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  1. #11  
    LTC Member Odysseus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    That's a convenient whipping boy, but the teachers I play trivia with despise all this "great idea of the week" and new superintendent trying to make his mark crap. We have been watching this for generations now. Every decade or so it's the "new and improved method" except that it isn't new and it isn't improved. We all know, and the teachers do too, that the old way works best: rote and repetition. But it only worked best when the classes were well behaved and tracked. You can't do that anymore because the parents insist that their emotionally or intellectually damaged/fragile child be "mainstreamed" and that all the classes be mixes of kids of all skill levels.

    We can't tie the hands of these teachers and then say "Now play the piano."
    I can't speak about Florida but in NYC and Los Angeles, the problem is the teachers' unions, which oppose every reform, not the parents. NYC has charter schools which basically replicate the models that you talk about, but the unions and politicians (who they pay for) work like mad to undermine them because they are not unionized, but their performance is superior to the public schools. The waiting lists for these schools are huge, precisely because they enforce standards and parents would rather have a kid held back and learning than socially promoted and functionally illiterate.
    --Odysseus
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    Before you can do things for people, you must be the kind of man who can get things done. But to get things done, you must love the doing, not the people!
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  2. #12  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odysseus View Post
    I can't speak about Florida but in NYC and Los Angeles, the problem is the teachers' unions, which oppose every reform, not the parents. NYC has charter schools which basically replicate the models that you talk about, but the unions and politicians (who they pay for) work like mad to undermine them because they are not unionized, but their performance is superior to the public schools. The waiting lists for these schools are huge, precisely because they enforce standards and parents would rather have a kid held back and learning than socially promoted and functionally illiterate.
    I happen to know something about Los Angeles personally.

    The teachers themselves are not guiding the curriculum. The curriculum comes out of the state office of education in Sacramento. Most teachers teach in spite of the curriculum, not because of it. That being said, the teachers are fighting charter schools in LA because most are owned by Eli Broad's "Green Dot" company. Green Dot is basically a funnel of taxpayer money and assets (like deeds for entire school buildings) to hedge funds.

    The charters that actually work well are not Green Dot charters. Well-working charters are those started in the state before the attack of the hedge fund fronts, and parents have a great deal of control and responsibility. I know a guy whose kid is in one of these charters and he and his wife must volunteer 20 hours a week for the school. These charters do well precisely because of the parental involvement and the dedication of the teachers.

    The Green Dot charters, on the other hand, (like those of Edison and other companies) actually do as badly or worse than the public schools because it's not about schooling.

    I am totally in support of the original charter schools started in California because they actually do work for kids. I am vehemently opposed to Green Dot, Edison, and other charter corporations that are nothing more than thieves of public resources.
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  3. #13  
    Power CUer NJCardFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arroyo_Doble View Post
    People will pay a premium for good public schools, real or perceived. Sounds like some people are finding out that no, perception is not reality.
    The hell are you talking about? Explain to the class the merits of giving a student credit for wrong answers. There are very few school subjects that are subject to interpretation. History is about the only required class I can think of, the rest are electives. That is not perception, that is reality. You can't argue that a circle is a square and expect to get a right answer. That is reality and giving a kid full credit for answering that way diminishes the work those who got it right, which is the goal of the left. Their view of no child left behind is to drag everyone back to those who are lagging. Basically no one can claim that no child was left behind if all are behind.
    The Obama Administration: Deny. Deflect. Blame.
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  4. #14  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    I couldn't find an explanation for the white suburban mom crack. Is common core somehow supposed to appeal to inner city black parents?
    Here's how Duncan did with inner city blacks:

    This man was in charge of educating 700,000 Chicago school kids before being plucked by his friend Barack Obama to be education secretary. When he left as Chicago school superintendent, the graduation rate was less than 50% and 70% of high school seniors couldn't read at a 12th grade level.

    http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/...#ixzz2l1Szf8lF
    I imagine black parents are no happier with Duncan than white parents.
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  5. #15  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Odysseus View Post
    I can't speak about Florida but in NYC and Los Angeles, the problem is the teachers' unions, which oppose every reform, not the parents. NYC has charter schools which basically replicate the models that you talk about, but the unions and politicians (who they pay for) work like mad to undermine them because they are not unionized, but their performance is superior to the public schools. The waiting lists for these schools are huge, precisely because they enforce standards and parents would rather have a kid held back and learning than socially promoted and functionally illiterate.
    I think that the teachers objections to charter schools are basically the same as vouchers: they believe that if there are self selected student bodies peopled by kids with involved parents, then we will end up with two school systems and ultimately a society which knows who went where. As if that weren't already the case. Right near Ft. Belvoir you have a very elite track in place: Burgundy Farm Country Day School, and St. Stephens. Combination thereof is going to cost you something on the order of $300,000.
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  6. #16  
    LTC Member Odysseus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Novaheart View Post
    I think that the teachers objections to charter schools are basically the same as vouchers: they believe that if there are self selected student bodies peopled by kids with involved parents, then we will end up with two school systems and ultimately a society which knows who went where. As if that weren't already the case. Right near Ft. Belvoir you have a very elite track in place: Burgundy Farm Country Day School, and St. Stephens. Combination thereof is going to cost you something on the order of $300,000.
    You're going to get that no matter what. You cannot legislate parental involvement, and people who have more will always be able to spend more on their own kids. But, that doesn't justify the attacks on schools that work for kids whose parents are genuinely committed to getting them an education and starting them off in life with the tools to succeed. The teachers' objection is to inequality, but since they cannot mandate excellence, and are actually working to destroy it, the end result is to spread the misery equally, but that's not a solution, it's sabotage.
    --Odysseus
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    Before you can do things for people, you must be the kind of man who can get things done. But to get things done, you must love the doing, not the people!
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  7. #17  
    PORCUS MAXIMUS Rockntractor's Avatar
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    Ann DuncanďBlack Ghetto MomsĒ Upset That Common Core Shows Their Kids Arenít ďBrilliantĒÖ

    Would she still have a Job?
    The difference between pigs and people is that when they tell you you're cured it isn't a good thing.
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