web Hubbell prison phone call
• Selling NORAL Military Technology to the PLA
• Jaunita Broaddrick rape
• Vandalizing the White House before leaving
• Looting the White House before leaving
• Sale of pardons

Too funny. The fact that Obama (and Bush) saved GM, and probably the entire parts chain and therefore American automobile manufacturing, at near zero cost galls you guys. You would rather have American workers by the millions unemployed than for Obama to succeed so all you can do from the peanut gallery is whine about unions. Unbelievable.

Obama "saved" GM the way that Rome "saved" Carthage, except that instead of salting the earth, he turned it over to his union cronies. Of course, raping the bondholders who lent GM billions, and who, by law, were supposed to be the first to be repaid, is just par for the course when you see capitalists as the enemy.

Find a way to do it better and get a waiver. You don’t have to be an “ally” of Obama.

We've been doing it better for decades. It's called "the private sector." And you may not have to be an "ally" of Obama's (i.e., poltical crony), but it sure seems to help. Here's the list, on HHS' website, but to understand the degree of cronyism, you have to realize that many of the employers exempted are union shops or companies that fought tooth and nail for Obamacare (Starbucks, for example). Here's a partial list:

• The Service Employees Benefit Fund
• United Food and Commercial Workers Allied Trade Health & Welfare Trust Fund
• International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers Union No. 195
• Asbestos Workers Local 53 Welfare Fund
• Employees Security Funds
• Plumbers & Pipefitters Local 123 Welfare Fund
• United Food and Commercial Workers Local 227
• United Food and Commercial Workers Maximus Local 455
• Service Employees International Union Local 25
• United Food and Commercial Workers Local 1262
• Musicians Health Fund Local 802
• Hospitality Benefit Fund Local 17
• Transport Workers Union
• United Federation of Teachers Welfare Fund
• International Union of Painters and Allied Trades (AFL-CIO)

Also, The Affordable Care Act is a law, not an Executive Order.

Actually, it's a law that's been struck down and is awaiting Supreme Court review, but until then, it's in limbo, but the administration doesn't seem to grasp that, as they keep allocating funds to implement it.

No enough? It’s not anything but typical affirmation radio garbage used to stroke the like minded. Trying to find a valid criticism in that is like trying to find a wholesome meal for the family in a kettle of cotton candy.

Your response is the typical liberal talking point blather that passes for a response when you can't actually argue your points.

That’s vague enough to skip.

So, you're asking for more detail? Why certainly. The Obama administration has stonewalled congress and the courts on a number of issues, even landing itself in contempt. A sample:

• The administration barred federal police and US military personnel from testifying before congress in the FT Hood congressional inquiry.
• The DOJ has refused to allow the Civil Rights Division attorneys answer congressional investigators regarding the Black Panther case.
• The administration's doctoring of the Oil Spill report and subsequent reimposition of the drilling ban after it was lifted by a judge, has resulted in a contempt citation.
• The White House refused to release documents related to potential job offers made to two Democratic Senate primary challengers, Andrew Romanoff in Colorado and Joe Sestak in Pennsylvania.
• Congress is fighting the Department of Justice over documents detailing Operation Fast and Furious, described as a "botched gunrunning sting set up by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives that funneled more than 1,700 smuggled weapons from Arizona to Mexico" and that has resulted in the deaths of "dozens, if not hundreds of Mexicans."

Obama bowed to Arafat?

No. Arafat may be the one Arab leader that Obama hasn't bowed to, but then, Arafat is dead.

Good lord, I’ll just read Weekly Standard if I want to see so much nonsensical pearl clutching. Christ, George Herbert Walker Bush was the last president to actually stand up to Israel. Obama hasn’t even come close to having the balls to do so yet.

Wow. In the parlance of my rater, that's more wrong than a football bat. Obama has deliberately insulted the Israeli PM, attacked Israel over the building of housing units in its own capital city and provided aid to regimes that are virulently anti-Israeli and anti-Semitic.

Waka waka waka … A parakeet, a goat and a Vulcan walk into a bar ….

Yeah, I'm the one who's not taking this discussino seriously.

Really? You think it is a good idea to have openly disrespectful military leadership in the chain of command? In a combat zone? At first, I though it showed weakness on Obama’s part in firing the general but now, I am not so sure. I like the American style civilian control of the military and if a soldier doesn’t, and cannot respect the chain of command, he should resign. MacArthur found that out the hard way.

I'd have been a lot more sympathetic if any of the comments made had actually been made by the CG, rather than his staff (in what were supposed to be off the record sessions (so much for Rolling Stone's journalistic ethics), and if he'd bothered to meet with McChrystol or had been even remotely engaged on Afghanistan. And remember that MacArthur had deliberately undermined Truman's policies for months before he was fired, even going so far as to threaten the Chinese while Truman was trying to negotiate an end to the Korean War. Equating bar talk among staffers with a prolonged pattern of insubordination by a theater commander is BS.

This isn’t an argument; this is just bile.

No, it's a litany of Obama screw ups, failures and deliberate malfeasance. Addressing it by not addressing it is typical.

3.

He's moving to reform things that need to be reformed but when it actually comes down the actual reform itself its just the same garbage ideas aimed at keeping the rich richer and middle class as the rich's pinata. I guess it might be the thought that counts but I'm so used to this crap that I'm fairly convinced he's just the digestable face put on undigestable legislation.

What keeps from being a 2 is he does carry the country as a whole pretty well. Buys us some international cred and peopel elsewhere generally dont mind the guy. If people follow his model of cultural consideration and open-mindedness about the rest of the world it'll probably soften the inevitable collapse of the American Empire.

What color is the sky in your world?

[Wei Wu Wei]

lmao at the idea that Obama is anti-Israel

[Odysseus]

lmao at the idea that Obama is anti-Israel

LMAO at the idea that you had an idea.

But, by all means, feel free to cite a Pravda article in his defense.

Speaking of which, did you miss where I cited actual CDC numbers from the 1930s to refute your "source"? I didn't see a reply, so you must not have gone back to that thread, since any honest man who'd been so thoroughly spanked would have been honor bound to admit it.

[Wei Wu Wei]

LMAO at the idea that you had an idea.

But, by all means, feel free to cite a Pravda article in his defense.

Speaking of which, did you miss where I cited actual CDC numbers from the 1930s to refute your "source"? I didn't see a reply, so you must not have gone back to that thread, since any honest man who'd been so thoroughly spanked would have been honor bound to admit it.

NAh it's cool about the numbers in that thread like I said i don't really know the exact figures so your numbers might be right, i'm cool with that.

as for this Israel thing, come on now, just recently the United States used it's Veto in the UN to block a nearly unanimous official condemnation as illegal of the continued Israeli settlements.

Obama and some democrats may, in some contexts, try to appear somewhat objective on the issue of Israel but the reality is that the America-Israel relationship is very strong, there is a very strong Israeli lobby in the US affecting lawmakers.

When it comes to financial aid, military support, and foreign policy (particularly in the middle east), the USA is clearly, firmly, and near-totally pro-Israel.

[Sonnabend]

as for this Israel thing, come on now, just recently the United States used it's Veto in the UN to block a nearly unanimous official condemnation as illegal of the continued Israeli settlements.

Yeah, the UN has "cred"...like putting Libya on a Human Rights Panel, or Iran on the Rights of Women..God don't you ever fact check the crap you spew?

When it comes to financial aid, military support, and foreign policy (particularly in the middle east), the USA is clearly, firmly, and near-totally pro-Israel.

As it should be.