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  1. #21  
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    Quote Originally Posted by nightflight View Post
    Great roundup of facts from Sister Toldjah:

    http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/20...e-falls-apart/
    Fantastic!

    This backs up what we have been saying here:

    – It is confirmed as per the 911 call Zimmerman made that night that once he was on foot looking for Trayvon Martin that he had LOST sight of Martin.
    Just look at the timeline we have here.

    Police say there is about a one minute gap in between the time of end of Zimmerman’s phone call to them where they don’t know what happened and after that one minute is what they hear on the 911 call made by the resident as the struggle is in progress.
    [/B]
    This is huge. It indicates that there was no post-phone call pursuit, as we have been saying all along. There was one pursuit: it was 25 seconds long. It ended almost two minutes before the end of the George's call to non-emergency dispatch. So our timeline is now:

    0.00: (approx. 7:00 pm): Zimmerman's call to non-emergency dispatch. He is in his vehicle

    0.58-2:06: Trayvon approaches Zimmerman's vehicle.

    2.06: Trayvon changes his mind and starts to run. Zimmerman still in his SUV.

    2.10: Zimmerman gets out of his car. (2.10-2.14)

    2:14-2:39: Zimmerman pursues Trayvon on foot. He is winded. Huffing and puffing. (Windedness: 2.20-2.45 on the tape)

    2.23: Dispatch asks if Zimmerman is in pursuit.

    2.26: "We don't need you to do this."

    2.39: Trayvon completely disappears. Zimmerman no longer sees him.

    2.39-2.45: Zimmerman's breathing calms down

    2:45-4.11: Zimmerman and dispatch discuss where to meet police officer; Zimmerman gives his name and address, but registers fear that Trayvon might still be around somewhere. Clearly he doesn't see him or know where he is.

    4.11-5.11 (approx): Unclear. Zimmerman claims he walked back to van and Trayvon attacked him.

    5.11 (approx): First 911 calls from neighbors start.




    Zimmerman told police that he’d lost sight of Martin and was headed back to his SUV when Martin confronted him and that’s when the altercation allegedly started. Zimmerman’s claims are that Martin asked him what his problem was and said that he had a problem now, and punched him in the nose and slammed his head against the sidewalk and was on top of him, beating him up, and that he (Martin) was reaching for his (Zimmerman’s) gun, and that he (Zimmerman) had no choice but to shoot to save his life.
    This we have to wait to be confirmed in its entirely, but there is a lot of evidence to to back most of it up.


    Gotta read her whole post: http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/20...e-falls-apart/

    However, she makes many of the same points we've been making here, which is a GOOD thing. It means that there are actual facts that can be backed up.
    Last edited by Elspeth; 03-27-2012 at 09:40 PM.
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  2. #22  
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    Perfect. Just Perfect.

    http://sistertoldjah.com/archives/20...e-falls-apart/

    -Do those who plan on murdering someone typically call the police and give them their whereabouts before they commit the act? George Zimmerman did.

    - Do those who plan on targeting someone for murder typically give the police all their personal information (name, address, telephone number) prior to commencing with their sinister plot? George Zimmerman did.

    - Do those whose intent it was to kill someone tell the police to call them back so they can tell them where they are while they are tracking someone they view as suspicious in their neighborhood? George Zimmerman did.

    - Do those who have a bloodlust for gunning down anyone who looks suspicious – black or otherwise – call 911 at all to report the activity rather than take the law into their own hands? George Zimmerman did. In fact, on the phone call he made to 911, he first describes Trayvon was walking towards his SUV like Trayvon was going to confront him then. If his intent was to kill, don’t you think he’d have pulled his gun at that time and fired?

    - Do people who are on top of someone else beating them up usually call for help multiple times?
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  3. #23  
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    Okay, here's my take on this:

    I don't know enough of the facts to make an informed judgment about who is at fault in this incident. Until the inquiry is complete, none of us will. My gut feeling is that Zimmerman was a cop wannabe and that Martin was a thug wannabe, but I don't know enough to be sure, and neither does Al Sharpton or Barack Obama, who may end up having another beer summit when this is over. What I do know is that Obama desperately needs to energize his base and make his reelection campaign a racial one, in which whites are compelled by guilt to vote him a second term. As a result of his cynical manipulation of a tragic shooting, racial animosity is increasing throughout the country. Obama, Sharpton, Jackson and the media are playing with fire, and because of their recklessness, something is going to burn.
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  4. #24  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odysseus View Post
    Okay, here's my take on this:

    I don't know enough of the facts to make an informed judgment about who is at fault in this incident. Until the inquiry is complete, none of us will. My gut feeling is that Zimmerman was a cop wannabe and that Martin was a thug wannabe, but I don't know enough to be sure, and neither does Al Sharpton or Barack Obama, who may end up having another beer summit when this is over. What I do know is that Obama desperately needs to energize his base and make his reelection campaign a racial one, in which whites are compelled by guilt to vote him a second term. As a result of his cynical manipulation of a tragic shooting, racial animosity is increasing throughout the country. Obama, Sharpton, Jackson and the media are playing with fire, and because of their recklessness, something is going to burn.
    I was about to post the same thing. This has less to do with the participants and more to do with politics. In typical leftist fashion, Obama and this cast of clowns is taking this cause celebre and making it a political platform. They could give 2 shits about Tayvon Martin. Thousands of young blacks are killed every year but for some reason they chose this and make it a racial platform. But they're falling on their faces because as hard as they are trying, the only people you are going to convince that George Zimmerman is white are your already existing moonbats. Anyone else with a brain cell will see him as mixed race at least. So, no, this is politics through and through.
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  5. #25  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odysseus View Post
    Okay, here's my take on this:

    I don't know enough of the facts to make an informed judgment about who is at fault in this incident. Until the inquiry is complete, none of us will. My gut feeling is that Zimmerman was a cop wannabe and that Martin was a thug wannabe, but I don't know enough to be sure, and neither does Al Sharpton or Barack Obama, who may end up having another beer summit when this is over. What I do know is that Obama desperately needs to energize his base and make his reelection campaign a racial one, in which whites are compelled by guilt to vote him a second term. As a result of his cynical manipulation of a tragic shooting, racial animosity is increasing throughout the country. Obama, Sharpton, Jackson and the media are playing with fire, and because of their recklessness, something is going to burn.
    Everyone has an opinion but almost no one has analyzed the tapes and the available evidence. They just project their own ideas onto the situation. I personally don't care if George Zimmerman wanted to be a cop or if Trayvon Martin wanted to be all "gangsta". It's immaterial. I have been looking at timelines all week and keep posting them in the hope that people will actually look at them, along with facts about the physical traits of the two males, and see how little time there actually was between events. (I even posted a short version of the timeline on this thread, just above your post.)


    My take on the situation is based on Zimmerman's phone call to non-emergency police dispatch and my analysis of that call. The only "pursuit" Zimmerman made was 25 seconds long during the phone call with the police and ended over a minute before the phone call ended. Zimmerman stopped trying to follow Trayvon because the kid had run off and disappeared. You can there hear his breathing calm down. (He was 5'9'' and 240; overweight.)

    Then, there was only a minute between the end of that call and the beginning of the 911 calls from the neighbors. That minute is what is in dispute. Just that minute. When Zimmerman hung up with dispatch, he didn't know where Trayvon was. The kid had run off.

    Now which is more likely to have happened in that minute considering the facts:

    a. that George Zimmerman ran his overweight body around looking for a kid who was nowhere in sight, somehow found him, and then threatened him verbally or physically; and that both males made it back to the SUV in time to be having a physical altercation there in time for the neighbors to call 911

    OR

    b. that Zimmerman finished walking back to his SUV and was getting into it when he was attacked from behind by Trayvon who had quickly returned to the scene from wherever he was hiding

    Which is more likely?

    I don't give a shit about the psychology or the racist accusations or the gangsta or the pot. I care about the fucking timeline and the facts on the ground as they are now known.

    I know what I think happened.


    EDITED TO ADD:

    Sorry if I seem really angry, but the whole damned country seems to be running its mouth over this case without having a fucking clue that the "pursuit" was 25 seconds and was over before the call with the police was done. I'm tired of the projection: the Emmott Till comparisons and the "racism" accusations. Nobody fact checks. And Zimmerman's fate is going to depend on that.
    Last edited by Elspeth; 03-27-2012 at 11:18 PM.
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  6. #26  
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    What I see is a district attorney already looked at the case and on the basis of all the evidence presented to him he chose not to press charges, I'm sure he had more to study than I have or anyone here, his findings were discarded because they did not fit the narrative that liberals had already written.
    The end result has already been decided and they will keep on rearranging the officials and the facts until they come up with a match for their conclusions.
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  7. #27  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elspeth View Post
    Sorry if I seem really angry, but the whole damned country seems to be running its mouth over this case without having a fucking clue that the "pursuit" was 25 seconds and was over before the call with the police was done. I'm tired of the projection: the Emmott Till comparisons and the "racism" accusations. Nobody fact checks. And Zimmerman's fate is going to depend on that.
    Not just Zimmerman's. Obama is using this to keep himself in office, and even if he fails, he will raise the level of animosity between blacks and whites to a fever pitch. Think about the racial arsonists who inflamed public opinion for months after the Rodney King beating, and the resulting riots when the evidence didn't support their narrative. People are going to end up dying because of this, and the race hustlers don't care.
    --Odysseus
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  8. #28  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odysseus View Post
    Not just Zimmerman's. Obama is using this to keep himself in office, and even if he fails, he will raise the level of animosity between blacks and whites to a fever pitch. Think about the racial arsonists who inflamed public opinion for months after the Rodney King beating, and the resulting riots when the evidence didn't support their narrative. People are going to end up dying because of this, and the race hustlers don't care.
    I thoroughly get that, and it's making me sick. These people are using this tragic set of circumstances to create racial animus for the sake of a damned election. None of this helps the country. It just puts a very inept person back in office.

    I can't imagine being Zimmerman and being in the middle of this firestorm. The only thing that can liberate him are the facts--and a damned good attorney, which I don't think he has.

    Did you at least read the timeline?
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  9. #29  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kay View Post
    Yeah, typical of the Jackson-Sharpton brigade.
    Any excuse to loot and burn down the neighborhood.
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  10. #30  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elspeth View Post
    ROFLMAO!

    Press that pedal, woman. You go from zero to self-righteous in under 60 seconds!

    When you slide off that high horse you rode in on, maybe we'll be nice and tell you that, no, we don't believe that a high school student who smokes weed, skips class, and talks about fucking all the time deserves to die. In fact, we might even share a nice little secret with you: we don't think those topics of conversation are all that unusual for a teenager, especially one who is, in fact, skipping class, smoking weed, and fucking (although probably a lot less than he talked about it.)

    Putting it on Twitter and Facebook seems rather stupid, but young people don't think about how a future employer is going to view their uploaded photos of blunts and their messages about what to do if your dick falls out when you're doing it doggie style (And yeah, that was on the Twitter feed. Every mother's dream, ain't it.)



    That's exactly the problem. The activists have prevented the truth from coming out. And the actual truth, quite frankly, doesn't sound that horrible--yet. There's nothing here that warrants a "thug" label for Trayvon. What he does look like is a kid in a downward cycle: the 3 suspensions happened in his junior year (16/17). The using (and possible selling) of drugs may be leading to the other behavior changes: missing class, poor judgment (the graffiti and the stolen jewelry), for example. It sounds like he needed some kind of intervention before things really did get worse and the kid ended up arrested or dead.

    I have a feeling that's why Mama sent Baby Boy 250 miles away to "safe" Sanford with Mostly Absent Dad. Maybe Mostly Absent Dad could bond with Baby Boy and talk some sense into him. The problem is that Dad's date with his girlfriend came first that Sunday night. According to the Grio (MSNBC's version of "The Root"), Mostly Absent Dad and Girlfriend left Baby Boy at home with Girlfriend's Younger Son. I'm guessing that makes Trayvon the babysitter. The wisdom of leaving a troubled kid as babysitter for a younger one is dubious, but there you have it.

    When Dad and girlfriend return, Baby Boy has left the house and, I am guessing, was already dead. Girlfriend's Younger Son must have some story to tell Mostly Absent Dad, because Dad doesn't bother to worry. Everybody goes to bed and Baby Boy is in the morgue. Is it possible that Baby Boy has told Girlfriend's Younger Son that Twenty-Something Cousin is coming to pick him up? Maybe that's why no one worries? Dad has told the Sentinel that he thought his son was with Twenty-Something Cousin. Until Monday morning when Dad finds out that cousin has not seen him. Then Mostly Absent Dad calls the cops to see if Baby Boy has been arrested. (This is what he told the Sentinel)

    So here's the deal: we don't know what happened, and that's because the family's story keeps changing. Dad can't seem to tell the truth to save his life; Attorney Crump doesn't care if he's telling truth or fiction; and Mom just holds her hand to her heart and talks about "hurt" and "justice. Meanwhile, the media is adding a saccharine sauce and a chorus of violins with a bass line of racial animus.

    In this artificially sweet racial bludgeon of a delivery, it would be nice to get a fact or two. Just sayin.





    Whoa! Let's add some more imagination to an already overbloated fairy tale. We can also some UFOs if you want, and maybe even a visit from Elvis, fresh out of a coma, who was just trying to get home to Graceland.

    MSNBC should hire you.

    In all seriousness, adding imaginary scenarios to other imaginary scenarios just makes things worse. What most of us on this side of the aisle are trying to do is find out the facts as they really happened. When we find a lie, we expose it. When we find media distortion, we try to fix it. When Trayvon's daddy tells an impossible story or changes his story or can't seem to get his story straight, we point that out. When the attorney makes damning accusations and then has to (very quickly) backtrack, we point that out. When the media shows pictures of Trayvon as a middle school student instead of as a 17-year old, we point that out.

    And when Trayvon goes from being a "little boy" with a "baby face" who is angelic in every way, we point out that he was expelled three times, that his father had some expectation of his being arrested, that he caused George Zimmerman some serious injuries. If we sometimes enjoy the process, it's only because the race-baiting of Weird Al Sharpton and his ilk is tearing the country apart, and that finding the real truth, the counterbalance, is a relief from the pain they are dishing out.

    After that post (and the hundreds of others that you have posted on this topic), you think I'm riding a high horse? You refer to Trayvon as "Baby Boy" and his father as "Absent Dad", yet you refer to the shooter by his name, George Zimmerman. You make a lot of judgemental guesses as to why he was staying with his dad, what was going on in the home, and so on, but that is not evidence regarding his death and isn't even admissible if the case comes to trial.


    I don't care whether Trayvon was a perfect kid. I don't care if his family is perfect. I care that an unarmed 17 year old was shot by a "neighborhood watch" volunteer who was told by the police to stop following the kid, and that the original prosecutor took the shooter's word for it that it was self-defense without much of an investigation.

    Do you know what it will come down to-the tapes of the 911 calls that the FBI is evaluating. If the screaming voice in the backround is determined to be Martin, not Zimmerman, the latter is going to be charged. If it is determined that it is George screaming, than he will not be charged.
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