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  1. #11  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lanie View Post
    I'm fine with the compromise of exempting Catholic schools and church schools and allowing insurance to pay for things. What I'm not fine with is the bishops saying they won't compromise, like they get a say so in it. This isn't a theocracy.

    What they really want is for birth control to be illegal. There's no chance of that happening, but the fact that they feel it should be is repulsive and NO that doesn't represent the Catholic Church. Most Catholics take birth control.
    It doesn't matter what most Catholics do. The Church establishes the rules, and you choose whether you want to be a part of that. It's not a democracy. The bishops don't need to compromise. This isn't something they all of a sudden announced this year. It has been a part of their doctrine for a long time.

    I'd be intersted to hear where you heard they wanted birth control to be illegal. When is the last time you heard the Catholic Church speak publicly about birth control?
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  2. #12  
    Senior Member Chuck58's Avatar
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    It isn't about birth control being illegal for everyone. This fight is about the Catholic Church and its various institutions, charities and so on not providing it, which is their right at least as I see it.

    It isn't like there aren't other hospitals, charities etc that people can use, who will provide birth control if that's such an overwhelming issue.

    I see this as another attack on religion itself. The Catholic Church is the biggest and most powerful in America. Break it and the rest will go down like dominoes.
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  3. #13  
    Quote Originally Posted by michaelsean View Post
    It doesn't matter what most Catholics do. The Church establishes the rules, and you choose whether you want to be a part of that. It's not a democracy. The bishops don't need to compromise. This isn't something they all of a sudden announced this year. It has been a part of their doctrine for a long time.

    I'd be intersted to hear where you heard they wanted birth control to be illegal. When is the last time you heard the Catholic Church speak publicly about birth control?
    They don't have to compromise as far as doctrine goes.

    However, they need to grow up and recognize that they have no say so over government affairs.

    The idea of wanting birth control to be illegal isn't something I know for 100% certainty. However, the fact that they're not happy with the religious schools and hospitals being exempt tells me a lot. Truth is they want everybody to be "exempt." What else do you think their "We won't compromise" thing means? I think it's arrogant that they think Obama needs to compromise with them at all. The church does not run this country.
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  4. #14  
    Quote Originally Posted by Carol View Post
    So Lanie....do you really think that the insurance companies are going to give birth control for FREE?

    If you think so you're wrong. SOMEONE will pay for it. It will simply be built into the contracts that they make with the companies/organizations they insure. So the Catholic Church WILL be paying for the birth control.

    Just because Obama claims that they will not be paying for it doesn't make it so.

    And just because "most Catholics" take birth control doesn't mean that the Church needs to change and cover it when their position has been the same for hundreds of years.

    The Catholic Church forms their opinions and beliefs based on the Bible........NOT what people decide what they WANT to do based on what society rationalizes and justifies as being OK to do.

    This ISN'T even about birth control.........it's about the Government telling the Church that they need to cover BC. It's the government sticking their nose in where they legally don't belong.

    Only leftists who are applauding this because it fits with their abortion and birth control religion are saying that this is about birth control and "controlling a woman's body".
    I don't like the current healthcare plan, but it's here. It's not fair to tell women that their birth control pills won't be covered because *some* people don't like it.

    And newsflash, Catholics have been paying for what they don't approve of. Many Catholics adopted beliefs against the death penalty thanks to the opinion of Pope John Paul II. They were still FORCED to pay to put people to death. It wasn't seen as a persecution toward Catholics. It was seen as everybody pitching in. Meanwhile, Quakers have a belief against war, any type of war. They were still FORCED to pay this one. No righty came forward showing that they cared about the religious beliefs of Quakers on this one.

    We're all paying for what we don't approve of. Catholics aren't special.
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  5. #15  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lanie View Post
    They don't have to compromise as far as doctrine goes.

    However, they need to grow up and recognize that they have no say so over government affairs.

    The idea of wanting birth control to be illegal isn't something I know for 100% certainty. However, the fact that they're not happy with the religious schools and hospitals being exempt tells me a lot. Truth is they want everybody to be "exempt." What else do you think their "We won't compromise" thing means? I think it's arrogant that they think Obama needs to compromise with them at all. The church does not run this country.
    They aren't asking for control over government affairs, just their own. How don't you get that? Using your logic, the government could ban going to church on Sundays, and protesting that would trying to have say-so over government affairs. The government came and stepped on their toes, not the other way around. The fact that you put Obama's authority ahead of the Constitution is frightening. The Constitution trumps the desires of whoever happens to be holding office. Objecting to someone ignoring the Constitution is not having say-so over how the country is run. That say-so was written over 200 years ago, and they are just pointing it out.

    And while we are at it, where does the government derive the authority to tell anyone they have to cover anything?
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  6. #16  
    Senior Member Chuck58's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by michaelsean View Post
    They aren't asking for control over government affairs, just their own. How don't you get that? Using your logic, the government could ban going to church on Sundays, and protesting that would trying to have say-so over government affairs. The government came and stepped on their toes, not the other way around. The fact that you put Obama's authority ahead of the Constitution is frightening. The Constitution trumps the desires of whoever happens to be holding office. Objecting to someone ignoring the Constitution is not having say-so over how the country is run. That say-so was written over 200 years ago, and they are just pointing it out.

    And while we are at it, where does the government derive the authority to tell anyone they have to cover anything?
    Be patient. It could be coming. After all, all those people gathered together could qualify as a health issue. What if one of them is in the the first stages of some communicable disease - the flu or something?
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  7. #17  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lanie View Post
    They don't have to compromise as far as doctrine goes.

    However, they need to grow up and recognize that they have no say so over government affairs.
    Nice of you to say this considering you believe that the government should have a say in Catholic affairs.
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  8. #18  
    Senior Member Dan D. Doty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lanie View Post
    The church does not run this country.
    Nor does the country run the church; that's why we have a 1st Amendment and you can't force anyone to go against their religous beliefs because the States tells them to.
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  9. #19  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lanie
    However, they need to grow up and recognize that they have no say so over government affairs. I think it's arrogant that they think Obama needs to compromise with them at all. The church does not run this country.

    Catholics aren't special.
    Whoa. Take a breath there from all the Catholic hate. We're used to it enough but slow down there.

    Do you know that the Amish and the Christian Scientists (folks that don't believe in medicine like you and I do) have been exempt from the Barry healthcare rules? That means they don't have to provide healthcare to anyone that works for them, is associated with them, etc...

    You did know this, right? Maybe Catholics aren't special and don't run the country but it looks like the Amish and the CS do. ;)
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  10. #20  
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    Quote Originally Posted by JB View Post
    Whoa. Take a breath there from all the Catholic hate. We're used to it enough but slow down there.

    Do you know that the Amish and the Christian Scientists (folks that don't believe in medicine like you and I do) have been exempt from the Barry healthcare rules? That means they don't have to provide healthcare to anyone that works for them, is associated with them, etc...

    You did know this, right? Maybe Catholics aren't special and don't run the country but it looks like the Amish and the CS do. ;)
    Not that I doubt you, but do you have a link or something to back it up?
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