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  1. #61  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    The world is as you see it from your window isn't it? Well it isn't. Fifteen to twenty years ago you could buy a house in many parts of Florida for $25,000 to $50,000. Actually, right now you can buy them almost as cheaply. You also don't have to mortgage the entire amount if you have a chunk of cash which you inherited. Others have taken out loans on paid for properties. Lots of people make $10/hr now who made the same or more 15 years ago. I realize that these people aren't as smart as you are, or they would live in some godforsaken place in New Jersey, wouldn't they? But there are people who make $10/hr who pay $1,000 a year in property tax.
    Same straw man. Only now he has inherited money, bought a house, and made no improvement in his earning capacity in 15 years. Poor straw man.

    Tell you what: Since he is only a straw man, I say we give him some of Odysseus' money. That'll tide him over until he can get a job that pays 25/hour like he deserves. Happy?:smile:

    OOPS! Now he has to pay the evil income tax! Damn! Straw Man just can't win.
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  2. #62  
    Best Bounty Hunter in the Forums fettpett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arroyo_Doble View Post
    If it is high enough, the underground economy would take over and commerce would be conducted outside of normal business channels giving an unfair advantage to the cheats.

    A so-called Fair Tax would be a disaster.
    no it wouldn't. the tax is already figured into the price at the cash register. It is also only on new goods. It gets rid of all "hidden" taxes, which in of it's self brings prices down, there would be a significant price change, but it would be in the downward direction.

    When Russia went to their flat tax around 10-13 years ago, their black market virtually disappeared over night. the same would happen here. Used goods can be sold for any price with no taxation, nothing wrong with that.
    "Should I keep back my opinions at such a time, through fear of giving offense, I should consider myself as guilty of treason towards my country, and of an act of disloyalty toward the Majesty of Heaven, which I revere above all earthly kings..." Patrick Henry
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  3. #63  
    Best Bounty Hunter in the Forums fettpett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    I like the idea, but I confess that I am unaware of any major world power which has such a tax system.

    I also think that sales tax is the easiest of all taxes to illegally avoid. Without an effective enforcement system and severe penalties for not charging sales tax it won't work.
    actually, for most of our history we had Consumption taxes, and relied almost solely on it.

    Alexander Hamilton said this on it in Federalist Papers 21:
    It is a signal advantage of taxes on articles of consumption that they contain in their own nature a security against excess. They prescribe their own limit, which cannot be exceeded without defeating the end proposed—that is, an extension of the revenue. When applied to this object, the saying is as just as it is witty that, "in political arithmetic, two and two do not always make four." If duties are too high, they lessen the consumption; the collection is eluded; and the product to the treasury is not so great as when they are confined within proper and moderate bounds. This forms a complete barrier against any material oppression of the citizens by taxes of this class, and is itself a natural limitation of the power of imposing them.
    We made it through 120+ years without Income taxes, we can get rid of the Income tax and go back to the Consumption tax and grow even greater
    "Should I keep back my opinions at such a time, through fear of giving offense, I should consider myself as guilty of treason towards my country, and of an act of disloyalty toward the Majesty of Heaven, which I revere above all earthly kings..." Patrick Henry
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  4. #64  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    It might mean different things in different places. Where I am from, it's someone who has made a little money and gotten above himself.
    I say, Muffy, he's talking about those dastardly nouveau riche arivistes who moved into the the guest house on Uncle Thurston's old estate. How declasse. We simply must move before the country club is overrun.
    Quote Originally Posted by Starbuck View Post
    Same straw man. Only now he has inherited money, bought a house, and made no improvement in his earning capacity in 15 years. Poor straw man.

    Tell you what: Since he is only a straw man, I say we give him some of Odysseus' money. That'll tide him over until he can get a job that pays 25/hour like he deserves. Happy?:smile:

    OOPS! Now he has to pay the evil income tax! Damn! Straw Man just can't win.
    Hey! How come he gets some of my money? Oh, wait, Obama thinks that I'm rich, on O5 pay.
    --Odysseus
    Sic Hacer Pace, Para Bellum.

    Before you can do things for people, you must be the kind of man who can get things done. But to get things done, you must love the doing, not the people!
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  5. #65  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    I had a roommate from Franklin Lakes and my uncle Clyde was from Camden. I saw a bleeding merchant chasing a shoplifter down the boardwalk in Atlantic City and a drag show where Doris Day got machine gunned and Cass Elliott choked on a ham sandwich in the middle of Dream A Little Dream. I met eithr James Coco or Dom Deluise (can't remember which) at that same nightclub. I used to get pistachio ice cream at some place on the NJ Turnpike when I was a kid. A distant cousin was governor of NJ for 14 years. I always wanted to but never got around to taking the Lewes Cape May Ferry. Now you have my entire relationship with New Jersey.
    Then you know nothing about the state. Thanks for clearing that up.
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  6. #66  
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    Quote Originally Posted by fettpett View Post
    no it wouldn't. the tax is already figured into the price at the cash register. It is also only on new goods. It gets rid of all "hidden" taxes, which in of it's self brings prices down, there would be a significant price change, but it would be in the downward direction.

    When Russia went to their flat tax around 10-13 years ago, their black market virtually disappeared over night. the same would happen here. Used goods can be sold for any price with no taxation, nothing wrong with that.
    And who buys the most new goods?
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  7. #67  
    Best Bounty Hunter in the Forums fettpett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJCardFan View Post
    And who buys the most new goods?
    the most? anyone with money.
    "Should I keep back my opinions at such a time, through fear of giving offense, I should consider myself as guilty of treason towards my country, and of an act of disloyalty toward the Majesty of Heaven, which I revere above all earthly kings..." Patrick Henry
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  8. #68  
    Senior Member Madisonian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    It might mean different things in different places. Where I am from, it's someone who has made a little money and gotten above himself.
    We used to call them nickle millionaires but I'm sure the concept was the same.
    They were the kind that would buy a house they could barely afford in a tony neighborhood then stiff the paperboy when they were three months behind in payment or write the milkman a bad check and then switch delivery companies.
    They bought a bottle of top shelf 12 year old single malt scotch and then refilled it with cheap well brands, being careful to never offer it to anyone that could tell the difference.
    They dined on steak at the country club, but fed the kids cheap hot dogs and hamburgers when no one was around. They did hide the wrappers in someone else's garbage can.

    The Irish saying was that they would fart higher than their ass.
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  9. #69  
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    Quote Originally Posted by fettpett View Post
    the most? anyone with money.
    How often would anyone in the upper 25% buy a used car? My point is, even in a Fair Tax system, the wealthy will still pay more taxes.
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  10. #70  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Madisonian View Post
    We used to call them nickle millionaires but I'm sure the concept was the same.
    They were the kind that would buy a house they could barely afford in a tony neighborhood then stiff the paperboy when they were three months behind in payment or write the milkman a bad check and then switch delivery companies.
    They bought a bottle of top shelf 12 year old single malt scotch and then refilled it with cheap well brands, being careful to never offer it to anyone that could tell the difference.
    They dined on steak at the country club, but fed the kids cheap hot dogs and hamburgers when no one was around. They did hide the wrappers in someone else's garbage can.

    The Irish saying was that they would fart higher than their ass.
    Holy shit, you just described my dad. Except he still drinks top shelf booze.
    The Obama Administration: Deny. Deflect. Blame.
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