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  1. #21  
    Senior Member Unreconstructed Reb's Avatar
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    One of my favorite liberl lies comes from that darling of the left wing, the diva of the democrats, the 2016 hopeful, Hillary Dodging-Sniper-Fire Clinton:

    "The beauty of the Second Amendment is that you won't need it until they try to take it away."---Thomas Jefferson

    ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
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  2. #22  
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    If drowning puppy dogs would win support for his agenda, Obama would claim to do that all the time, too. Same with Hillary, Nancy and Harry. Not so much with Mitch, John, and certainly not Mitt.

    Some Republicans are like that, of course, but by and large it is a Democrat habit.
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  3. #23  
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    I don't even know what kind of animal a skeet IS.
    "Today, [the American voter] chooses his rulers as he buys bootleg whiskey, never knowing precisely what he is getting, only certain that it is not what it pretends to be." - H.L. Mencken
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  4. #24  
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    Quote Originally Posted by noonwitch View Post
    I also don't think the comments, in full context, about skeet shooting at Camp David are a lie. If you take the first answer without context, which is what your side always does, then yes, it appears to be a lie. But if you look at the whole thing, it's not. He used "we" in the first answer, then clarified later that it wasn't his kids, it was guests.
    Obama's comments are meant to mislead.

    It is true that the use of "we" can be ambiguous. For example, when people say "We went skiing up at Big Bear," they are usually referring to their families (or the group they went with), but not everyone had to ski for the same amount of time. In fact, you often hear people say, "We went skiing at Big Bear, but Tom pulled a muscle and spent most of the trip inside the lodge watching sports." Your argument is that Obama is using "we" in this way. He is referring to the Camp David entourage as a group, with himself a part of it, and skeet shooting was a general activity that the group participated in, even if his own participation was minimal. And certainly that could be logically and morally true.

    The problem is the context: the comments about skeet shooting did not occur in a vacuum. It wasn't just a casual, "We were up at Camp David last weekend and we all did some skeet shooting." It was a comment with serious subtext meant to address Second Amendment supporters who think Obama is anti-gun:

    Context: Huge battle over gun rights in the wake of school shooting

    Statement:

    “Have you ever fired a gun?

    Yes, in fact, up at Camp David, we do skeet shooting all the time.

    Subtext:

    I am a gun user, too. I have nothing against guns. My proposals for gun control legislation and/or related executive orders do not come from ignorance or hatred of guns.

    Accompanying PR:

    A photo of Obama shooting a firearm.


    The message to the gullible public is clear and is meant to garner support for gun control.

    Now if Obama doesn't really shoot, hates to shoot and is uncomfortable with it, then that gives the lie to the PR campaign. Fox News' attack on the comments Obama made goes to the heart of the SUBTEXT, which is, of course, crucial to the PR message and spin. On the surface, Obama said "we" (implying that he himself is included), but, in reality, he is Tom at Big Bear who sat in the lodge all weekend watching football while everyone else was out on the slopes. Tom might say "We went skiing", but in reality he didn't ski at all. Obama says, "We do skeet shooting," but in reality doesn't shoot (except on rare uncomfortable occasions).

    Under these conditions it really DOES matter if the pronoun "we" includes Obama himself as a regular gun user. To dismiss the pronoun use as "not a lie" is to miss the subtext of the comments and the false impression that is being created about Obama, "the great sportsman." You can argue that the use of "we" is not sociolinguistically incorrect (since many people use "'we go' plus an activity " to describe a group activity in which they had minimal or no participation) but you cannot argue that the intent was not a lie, that the subtext was not a lie, and that the PR spin was not a lie.
    Last edited by Elspeth; 02-05-2013 at 02:26 PM.
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  5. #25 Skeetgate: Obama lied 
    Senior Ape Articulate_Ape's Avatar
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    "The efforts of the government alone will never be enough. In the end the people must choose and the people must help themselves" ~ JFK; from his famous inauguration speech (What Democrats sounded like before today's neo-Liberals hijacked that party)
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  6. #26  
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    Quote Originally Posted by linda22003 View Post
    I don't even know what kind of animal a skeet IS.
    Close relative of the nauga

    I believe in Christianity as I believe that the sun has risen: not only because I see it, but because by it I see everything else.
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  7. #27  
    Senior Member Apache's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by linda22003 View Post
    I don't even know what kind of animal a skeet IS.



    A flock of skeet...
    Government is not the solution to our problem, government is the problem.
    Ronald Reagan

    We could say they are spending like drunken sailors. That would be unfair to drunken sailors, they're spending their OWN money.
    Ronald Reagan

    R.I.P. Crockspot
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  8. #28  
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    Quote Originally Posted by linda22003 View Post
    I don't even know what kind of animal a skeet IS.
    Close cousin of the snipe.
    Olde-style, states' rights conservative. Ask if this concept confuses you.
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  9. #29  
    CU Royalty JB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by linda22003 View Post
    I don't even know what kind of animal a skeet IS.
    Don't worry about it, Obama doesn't know either.
    Be Not Afraid.
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  10. #30  
    CU Royalty JB's Avatar
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    “Have you ever fired a gun?

    "Yes, in fact, up at Camp David, we do skeet shooting all the time."
    Who talks like that? "We do skeet shooting". Someone caught off guard and needing to think of a quick lie would fumble around with a response like that. Normal people would simply say "we go skeet shooting all the time" or "we skeet shoot all the time". He didn't.

    Have you ever bowled? We do bowling all the time. Have you ever golfed? We do golfing all the time. Sounds stupid and contrived, just like we do skeet shooting...

    And finally, we already know he changed from his golfing clothes to his skeet shooting clothes that day but did you also notice from the pics in this thread that he changed from his golfing watch to his skeet shooting watch? It's good to president. A new wardrobe for everything. I imagine he showered and changed into his eating clothes and eating watch after the skeet session and then his movie clothes and movie watch for family movie time that night. What a tool this guy is.
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