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  1. #11  
    LTC Member Odysseus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    Your assumption would need to be that flags are only lowered and ships are only named for heros. That is simply not the case. Your assumption is wrong, leading to your reaction being wrong. You are welcome to wish that these honors only be reserved for firemen who run into burning buildings to save children, or soldiers who actually do something heroic but thus far that limitation is not applied.
    Do you ever bother to look anything up before you speak?

    The flag, when flown at half-staff, should be first hoisted to the peak for an instant and then lowered to the half-staff position. The flag should be again raised to the peak before it is lowered for the day. On Memorial Day the flag should be displayed at half-staff until noon only, then raised to the top of the staff. By order of the President, the flag shall be flown at half-staff upon the death of principal figures of the United States Government and the Governor of a State, territory, or possession, as a mark of respect to their memory. In the event of the death of other officials or foreign dignitaries, the flag is to be displayed at half-staff according to Presidential instructions or orders, or in accordance with recognized customs or practices not inconsistent with law. In the event of the death of a present or former official of the government of any State, territory, or possession of the United States, or the death of a member of the Armed Forces from any State, territory, or possession who dies while serving on active duty, the Governor of that State, territory, or possession may proclaim that the National flag shall be flown at half-staff, and the same authority is provided to the Mayor of the District of Columbia with respect to present or former officials of the District of Columbia and members of the Armed Forces from the District of Columbia. The flag shall be flown at half-staff 30 days from the death of the President or a former President; 10 days from the day of death of the Vice President, the Chief Justice or a retired Chief Justice of the United States, or the Speaker of the House of Representatives; from the day of death until interment of an Associate Justice of the Supreme Court, a Secretary of an executive or military department, a former Vice President, or the Governor of a State, territory, or possession; and on the day of death and the following day for a Member of Congress. The flag shall be flown at half-staff on Peace Officers Memorial Day, unless that day is also Armed Forces Day. As used in this subsection —
    http://www.ushistory.org/betsy/more/micks.htm

    In other words, lowering the flag for celebrities, buddies of the governor and housepets is not authorized.
    --Odysseus
    Sic Hacer Pace, Para Bellum.

    Before you can do things for people, you must be the kind of man who can get things done. But to get things done, you must love the doing, not the people!
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  2. #12  
    Beaten Last Dead Horse
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    I think Roberta Flack makes Aretha Franklin sound like a scalded mule.
    I have to agree. Roberta Flack has a great voice.

    But to honor Whitney Houston for all that noise pollution she caused over the years by lowering the American flag is just ridiculous.
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  3. #13  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Janice View Post
    I can understand the state flag, but the US Flag ... not so much.

    Guess the nation lost reverence a long time ago so it doesnt really matter. Its all in the eyes of the beholder now. At least its only on the state level ... so far.
    Just so we're clear here, do you object to lowering the flag for alcohol/drug addicts?
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  4. #14  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Wood View Post
    Flags were lowered for Michael Jackson. They were lowered for Joe Paterno. IIRC, they were lowered here in Nashville, if not state-wide, when Johnny Cash died. While this may be over-use of the half-mast, I don't think it's out of line relative to other actions.

    Perhaps the procedure should be reined-in a bit. I remember a couple of decades ago my brother flew into town. He noticed that the flags were half-mast and asked me who died. I had no clue. Later, upon research, they had been ordered lowered because some guy who had been Postmaster General for six months five years earlier had died.




    In this circumstance, in this time, I don't think it's inappropriate. But maybe we should examine the whole practice a bit before the next time comes along.
    Joe Paterno did serve in the military. I don't understand about flags being half mast for celebrities. I am no fan of Chris Christie.
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  5. #15  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odysseus View Post
    Do you ever bother to look anything up before you speak?
    Yeah, do you?

    Christie had been criticized for ordering flags at state government buildings to be lowered on Saturday, the day that Houston’s funeral services would be held in Newark.
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  6. #16  
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedGrouse View Post
    Joe Paterno did serve in the military. I don't understand about flags being half mast for celebrities. I am no fan of Chris Christie.
    I was unaware of that, although his age should have been a giveaway, since almost everyone of that age and male served in the military in some capacity.
    Olde-style, states' rights conservative. Ask if this concept confuses you.
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  7. #17  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    Yeah, do you?

    Christie had been criticized for ordering flags at state government buildings to be lowered on Saturday, the day that Houston’s funeral services would be held in Newark.
    Doesn't matter where it is done at. It is the National Flag, not the State Flag, so he has to follow the National guidance on it.

    Getting into the legalities of it, I'm sure he could have made an executive order making her an honorary state government official, and all the I's would have been dotted.

    I don't know if he did that, but even if not I doubt anyone is going to attempt to enforce the U.S. Code.
    In most sports, cold-cocking an opposing player repeatedly in the face with a series of gigantic Slovakian uppercuts would get you a multi-game suspension without pay.

    In hockey, it means you have to sit in the penalty box for five minutes.
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  8. #18  
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    Quote Originally Posted by djones520 View Post
    Doesn't matter where it is done at. It is the National Flag, not the State Flag, so he has to follow the National guidance on it.

    Getting into the legalities of it, I'm sure he could have made an executive order making her an honorary state government official, and all the I's would have been dotted.

    I don't know if he did that, but even if not I doubt anyone is going to attempt to enforce the U.S. Code.
    As I read it, the code that Ody was referring to addresses only federal facilities. It defines the conditions under which a governor may make a proclamation which will affect federal offices and facilities. Christie's proclamation only pertained to state offices and facilities.

    ...........the National flag flown at any Federal installation or facility in the area
    http://www.ushistory.org/betsy/more/micks.htm

    I really don't think that Governor Christie would step in it by not having his consigliere check it out. But I could be wrong.
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  9. #19  
    Zoomie djones520's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    As I read it, the code that Ody was referring to addresses only federal facilities. It defines the conditions under which a governor may make a proclamation which will affect federal offices and facilities. Christie's proclamation only pertained to state offices and facilities.

    ...........the National flag flown at any Federal installation or facility in the area
    http://www.ushistory.org/betsy/more/micks.htm

    I really don't think that Governor Christie would step in it by not having his consigliere check it out. But I could be wrong.
    http://uscode.house.gov/download/pls/04C1.txt

    Check out the actual US Code. Makes no deliniation about where.
    In most sports, cold-cocking an opposing player repeatedly in the face with a series of gigantic Slovakian uppercuts would get you a multi-game suspension without pay.

    In hockey, it means you have to sit in the penalty box for five minutes.
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  10. #20  
    Ancient Fire Breather Retread's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by djones520 View Post

    Check out the actual US Code. Makes no deliniation about where.
    And never has - but it should be well known by now that violating flag code and etiquette is never again going to be a punishable defense.

    Somebody should read the code to Christie.
    It's not how old you are, it's how you got here.
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    Live every day as if it were your last, because one of these days, it will be.
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