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  1. #21  
    Senior Member Generation Why?'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by wasp69 View Post
    Surely you are aware that Christian Missions do more than just stand around and preach to the masses, right?
    I know. Just having some fun in a post is all.
    “A creative man is motivated by the desire to achieve, not by the desire to beat others.”Ayn Rand

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  2. #22  
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    Quote Originally Posted by AmPat View Post
    I'd argue that the knowledge of good and evil comes from God and is not dependent on the written word. God can write that knowledge into our very DNA.
    True, which is the point of an article like this. Our atheists are trying to convince us they "don't get it." this seems disengenuous to me.

    Not well. Liberals will now pile on with all manner of quibbling little, pathetically inadequate defenses of their various sins.

    But not without God. If there is no God, there is no reason to constrain yourself, no matter how many bones you have stitched into your nose.

    Not true. You can appreciate all manner of things and still destroy them. You may snuff out the life of somebody and justify it as essential. The very fact you felt it necessary to justify it speaks of an internal right and wrong. Where does that come from?
    AmPat, I don't want to get into a religious quarrel(sp?) over this. We are going to disagree. And that is fine by me. I don't think religious people are ignorant or anything to that extent. I respect individual faith, seeing as it helps most people. I am just not a person who believes in God. I pay my taxes, obey the laws, and don't treat anyone like trash. I would say I am doing just fine. Lastly the "If there is no God, there is no reason to constrain yourself" statement seems more an opinion in my eyes. Have a good day.
    “A creative man is motivated by the desire to achieve, not by the desire to beat others.”Ayn Rand

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  3. #23  
    Senior Member wasp69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starbuck View Post
    Well, if you say so. But not everyone agrees with you. Jesus-is-savior.com doesn't:

    “And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. But may we hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with this artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine doctrines of this most venerated reformer of human errors.” —Thomas Jefferson, Letter to John Adams, April 11, 1823
    To the above quoted "bleever" Jefferson strays off the path of Christianity; others make a different argument. But both arguments are out there.
    Then the "bleever" was making the same mistake as those who would paint Thomas Jefferson a diest.

    "The truth is that the greatest enemies to the doctrines of Jesus are those calling themselves the expositors of them, who have perverted them for the structure of a system of fancy absolutely incomprehensible, and without any foundation in his genuine words. And the day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus, by the supreme being as his father in the womb of a virgin will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away all this artificial scaffolding, and restore to us the primitive and genuine doctrines of this the most venerated reformer of human errors."
    Context is everything, especially when the subject of the quoted passage was Jefferson railing against those that perverted the words and deeds of Jesus.

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  4. #24  
    Ancient Fire Breather Retread's Avatar
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    Did I light a fire?

    Jefferson's own words declare him a Christian. Any other views ignore that fact.
    It's not how old you are, it's how you got here.
    It's been a long road and not all of it was paved.
    Live every day as if it were your last, because one of these days, it will be.
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  5. #25  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Retread View Post
    ...........Any other views ignore that fact.................
    There ya go then. If you disagree with retread, you are just...........wrong.
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  6. #26  
    Ancient Fire Breather Retread's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starbuck View Post
    There ya go then. If you disagree with retread, you are just...........wrong.
    Not me - Jefferson himself
    It's not how old you are, it's how you got here.
    It's been a long road and not all of it was paved.
    Live every day as if it were your last, because one of these days, it will be.
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  7. #27  
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    Well, here's the thing. Jefferson calls himself a Christian.
    But if he didn't believe that Jesus was the son of God; did not believe in miracles; did not believe in The Resurrection; thought the writers of the New Testament were befuddled; would you call him a Christian?

    A rhetorical question surely, since your opinion and preference is simply that - your opinion and preference. I have heard Christians speak that I know would welcome TJ into their ranks and call him "Brother". But I have heard others speak who would ostracize him, excoriate him, and call him a "non-bleever". I referenced one of those groups.

    Was he? I guess if Jefferson says he is a Christian, then so be it; he is. My participation in this thread was fairly clumsy, but my point is that there are some who call themselves Christian who say Jefferson was not Christian; there are others who call themselves Christian who say Jefferson was indeed Christian.

    I will not be offended if one of you Christians points out that since I am a non-Christian I am not qualified to judge.
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  8. #28  
    Senior Member wasp69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Starbuck View Post
    I will not be offended if one of you Christians points out that since I am a non-Christian I am not qualified to judge.
    I would not say that, far from it. Since context is everything, especially being able to read the thoughts and words of the man himself, I would just say that you haven't gotten the full picture.

    No big deal, just kicking around things on a message board.
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  9. #29  
    Senior Member Gina's Avatar
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    And in conclusion:

    I'm a Christian, if I'm wrong I lose nothing, if you're not a Christian and you're wrong, you lose everything.
    Good men sleep peaceably in their beds at night because
    rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf.



    Real superheroes don't wear capes. They wear dog tags.
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  10. #30  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gina View Post
    And in conclusion:

    I'm a Christian, if I'm wrong I lose nothing, if you're not a Christian and you're wrong, you lose everything.
    According to Christian teachings.
    But that's only 34% of the world.
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