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  1. #21  
    Senior Member Big Dog's Avatar
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    A question for Lanie:

    Libertarians believe that personal freedom, personal responsibility, and limited government which protects individual liberty are best for the individual and by extension for society. The principles of Liberty and personal responsibility are referred to as virtues in the field of Ethics.

    You want us (libertarians) to ignore our principles and vote for Republican candidates who are vehemently opposed to our virtues. Your justification was that Americans won't accept our principles, so we should join your team so you can win.

    My question is:

    Which of your principles, your virtues, are you willing to abandon just to be part of a winning team?
    It is the right and duty of the citizen to be at all times armed.
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  2. #22  
    Power CUer NJCardFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Dog View Post



    The Romney Shit Sandwich may have had only half the shit of the Obama Shit Sandwich, but it was still too much shit for those of us who believe in personal freedom, personal responsibility, free markets, and limited constitutional government.

    Here's a novel idea, sunshine: Don't expect Liberty-loving citizens to vote for your statist, collectivist, big government candidates, just because they have an (R) by their names. If your party can't nominate someone with a history of supporting the principles of Liberty, then don't be surprised if we leave your shit sandwich on the plate.

    After all, if your own Tea Party Republicans won't support your candidates, why would expect libertarians to?
    You do realize it was this attitude that allowed Obama to get re-elected. If there ever was an instance to hold one's nose and vote for the Republican, 2012 was it but this attitude that wanted that nutbag Ron Paul as president and who either didn't vote or voted for a 3rd party that allowed this idiot to get 4 more years. Truth is, we don't know what we would have had with Romney but we knew damned well what we were getting with Obama but the so called conservatives took their ball, went home, knowing that we'd be in deeper shit. Bravo for standing up for your principles.
    The Obama Administration: Deny. Deflect. Blame.
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  3. #23  
    Power CUer NJCardFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockntractor View Post
    Sure thing, we can argue all day about drugs, while the border continues to be overrun, our foreign policy collapses, our health care system is destroyed, our economy collapses and terrorists continue to grow in strength.
    I was mocked in another thread when I said the Republican leadership needed to adapt some Libertarian views, "some" was quickly transformed into all and a straw-man was quickly built and mocked.
    The Republican party leadership has been mocking tea-party Americans all along, they won't fund conservative choices and they to finance their good old boy network, this is not a way to bring the party together.
    Libertarians want an open border so the GOP congresscritters are certainly on board with that.
    The Obama Administration: Deny. Deflect. Blame.
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  4. #24  
    Power CUer NJCardFan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Big Dog View Post



    You must be realistic, Lanie. People who believe in personal freedom, personal responsibility, and limited constitutional government won't vote for establishment Republicans, Democrats of any stripe, or other statist collectivists. It's a matter of principle: Voting for the lesser of two evils is still voting for evil.
    How's that "standing up for your principles" working out for you now?
    The Obama Administration: Deny. Deflect. Blame.
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  5. #25  
    PORCUS MAXIMUS Rockntractor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJCardFan View Post
    Libertarians want an open border so the GOP congresscritters are certainly on board with that.
    Some do some don't.
    The difference between pigs and people is that when they tell you you're cured it isn't a good thing.
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  6. #26  
    PORCUS MAXIMUS Rockntractor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJCardFan View Post
    How's that "standing up for your principles" working out for you now?
    Stand up for principles into the primaries and then you vote for those that come the closest to you principles.
    The difference between pigs and people is that when they tell you you're cured it isn't a good thing.
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  7. #27  
    Senior Member Big Dog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJCardFan View Post
    You do realize it was this attitude that allowed Obama to get re-elected. If there ever was an instance to hold one's nose and vote for the Republican, 2012 was it but this attitude that wanted that nutbag Ron Paul as president and who either didn't vote or voted for a 3rd party that allowed this idiot to get 4 more years. Truth is, we don't know what we would have had with Romney but we knew damned well what we were getting with Obama but the so called conservatives took their ball, went home, knowing that we'd be in deeper shit. Bravo for standing up for your principles.
    Democrats are driving us off a cliff at 100 miles an hour. Republicans are driving us off the same cliff at 75 miles an hour. The Republicans oppose any attempt to step on the brakes, or God forbid, to shift into reverse- more vehemently than they oppose the Dems. Romney was ruthless toward the conservative Republicans in the primary, and agreed with King Putt on more than half of his positions during the general election.

    Your party nominated a "progressive" Northeastern country club Republican with a track record of socialized medicine, gun control, and tax increases- all things King Putt supports as well. And you voted for him.

    I did not, and would not. Right is right, wrong is wrong, and Romney was wrong.

    My conscience is clear. Can you say the same?
    Last edited by Big Dog; 07-20-2014 at 12:13 AM.
    It is the right and duty of the citizen to be at all times armed.
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  8. #28  
    Senior Member Big Dog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJCardFan View Post
    How's that "standing up for your principles" working out for you now?
    Doing the right thing for the right reason is never wrong. It's something our friend dutch calls "moral clarity". I call it honor.

    Obama is acting exactly as I expected he would; and the Republicans are acting, and failing to act, exactly as I expected they would. The Republicans continue to crush the Liberty movement within their ranks, while letting King Putt carry out his dictatorial plan unimpeded.

    The GOP shows me almost daily that they didn't deserve my vote in 2012, and they don't deserve it today. It's up to you and your party to earn my vote in 2016. Don't fuck it up like you did last time.
    It is the right and duty of the citizen to be at all times armed.
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  9. #29  
    Senior Member Big Dog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NJCardFan View Post
    Libertarians want an open border so the GOP congresscritters are certainly on board with that.
    This one doesn't.
    It is the right and duty of the citizen to be at all times armed.
    - Thomas Jefferson
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  10. #30  
    Ancient Fire Breather Retread's Avatar
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    Not to put to fine a point on it Big Dog but the attitude/view you have shown here is still running us off the same cliff at somewhere in the middle speeds you list. Unless/until you and yours can do something you are still contributing to the problem. That clear conscience is a figment of the moment if we all end up in the same hell.
    It's not how old you are, it's how you got here.
    It's been a long road and not all of it was paved.
    A man is but a product of his thoughts. What he thinks, he becomes. Gandhi
    Quote Originally Posted by Carol
    When I judge someone's integrity one key thing I look at is - How does s/he treat people s/he doesn't agree with or does not like?
    I can respect someone who I do not agree with, but I have NO respect for someone who puts others down in a public forum. That is the hallmark of someone who has no integrity, and cannot be trusted.
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