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  1. #1 Really good analysis by Newt 
     

  2. #2  
    Senior Member Bailey's Avatar
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    Yes we have to run a campaign like american idol.
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  3. #3  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bailey View Post
    Yes we have to run a campaign like american idol.
    Including people who you want to vote for you in the conversation isn't the same as running a campaign like american idol.
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    Quote Originally Posted by m00 View Post
    Including people who you want to vote for you in the conversation isn't the same as running a campaign like american idol.
    On the face of it I agree with inclusion in the conversation. The trouble is treating someone or a group of people as special only gets them to thinking as they are special and then the demands come. Somewhat like all the free stuff that got us to the point we are at now.
    The 21st century. The age of Smart phones and Stupid people.

    It is said that branches draw their life from the vine. Each is separate yet all are one as they share one life giving stem . The Bible tells us we are called to a similar union in life, our lives with the life of God. We are incorporated into him; made sharers in his life. Apart from this union we can do nothing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zeus View Post
    On the face of it I agree with inclusion in the conversation. The trouble is treating someone or a group of people as special only gets them to thinking as they are special and then the demands come. Somewhat like all the free stuff that got us to the point we are at now.
    Getting the Paul people on board wouldn't have been hard, and there wouldn't have been any real concessions from a Conservative standpoint. But let's be honest... you don't want Paubots for their votes, you want to use them for their tireless activism and grassroots organization, and the fact that organization reaches deeply across the aisle. Romney would have just needed to appear serious about personal liberty and auditing the Federal Reserve (neither of which are bad ideas). This is how you get the youth vote.

    The real group that was important to include are hispanic voters and young, single women. Hispanics that come to this country have a very high incidence of small-business ownership and small-business participation. There's common ground there. As I said elsewhere George W Bush managed to pick up 40% of the hispanic vote... Romney only picked up 20%. This is to Bush's credit.

    I highly doubt young single women actually care about whether the government picks up their $15/mo birth control tab. Republicans just have to stop using dumbass/insulting language when talking about the issue.

    You know, Reagan wasn't some magic prophet. He was just a really sincere guy who considered liberals his "friends" and worked with them where there was common ground, and had a "I strongly believe in my convictions, but reasonable people can disagree" approach where there wasn't. Reagan didn't demonize other Americans. He didn't insult people's intelligence. Romney (and lets expand this to the RNC beltway elite crowd) on the other hand couldn't even work with people who were supposed to be in his own party. His campaign considered other Republicans his enemies, but still demanded their vote. It doesn't work like that.

    Newt when he was speaker worked with a Democrat president to balance the budget. All the politics aside, when it came down to the wire, Newt and Clinton worked together on economic issues where they could agree (aka... we have to balance this budget, somehow). Romney worked together with democrats when he was Governor and was quite successfully, so I had high hopes in the early primaries. But he seriously burned some important bridges throughout his campaign. And those bridges had voters on them.

    "Campaign Mitt" was like the worst of both worlds -- a moderate that couldn't reach across the aisle, or even deeply appeal to anyone other than a narrow segment of Republicans (coincidentally, the Republicans that are the beltway elite crowd).

    Just my take.
    Last edited by m00; 11-07-2012 at 03:29 PM.
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    Senior Member Zeus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by m00 View Post
    Getting the Paul people on board wouldn't have been hard, and there wouldn't have been any real concessions from a Conservative standpoint. But let's be honest... you don't want Paubots for their votes, you want to use them for their tireless activism and grassroots organization, and the fact that organization reaches deeply across the aisle. Romney would have just needed to appear serious about personal liberty and auditing the Federal Reserve (neither of which are bad ideas). This is how you get the youth vote.

    The real group that was important to include are hispanic voters and young, single women. Hispanics that come to this country have a very high incidence of small-business ownership and small-business participation. There's common ground there. As I said elsewhere George W Bush managed to pick up 40% of the hispanic vote... Romney only picked up 20%. This is to Bush's credit.

    I highly doubt young single women actually care about whether the government picks up their $15/mo birth control tab. Republicans just have to stop using dumbass/insulting language when talking about the issue.

    You know, Reagan wasn't some magic prophet. He was just a really sincere guy who considered liberals his "friends" and worked with them where there was common ground, and had a "I strongly believe in my convictions, but reasonable people can disagree" approach where there wasn't. Reagan didn't demonize other Americans. He didn't insult people's intelligence. Romney (and lets expand this to the RNC beltway elite crowd) on the other hand couldn't even work with people who were supposed to be in his own party. His campaign considered other Republicans his enemies, but still demanded their vote. It doesn't work like that.

    Newt when he was speaker worked with a Democrat president to balance the budget. All the politics aside, when it came down to the wire, Newt and Clinton worked together on economic issues where they could agree (aka... we have to balance this budget, somehow). Romney worked together with democrats when he was Governor and was quite successfully, so I had high hopes in the early primaries. But he seriously burned some important bridges throughout his campaign. And those bridges had voters on them.

    "Campaign Mitt" was like the worst of both worlds -- a moderate that couldn't reach across the aisle, or even deeply appeal to anyone other than a narrow segment of Republicans (coincidentally, the Republicans that are the beltway elite crowd).

    Just my take.
    Well you rather emphasized my point. The ronbots were unwilling to bend/give,as evidence by their behavior on this and multiple other boards) but more than willing to take/make demands.

    With the hispanics I don't know if it was the Brother from a different mother complex that helped Obama and hurt Romney.

    As shallow as it seems I do believe the female vote was more emotional than intellectual.

    I don't see not kissing someones ass as demonizing them, it's just more of the "I'm special so what you got for me"

    I think there are way to many "Republicans" insisting they are standing on principle while they insist others abandon theirs.

    In many aspects of life are instances calling for give and take, this can be done without compromising principle, those not willing to give are takers. 10% of something will always be more than 100% of nothing.

    Politicians the likes of Reagan , Tip O'Neill or a Gingrich will not be elected in today's political atmosphere.
    The 21st century. The age of Smart phones and Stupid people.

    It is said that branches draw their life from the vine. Each is separate yet all are one as they share one life giving stem . The Bible tells us we are called to a similar union in life, our lives with the life of God. We are incorporated into him; made sharers in his life. Apart from this union we can do nothing.
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    Quote Originally Posted by m00 View Post
    Getting the Paul people on board wouldn't have been hard
    And nobody could have done that any better than Paul himself. Where was he?
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    Quote Originally Posted by m00 View Post
    Getting the Paul people on board wouldn't have been hard,
    You're absolutely right. All Ron Paul had to do after the convention is throw his support behind Romney. After it was apparent that Paul wasn't going to get the nomination, like the rest of the candidates, he should have thrown his support behind the winning candidate. What Paul did by acting like he was in the hunt was fracture the party. Whatever he was trying to accomplish failed miserable. The moment when the delegates were being rattled off and some states were giving their votes to Paul, I started to get a feeling that Romney was in trouble. As I keep saying, say what you want about the Democrats but you would never see that garbage at their convention. They threw their support behind Obama 100% and the end result is, well, you see what the end result was. Same goes for the Tea Party.
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    I have long thought that Newt Gingrich was a pig, and I don't say that as a comment on his body. But through the GOP primary, he grew on me. BY the time things were winding up, I thought that Gingrich (warts and all) might just be the best candidate for president in my lifetime. My mother said it was impossible, that his baggage was too much and that women would never vote for him because of his personal life. I disagreed, because I thought that America would rather have an imperfect man doing a good job than a Sears model and 1950's TV stereotype who doesn't know his ass from a hole in the wall. I was wrong.

    I will be studying up on Chris Christie. I think he might just be the smartest man out there right now. For some reason he comes off like an up from the streets union boss, but his actual credentials are pretty upper crusty- what a combination! Somehow, he came through all of this leaving me with the impression that he should have been on the ticket. If I'm taken in, I have to assume that others are as well. He needs to lose some weight, Americans can be very shallow and his weight is into the health risk category which some consider relevant to serving as President. Truth is, Ryan will probably hit the dirt before Christie, but that's not the popular perception.
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