Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 10 of 16
  1. #1 Hell no, I won’t go! Soldier claims conscientious objector status days... 
    eeeevil Sith Admin SarasotaRepub's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    Sunny,FL
    Posts
    43,090
    Awww...he got scared.



    Sun Jul 21, 2013, 10:29 PM
    Catherina
    Hell no, I won’t go! Soldier claims conscientious objector status days before deployment

    Hell no, he won't go? Soldier claims conscientious objector status days before deployment


    22-year-old Chris Munoz, a private in the U.S. Army, refused to deploy to Afghanistan with his unit after claiming a crisis of conscious

    By Bill Briggs, NBC News contributor

    As his fellow First Cavalry soldiers stow their gear in Afghanistan, a 22-year-old Army private moves vehicles and cleans buildings at Fort Hood after declining to deploy on the grounds that his conscience won’t let him kill — a move resulting in fierce backlash within the military community.

    Amid the era of the all-volunteer force and after 12 years of war, the “conscientious objector” application recently filed by Private Second Class Chris Munoz is a rarity compared to the 171,000 CO claims made during the divisive, draft-based Vietnam War. Only about 100 such claims are submitted annually, according to a federal report. But that number is rising, says a national organization that helps objectors.

    “We are getting more calls. There seems to be a lot of folks having problems of conscience,” said Bill Galvin, counseling coordinator at the Center of Conscience & War, a Washington, D.C.-based advocacy group.

    “When there’s conscription, we have a lot more work, certainly. But even these days, it's one thing in the abstract to say, ‘I'd like to defend my country,’ but it's something else entirely to be looking down at the barrel of gun and know you have that person’s life in your hands,” Galvin said. “Especially if you don’t know if that person is your enemy.”

    ...

    http://usnews.nbcnews.com/_news/2013...Hb0UF8.twitter


    DUmmies give the expected "Good job!" to the coward except...



    Response to Catherina (Original post)
    Mon Jul 22, 2013, 12:25 AM
    Pelican

    6. Big rocks into little ones and the little ones into pebbles...


    Fuck this guy...

    Hey genius, the war has been on for 12 years and the rest of us who signed on the line managed to leave our families multiple times because we agreed to. It's what men (and some women) do.

    I think he can manage once at the tail end of things...

    I've seen the video of his wife and it basically came down to "He went to basic and got scared and this is what we came up with to get out of it"
    Pelican should come over here to CU. You're wasting you time and brain power at the DUmp!!!
    May the FORCE be with you!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  2. #2  
    Power CUer noonwitch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    Warren, MI
    Posts
    12,600
    I didn't think that once one is already enlisted that one could claim CO status. I really thought that it only applied to draft or draft registration status.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  3. #3  
    LTC Member Odysseus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    FT Belvoir, VA
    Posts
    15,638
    Quote Originally Posted by noonwitch View Post
    I didn't think that once one is already enlisted that one could claim CO status. I really thought that it only applied to draft or draft registration status.
    You can, but it's much tougher. The biggest mistake that we've made was allowing a Muslim Soldier to claim that he had a religious prohibition against fighting other Muslims, and to use that to get CO status. Of course, that Soldier then turned around and got caught planning to bomb FT Hood, so it turns out that he wasn't that conscientious after all...
    --Odysseus
    Sic Hacer Pace, Para Bellum.

    Before you can do things for people, you must be the kind of man who can get things done. But to get things done, you must love the doing, not the people!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  4. #4  
    Senior Member DumbAss Tanker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    2,695
    Noon, what Ody says is right, though none of the few I dealt with were Muslims. Soldiers are recruited at a pretty malleable age (Which for obvious reasons, best suits the military's own needs), but they aren't exactly kept in isolation from other influences after Initial Entry Training (Basic/AIT or OSUT to the Army) and they come under a variety of other influences during their enlistment. A certain percentage of them are legit converts to nonviolent belief systems, but many of them seem to be motivated more by a desire to break the contract and get out - especially in units about to deploy, or people in the medical field particularly who have had DOD pay for their professional education and now don't want to hold up their end of the bargain when there are jobs with better hours and pay and no hardship or danger out there.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  5. #5  
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    9,808
    Quote Originally Posted by Odysseus View Post
    You can, but it's much tougher. The biggest mistake that we've made was allowing a Muslim Soldier to claim that he had a religious prohibition against fighting other Muslims, and to use that to get CO status. Of course, that Soldier then turned around and got caught planning to bomb FT Hood, so it turns out that he wasn't that conscientious after all...
    Is there some reason why the military seems to be always the last to know in these situations? Isn't the whole point of NSA surveillance to know who the terrorists are?
    Reply With Quote  
     

  6. #6  
    LTC Member Odysseus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    FT Belvoir, VA
    Posts
    15,638
    Quote Originally Posted by DumbAss Tanker View Post
    Noon, what Ody says is right, though none of the few I dealt with were Muslims. Soldiers are recruited at a pretty malleable age (Which for obvious reasons, best suits the military's own needs), but they aren't exactly kept in isolation from other influences after Initial Entry Training (Basic/AIT or OSUT to the Army) and they come under a variety of other influences during their enlistment. A certain percentage of them are legit converts to nonviolent belief systems, but many of them seem to be motivated more by a desire to break the contract and get out - especially in units about to deploy, or people in the medical field particularly who have had DOD pay for their professional education and now don't want to hold up their end of the bargain when there are jobs with better hours and pay and no hardship or danger out there.
    Of all of the cases that I've dealt with involving Soldiers who sought to evade deployment, I've had one case where a Soldier refused to deploy, but he was an IRR Soldier who'd been called up to fill a slot on a battle roster, and he just didn't show up. The MPs brought him in and he ended up going with the unit. In the vast majority of other cases, soldiers resort to malingering (especially in the case of one officer who went out and got Lasik surgery within the deployment window, rendering himself nondeployable for a year), screwing up their family care plans or trying to transfer into other units that are not deploying. I've never had someone try to claim Consciencious Objector status, partly because the onus of proof is on the troopie, and it's a very difficult hurdle. Those who do it tend to be more concerned with making a statement than in actually accomplishing anything.

    Quote Originally Posted by Elspeth View Post
    Is there some reason why the military seems to be always the last to know in these situations? Isn't the whole point of NSA surveillance to know who the terrorists are?
    We'd know, if we were allowed to. MAJ Nidal Hasan spent months haranguing his patients with jihadi talking points and communicating with known terrorists, but was not investigated, even though the FBI knew what he was doing, because the chain of command was afraid of the repercussions. PC trumps OPSEC every time.
    --Odysseus
    Sic Hacer Pace, Para Bellum.

    Before you can do things for people, you must be the kind of man who can get things done. But to get things done, you must love the doing, not the people!
    Reply With Quote  
     

  7. #7  
    Senior Member Eupher's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Mizz-uhr-ah
    Posts
    533
    I've known guys and gals who wanted to get out and would employ all sorts of stories to make that happen, up to and including faking a divorce, using a family illness as a pretext for hardship, going AWOL, admitting smoking a pole, and even punching a guy out.

    But never CO.
    U.S. Army, Retired
    Reply With Quote  
     

  8. #8  
    Senior Member DumbAss Tanker's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2002
    Location
    Missouri
    Posts
    2,695
    I've seen one or two try the CO thing to avoid deploying, not with any great success though. Trying to get the application through is the king of paper chases, however the little shits who want to try it are usually in touch with family members who are egging them on and bombarding their Congressman and Senators with distorted blow-by-blow accounts of how mean the service is to their precious little douchebag.
    Reply With Quote  
     

  9. #9  
    Destroyer of Worlds Apocalypse's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Locked in a Dungeon, being tortured and LOVING IT!
    Posts
    5,183
    Quote Originally Posted by SarasotaRepub View Post





    Pelican should come over here to CU. You're wasting you time and brain power at the DUmp!!!
    I would imagine Pelican would be joining us soon. I'm sure the "Report Post" button is nearly worn out.
    Rest In Peace America
    July 4, 1776 - January 20, 2009
    Reply With Quote  
     

  10. #10  
    CU Royalty JB's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Posts
    8,032
    Quote Originally Posted by SarasotaRepub View Post
    Pelican should come over here to CU. You're wasting you time and brain power at the DUmp!!!
    We had a Pelican here for years. Then he went away for a while, came back and is gone again.

    There was something quirky about him the second time around that I'm drawing a blank on right now.
    Be Not Afraid.
    Reply With Quote  
     

Bookmarks
Bookmarks
Posting Permissions
  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •