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  1. #21  
    Senior Member marinejcksn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillygirl View Post
    Can you tell me why you don't think DADT shouldn't be changed, if you have no objection to them serving in general? What changes do you see happening if gays were permitted to serve openly?
    From a pure troop on the ground standpoint I view it in the following context:

    We're sworn to uphold the constitution and that document protects our essential rights. Sexual orientation doesn't affect your ability to raise your right hand and take the oath of enlistment to defend this country. Why I feel DADT shouldn't matter is because when you're off duty and off base, what you do is your business but at the same time we're all expected to hold ourselves to a higher standard. Like, being a member of the Armed Forces we're supposed to be the cream of the crop, the absolute best America has to offer. So as such of course we shouldn't be out acting an idiot on weekends and getting into trouble, we're allowed to have private lives but have to uphold standards. Where I see there potentially being problems with the abolition of DADT is the possibility of creating the attitude of flaunting your homosexuality out in public if it were suddenly not an issue and I draw the line there. You shouldn't be flaunting your heterosexuality out in public either, like I don't go around making out with my wife and acting innapropriate in town because you're supposed to set the standard, you know? I just feel if DADT was done away with it might give people the excuse to act a fool and create a PR nightmare for us who serve.

    That being said, gays who serve in the military should be happy with DADT, in my opinion. It's not like the US Military says you can't serve if you're gay, and we all have the right to our private lives.
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  2. #22  
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    I'm MJ. Do whatever you want off duty, but don't bring that shit to the unit or my squad. Truth be told, I had a gay soldier in my squad. And because he never brought it to my squad, it mattered little.
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  3. #23  
    Senior Member marinejcksn's Avatar
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    I hear ya and I agree. Shoot, I served under a gay officer as my first OIC. I didn't figure it out, but the first time my wife met him she could tell he was and sure enough he had a guy living with him that he was dating. Actually the other guy was a naval officer. Guess marines & squids are really close after all, in some cases. :p

    But like you said, they keep that stuff to themselves and I got no problem with it. I always lead my Marines like that, work is work and your personal life is your separate private time. You need that disconnect otherwise you lose your mind.
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  4. #24  
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    Quote Originally Posted by marinejcksn View Post
    From a pure troop on the ground standpoint I view it in the following context:

    We're sworn to uphold the constitution and that document protects our essential rights. Sexual orientation doesn't affect your ability to raise your right hand and take the oath of enlistment to defend this country. Why I feel DADT shouldn't matter is because when you're off duty and off base, what you do is your business but at the same time we're all expected to hold ourselves to a higher standard. Like, being a member of the Armed Forces we're supposed to be the cream of the crop, the absolute best America has to offer. So as such of course we shouldn't be out acting an idiot on weekends and getting into trouble, we're allowed to have private lives but have to uphold standards. Where I see there potentially being problems with the abolition of DADT is the possibility of creating the attitude of flaunting your homosexuality out in public if it were suddenly not an issue and I draw the line there. You shouldn't be flaunting your heterosexuality out in public either, like I don't go around making out with my wife and acting innapropriate in town because you're supposed to set the standard, you know? I just feel if DADT was done away with it might give people the excuse to act a fool and create a PR nightmare for us who serve.

    That being said, gays who serve in the military should be happy with DADT, in my opinion. It's not like the US Military says you can't serve if you're gay, and we all have the right to our private lives.
    I think that is a fair concern. Now how does that fly with the reputation that many naval pilots have had in terms of flaunting not only their heterosexuality, but their lack of fidelity to their spouses as well?
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  5. #25  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillygirl View Post
    I think that is a fair concern. Now how does that fly with the reputation that many naval pilots have had in terms of flaunting not only their heterosexuality, but their lack of fidelity to their spouses as well?
    It has always been that way and it has not hindered those pilots from being the best in the world. No one FLAUNTS their hetrosexuality. Just existing and not being homosexual is pretty much FLAUNTING hetrosexuality in the mind of some people.

    Here is the crux of the problem, homosexuals do not want tolerance, they want acceptance if not the outright embracing of their lifestyle. These same people won't embrace conservatives or Mormons.
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  6. #26  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillygirl View Post
    I think that is a fair concern. Now how does that fly with the reputation that many naval pilots have had in terms of flaunting not only their heterosexuality, but their lack of fidelity to their spouses as well?
    Let us examine this issue more indepth:



    vs




    I say we stick with the fighter pilots and leave the homos in the closet.

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  7. #27  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Speedy View Post
    It has always been that way and it has not hindered those pilots from being the best in the world. No one FLAUNTS their hetrosexuality. Just existing and not being homosexual is pretty much FLAUNTING hetrosexuality in the mind of some people.
    And yet perhaps the same can be said about those who do not want homosexuals to admit that they are homosexuals, while serving in the military.

    Here is the crux of the problem, homosexuals do not want tolerance, they want acceptance if not the outright embracing of their lifestyle. These same people won't embrace conservatives or Mormons.
    I agree with that statement. And yet I wonder if those that would "flaunt" their heterosexuality by being promiscuous want others' acceptance of that lifestyle...or if it really matters much when it comes to choosing who is best able to serve in the military.
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  8. #28  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillygirl View Post
    And yet perhaps the same can be said about those who do not want homosexuals to admit that they are homosexuals, while serving in the military.



    I agree with that statement. And yet I wonder if those that would "flaunt" their heterosexuality by being promiscuous want others' acceptance of that lifestyle...or if it really matters much when it comes to choosing who is best able to serve in the military.

    Being hetrosexual and promiscuous is more in keeping with the natural order of things than being homosexual.
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  9. #29  
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    Quote Originally Posted by zBoots View Post
    I say we stick with the fighter pilots and leave the homos in the closet.
    I'm with you on this statement.
    Last edited by PC Guy; 12-08-2008 at 02:13 AM.
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  10. #30  
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phillygirl View Post
    I see that attitude a lot among the younger members of the military. It seems to me that the most objection to gays serving (and this is merely anecdotal, so take it for what it's worth) comes from the older generation, and particularly those that are no longer serving.

    Can you tell me why you don't think DADT shouldn't be changed, if you have no objection to them serving in general? What changes do you see happening if gays were permitted to serve openly?
    Here's my 2 cents. I'm now in that over the hill gang yet still serving. I, like our resident Jarhead, have no problem with DADT. DADT keeps the In-Your-Face-Flamers in the closet. If you change DADT you open the flood gates. You will have the Man Francisco types In-Ranks. The military relies on disicpline and standards of conduct. Do away with DADT and military bearing dissapears in short order.

    Can you imagine a Veteran's day Parade with a hint of Gay Pride Parade thrown in?:eek:
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